Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 9: F5 F5 F5 F5 F5 F5

Status
Not open for further replies.
Durden77 said:
That's weird. I thought the P:M guys said at one point they specifically didn't want to add anything they thought would show up in Smash 4.
Click to expand...

BGBW said:
Well so much for Project M's original intent. :/
Click to expand...

As I said earlier:

Miutsu said:
Yeah I think that's what I read. What I meant is that the stage is not part of Project M but something the CEO people are offering for the people that want to play on it.
Click to expand...

For more info:

http://www.reddit.com/r/SSBPM/comments/2914to/prelude_to_ceo_2014_get_your_project_m_ceo/

DISCLAIMER: THIS IS JUST A PACK FOR 3.02. This is not an official Project M build. You must already have 3.02 on your SD card, and then you extract and replace this to the root of your card.
Click to expand...
 
PadWarrior said:
Brawl ruining smash is your opinion. What is people posting opinions as facts?
Click to expand...

Brawl ruined the smash community by being so divisive and aimed towards one demographic that it completely tore the community in two.

You can't even talk about the series casually or competitively anymore without having someone from the other side get annoyed merely by the mention of it.
 
CEO is a fighting game tournament where the competitors play inside a wrestling ring, hence the addition of a wrestling stage for that tournament.
 
justchris said:
This is not a wholly correct statement. Brawl is very exciting to watch. I actually enjoyed a lot of the Brawl matches at SKTAR3 more than the Melee matches (although both were inferior to the Project M matches). Saying something isn't exciting is a purely subjective statement, and shouldn't be used as a basis for argument.
Click to expand...

This was more of an opinionated statement yes, and while there are people and players that will enjoy a defensive game, I think the popularity of Melee and P:M compared to the relative death of competitive Brawl shows that people enjoy a more offence-oriented smash bros.

I mean shit, it doesn't even have to be completely offence-oriented, they can strike a balance for people who want to play more defensive, it's not as if it can't be done.
 
No offense to anyone;

Sometime I felt that people here should take their casuals vs completive and brawl vs Melee arguments out of this thread and make a new thread about the topic. I would like it very much if people are going to let us enjoying smash 4 threads without those stupid argument tainting our hype, discussions and threads please.

If people want to continuing this silly argument then please make a new thread so you could have more people to participating to your argument and discussions. I'm not going to tolerating it anymore so you can chase some members out of our thread.
 
Neoriceisgood said:
I wonder if Amiibo influenced the removal of transforming characters.
Click to expand...
In his roundtable discussion, Sakurai said a focus on individuality played a major role in the removal of transforming characters. Amiibo, custom special moves, and equippable items (power-ups) wouldn't work for something like the Pokémon Trainer.
 
JoeInky said:
Brawl ruined the smash community by being so divisive and aimed towards one demographics that it completely tore the community in two.

You can't even talk about the series casually or competitively anymore without having someone from the other side get annoyed merely by the mention of it.
Click to expand...

That's not the fault of brawl. It's the fault of people who can't respect others opinions and use their own opinions as facts.
 
IntelliHeath said:
No offense to anyone;

Sometime I felt that people here should take their casuals vs completive and brawl vs Melee arguments out of this thread and make a new thread about the topic. I would like it very much if people are going to let us enjoying smash 4 threads without those stupid argument tainting our hype, discussions and threads please.

If people want to continuing this silly argument then please make a new thread so you could have more people to participating to your argument and discussions. I'm not going to tolerating it anymore so you can chase some members out of our thread.
Click to expand...

Well said Heath.
 
JoeInky said:
I've posted informatively and not "loud" before but it generally gets ignored so that anti-competitive people can continue with their misinformed agenda, so yes of course I'm going to be condescending to people who are like that.

I don't swear for the edge or anything like that, I just do it because it feels good to say.

I do it more for my own sake than to try and convert their opinion, sometimes you just want to call someone a twat, you know? It's stupid, but I don't value my membership here that much considering I only enjoy one thread (and I've since become a member of smashboards anyway but damn is that site fucking slow despite having so many users).

Casuals didn't ruin smash, I have never said that - brawl ruined smash for trying to be a game that divided the two fanbases unlike melee.
Click to expand...
Some of your posts have indeed been informative and interesting... it's just that people go by what they see and as such the laws of volume and averages mean they're more likely to have seen you getting annoyed than they have seen you explaining stuff :o

Don't worry, I assume most people who swear a decent amount aren't doing it to be edgey or anything, it's just that if you ever find yourself needing to get people's attention or show you're really serious, it's handy to have a tool that lets you do so quickly and effectively... that's where keeping the edge on swearing is useful, at least for me :3

Sure, sometimes people get under my skin but I try not to bother calling them stuff because all that leads to is several pages of venom clogging up our lil smashGaf. I find the best thing to do when someone annoys me with a post is to type out a huge, flaming response, making sure I get everything pissing me off in there, then proof-read it, and once I think it's all correct, I delete it :P

I don't think you should blame Brawl... It's an inanimate object with no agency. if you don't agree with the direction of things then Sakurai's the one you should be shaking your fist at, as it was crafted by his vision :3

Neoriceisgood said:
I wonder if Amiibo influenced the removal of transforming characters.
Click to expand...
I think you might very well be right, though to be honest I thought the transformation mechanic was clunky and didn't really add a whole lot. Outside of maybe pokemon trainer and Samus's final smash where you were basically forced to change, I think most people just picked their form and stuck with it for the whole match. It's not like you could combo into it or anything to make it worthwhile, at least not in my opinion :/
 
There was a bridging between the two communities until E3.

Then both sides' rabid dogs went in to attack mode. It would be one thing if it was just the loud crazies, but a number of people who maybe leaned on one side of the fence decided to jump off and go on a full-sprint to what they perceived as an attack on what they like. Don't expect there will ever be permanent harmony.
 
botty said:
what?
Click to expand...

In brawl/melee transformation was only as fast as you could load from the disc.

Smash 4 has physical vs digital as well as 3DS vs Wii U. Transformation time probably varied wildly between the 4 possible ways of playing. To remove that variable time difference transformation was removed. That's my hypothesis anyway.

Sakurai's official reasoning was so that players could 'focus on one character,' but I really think something more technical or a new feature meant that transformation was no longer a good idea. I think equipment makes perfect sense, too. You might want special attack on zelda going up but maybe you want physical attack on sheik going up. Something along those lines.
 
I blame Heath for all this arguing. If he wouldn't have done the thing, then Nintendo would've given us all blowjob machines and the Smash Community would never argue again.

#ImpeachHeath
#CakeSux
 
georly said:
In brawl/melee transformation was only as fast as you could load from the disc.

Smash 4 has physical vs digital as well as 3DS vs Wii U. Transformation time probably varied wildly between the 4 possible ways of playing. To remove that variable time difference transformation was removed. That's my hypothesis anyway.

Sakurai's official reasoning was so that players could 'focus on one character,' but I really think something more technical or a new feature meant that transformation was no longer a good idea. I think equipment makes perfect sense, too. You might want special attack on zelda going up but maybe you want physical attack on sheik going up. Something along those lines.
Click to expand...

ah I see. Yeah that makes sense.
 
georly said:
In brawl/melee transformation was only as fast as you could load from the disc.

Smash 4 has physical vs digital as well as 3DS vs Wii U. Transformation time probably varied wildly between the 4 possible ways of playing. To remove that variable time difference transformation was removed. That's my hypothesis anyway.

Sakurai's official reasoning was so that players could 'focus on one character,' but I really think something more technical or a new feature meant that transformation was no longer a good idea. I think equipment makes perfect sense, too. You might want special attack on zelda going up but maybe you want physical attack on sheik going up. Something along those lines.
Click to expand...

Never thought of that good point.
 
IntelliHeath said:
No offense to anyone;

Sometime I felt that people here should take their casuals vs completive and brawl vs Melee arguments out of this thread and make a new thread about the topic. I would like it very much if people are going to let us enjoying smash 4 threads without those stupid argument tainting our hype, discussions and threads please.

If people want to continuing this silly argument then please make a new thread so you could have more people to participating to your argument and discussions. I'm not going to tolerating it anymore so you can chase some members out of our thread.
Click to expand...

Is the "rules" section going to say something about this specifically now!? Or its just going to be considered "off topic"??
 
PadWarrior said:
Never thought of that good point.
Click to expand...

My theory was that maybe it was instant on one of the versions (maybe wii U could load all characters into RAM before the fight) which allowed for combos or crazy recovery or something. The same thing might not be possible on 3DS, so the character would be significantly worse. Trying to balance all the characters when they behave slightly differently on 2 different systems would have been a nightmare so the ability to transform was removed. Not an issue w/ Samus, but it could have made Zelda or PkMn trainer much better on one system than the other.


EDIT:

---TO BRING THE THREAD BACK ON TOPIC FOR PICTURE OF THE DAY---

Why was nabbit not at E3? No one saw him once. Why?

What other stages were missing things? What other stages that were at E3 will have different behavior from the final stages? Does this mean the Yellow Devil might actually appear LESS OFTEN on the retail release?

Are there stages w/ stage bosses that had the stage bosses removed from the E3 Build? Could Dark Pit be a stage boss on 3DS?
 
That feel when the first thing you read on a new page is that "Pit sucks in Project M".

Dude is legitimately the first Smash character that has enough tricks to make you feel bad for anyone playing space animals against him. The only things keeping him from being truly tops are Mario and 20XX tier Fox/Falco mains.

Hot Coldman said:
spent a good 2 hours trying to set up Project M on my PAL Wii with a busted disc drive, and failing

basically fuck PM
Click to expand...

:(

I know this feel though, I've had to run P:M through the Wii U myself since my current Wii lost the ability to consistently read dual layered discs about two years ago.
 
Freezie KO said:
I think there's a pretty easy solution that would make the game work for both sides. The problem is that Sakurai believes that certain design changes (such as reducing landing lag, increasing combo-ability, among others) would repel the more casual players.

Personally, I believe that Sakurai is incorrect in that theory. I don't believe that adding more movement options, allowing you to cancel a dash, etc. will deter casual players. I think most won't notice.

It's not because casual players lack taste. It's because with a bunch of items and stage hazards, the choices you make based on the core mechanics become diminished. When random externalities are introduced, those begin to dictate a lot about how the match is played. You only need to see what happens when a Smash Ball comes out to realize that.

I also don't believe there is any sales evidence to back up Sakurai's belief either. Brawl sold more, but it did so on a runaway success of a console. Melee's attach rate was significantly better, and that the game is even close to Brawl in sales says something about its desirability among casual players.
Click to expand...

Part of the reason Melee had such a high attached rate was because games like Wii Sports, Fit, and such didn't exist. Also, Mario Kart really took off. And Melee was a launch window game vs Brawl coming out in the middle of the Wii's life along with two other huge games (Mario Kart and Wii Fit). So, let's put Melee's attach rate into perspective just as you did with Brawl's sells.

I also disagree with the stage argument. Only in a few stages did stage hazards cost me a match or made my life harder, the same with Melee. The only time I had a real problem with stage hazards was in the first Smash game. So I do not know why people gets on Brawl's hazards when Melee had some gimmicky stages too. Maybe because there were more of them, but they were a lot more stages in Brawl anyway and you could even make your own. Items, I personally found no real different in items except for the Dragoon, Smash Balls, and the Pokeballs not being as fun.

Sakurai obviously went back on some on this since combo appears more readily, although I personally think combos are overrate but I won't get into that. But there is some evident that Sakurai was right about some things since Brawl got a overall higher review than Brawl despite some vocal people acting like it is the worst game ever.
 
Freezie KO said:
Personally, I believe that Sakurai is incorrect in that theory. I don't believe that adding more movement options, allowing you to cancel a dash, etc. will deter casual players. I think most won't notice.
Click to expand...

I don't know why people say this, it is a ridiculous statement. Any and every change to the way the game plays that doesn't require some ridiculous or finicky input will be noticed by everyone who plays the game. Casual players don't have fewer senses than competitive players. They will notice if attacks are faster or slower, if they're more lag on landing, and a host of other things that competitive players act like won't affect casuals. These things very definitely affect the way everyone will play the game.

Now, if you wish to claim that casuals won't care, you could have a reasonable argument there, but you have to be either very stupid or willfully obtuse to think they won't notice.

JoeInky said:
Casuals didn't ruin smash, I have never said that - brawl ruined smash for trying to be a game that divided the two fanbases unlike melee.
Click to expand...

This is incorrect, Brawl's design was intended to do the exact opposite of that actually. Look at Brawl again, with the idea that it was intended to be a game where a casual player could play against a competitive expert and still have an equal chance of winning. It explains tripping, it explains final smashes and pity final smashes, and the more defensive play style. The game is balanced to be an equalizer, in much the same way that you only get the really good items in Mario Kart when you're far behind.
Seriously, who decided putting coins in items boxes was a good fucking idea?

Now, you can disagree with this design ideal, and you can see the effect it's had, but the original intent was the exact opposite of what you state.

JoeInky said:
This was more of an opinionated statement yes, and while there are people and players that will enjoy a defensive game, I think the popularity of Melee and P:M compared to the relative death of competitive Brawl shows that people enjoy a more offence-oriented smash bros.

I mean shit, it doesn't even have to be completely offence-oriented, they can strike a balance for people who want to play more defensive, it's not as if it can't be done.
Click to expand...

Not really, it's way more indicative of the people who actually care about watching video game streams. The competitive community prefers to play Melee and Project M, so that's what they stream. Casual players don't really spend much time watching streams. Most casual players probably don't even know people are streaming Smash Bros. If they did, maybe they would prefer competitive Melee, or maybe they would prefer items matches, or maybe they'd prefer Brawl teams. You're assuming the people who watch Smash streams and participate in Smash tourneys are a majority of the Smash audience. There are probably people who have logged as many hours of Smash as any pro player who have never watched a single stream or been to a single tournament.

If Nintendo adds a Smash TV feature to SSB4 and actively supports and advertises Smash tournaments and streams, you're going to see a huge influx of viewership over what there is now, and I will guarantee you that, even if it is a worse game than Brawl, Smash 4 viewership will completely outstrip what has gone before.
 
Shadow Hog said:
He's already president of SonicGAF.

I'm not sure you realize what you're asking for. The streets will run red with blood! (...from everyone's ears as he posts "Nocturne" for the hundredth time)
Click to expand...
He's the president of AceAttorneyGAF as well (well, he made the community thread lol) and I love it there. :p

Except he didn't update the OP to include the iOS ports, AA5, and AATrilogy for the 3DS. Get on to it Beef.
 
Honestly this thread feels less about Smash 4 and more about Smash in general. We should really limit discussions to upcoming characters, etc. you know, stuff relevant to Smash 4. Just make a different general and keep them there.
 
Boss Doggie said:
Honestly this thread feels less about Smash 4 and more about Smash in general. We should really limit discussions to upcoming characters, etc. you know, stuff relevant to Smash 4. Just make a different general and keep them there.
Click to expand...


Agreed. I promise to stay out of the Braw vs Melee debate. I just kind of needed to say something after six years of hearing the same stuff over and over again.
 
Boss Doggie said:
Honestly this thread feels less about Smash 4 and more about Smash in general. We should really limit discussions to upcoming characters, etc. you know, stuff relevant to Smash 4. Just make a different general and keep them there.
Click to expand...

thread is much better when it's about smash in general, especially since smash 4 will always be discussed in relation to the other smash games
 
justchris said:
I don't know why people say this, it is a ridiculous statement. Any and every change to the way the game plays that doesn't require some ridiculous or finicky input will be noticed by everyone who plays the game. Casual players don't have fewer senses than competitive players. They will notice if attacks are faster or slower, if they're more lag on landing, and a host of other things that competitive players act like won't affect casuals. These things very definitely affect the way everyone will play the game.

Now, if you wish to claim that casuals won't care, you could have a reasonable argument there, but you have to be either very stupid or willfully obtuse to think they won't notice.



This is incorrect, Brawl's design was intended to do the exact opposite of that actually. Look at Brawl again, with the idea that it was intended to be a game where a casual player could play against a competitive expert and still have an equal chance of winning. It explains tripping, it explains final smashes and pity final smashes, and the more defensive play style. The game is balanced to be an equalizer, in much the same way that you only get the really good items in Mario Kart when you're far behind.
Seriously, who decided putting coins in items boxes was a good fucking idea?

Now, you can disagree with this design ideal, and you can see the effect it's had, but the original intent was the exact opposite of what you state.
Click to expand...

Okay, you're right. They won't care. They may notice, but such mechanic tweaks ultimately don't have as big of an effect when items, final smashes, and random-element stags are involved. The mechanics become more important when those things are removed, but if you're playing without items, random elements, etc., then you're probably in favor of a deeper game.
 
ShockingAlberto said:
There was a bridging between the two communities until E3.

Then both sides' rabid dogs went in to attack mode. It would be one thing if it was just the loud crazies, but a number of people who maybe leaned on one side of the fence decided to jump off and go on a full-sprint to what they perceived as an attack on what they like. Don't expect there will ever be permanent harmony.
Click to expand...
It will be interesting to see whether things blow up or smooth out when the game arrives.

We should do two separate Google Docs: one for folks who like to play with items, and one for folks who don't. Anyone can sign up for both, but then people would be able to find opponents to their taste.
 
How many gamecube controllers is everyone buying? I got a black one coming today and have the white one at home. I plan on getting 2 smash edition gc controllers.
 
PadWarrior said:
How gamecube controllers is everyone buying? I got a black one coming today and have the white one at home. I plan on getting 2 smash edition gc controllers.
Click to expand...
0 or 1. Unlike most, I never felt like the GC controller was something special. I didn't like the button placement. I played Brawl with a Wii U Pro Controller just fine.
 
ec0ec0 said:
Is the "rules" section going to say something about this specifically now!? Or its just going to be considered "off topic"??
Click to expand...

I don't know what to do right now but I'm working on some kind of rules that would allow it at same time and disallow it. I just want competitive fanbase and casual fanbase to respect each other. I know it's possible because I'm one of them, and I love both side depend on circle of friends.

georly said:
Why was nabbit not at E3? No one saw him once. Why?

What other stages were missing things? What other stages that were at E3 will have different behavior from the final stages? Does this mean the Yellow Devil might actually appear LESS OFTEN on the retail release?
Click to expand...

Maybe, Nabbit wasn't ready by then.
 
Karsticles said:
0 or 1. Unlike most, I never felt like the GC controller was something special. I didn't like the button placement. I played Brawl with a Wii U Pro Controller just fine.
Click to expand...

I own four of those as well for mk8. It's a great controller. They both feel good in my hands but I want a wired controller for my online smashing. And I like collecting controllers lol.
 
Karsticles said:
It will be interesting to see whether things blow up or smooth out when the game arrives.

We should do two separate Google Docs: one for folks who like to play with items, and one for folks who don't. Anyone can sign up for both, but then people would be able to find opponents to their taste.
Click to expand...
I think things will smooth out for a while, as everyone's just going to be playing/enjoying/learning the game. After it sinks in a while, it will either meet or fall short of each person's hopes and expectations, and there will either be more unity or more division. I really wonder if we'll see a Brawl division stay standing after 4 comes out. I don't think Melee and PM diehards are going to really be swayed, but I'm curious if Brawl players will move over, or sort of fade back like 64 did, if the new game scratches a similar itch.

I like that idea. Rather than two docs though, I think just an extra column (that can be filtered/sorted). Let people choose items/no items/don't care. Same for preference with regards to FFA/teams/1v1. Maybe we could even ask players for their favorite characters, so you could find practice in a certain matchup if you were looking for it.
 
Boss Doggie said:
Honestly this thread feels less about Smash 4 and more about Smash in general. We should really limit discussions to upcoming characters, etc. you know, stuff relevant to Smash 4. Just make a different general and keep them there.
Click to expand...

This thread has always been Smash general, and I think that's fine. It hasn't been disruptive to regular discussion for the most part, with the exception of all those discussions that can be boiled down to casual vs competitive players.
 
PadWarrior said:
How many gamecube controllers is everyone buying? I got a black one coming today and have the white one at home. I plan on getting 2 smash edition gc controllers.
Click to expand...

Preordered 4 from amazon. I plan on also getting the bundle, so 5 total. 4 to use, one to save until it's needed.
 
Yeah, I don't think it's bad. When the pictures aren't exciting, discussion will generally either come down to Smash Bros general talk, a dead thread until the next new info, or weekend Smash Gaf weirdness.

I honestly think Melee vs Brawl junk is the lesser of the evils, even if it's been done a million times and it gets redundant.

Anth0ny said:
Buying one new GC controller.

I have 7 GC controllers already and 2 wavebirds.
Click to expand...

Same. Except I only have 5 official controllers still alive, and one Wavebird.
 
PadWarrior said:
Nice. Man if they make the smash themed controllers in various colors I'm so there.

Wavebirds are awesome wish I kept mine from years ago.
Click to expand...

That's why I did amazon, so it's easy to cancel if they announce multiple colors. I have a feeling they won't, though.

I still have working wavebirds but they won't last forever. I also like the rumble on the normal ones. I have no working non-wavebirds, though.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Super Smash Bros mod adds Nintendo cease and desist letter as playable character
9
218
ecosse_011172 replied
Super Mario Bros Sequel Movie Titled "Super Mario World"
20
1K
E-Cat replied
Super Mario Bros. Wonder Switch 2 Edition out in Spring 2026
News 
22
583
Zacfoldor replied
What if the WII U was successful?
2
53
564
Alan Wake replied
Super Mario Galaxy 2 - Switch 2 vs Wii Direct Comparison
2 3 4 5
207
948
Panajev2001a replied
Top Bottom