Giant Bomb #8 | It's a Hit!

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hamchan said:
Well, yes, yes really.

Unless the person makes a harsh comment to accompany the tweet.
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Let me put it like this: in all of the years that I've been reading and posting in GB threads, I don't think anybody has ever brought up Leigh Alexander tweets for any reason other than "wow, let's all look at what crazy Leigh said and get upset!"

So excuse me if, upon seeing her tweets on a controversial subject brought up in this thread again for the umpteenth time, I don't immediately assume the best intentions.
 
Dragon said:
Do you have evidence on the math aptitude side? Because it seems pretty offensive at first glance without it.
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Jesus I wasn't saying women are bad at math people. And yes there are scientific studies showing men are better at math and spatial abilities. It is an average though so there will always be people who skew more to one side or the other. Some people in this thread are looking for a fight. Would people argue if I said that women have more aptitude for communication skills because that is also true.

Edit:

I'm an idiot and wrong sorry.
 
Mesoian said:
If anything, it's shrinking, changing into a more personality driven enterprise where the usual standards of journalistic norms don't apply. Jeff has said plenty of times on his Mixlr streams that the world of Games Journalism isn't sustainable, especially with stuff like twitch and youtube celebrities often doing as good or better of a job as sites like Kotaku or IGN, and many of them are doing it for free.

It's going to get to a point where up and coming gamers identify more with people like Egorapter or PewdiPie than anyone on staff at IGN or Gamespot, and that's where their attention and money will go.

It's just...evolution. Or de-evolution depending on how you see it. Giantbomb stays ahead of the curve by being so personality driven, all we can hope is that such a thing can hold out.
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That's also what Jeff said on his latest Jar Time video. I think that segment is really relevant to see how Jeff would go about judging who should be the new hires.
 
Wereroku said:
Jesus I wasn't saying women are bad at math people. And yes there are scientific studies showing men are better at math and spatial abilities. It is an average though so there will always be people who skew more to one side or the other. Some people in this thread are looking for a fight. Would people argue if I said that women have more aptitude for communication skills because that is also true.
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No one's looking for a fight, but you just can't throw out biological differences like that and think people are gonna be okay with it.
 
I wonder if there's a way to aggregate total audience share numbers or something. I bet individual youtube personalities are already way more embedded in young gamer consciousness than places like ign or gamespot. I feel like anecdotally we're already past that tipping point.
 
Otnopolit said:
Doesn't that "point" just counter the argument itself?
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No, it's flawless. He can't pronounce a dude's name therefore he only hired him cause he was friend of a friend. There are no other options. It's the only possibility.

I'm genuinly curious what happened between the GB and Leigh. I watched all the videos (which means the one there is I think) and can't really find anything offensive other than she was drunk and got a number wrong.
 
Jimmyfenix said:
Scoops tweeted this http://bluebomber.wordpress.com/2008/05/07/my-enemy-this-week-my-conscience-and-how-grand-theft-auto-iv-made-me-feel-regret/

If any of you killed Dwayne i feel sorry for you.
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There are days where I look back on the Dwayne thing and wonder if you were actually supposed to feel sorry for him, or if you were supposed to antagonize him because he was weak. I know it's subjective, but there are times where it feels like Playboy X is the "correct" option to pick due to the narrative of that story, regardless of how it makes you feel.
 
The "biological differences" argument probably comes from people looking at the history of science and saying "look at all these dudes" and never thinking about why is it that women never really made major discoveries until a few hundred years ago.
 
Jintor said:
I wonder if there's a way to aggregate total audience share numbers or something. I bet individual youtube personalities are already way more embedded in young gamer consciousness than places like ign or gamespot. I feel like anecdotally we're already past that tipping point.
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I'm almost certain that just PewDiePie has a bigger share of the young gamer audience than both of those sites combined. And then there's all the minecraft youtubers/streamers.
 
NumberThree said:
Probably not, because it's bullshit: http://www.wjh.harvard.edu/~lds/pdfs/spelke2005.pdf
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Did you read that whole thing? Even in the opening paragraph they throw out a bunch of factors that could effect math and science development like hormone effects and preferences.

peterb0y said:
No one's looking for a fight, but you just can't throw out biological differences like that and think people are gonna be okay with it.
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Well I apologize for being over broad. I will restate that women are good at math but for some reason men tend to focus on these areas more. It could be societal or biological or more likely both. I didn't mean to cause some sort of controversy I was just trying to point out that men and women are different in their development and recognition of the world and as such it causes us to enjoy different things. This leads to imbalances in many different fields and I agree that it would be nice if we could balance that more but I think there will always be a skew.

Edit:

I'm an idiot and wrong sorry.
 
Man, I better tell my girlfriend and all of her female classmates (who outnumber the men by a 60:40 ratio) in a top 10 medical school that they should probably quit because they can't do science or math for biological reasons.
 
Mesoian said:
There are days where I look back on the Dwayne thing and wonder if you were actually supposed to feel sorry for him, or if you were supposed to antagonize him because he was weak. I know it's subjective, but there are times where it feels like Playboy X is the "correct" option to pick due to the narrative of that story, regardless of how it makes you feel.
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It is weird because in GTA 4 when you shoot someone they are not dead just wounded so technically you could play that game only killing story related characters.
 
Wereroku said:
Did you read that whole thing? Even in the opening paragraph they throw out a bunch of factors that could effect math and science development like hormone effects and preferences.
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Did you? "the wealth of research on cognition and cognitive development, conducted over 40 years, provides no reason to believe that the gender imbalances on science faculties, or among physics majors, stem from sex differ- ences in intrinsic aptitude."


Stop posting about things you don't understand
 
Mesoian said:
There are days where I look back on the Dwayne thing and wonder if you were actually supposed to feel sorry for him, or if you were supposed to antagonize him because he was weak. I know it's subjective, but there are times where it feels like Playboy X is the "correct" option to pick due to the narrative of that story, regardless of how it makes you feel.
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Really? I thought Playboy X was a dick regardless. Doesn't help you get his apartment whatever you decide.
 
To be honest, I'm happy that they've got new blood in there, even if they were the safest choice. That said, I've seen some people I know having gripes about one of them. Either for personal or professional issues, I don't know. It makes me nervous about the future of Giant Bomb.
 
Zornack said:
I'm almost certain that just PewDiePie has a bigger share of the young gamer audience than both of those sites combined. And then there's all the minecraft youtubers/streamers.
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PewDiPie is the "thing" that makes me realise I'm old. Cause everytime I see or hear from him I just wanna shake my cane and yell "What do you people see in him! In my time we had some decency!" And I wish I was making any of that up
 
I wish the next couple of weeks were over and done with. Everyone is so defensive/angry/offended/offensive/upset/pissed off that I don't think I can handle this any more. I mean this is some next level shit right here compared to what it's been like for a long time.

Where are the Kate pictures for this page? WE NEED TO GO BACK (to) KATE
 
Fantastapotamus said:
No, it's flawless. He can't pronounce a dude's name therefore he only hired him cause he was friend of a friend. There are no other options. It's the only possibility.

I'm genuinly curious what happened between the GB and Leigh. I watched all the videos (which means the one there is I think) and can't really find anything offensive other than she was drunk and got a number wrong.
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I think it's a combination of the embarrassment of the amount of exposure she got from the stream/video maybe mixed with not getting hired? She wouldn't be the first person to jump to twitter to post their angsty thoughts or feelings. Hell, that's where I go to do it! Just without the calling people out part....
 
Wereroku said:
Did you read that whole thing? Even in the opening paragraph they throw out a bunch of factors that could effect math and science development like hormone effects and preferences.
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I feel sorry for your reading comprehension. From that very same paragraph:
Research on cognitive development in human infants and preschool children, and research on cognitive performance by students at all levels, provides evidence against these claims. Mathematical and scientific reasoning develop from a set of biologically based capacities that males and females share. From these capacities, men and women appear to develop equal talent for mathematics and science.
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Otnopolit said:
I think it's a combination of the embarrassment of the amount of exposure she got from the stream/video maybe mixed with not getting hired? She wouldn't be the first person to jump to twitter to post their angsty thoughts or feelings. Hell, that's where I go to do it! Just without the calling people out part....
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Did she really apply for the job?
 
Mesoian said:
There are days where I look back on the Dwayne thing and wonder if you were actually supposed to feel sorry for him, or if you were supposed to antagonize him because he was weak. I know it's subjective, but there are times where it feels like Playboy X is the "correct" option to pick due to the narrative of that story, regardless of how it makes you feel.
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I don't know, killing Playboy gives you gameplay benefits, killing Dwayne doesn't (unless I'm remembering incorrectly). Seems pretty clear they wanted to reward one choice.
 
Otnopolit said:
Probably soon, assuming CBSi doesn't get any bright ideas and decide to release some kind of statement or something silly.
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34939.jpg


Our lord and Savior.
 
peterb0y said:
Who's dragging GB through the mud? Some people are disappointed. It opens the door for a productive discussion.

Why are you so entrenched on a defensive stance that really has no productive outcome?
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If not dragging through the mud (even though that's a subjective description) then rampant disappointment?

I totally agree that the discussion is something that should continue to happen, but question the purpose of having it in this thread specifically.

First off it's a small hire for a very small staff. Diversity usually begins to show with larger groupings of people (usually, not always) so expecting or being disappointed in this hiring seems a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

Second we have no idea what the hiring qualifications even were which makes it difficult to even discuss, let alone criticize. I'd agree with some that it was a pre-ordained friend hiring friend thing with the 'process' a formality but again that's just supposition.

I dunno, to me the majority of this discussion has felt completely off-topic and barely relevant to the GB thread. They just happened to be the latest/more popular folks hiring I guess and that's why it's in here? Such a discussion would probably be better served in its own thread is all I'm thinking (unless there was even a shred of evidence that hiring discrimination or whatever happened in this specific instance).

Anyway just wanted to throw my two cents in. Hopefully the thread quiets down to more related stuff soon.

Also grats to Dan and Jason on their new jobs, I'm looking forward to new content and seeing how it all mixes with the crew.
 
peterb0y said:
Nothing is. But this happens all the time in society, and the same question is raised, and you can never really show any harmful reason for isolated hires, similarly. But it accrues and accrues, and continues to perpetuate problems in an industry that has significant gender issues. So by just being more of the same, its open to criticism.

This isn't to say GB per se did anything wrong- but they didn't go out of their way to fix a prevailing problem, so a discussion is opened. Thats it.
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The idea of going out of your way to hire someone who isn't white always seems really weird to me.
 
Flambe said:
If not dragging through the mud (even though that's a subjective description) then rampant disappointment?

I totally agree that the discussion is something that should continue to happen, but question the purpose of having it in this thread specifically.

First off it's a small hire for a very small staff. Diversity usually begins to show with larger groupings of people (usually, not always) so expecting or being disappointed in this hiring seems a bit of a stretch in my opinion.

Second we have no idea what the hiring qualifications even were which makes it difficult to even discuss, let alone criticize. I'd agree with some that it was a pre-ordained friend hiring friend thing with the 'process' a formality but again that's just supposition.

I dunno, to me the majority of this discussion has felt completely off-topic and barely relevant to the GB thread. They just happened to be the latest/more popular folks hiring I guess and that's why it's in here? Such a discussion would probably be better served in its own thread is all I'm thinking (unless there was even a shred of evidence that hiring discrimination or whatever happened in this specific instance).

Anyway just wanted to throw my two cents in. Hopefully the thread quiets down to more related stuff soon.

Also grats to Dan and Jason on their new jobs, I'm looking forward to new content and seeing how it all mixes with the crew.
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I just think that people love GB, so they feel attacked somehow when these issues are discussed in relation to their favorite game site. No one is necessarily attacking GB. Its just the latest instance of a pervasive, harmful norm in the industry.
 
peterb0y said:
I just think that people love GB, so they feel attacked somehow when these issues are discussed in relation to their favorite game site. No one is necessarily attacking GB. Its just the latest instance of a pervasive, harmful norm in the industry.
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Eh, part of it is twitter. There are some very vile things being said on twitter and people come here to defend/laugh at them.

There's some bad stuff being said here but twitter, twitter is just youtube comments now.
 
peterb0y said:
Who's dragging GB through the mud? Some people are disappointed. It opens the door for a productive discussion.

Why are you so entrenched on a defensive stance that really has no productive outcome?
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Personally I'm very frustrated with a lot of the comments I've read. It's kinda hard not to take offense to some of the "yet another cis-white male" flavored posts being made here and elsewhere. That discussion and all it's tendrils is fervent and ongoing. There's no worry of underconsideration of the breadth of gaming culture and it's participants. Not anymore. Not from the crowds and feeds I read.

A big part of why discussion seems inappropriate to me is the loss of Ryan. Thinking back on the last year of content while listening to the new bomb cast featuring two lively and friendly new characters made me incredibly excited for the future. Yes, this is Giantbomb growing.. but it's also Giantbomb filling in a gigantic hole in its roster that was left unexpectedly.

Personally I'm really genuinely bummed Zoe Quinn hasnt been hired yet. She's one of my favorite in the Giantbomb extended family, my disappointment doesn't come from any sense of social misjustice or perceived insularity from the guys.. I'm disappointed because I genuinely like her personality and would love to see her on GB every morning.

I don't know anything about dan rycker or Jason oestriker, but I trust in Giantbomb to do what's right for the content first. Personally I don't see a lot of avenues for productive discussion when it does boil down to "they didn't hire who I thought they should hire." These greater discussions about videogame culture at large are persistent and ongoing.. and temporarily weaving these hires into that narrative just kinda misses the point from where I'm sitting.
 
peterb0y said:
I just think that people love GB, so they feel attacked somehow when these issues are discussed in relation to their favorite game site. No one is necessarily attacking GB. Its just the latest instance of a pervasive, harmful norm in the industry.
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There has been some vile comments in both side of the equation.
 
daydreaming said:
Just noticed the plush Giant Bomb in the side shot of the PC desk. Glad they found a place for it on the set.
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It looked so rad. Too bad making those things requires talent and time. Otherwise I'd hope they were something people could buy from the store instead of just t-shirts and posters. And, no, I'm not saying designing either of those things don't require talent or skill, I'm just saying they don't require either to manufacture them in bulk.
 
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