Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 10: Against the Odds, We Choose to Hype!

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MaverickHunterAsh said:
So taking into account what we know now as well as my own predictions for the rest of the characters, this is my educated guess at what the final roster could look like. (It doesn't take into account characters I'd personally still like to see but don't think have made the cut, like Dixie Kong and Krystal, or popular fan hopefuls like Ridley and K. Rool.)

Smash_Roster071614.png


Notes:
- 48 characters total (and a Random panel makes it 49, so I organized it into a 7x7 grid)
- Assumes the Sal Romano leak is still legit in terms of Shulk and Marshal/Chorus Kids (I think it is)
- One more additional newcomer beyond Sal's: Dark Pit (between his tease at the end of Palutena's trailer and Lucina being a newcomer clone, I think he'll be added as a newcomer clone of Pit)
- Four vets are cut: Snake, Lucas, Wolf, and the Ice Climbers (Snake for obvious reasons, and the other three are just a gut feeling I've had since early on; I hope I'm wrong, especially about the Ice Climbers!). Assuming I'm wrong about the latter three, that equals 51 characters total, which is a roster I could also see happening.

Thoughts?
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I would be happy with this roster, except I would hope he keeps Ice Climbers because they're unique and Wolf because Star Fox needs its villain rep.

Also I hope Pitoo is a skin of Pits and not a standalone character. I also really don't think we'll see Mewtwo again.

So I'd remove those two and re-add Wolf/Ice Climbers and keep the same number you have. That's what I think will end up happening.
 
MaverickHunterAsh said:
Hades would be awesome as a legit newcomer, but seeing as Sakurai's said we're nearing the end of the newcomers and we've already gotten one original Kid Icarus newcomer, I don't see another one happening unless it's a clone (i.e. Dark Pit).
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I guess there's so many weapons to use from Uprising, they were never going to cover them all with just Pit. Pitoo would be okay. And I doubt he'd be a clone.
 
Tyeforce said:
Here are my updated roster predictions:

9KInsQ.png


And yes, it all fits on the character select screen.


Also, I have an interesting theory about the remaining Super Smash Bros. newcomer videos.

Since Sakurai said that we're "nearing the bottom of the stash" of newcomer videos, there are probably only a couple videos left. (This doesn't mean there are only a couple newcomers left, because it's very possible that there will be unlockable newcomers that won't get a video so the surprise of unlocking them isn't ruined, and there's always the possibility of multiple newcomers being revealed in a single video, like what just happened with Robin and Lucina.) Anyway, this fits nicely with the two remaining supposed leaked characters: Shulk and Chorus Kids.

Now, the leak, if there's any truth to it, has been proven to not be 100% accurate, as it claimed Chrom would be a newcomer but instead we got Robin and Lucina. However, up until now the leak has been completely accurate, even with completely off-the-wall characters like Wii Fit Trainer, and I believe we can still expect to see Shulk and Chorus Kids. And regardless of the leak, I think Shulk and some kind of Rhythm Heaven character are very likely, anyway. Especially the Rhythm Heaven character, because we've already seen a Rhythm Heaven enemy in the demo of Smash Run.

If we are to assume that Shulk and Chorus Kids (or some Rhythm Heaven character, at least; it could end up being Marshal from Rhythm Heaven Fever) are the last remaining newcomers to get reveal videos (that is to say, they're the last of the newcomers that will be on the starter roster; there may be more that are unlockable that won't get videos), then we should be seeing those videos pretty soon. I'd guess one next month in August, and a final one in September before the game releases in Japan. But what will those videos be like?

If we take what we've seen so far, I think it may be fairly easy to predict what we might get (again, assuming the last pre-release newcomer reveals are Shulk and Chorus Kids or another Rhythm Heaven character). As we've seen, some of the newcomer videos are done in the style of animation that is used in or inspired by the game(s) of the newcomer's origin. Additionally, some of the videos have introduced returning veterans as well (Charizard in Greninja's video and Captain Falcon in Robin and Lucina's video).

Regarding veterans, we're quickly approaching the release date for the Japanese version of Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS, and all of the characters on the starting roster will have to be revealed by then. So who else can we expect to see before then? Well, of the past Smash Bros. starting characters, we're still missing Ice Climbers, Meta Knight, Wario, and Ness or Lucas. Also, if Snake is back, we can expect to see him revealed before the game comes out, too, since third-party characters are always revealed pre-release.

With all that in mind, I think some of the remaining veterans will be revealed in the last couple newcomer videos, and I'm sure they will be paired appropriately. After all, Charizard being revealed alongside Greninja made perfect sense, and I believe Captain Falcon was chosen to be revealed alongside Robin and Lucina because he fits well in the animation style that was used.

The Rhythm Heaven newcomer video is obvious. It HAS to be animated in the style of the Rhythm Heaven games. And since the Rhythm Heaven games use the same style as the WarioWare games...you know where this is going. Yes, Wario will be revealed alongside the Rhythm Heaven character! It makes too much sense, and it would explain why Wario has been oddly absent all this time, much like Captain Falcon. It's because he's being paired with a newcomer that hasn't been revealed yet!

And then there's Shulk. I imagine Shulk's video will use the standard CGI style used in the Villager, Mega Man, Wii Fit Trainer, Rosalina & Luma, Greninja, and Pac-Man videos. But who would he be paired with? I think there are two possible choices. The Monado gives Shulk psychic abilities...and what other characters have psychic abilities? That's right, Ness and Lucas. Right now, Ness remains the last of the original 12 Super Smash Bros. characters (aside from Jigglypuff, who has always been unlockable) to be revealed. Perhaps they'll reveal him alongside Shulk, with the video revolving around their psychic abilities?

Or another option: Snake. A lot of people think that Snake would have been revealed by now if he was returning...but giving him a late reveal provides the perfect set up for a "Kept you waiting, huh?" moment. And for a video...well, picture something like this: A cardboard box lies on the ground. A Metal Gear stomps into the scene. Snake reveals himself from underneath the cardboard box, and confronts the Metal Gear. He manages to evade it and takes it down with his weapons, but another one emerges. But...this one isn't the same. It's not a Metal Gear—it's a Mechon, and Snake's weapons have no effect! Just then, Shulk charges in with the Monado activated, and he topples the Mechon and slices it with the glowing blade. "Behold the power of the Monado!"

So...yeah. Those are my predictions for the remaining Smash Bros. newcomer videos. Let's see how accurate (or not) they turn out to be! After all, my idea for Robin's reveal video was pretty close to what we actually got! Not exact by any means, but close nonetheless! lol



Also, while I've got this giant post going, lol, I wanna talk about Lucina. I've noticed that a lot of people are disappointed that Lucina's in the game as a clone of Marth. People think that she could have been more unique and that she's just taking another potential newcomer's spot on the roster. STOP THINKING LIKE THAT! That's not the case here at all.

Sakurai directly compared her to Little Mac's alternate costume and the gender swaps of Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and Robin. She is effectively like an alternate to Marth, but because she has minor differences in abilities (and because she's actually a separate character from Marth, unlike the gender swaps and such that she's compared to), she gets her own slot on the roster. But that doesn't mean she's taking anyone else's slot!!

The Smash Bros. roster isn't limited by a certain number of "slots." It's limited by how many characters the development team can realistically create and balance in time for the game's release. Lucina, who is effectively on par with other alts like female Villager, male Wii Fit Trainer, and female Robin, doesn't really require much additional work for her character. And because she's nearly identical to Marth with a few differences, balancing her character won't take much more effort, either.

Having her in the game as a low effort Marth clone is better than her being a more unique character from Marth, because that would only be taking up more development resources, and then she really WOULD be taking another potential newcomer's slot. And really, as different as Sakurai could make her from Marth...she still wouldn't be anywhere as unique as Robin, or any other newcomer for that matter, because this is a character that is pretty much based entirely around Marth in the first place. There's no better character to be a Marth clone than Lucina, lol.

So don't think of Lucina as a disappointing clone who's taking the spot of another potential, more unique newcomer. Think of her as a bonus character, an extra. Because that's what she is.
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Mewtwo is simply not coming back unless game freak wants to promote Mega Mewtwo. Game freak likes promoting new Pokémon, that's why they have Sakurai Greninja.
 
So is it safe to assume tomes are like levin sword and take some time to regenerate as well? I also assume if you use a lot of powerful spells they get used up faster. Good to know the levin sword comes back after a while and you don't have to wait for the next stock. What a weird, but unique mechanic. Glad that pretty much every newcomer is really really unique.
 
BassForever said:
I would have preferred unique Dedede to 6 clones, then perhaps Ganondorf when he got added in Brawl would have had a moveset fitting who he is instead of a crappy clone moveset.
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Differences of philosophy here. There's a lot of people who would rather have more characters than 5 less for a more unique one they potentially would have no interest in.

Hours Left said:
I don't begrudge the characters' inclusions at all, but if you are gonna take the time to add more characters, I'd prefer that they get the same amount of attention as everyone else, especially when merited. I'm not anti-clone, but I don't think this is an unreasonable opinion.

It doesn't matter now though, we got who we got.
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Sure. I just feel like the word "laziness" is thrown around too easily in this regard. The only lazy thing was some characters getting the same Final Smashes in Brawl (PK Starstorm, Landmaster, Light Arrow, Triforce Slash, just to name those that came to mind right away).
 
Red Arremer said:
Differences of philosophy here. There's a lot of people who would rather have more characters than 5 less for a more unique one they potentially would have no interest in.



Sure. I just feel like the word "laziness" is thrown around too easily in this regard. The only lazy thing was some characters getting the same Final Smashes in Brawl (PK Starstorm, Landmaster, Light Arrow, Triforce Slash, just to name those that came to mind right away).
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Normally I'd agree with more characters, but looking at the selection of clones (dr mario, captain ganondorf, falco, young link, pichu, roy) the only one I'd be sad to miss is Falco. I like Ganondorf but Captain ganondorf is still a huge disrespect. I also really like how Dedede played and I think it would have been cool to see him in melee competitive scene
 
Moonlight said:
Maybe the way that they come out in the trailer is the hint? Because Robin casts 'Thunder, Elthunder, Arc Thunder, and then Thoron' in order from least strongest to most. So like someone else mentioned, each successive spell comes out in order like Pikmin. And when you run out of tomes and reach the end of the 'cycle', a cooldown kicks in and the cycle begins anew once it ends. So when Sakurai says that the tome changes after every special, he just means neutral, maybe? Down-B could still be used to cycle between tomes, maybe, unless there's no way of swapping tomes without using them first, which I would be, ah, mixed about.

EDIT: Oh, well, ninja'd in so many less words. I was more elaborate about my explanation, though!
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Didn't we see him use Thunder twice near the start of the trailer?
 
The Lamp said:
Mewtwo is simply not coming back unless game freak wants to promote Mega Mewtwo. Game freak likes promoting new Pokémon, that's why they have Sakurai Greninja.
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Not true, Sakurai said they chose the Greninja long before he became popular and the entire line up is chosen before development started.

Kurtofan said:
Sakurai wanted Mewtwo in Brawl, but time constraints got to him.
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Yep and it's all thanks to Sonic The Hedgehog. Honestly speaking I rather have Sonic over a clone. ;)

Clone as in Mewtwo is a clone of Mew in the Pokémon game.
 
Troubled Bat said:
But I thought Sakurai was getting rid of randomness. :P
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I have a feeling that it's not randomness but we will see.

exfatal said:
" The Levin sword and tomes are Robin's life lines"
Im pretty sure both are in danger of breaking, but only the Levi sword gets a replacement as the items recharge. Meaning if you run out of tomes your screwed with specials. Elements will be assigned to his specials, with each of them probably having 3 uses each till it needs to be recharged, and goes through the levels with each use.
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I'm trying to figure out if our tome and swords would break if we spammed so much or are there any specific numbers of how much we would use it.

Vashzaron said:
I can see people potentially getting confused over their controlled character when playing with 2 Robins using the same color scheme of opposite genders.
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lol, that would be funny.

SmithnCo said:
I wonder if Robin will only get a male amiibo. Definitely getting that and Falcon's.
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I wonder if Robin are going to get both model in one Amiibo instead of having male only.
 
Speaking of Ganondorf and spells, why does he have dark effects on his moves, anyway? In TP and OoT, didn't he mainly have light or lightning-based magic?
 
My japanese is kinda rusty now.. But lets try.

But his jp miiverse comment seems to say that the sword regenerates after a set amount of time (note: jikan = "time" from a clock or something like it)

And the tome, it looks like it changes element after each "magic" you use.
 
BassForever said:
Ganondorf wouldn't have weapon breaking though, nor is he really know for spells outside of his dark energy ball for which he and Link play Tennis
Click to expand...

Ganondorf not known for spells? That's literally all he does in ocarina of time while he's ganondorf. WW and TP ganondorf do less, but still, he's at least 50% spells 50% sword :p Smash melee/brawl was 100% wrong.
 
DrStiles said:
It'd be pretty funny if Ganondorf went from being a Captain Falcon clone to a Robin clone.
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If Ganondorf kept his side B, aerial down and aerial forward, do whatever they want with Ganondorf. I must have my CHOKE SLAM!

Golnei said:
Speaking of Ganondorf and spells, why does he have dark effects on his moves, anyway? In TP and OoT, didn't he mainly have light or lightning-based magic?
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I swear that I saw Ganondorf doing dark magic in a gif that was posted somewhere, but it could be fake tho.
 
PadWarrior said:
I posted this last night but a lot of folks missed it. Here's footage of Smash on an original 3DS:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K2WZnM1pho
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To anyone who never saw smash 3DS in person, that video is great. It instantly stuck out to me how smooth the game runs. It's impressive. Especially after watching 30fps youtube streams/content all day, to see the game run in 60fps is a treat.

IntelliHeath said:
If Ganondorf kept his side B, aerial down and aerial forward, do whatever they want with Ganondorf. I must have my CHOKE SLAM!
I swear that I saw Ganondorf doing dark magic in a gif that was posted somewhere, but it could be fake tho.
Click to expand...

For ganondorf to ever get better we need to let go heath. Just let his old moveset go. We don't need it anymore. Whatever we're used to, we have to let it go or sakurai will never change. It's comments like "whatever happens, he just needs to keep his warlock punch" or "I need that choke slam" that makes them not want to change him. Everyone, just be willing to accept him as 'cut' and then we can have a new ganondorf/ganon rise from his ashes.

Let him go, please.
 
Wow, I can't believe that it took me almost an entire day to catch up on the goings-on in this thread. (Going at a completely leisurely pace of course.) It was completely worth it, but if things keep going at this rate and I wake up tomorrow to find another 50 pages of whackiness, then I just won't have the stamina left to leaf through it all again :-( . I think that any statement or sentiment I agree with has already been expressed, so... keep up the good work of having mostly good opinions, guys?

MaverickHunterAsh said:
Here's something fun: now that Captain Falcon is confirmed, rank the remaining unconfirmed Brawl vets (plus Mewtwo, I guess) in terms of how much you care about them returning in Smash 4!
Click to expand...

1. Ice Climbers
2. Wario
3. Ness
4. Snake
5. Mr. Game & Watch
6. Meta Knight
7. Ivysaur
8. Mewtwo
9. Falco
10. Lucas
11. Wolf
12. Ganondorf
13. Squirtle
14. R.O.B.
15. Jigglypuff

Right from the start, I wanted Lucario and Ike back more than any potential newcomer, so every reveal since the naysayers were proved wrong has basically felt like a bonus to me. (I wish I could say that I wanted Wolf and Lucas with the same fervour, but I know that would be a lie. It would still be great to see them back, of course!)
 
georly said:
Ganondorf not known for spells? That's literally all he does in ocarina of time while he's ganondorf. WW and TP ganondorf do less, but still, he's at least 50% spells 50% sword :p Smash melee/brawl was 100% wrong.
Click to expand...

WW Ganondorf doesn't use any spells in his battle, but you fight him immediately after fighting Puppet Ganon who was a prime example of Ganon's magic in action.

In any case we really ought to have tennis involved in some way.
 
Berordn said:
WW Ganondorf doesn't use any spells in his battle, but you fight him immediately after fighting Puppet Ganon who was a prime example of Ganon's magic in action.

In any case we really ought to have tennis involved in some way.
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I technically count him conjuring and controlling the puppet ganons as spells, but yeah, he does none. I also count OoT Ganondorf summoning and creating phantom ganon as a spell, as well.

All I ask is for one projectile spell or something, and i'll be happy.
 
georly said:
For ganondorf to ever get better we need to let go heath. Just let his old moveset go. We don't need it anymore. Whatever we're used to, we have to let it go or sakurai will never change. It's comments like "whatever happens, he just needs to keep his warlock punch" or "I need that choke slam" that makes them not want to change him. Everyone, just be willing to accept him as 'cut' and then we can have a new ganondorf/ganon rise from his ashes.

Let him go, please.
Click to expand...

The side-B is pretty much the only move actually from a Zelda game, though. Even if everything else needs to be changed.
 
Berordn said:
I'd very much doubt the Ice Climbers were ever on the chopping block, since they're still getting representation:

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If we're extending the logic that "playable reps get enemy representation in Smash Run" toward a Rhythm Heaven rep with the Sneaky Spirit, then the Ice Climbers are probably in there too.
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Yeah, I think Ice Climbers will work on different mechanics and still be in the game. My guess for the cuts are Pokémon Trainer, Snake, Lucas, and Wolf making the roster around 47-48.
 
You know what I'm looking forward to the most? The Smash 4 photo thread. We've had photo threads for Pikmin 3 and Wind Waker HD, but I feel that the Smash thread is gonna be the real deal.

You could upload photos from Brawl too, but it was a hassle and they looked like shite. With the Wii U's ability to upload directly to the browser, the photo thread is going to be fantastic.
 
georly said:
xFor ganondorf to ever get better we need to let go heath. Just let his old moveset go. We don't need it anymore. Whatever we're used to, we have to let it go or sakurai will never change. It's comments like "whatever happens, he just needs to keep his warlock punch" or "I need that choke slam" that makes them not want to change him. Everyone, just be willing to accept him as 'cut' and then we can have a new ganondorf/ganon rise from his ashes.

Let him go, please.
Click to expand...

XVl296K.gif


We wouldn't know :P



Rychu Supadude said:
Wow, I can't believe that it took me almost an entire day to catch up on the goings-on in this thread. (Going at a completely leisurely pace of course.) It was completely worth it, but if things keep going at this rate and I wake up tomorrow to find another 50 pages of whackiness, then I just won't have the stamina left to leaf through it all again :-( . I think that any statement or sentiment I agree with has already been expressed, so... keep up the good work of having mostly good opinions, guys?



1. Ice Climbers
2. Wario
3. Ness
4. Snake
5. Mr. Game & Watch
6. Meta Knight
7. Ivysaur
8. Mewtwo
9. Falco
10. Lucas
11. Wolf
12. Ganondorf
13. Squirtle
14. R.O.B.
15. Jigglypuff

Right from the start, I wanted Lucario and Ike back more than any potential newcomer, so every reveal since the naysayers were proved wrong has basically felt like a bonus to me. (I wish I could say that I wanted Wolf and Lucas with the same fervour, but I know that would be a lie. It would still be great to see them back, of course!)
Click to expand...

That's how I felt about this thread being moving so fast. Its pretty hard to catch up when I'm busy this week.

Hmm, if we get rid of Squirtle, Ivysaur and Snake then we might have like 12 characters to go. I'm still unsure about Mewtwo.
 
Kjellson said:
You know what I'm looking forward to the most? The Smash 4 photo thread. We've had photo threads for Pikmin 3 and Wind Waker HD, but I feel that the Smash thread is gonna be the real deal.

You could upload photos from Brawl too, but it was a hassle and they looked like shite. With the Wii U's ability to upload directly to the browser, the photo thread is going to be fantastic.
Click to expand...

I hope we get photos, video replays, and good online like Mario Kart 8.
 
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