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[call_kotaku]

Ok? Plenty of people? Really? There's some misguided paranoia around right now, but I think we all have discussed this back and forth and everyone have seemed to be more than sober to me.

Oculus VR has repeatedly repeated and warned about this by far isn't a consumer device. It's appalling to hear that some people despite all this are stupid enough to believe it is.

I've seen a couple ridiculous things being said on the internets (the FOV charade is borderline embarrasing, I almost feel sorry for OVR having to fend off overly entitled people). But that's for the most part coming from ignorants who are aggregating negatives which in the big picture are not.

I saw a good amount of hysteria over the announcement of DK2 and the fact that CV1 might be more than 9 months away, when they've obviously already got the highest-quality consumer VR device people can buy. I suppose some of it was people being anxious about Morpheus or Samsung beating Oculus to market, but people did express doubts about Oculus's decision to spend more time in development and wait for better optics/displays.

This does make me curious about what kind of changes Sony would need to make before bringing Morpheus to market, though, since their current devkit is inferior specs-wise to DK2. Their audience would theoretically be less tech-savvy with possibly equally high expectations.

 

[bj00rn_]

The FoV thing is a legit criticism, I think. Some people are very harsh about it rather than constructive, but to call it a 'charade' ignores an important part of the immersion-enhancing aspect of VR.

As for people thinking this would be good enough for a consumer product, this is mostly an older sentiment, but one that was entirely real and very widespread. 1080p/60fps was pretty much all that was initially expected of CV1 initially. And most people were ok with that and still excited about it. There was a very long period where we didn't know if a DK2 was coming at all, and we only found out that CV1 would have higher specs a bit earlier this year. So yes, for quite a while, the DK2(in terms of specs) was definitely considered to be good enough for a consumer product.

What, this is the first time I've ever seen someone saying that. Maybe I haven't been a part of all discussions on internet, but from my point of view it has never ever been a expectation that 1080p would be good enough. And I think Palmer very early in the process said that the CV would be higher than 1080p for that reason. That's why many of us have expected at least ~1440p all along

FOV is a legit criticism in a intelligent discussion about the technology, immersion and precision of VR, yes, but not as a entitled and paranoid consumer, which is how the internet has been centered around from what I've seen.

 

[flyinpiranha]

I do'nt know, from thoses impressions it's hard to see if they are nitpicking cause they are used to it, or if thee is really something broken with the immersion. That's why i'd like to see person trying it for the first time. If it's harder to create disoriented reactions for exemple it could be an indication.
.

Go to reddit or the official OVR forums, tons of "first timers" with great impressions of how amazing it is.

I honestly think people are thinking this is a CV release, not a DK release. Just in this thread people running with a card that is two tiers under the MINIMUM recommended with default settings. That will cause issues. It takes tweaking, editing files, etc ... to really get it to work.

I get mine today and I'll be a "first timer" and I'm completely keeping my expectations in check. I'm not loading up a 3DS game expecting it to look like a PS4 game. I know there will be screendoor, tracking issues, configuration problems.

Shame we live in an age where graphic fidelity trumps innovation and an incredible new way to experience gaming(and other experiences). But you're right. It isn't going to be mainstream right away because of this. Thankfully there are enough of us that don't feel this way that will support the tech so you and others can enjoy it later on.

Yeah, it is sad. I think the expectations of the "COD" on the Rift is a bit biased towards personal expectations. Minecraft is the best selling PC game of all time, and it's a pixelated mess in comparison. I think if the experience is there, people will come, regardless of the graphic fidelity.

What, this is the first time I've ever seen someone saying that. Maybe I haven't been a part of all discussions on internet, but from my point of view it has never ever been a expectation that 1080p would be good enough. And I think Palmer very early in the process said that the CV would be higher than 1080p for that reason. That's why many of us have expected at least ~1440p all along

FOV is a legit criticism in a intelligent discussion about the technology, immersion and precision of VR, yes, but not as a entitled and paranoid consumer, which is how the internet has been centered around from what I've seen.

Nah, first time I've seen that in more recent discussions. I remember people speaking of it before DK2 was even announced but even Palmer has said numerous times around DK2 announcement that 1080p is not even a minimum, it would need to be higher.

I think we're going to see A LOT of different types of criticism with the DK2 because consumers purchased it with the expectation it could be a CV product until the CV comes out. Hell, I'm partially using it for that but also plan to really get my hands dirty and my expectations are in check.

 

[Zaptruder]

What, this is the first time I've ever seen someone saying that. Maybe I haven't been a part of all discussions on internet, but from my point of view it has never ever been a expectation that 1080p would be good enough. And I think Palmer very early in the process said that the CV would be higher than 1080p for that reason. That's why many of us have expected at least all along ~1440p

Nope. Your recall of the facts are inaccurate. Or at least the temporality of them are skewed.

1080p was definetly perceived as good enough and people were surprised and excited to learn that 1440p would be the likely targeted standard for CV1.

It's only been about 6 or so months since we've learned of that fact, a shorter period than DK1 has been out and VR as a whole has been speculated about.

My direction of bias on the DK2 FOV issue is that people without glasses are entitled bastards

I had to use DK1 @ 85 degree FOV, and I thought it was fine. I'm stoked to find out that I get to use DK2 @ 105 degree FOV.

 

[Seanspeed]

What, this is the first time I've ever seen someone saying that. Maybe I haven't been a part of all discussions on internet, but from my point of view it has never ever been a expectation that 1080p would be good enough. And I think Palmer very early in the process said that the CV would be higher than 1080p for that reason.

Pretty sure it was only said CV1 would be higher than 1080p back in March(?), when DK2 pre-ordering was announced. Before that, there was hope CV1 would be higher, but 1080p was the expectation.

And if you haven't been following the discussions here in the past, then yea, you've probably only got a very recent picture of what people's views on things are.

 

[bj00rn_]

Nope. Your recall of the facts are inaccurate. Or at least the temporality of them are skewed.

1080p was definetly perceived as good enough and people were surprised and excited to learn that 1440p would be the likely targeted standard for CV1.

It's only been about 6 or so months since we've learned of that fact, a shorter period than DK1 has been out and VR as a whole has been speculated about.

My direction of bias on the DK2 FOV issue is that people without glasses are entitled bastards

I had to use DK1 @ 85 degree FOV, and I thought it was fine. I'm stoked to find out that I get to use DK2 @ 105 degree FOV.

It's been way more than 6 months since we knew that. Luckey said in an interview more than a year ago around when the discussions really got a momentum, I'm pretty sure of that and remember talking about it here before the summer last year (and if I'm wrong still, I'll accept the defeat like a humble man )

Maybe charade was a harsh word, and I do think the FOV issue worth discussing, just not in the kind of atmosphere I've seen. And as you say the FOV will in some instances be better for some.

Pretty sure it was only said CV1 would be higher than 1080p back in March(?), when DK2 pre-ordering was announced. Before that, there was hope CV1 would be higher, but 1080p was the expectation.

And if you haven't been following the discussions here in the past, then yea, you've probably only got a very recent picture of what people's views on things are.

Ah, it seems to me that we have a different perception of time. More than a year ago is ancient times to me

 

[wickfut]

My DK2 arrived a few hours ago and while I'm taking a short break I've decided to share my thoughts that spring to mind

1) The resolution isn't that good. It doesn't seem to be much of an improvement over the DK1 to be honest.
2) The setup with clone/extended monitors is a nightmare compared to the DK1.
3) The screen is bright and colourful, and the blacks are so black I keep wanting to turn the brightness up as I'm used to LCD.
4) The colours are out of whack with chromatic aberration everywhere and it's probably the worst thing about the DK2.
5) I've not noticed any purple black smears yet, but I haven't been looking for them.
6) Elite Dangerous plays quite nice in the DK2 but it's too low res
7) Radial G loses its sense of speed in VR.
8) I haven't felt ill yet. But I have felt a bit queasy doing loop the loops through asteroid belts in Elite.
9) The FoV isn't as bad as people are making out. I wouldn't have noticed anything if I hadn't read peoples moaning about it first.
10) I want to see Titans of Space more than anything else on the DK2. Hurry Drash!
11) My SLI GTX 670s work fine.


and, I'm going back in..

 

[MrCunningham]

I think you are just seeing some people who expected a consumer product.

Personally, I'm - if anything - more hyped after these DK2 impressions: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxyfWtFoHkE
Particularly the raving about contrast/blacks. It will be fantastic to finally play PC games on an OLED display.

The guy makes a few small nitpicks here and there, but overall, this looks amazing.

 

[trudderham]

Can't get mine working on OSX, just have constant orange light

Toolbox says no display detected

Any ideas?

AFAIK Oculus hasn't updated the SDK to support OSX yet. For now, a PC is the only way to get the hardware running.

 

[Seanspeed]

It's been way more than 6 months since we knew that. Luckey said in an interview more than a year ago around when the discussions really got a momentum, I'm pretty sure of that and remember talking about it here before the summer last year (and if I'm wrong still, I'll accept the defeat like a humble man )

They made a vague statement about doing 'something better' than Valve's prototype, but we didn't know if that was specs, features, design or what.

Having a higher resolution than 1080p wasn't specifically mentioned til earlier this year, though.

 

[Krejlooc]

Two shiney new oculus rift dk2s in my hands right now. Like he-man, I have the power!

 

[Bit-Bit]

Two shiney new oculus rift dk2s in my hands right now. Like he-man, I have the power!

Post pics!

 

[Doc Holliday]

DK2 vs DK1 (Inside the Rift): http://youtu.be/mgqzydC5jDs


https://developer.oculusvr.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=11266

probably the best dk2 vs dk1 compsrison video ive seen so far. You can see the improved color, better res, improved persistence and the lower horizontal fov.

 

[la_briola]

Post pics!

edit: oh I forgot the mini-box filled with plugs.

 

[orioto]

1) The resolution isn't that good. It doesn't seem to be much of an improvement over the DK1 to be honest.

Sorry what ??

 

[DEskofier]

Hey guys,

I've ordered two Rifts back in March and against expectation, I don't need the second kit anymore (developer friend doesn't have the money at hand ...)

Just wanted to let you know that I'm selling the kit on ebay if one of you enthusiasts is interested. The kit is unopened and I'm including free priority shipping to get it into the hands of a developer as soon as possible:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=221508218882

If linking to ebay is frowned upon, let me know and I'll redact/delete this post.

That said: Did anyone of you have any luck with the "ovrservice_x64 has stopped working" issue? I'm getting it on one of my desktops unfortunately. The other PC works, though I cannot get Direct to Rift working on there (light stays yellow, extended works). Any help is appreciated!

 

[la_briola]

Hey guys,

I've ordered two Rifts back in March and against expectation, I don't need the second kit anymore (developer friend doesn't have the money at hand ...)

Just wanted to let you know that I'm selling the kit on ebay [...]

Reselling is forbidden, so I would remove the ebay link.

 

[wickfut]

Sorry what ??

As it says on the tin..

The resolution jump from DK1 to DK2 isn't that much. To compare it to a regular monitor, It feels like going from a 640x480 screen to a 800x600 screen.

 

[Doc Holliday]

Reselling is forbidden, so I would remove the ebay link.

You can resell anything, they were cancelling pre-orders of people who they suspected of scalping.

 

[Krejlooc]

Post pics!

 

[DryvBy]

As it says on the tin..

The resolution jump from DK1 to DK2 isn't that much. To compare it to a regular monitor, It feels like going from a 640x480 screen to a 800x600 screen.

I thought it was 720p to 1080p though. Maybe I just didn't pay attention.

 

[Betta Lines]

DK2 vs DK1 (Inside the Rift): http://youtu.be/mgqzydC5jDs

It's pretty clear here - that square all the way around is obvious in DK2, whereas it was much harder for him to position the camera to see all the edges at once in DK1. It might be considered a very small change in terms of values, but the effect is significant. It's a disappointing step backwards on a device that is otherwise a big step forward.

 

[Soi-Fong]

I thought it was 720p to 1080p though. Maybe I just didn't pay attention.

No for him, the jump doesn't seem that high. Seems like a lot of people were expecting an HD-like picture, but it doesn't work that way for VR.

 

[Zamorro]

Talking about resolution, did anybody see this?

Nvidia quadruples display resolution by stacking two cheap LCD panels on top of each other

 

[wickfut]

I thought it was 720p to 1080p though. Maybe I just didn't pay attention.

It is. But your face is pressed against the screen so you don't see the whole image. The yellow circles represent your focussed view when looking forward. See how much of the screen is wasted and you aren't seeing?

 

[DEskofier]

Reselling is forbidden, so I would remove the ebay link.

Do you mean reselling is forbidden in neogaf? Or Oculus is disallowing reselling?

 

[orioto]

No for him, the jump doesn't seem that high. Seems like a lot of people were expecting an HD-like picture, but it doesn't work that way for VR.

Yeah but even if the VR makes the rez less effective, i mean.. The first one had an horrible resolution..

 

[la_briola]

Do you mean reselling is forbidden in neogaf? Or Oculus is disallowing reselling?

They "say" that you are "forbidden" to resell it, but lets be real here. You are from Germany, you can resell everything.

But selling it on ebay with no price limit seems like scalping, tbh. Do what you please. ;-)

 

[Krejlooc]

Now comes the longest day of work. When I get home, I have the new version of elite along with a freshly complete fight stick stand and the rift waiting, PLUS tlou remastered.

Soooo many toys 7 hours away...

 

[Krejlooc]

Initial reaction without turning it on or anything? This headset fits so much better than the first thanks to the flat lenses.

 

[Woody Invincible]

My unit finally shipped this morning, so I'll be diving in Thursday evening.

 

[wickfut]

Now comes the longest day of work. When I get home, I have the new version of elite along with a freshly complete fight stick stand and the rift waiting, PLUS tlou remastered.

Soooo many toys 7 hours away...

Well Elite is offline at the moment. It won't let you log in, and that's the reason why I'm not playing it. It's probably updating the servers for the beta update today.

 

[DEskofier]

They "say" that you are "forbidden" to resell it, but lets be real here. You are from Germany, you can resell everything.

But selling it on ebay with no price limit seems like scalping, tbh. Do what you please. ;-)

We Germans can do what we want, huh?

jk, I can understand that this looks like scalping - and I thought about selling the Rift on here or in /r/oculus before putting it on ebay. But with these crazy prices, I was afraid that any other way would only attract the attention of scammers.

What would have been a better way to sell it in your opinion?

 

[la_briola]

We Germans can do what we want, huh?

jk, I can understand that this looks like scalping - and I thought about selling the Rift on here or in /r/oculus before putting it on ebay. But with these crazy prices, I was afraid that any other way would only attract the attention of scammers.

What would have been a better way to sell it in your opinion?

Yeah, that sounds reasonable.

 

[Blizzard]

My DK2 arrived a few hours ago and while I'm taking a short break I've decided to share my thoughts that spring to mind

1) The resolution isn't that good. It doesn't seem to be much of an improvement over the DK1 to be honest.
4) The colours are out of whack with chromatic aberration everywhere and it's probably the worst thing about the DK2.

These are two of the biggest things that seem to jump out from pictures taken through the lens. As far as I understand, the different lenses this time cause worse chromatic aberration which has to be software-corrected...but it makes everything look awful, especially if it's not a demo that is not using correction properly.

I also wonder if lacking correction and/or NEEDING correction makes things look blurrier and lower resolution than they would otherwise appear.

 

[Bit-Bit]

Maaaaaan, I'm so jelly of you guys right now.

 

[Soi-Fong]

These are two of the biggest things that seem to jump out from pictures taken through the lens. As far as I understand, the different lenses this time cause worse chromatic aberration which has to be software-corrected...but it makes everything look awful, especially if it's not a demo that is not using correction properly.

I also wonder if lacking correction and/or NEEDING correction makes things look blurrier and lower resolution than they would otherwise appear.

Since the optics was changed, I wonder if demos like the Ghibli ones are experiencing heavy chromatic aberration since they were made with the DK1 optics in mind.

I think it's important we judge the device off native DK2 experiences, not ones that were ported to the DK2.

 

[Durante]

A lot of the complaints seem based on running DK1 software on DK2.

Especially the ease of use ones, with the service and display driver DK2 will be much more convenient and consistent to use than DK1.

 

[orioto]

A lot of the complaints seem based on running DK1 software on DK2.

I hope.

 

[plagiarize]

A lot of the complaints seem based on running DK1 software on DK2.

Especially the ease of use ones, with the service and display driver DK2 will be much more convenient and consistent to use than DK1.

Yeah. I think the service / display driver combo is going to work awesomely.

My should be arriving tomorrow (it's in the state!). The first thing I'm going to try is the game I've been making in UE4.3, which hopefully won't be too much of a headache to fire up.

With the DK1, the only thing I can reliably get to launch in direct mode is the test desk thing. Valkyrie V and the Ghibli stuff doesn't work for me with the direct launchers. Windows 8.1. I was able to get Tuscany working too, I think, but I might be misremembering.

I'm prepared for annoyances though, and really eager to see positional tracking in action finally!

It's a shame it comes right before we fly out of the state (on Thursday) but I'd rather get an evening to try it out first than have it come right after we leave.

 

[Betta Lines]

Since the optics was changed, I wonder if demos like the Ghibli ones are experiencing heavy chromatic aberration since they were made with the DK1 optics in mind.

I think it's important we judge the device off native DK2 experiences, not ones that were ported to the DK2.

The desk demo in the calibration tool should be optimised for DK2 right? Because the smaller FOV is just as apparent to me on there as in the Tuscany demo, as is the chromatic aberration (although I found that effect to be just as bad in the DK1).

 

[Blizzard]

Yeah. I think the service / display driver combo is going to work awesomely.

My should be arriving tomorrow (it's in the state!). The first thing I'm going to try is the game I've been making in UE4.3, which hopefully won't be too much of a headache to fire up.

Has Oculus SDK 0.4.0 support been added to UE4 yet? I thought that was still pending, not to mention Oculus still having further SDK updates that maybe Epic is waiting on.

 

[bee]

just got home and got everything plugged in, the oculus software recognises it etc but haven't actually used it yet, they've certainly shrunk the box that takes all the inputs a lot, can't remember an update firmware option on dk1 either

so it's just set ipd and adjust the headset and go ye? gonna get something to eat first

 

[Donnie]

I thought it was 720p to 1080p though. Maybe I just didn't pay attention.

Personally I think the jump in resolution is huge, its still certainly far from perfect but its a very large difference IMO. Technically the resolution of the DK2 screen is double that of DK1, so definitely a bigger increase than 640x480 to 800x600, though I'm sure that was just a rough example.

Also surely now that the screen is only 5" rather than 7" (like it was in DK1) the effective resolution increase is even higher than double? Since you're now seeing a higher percentage of the entire available pixels than before?

 

[plagiarize]

Has Oculus SDK 0.4.0 support been added to UE4 yet? I thought that was still pending, not to mention Oculus still having further SDK updates that maybe Epic is waiting on.

4.3 has native DK2 support with positional tracking. Not sure what version of the SDK its based on, but that is what was announced when it released and they included the Couch Knights example.

 

[Seanspeed]

Personally I think the jump in resolution is huge, its still certainly far from perfect but its a very large difference IMO. Technically the resolution of the DK2 screen is double that of DK1, so definitely a bigger increase than 640x480 to 800x600, though I'm sure that was just a rough example.

Also surely now that the screen is only 5" rather than 7" (like it was in DK1) the effective resolution increase is even higher than double? Since you're now seeing a higher percentage of the entire available pixels than before?

Right, although the pentile arrangement means its not quite as pixel dense as a traditional 1080p LCD(from what I hear).

 

[wickfut]

Personally I think the jump in resolution is huge, its still certainly far from perfect but its a very large difference IMO. Technically the resolution of the DK2 screen is double that of DK1, so definitely a bigger increase than 640x480 to 800x600, though I'm sure that was just a rough example.

Also surely now that the screen is only 5" rather than 7" (like it was in DK1) the effective resolution increase is even higher than double? Since you're now seeing a higher percentage of the entire available pixels than before?

Here is an image grab from Radial G. I have drawn a box around the whole viewable area.

Look at the bottom of the screen which shows the dimensions of the box. 830x737 pixels.

So a 1080p screen grab in the rift has a total 830x737 pixels viewable per eye - this includes the pixels in your peripheral vision that you can only really see in focus when you move your eyeballs.

So my estimate of it looking like it was running on a 800x600 resolution monitor was quite close.

 

[bj00rn_]

It is. But your face is pressed against the screen so you don't see the whole image. The yellow circles represent your focussed view when looking forward. See how much of the screen is wasted and you aren't seeing?

I was a little confused reading your first post (goes against all previews I've seen), and this one certainly didn't help either.. I don't get it. Even if the eyes worked like this (the focused center area is actually much smaller, and most people's eyes can see a larger horizontal FOV than both the DK1 and DK2 have), how is this different from the DK1?

Oh well, I'll get see for myself on friday and compare it to my DK1.

Edit: Just checked ebay for fun, wow the DK2s are flooding in..

 

[Blizzard]

4.3 has native DK2 support with positional tracking. Not sure what version of the SDK its based on, but that is what was announced when it released and they included the Couch Knights example.

The problems reported are as follows:

Yes, UE4 compatibility is broken. I'm attempting the work around for making it work though without uninstalling 0.4 Runtime, so I will report back once I make it work...somehow.

Here the works around that was just posted on the OR forums

Hey guys.

As many of you recently figured out DK2 and UE4 4.3 do not work together if Oculus Runtime 0.4 is installed.

We apologize for the mess. I want to confirm that UE4 4.3 is indeed DK2-ready. The problem is the new 0.4 Runtime that unfortunately is incompatible with 0.3-based apps for now. We are working on resolving this issue right now, as well as preparing a new integration of UE4 and Oculus SDK 0.4.

As a workaround for now - you should not install 0.4 Runtime while you use UE4 4.3. Instead, you'll need to install a DK2 camera driver, download link:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/static.ocul...+Installer.exe
(Note: you will need to uninstall this driver later when you decide to switch to 0.4).

If you already have installed 0.4 Runtime then you may either uninstall it and install the camera driver from above, or you need to disable the OVRService by performing the following steps:
1) Remove or Disable the "Oculus Service Scheduler" from the Windows Task Scheduler: "Start" button -> "Task Scheduler"
2) Switch display mode to Extended mode or uninstall the Oculus Display Driver;
3) Remove "OculusConfigUtil.exe" from Programs -> Startup (For example, C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs\Startup).

https://developer.oculusvr.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=11044&p=145877

So it sounds like you may be able to get UE4 support working, but at the cost of the new SDK. I'm just going to install the new SDK stuff and wait for UE4 to update.

 

[LordCanti]

It's pretty clear here - that square all the way around is obvious in DK2, whereas it was much harder for him to position the camera to see all the edges at once in DK1. It might be considered a very small change in terms of values, but the effect is significant. It's a disappointing step backwards on a device that is otherwise a big step forward.

Hopefully it's just a step backward to get DK2 out the door. I won't know until I get mine, but that video makes it seem like the border of the screen would constantly be in view whereas the borders in DK1 were often not visible for me (depending on the demo).