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Phil Spencer: MS will spend money on marketing and developing Rise of the Tomb Raider
- Thread starter CassidyIzABeast
- Start date
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
Look at the post I was responding to. I'm not saying Phil is definitely lying. I'm saying that believing him just because he said something is silly. Can't even make a little joke without somebody jumping down your throat.
My post is akin to asking this question.
soul creator
Member
Yes, retailers often make assumptions/put in placeholders to get people to preorder things, even when no official information is available. I remember working at a Gamestop that hide platforms and release dates for all sorts of random shit, even when no official details were available
Amazon still says the game is coming out at the end of the year, for example: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00KVRNIQU/?tag=neogaf0e-20
Retailer preorder info isn't reliable, especially when the official information from the publisher (original press release) never mentioned any platforms (and was only announced at an MS conference)
Edit: also, read the link where your picture is from. Even that article is just speculating and doesn't use your picture as some sort of official confirmation: http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Rise-Tomb-Raider-Coming-Xbox-360-PS3-64689.html
Nightengale
Member
MS press release separated Tomb Raider from 'Xbox exclusives.'
This. If they are indeed helping with the dev of this game then all of this "concerned gamer" outrage is for naught. There are plenty of games like this on all sorts of platforms, timed or not.
Should Microsoft just lay back and watch Sony trounce them this gen? Look, Playstation may have the better hardware this gen but that doesn't mean Nintendo and MS shouldn't fight for their lives to get our attention. Its called business and it keeps the industry healthy. Paying for exclusives (and sometimes complete buy-outs of companies) is as old as time and some here over the past week have acted as if it were a personal affront that MS attempt to collate a desirable library for their system.
I personally think Microsoft should have announced it as "Xbox One First for Fall 2015" but I still don't know what was so bad about "Coming Holiday 2015, Exclusive to Xbox One". Seems most gamers misunderstood the use of the comma? If it's a Mass Effect type of deal then it may even be a long while until it hits other hardware.Who knows? We certainly don't. That's no reason to defame a guy by calling him "Scum" though.
Neander
Member
Except that the man in charge of Xbox is saying they are and no one at SE or CD have said anything to refute that. Sure, you can choose to call him a liar and not believe him/them. But by default, the needle is tilted in one direction since that's all we have to go by at this time.
soul creator
Member
I'm referring to Square's press release: http://www.tombnews.com/news/2014/06/0902/
As I mentioned, it was assumed to be multiplatform due to past history (and it certainly feels like a logical assumption to make), but it was never actually announced that way.
I'm guessing the deal was still being worked out or whatever, but I haven't found any information ever saying that it was coming to any non-Xbox platforms.
Edit: it's pretty fascinating to research this. For example, this site says it's coming to all next-gen platforms: http://archaeologyoftombraider.com/2014/06/09/square-enix-announce-rise-of-the-tomb-raider/
But if you follow the link they source for their story (which is that same official press release), it doesn't make any mention of platforms, lol: http://gamingeverything.com/rise-of-the-tomb-raider-official-announcement/
I still can't find anything from SE or CD themselves ever announcing it was multiplatform
OverlordSteph
Banned
That's where you are wrong, consumers don't need to know anything about a business deal. All you need to do is turn up and buy the game. And why would MS tell you if the game is coming to ps4 or pc that is up to Sony/SE/CD to relay that message back to us.
Stare-Bear
Banned
If they supply free devkits that could count as helping in development. But the way their messaging has been this week it could mean that a Microsoft employee said the grass texture should be blue and thus helped in development.
His use of the word "developing" in context could mean multiple things I'd note (probably already noted but don't have time to read entire thread ):
I struggle to imagine it's the third option. The others seem for more likely at this stage.
- Develop awareness and demand for the game via PR and marketing to allow it to sell to its maximum potential
- Provide optimization development resources - such as they did with Destiny
- Co-develop with input to design and game creation
I struggle to imagine it's the third option. The others seem for more likely at this stage.
Don Mattrick would have cancelled the game and made a television series out of it ...
Don´t be so hard on Phil
They help develop all 3rd party Xbox versions. If a dev has issues/ needs extra help they send engineers to the devs. See Diablo 3 and Destiny
NDAs, how do they work? No one at SE or CD commented on the exclusivity until Spencer talked about it. At that point they said it was a timed exclusive and referred to Spencer's comment on it.
Chobel
Member
SE/CD can't relay the message because MS obviously made sure (in the contract) that SE/CD don't advertise PS/PC versions.
shacklesmcgee
Member
Well, then you could say where is the evidence that he's not lying or is lying. That's why I was saying it's kind of a stupid argument, it can just go on and on.
licktheenvelope
Member
You mean "maximum potential on Xbox"... because it sure as hell wont be selling to it's maximum potential.
matrix-cat
Member
lol, any question you want to answer, mate.
But we do deserve to know. We are their customers and they should be informing us on what they offer without being disingenuous about the product or service they are selling you or the services and products of others. When they make a deal on something, they should not deliberately try and misrepresent that deal by being ambiguous or disingenuous. We deserve to know what that deal entails to for us, their consumers. And as I said; this isn't just on Microsoft, it's also on Square Enix. It's just that Microsoft is on the forefront because they're continually being vague about this, whereas Square is just not saying anything.
This whole "Companies do what they do; it's just business #DealWithIt"-attitude is really puzzling to me. So companies should be allowed to be intentionally ambiguous in order to mislead us 'because that is what companies do'?
It being at a their event first doesn't mean anything. As long as it wasn't announced or hinted to have any sort of exclusivity. The game was coming to other platforms. Yes retailers can be mistaken but multiple ones across different terrorists around the world taking pre-orders doesn't suggest the game wasn't coming out to other platforms.
And there is nothing pointing it being an exclusive in any form at that point or MS helping the game's development or SE to publish the game until now. Which is the point people are making if it wasn't exclusive at that point then the only other thing it can be is a multiplat game.
Again, wording is iffy. "We will be spending money on developing the game", basically wanting to say they are involved in development -- a phrase that is only true by a technicality. Especially when an insider mod confirmed that TR didn't need any help getting it developed, let alone financially. Sounds again like a carefully constructed sentence that could get people thinking that Microsoft is somehow directly involved in its development process in attempt to douse the fire for its bought exclusivity.
cripterion
Member
There was a thread asking on more precision about the content of Destiny (1 location per planet, etc..) with allegations that they also mislead us into thinking there was this vast land we could explore and most gaffers shot it down as gamers being entitled when it was legitimate concern about the game that people liked and were planning to buy.
Now this is about some bullshit timed exclusivity and people make a big deal out of this.
Like I've said before, some people care more about what companies do as a business than the actual games they claim to love.
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Without articles like this:
http://www.joystiq.com/2013/10/29/titanfall-exclusive-to-xbox-one-xbox-360-and-pc-forever/
And obfuscation from Spencer it is very obvious that it is timed exclusive. If it wasn't he would already have said it is exclusive forever, just as they and EA did for Titanfall. Trying to muddy the waters by implying they have helped with development proves nothing.
It is timed exclusive, nothing more or less and MS are trying to imply that they have tied up the full exclusive but can't say that as it isn't true. That is the dishonesty people don't like, trying nod and wink to gamers that, yeah this is a full exclusive, while not actually saying it outright with phrases like "coming holiday 2015, exclusive to Xbox". So when it does eventually come out on PS4/PC those few people who buy XB1 to play the game have nothing to complain about because every statement makes a mention of 2015, even though they have all be worded in such a way to imply that it is indefinite and 2015 is just the launch.
Anyone still arguing that it isn't timed exclusive, if it wasn't why hasn't Spencer/Harrison/Major Nelson come out and used the word "forever" or "indefinitely"? That would clear up any and all confusion right away. The omission of such language is proof enough that it is timed exclusive, and the concerted effort to confuse people is yet more proof.
Why even bother getting involved in this shit show? Let MS tie themselves up in knots trying to pretend and imply that it is fully exclusive and just count down the days until the deal is over.
If that was the case then why didn't Spencer end all of the confusion and just say "It is Xbox exclusive forever" instead of using bullshit language like they have? We have an example with Titanfall where once the deal was made for the lifetime exclusive articles and quotes popped up with that information using words like "forever", "lifetime" and "indefinitely". The lack of this language for RoTR is very telling.
http://www.joystiq.com/2013/10/29/titanfall-exclusive-to-xbox-one-xbox-360-and-pc-forever/
And obfuscation from Spencer it is very obvious that it is timed exclusive. If it wasn't he would already have said it is exclusive forever, just as they and EA did for Titanfall. Trying to muddy the waters by implying they have helped with development proves nothing.
It is timed exclusive, nothing more or less and MS are trying to imply that they have tied up the full exclusive but can't say that as it isn't true. That is the dishonesty people don't like, trying nod and wink to gamers that, yeah this is a full exclusive, while not actually saying it outright with phrases like "coming holiday 2015, exclusive to Xbox". So when it does eventually come out on PS4/PC those few people who buy XB1 to play the game have nothing to complain about because every statement makes a mention of 2015, even though they have all be worded in such a way to imply that it is indefinite and 2015 is just the launch.
Anyone still arguing that it isn't timed exclusive, if it wasn't why hasn't Spencer/Harrison/Major Nelson come out and used the word "forever" or "indefinitely"? That would clear up any and all confusion right away. The omission of such language is proof enough that it is timed exclusive, and the concerted effort to confuse people is yet more proof.
Why even bother getting involved in this shit show? Let MS tie themselves up in knots trying to pretend and imply that it is fully exclusive and just count down the days until the deal is over.
If that was the case then why didn't Spencer end all of the confusion and just say "It is Xbox exclusive forever" instead of using bullshit language like they have? We have an example with Titanfall where once the deal was made for the lifetime exclusive articles and quotes popped up with that information using words like "forever", "lifetime" and "indefinitely". The lack of this language for RoTR is very telling.
devonraynor
Member
You guys think Sony should step in and ask clarification from SE?
I guess they want to answer their customers as well regarding this situation.
I guess they want to answer their customers as well regarding this situation.
It's not their place to.
What if SE is under NDA
BuggeryBugz
Member
Time will tell.
Well I'm sure it's a risk for both parties.
It might not always be that cut and dry.
Neander
Member
Honest question, what are the odds that they just didn't say anything at the time and planned to announce this at Gamescom all along just to "spread" the news if you will? Wasn't there a rumor that a big third party game was gonna be exclusive at Microsoft's E3 presser but never materialized? Could this have been that game?
Nightengale
Member
Being part-funded didn't stop Titanfall from potentially coming to PS3/4 initially.
There's no fool-proof consistency in all these 'part-funding stuff.' Tales of Vesperia got moneyhatted too, and that came to PS3 without an issue. (in Japan) And their refusal to release it in the west has nothing to do with MS, but entirely on Bamco because lol too old.
Titanfall isnt coming to PS4 at all, its sequel might but that game was tied down completely.
soul creator
Member
But none of that means the game was "announced as multiplatform" which is what the original person I responded to said. It just means that we all assumed it would be, based on SE being a 3rd party publisher, and the previous game being that way. But they certainly didn't announce it as a multiplatform game.
I'm sure Sunset Overdrive has a PC/PS4 build floating around their office somewhere, but that doesn't necessarily mean it was an "announced multiplatform game that was taken away by moneyhats" or whatever, lol
I'd bet that when they say they will help development, they mean they'll help do what they can to get it running as good as they can on the XB1. If it is a timed exclusive, they can take advantage of the focus on the XB1 platform and have that take #1 priority, while a PS4/PC version will likely get less priority(but still run ok due to being more powerful in all likelihood). I think its their way of 'closing the gap' in this instance.
And I imagine the vague statements about exclusivity and publishing is because they *want* people to think this is a proper exclusive and not just a timed exclusive(even if it is). Telling people its a timed exclusive off-the-bat kind of diminishes any impact its exclusivity will have. They'll want to make the most of the money they spent on this.
lol yeah obviously. I think SE are mad to have made this deal but yeah, he clearly means on Xbox platforms only.
Given the previous TR sold the least on Xbox family clearly Spencer and SE have their work cut out for them to raise demand and awareness to the level where it might remotely fill the void left from PC/PS4/PS3.
It's a dumb deal IMHO both tactically and strategically for SE - but to be honest I'd come to the conclusion a long time ago that SE was not a well run business.
Just pointing out that the words he used, in context, can have multiple meaning. In this case its probably accidental but it just adds to the whole air of confusion around the title, this deal and who's doing what to develop, promote and publish this game.
Nightengale
Member
I said initially.
The game was a 13 months exclusive at first before EA sold off the rest of it'd life.
I dont think Sony gives a fuck.
Sony PR team is probably laughing at how bad this got handled by everyone involved.
I think this will not be clarified until after Holidays 2015
Nightengale
Member
Pretty much.
The only way this will get clarified is through someone becoming a scapegoat and revealing the truth, and lose their job.
Cthulhu_Steev
Member
People. PEOPLE. People.
J
JoJo UK
Unconfirmed Member
I wouldn't use amazon as a definitive source on releases...
The screenshot under it? That's from official Microsoft press release.
Heyoooo
Well for a game like this if it wasn't announced with any form exclusivity what else is the game going to be apart from being a multi-plat that had it's debut at MS's stage?
The difference again with SO is it was announced with exclusivity were it was revealed. Whether it comes to other platforms is speculation. In addition they explained why it was an exclusive because of wanting to keep their IP which MS allowed them to.
That's likely but as someone posted early as far as people and MS were considered for that matter at E3 it wasn't an exclusive.
Earthpainting
Member
I was looking for the exact information a few days ago. As far as I could see, there were no platforms announced. Even asking in another thread on GAF, there was no response to prove otherwise. There's some vagueness to be found in the E3 round-up, but it hardly served as a concrete multiplatform announcement. I really do fear it was a case of feeling scorned over an assumption.
Given how it's worded, I do still think we'll see a port to another platform eventually. PC seems like a solid bet, as they also referenced Dead Rising 3, and that is where the series' roots lie. PS4 version is still on the table depending on how involved Microsoft is in this project. I doubt we'll know more until after the original release.
*edit*
Looks like it was less vague than I was lead to believe going by that press statement. Looks like the deal wasn't made or finalised yet at the time of the announcement.
The only thing this debacle has done for me is that now i outright refuse to even consider getting an Xbox one down the line, and as for Tombrider that is now a dead franchise to me.
Kinda bummed about it as i feel MS was doing better and fixing alot of the initial crap, so i guess it´s another gen where i´ll just go PS and PC with the odd WiiU game in the mix.
And yes my word of mouth for Xone will be toxic going forward, and if Sony does this i think i´ll be done with console gaming period.
Kinda bummed about it as i feel MS was doing better and fixing alot of the initial crap, so i guess it´s another gen where i´ll just go PS and PC with the odd WiiU game in the mix.
And yes my word of mouth for Xone will be toxic going forward, and if Sony does this i think i´ll be done with console gaming period.
J
JoJo UK
Unconfirmed Member
soul creator
Member
What else could it be? One possibility is that it was still leaning heavily towards Xbox exclusivity (hence the presence at the MS E3 conference, and the lack of any other platforms mentioned), but the paperwork wasn't signed yet (so it wasn't 100% official). The game was officially in limbo as far as the question "when and where will this be released?" goes (so MS couldn't use any official exclusivity language yet), but all signs were pointing heavily in Microsoft's direction.
Then the final deal gets signed, and all parties agree on the "holiday 2015, only on Xbox" language (or whatever it was it said). SE may or may not have already planned out and budgeted for the release date and platform plans for after 2015, but for now, that's what's known. And the rest is history, lol.
Of course, this is me "reading between the lines", but since that's what everyone else is doing anyway...
Yeah that seems to be the case. Beyond that it doesn't even matter in my opinion.
I honestly believe Rise of the Tomb Raider will be a better game with Microsoft's money. Now it's in Microsoft's best interest making sure it's the best possible game.