Ferguson: Police Kill 18yo Black Male; Fire Gas/Rubber Bullets Into Protesting Crowds

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Ether_Snake said:
Six shots, wherever they were shot, were unwarranted.
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I know, I'm just saying that for those that want to discount the 4 or 5 (or more) witnesses we have now. I'm pretty sure this guy is going to get convicted. The Mc-Bride case in Detroit succeeded with no eyewitnesses (only ear-witnesses, other than the perp.) We have much more than that in this case. Unless the jury pool is just outright racist against black witnesses, this case should be pretty open and shut.
 
GameGuru59 said:
Med. Examiner (Dr. Baden's employee) on MSNBC just said it was really only the final shot to the apex of the head that was fatal. The shot to the eye was survivable if treated. This means whatever happened before the final two shots (probably fired in quick succession) doesn't really matter. If he was surrendering or incapacitated at that point, it should be murder.
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That's not accurate. I don't believe the charging scenario, but it's not fair to say that the other shots would have incapacitated him regardless so therefore the final shot or shots amount to murder. The officer wouldn't be stopping to reassess the situation after every shot, and he shouldn't have to.
 
GameGuru59 said:
I know, I'm just saying that for those that want to discount the 4 or 5 (or more) witnesses we have now. I'm pretty sure this guy is going to get convicted. The Mc-Bride case in Detroit succeeded with no eyewitnesses (only ear-witnesses, other than the perp.) We have much more than that in this case. Unless the jury pool is just outright racist against black witnesses, this case should be pretty open and shut.
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Witness testimony is unreliable and especially so in such an emotional case. I don't think their accounts will matter.
 
benjipwns said:
No, he should have brought charges against the police department and the relevant prosecutors offices.

Wilson is small fish.
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Wilson is a murderer too. You have to make examples before you can change. Obama says he will change, but, he's a corporate stooge, he's no friend of the people.

TacticalFox88 said:
I would've love to see the conservative outrage over this.
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They would probably take up arms and revolt.
 
Ether_Snake said:
It's more a war on black people really. Let's not blur the line too much between black and poor. First you're black, then you're poor.
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The powers that be like those lines between black and poor, It keeps us all fighting against each other instead of together. Imagine if all the poor white people in the south who are diehard republicans realized they've been voting against their own self interest for decades.
 
Whats the tea party's take on this? I would have expected them to join the protests to talk about big goverment, nanny state, federal outreach and persecution of the lamestream media, but nope, just a couple of statements from Rand Paul as he escapes from a mexican.
 
JDSN said:
Whats the tea party's take on this? I would have expected them to join the protests to talk about big goverment, nanny state, federal outreach and persecution of the lamestream media, but nope, just a couple of statements from Rand Paul as he escapes from a mexican.
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The lack of any statements from potential candidates is disheartening to say the least. I would expect a statement from Hillary Clinton by now.
 
ReignofSparrows said:
That's not accurate. I don't believe the charging scenario, but it's not fair to say that the other shots would have incapacitated him regardless so therefore the final shot or shots amount to murder. The officer wouldn't be stopping to reassess the situation after every shot, and he shouldn't have to.
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Well, it depends on how fast he was shooting (which is why I lumped the last two shots together). If he fired a couple of shots, paused, and the situation changed but kept firing, he could be found guilty of something like manslaughter or murder 2 (rage murder). Where it stands now we're talking about murder 1, because he allegedly took an assertive action by getting his out of his car.

Assuming Mike was "charging" (the only thing he could have been doing because Wilson had no significant wounds on him) 99% of people are not going to be charging headlong into someone who is shooting them (let alone aiming at them). Maybe if he was high on bath salts... but there's no evidence at all of that.

Mr.Awesome said:
Witness testimony is unreliable and especially so in such an emotional case. I don't think their accounts will matter.
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Bullshit. If at this point, the testimony of 4 or 5 separate people who don't know each other is discounted by a jury, then that jury is racist. It's already racist. If 4 or 5 white people were saying this about the shooting of a white teen Cpt. Johnson shot, he would be in jail. I'm not calling you racist, but the whole situation is.
 
Bam Bam Baklava said:
You really think Rand Paul represents their views? Not to mention this is only speaking about demilitarization and not about any of the other issues surrounding Ferguson.
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Their purported views or their revealed preferences?

And he discusses the disparate impact on blacks, as he did a few weeks ago at the Urban League.
 
just saw officer's friend testifying to officer Wilson's character. interesting that people are starting to come out and actually talk about him personally. also CNN showed his fathers facebook photos of Wilson.
 
everyday math said:
.
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I didn't even realize a threat was made to them.

AlimNassor said:
No what does the President do? Bomb more innocent people or lie to the people? Obama if he cared would have stopped this madness, we could have seen reforms in the Police, we could have seen justice, but, he does nothing.
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We need a functioning congress to get police reform, or at the very least it's something that the state of Missouri would have to do on their own. I was hoping for executive action, but what with the lawsuit, maybe he doesn't feel like he should be touching that option on a story this hot.
 
AlimNassor said:
No what does the President do? Bomb more innocent people or lie to the people? Obama if he cared would have stopped this madness, we could have seen reforms in the Police, we could have seen justice, but, he does nothing.
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You know, when people call him a tyrant, they still mean it more metaphorically than literally for now.
 
AlimNassor said:
Wilson is a murderer too. You have to make examples before you can change. Obama says he will change, but, he's a corporate stooge, he's no friend of the people.
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I'm no fan of President Obama, but you do realize he only has so much power right? He can't just decide on a whim he wants a person arrested. The only thing he can do is ask the justice department to investigate, which they are. Short of that and calling the Governor to express his opinion, there isn't much else he can do.
 
AlimNassor said:
No what does the President do? Bomb more innocent people or lie to the people? Obama if he cared would have stopped this madness, we could have seen reforms in the Police, we could have seen justice, but, he does nothing.
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How does he reform the police? Last time I checked the DoJ and FBI were investigating. If they can't find grounds necessary to charge this officer what should they do? Make stuff up? Should they just say forget a trial and due process and throw him in prison right now?
 
Bam Bam Baklava said:
You really think Rand Paul represents their views? Not to mention this is only speaking about demilitarization and not about any of the other issues surrounding Ferguson.
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While very true, he's probably talking about it because demilitarization of the police is probably one of the only issues related to Ferguson that can actually be changed with support from all sides (aside from police maybe). Issues of race, especially police brutality towards black people, will hopefully be brought up, especially now that Amnesty International is calling for a thorough investigation of the PD. But let's face it, there's a large chance that even if Wilson gets indicted, even if the Ferguson Police are stripped down and charged with brutality/incompetence/conspiracy to cover up evidence/whatever, nothing will probably come of it. Demilitarization, on the other hand, could happen. I'd rather see some wider changes come out of this tragedy than none. I think the best that can be hoped for is a law requiring all cops to wear cameras so there will be documentation of these abuses.
 
AlimNassor said:
No what does the President do? Bomb more innocent people or lie to the people? Obama if he cared would have stopped this madness, we could have seen reforms in the Police, we could have seen justice, but, he does nothing.
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Reforms in the Police would take time... months and years... and it makes sense that this process wouldn't start until AFTER THIS SITUATION HAS BEEN DEALT WITH.
 
GameGuru59 said:
Well, it depends on how fast he was shooting (which is why I lumped the last two shots together). If he fired a couple of shots, paused, and the situation changed but kept firing, he could be found guilty of something like manslaughter or murder 2 (rage murder). Where it stands now we're talking about murder 1, because he allegedly took an assertive action by getting his out of his car.

Assuming Mike was "charging" (the only thing he could have been doing because Wilson had no significant wounds on him) 99% of people are not going to be charging headlong into someone who is shooting them (let alone aiming at them). Maybe if he was high on bath salts... but there's no evidence at all of that.
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If there was a significant gap between the non fatal and fatal shots and a clearly incapacitated victim, sure, but there isn't any evidence of that.

As for the charging scenario, I think it's ludicrous that (some) people give it equal probability with the surrendering scenario. It is possible, I guess, but highly improbable. So we agree, ultimately, but I was simply responding to you to say that the shot pattern indicated in the autopsy is not going to be dispositive. That was all my post was referring to.
 
Angelus Errare said:
As long as we don't talk about the numerous Vietnam protests and riots or the great depression riots.
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G20 riots, G8 riots, my sports team lost riots...

I remember in Boulder while I was visiting for a summer one time they rioted because the police said they could no longer burn couches in the middle of the street.
 
GameGuru59 said:
Well, it depends on how fast he was shooting (which is why I lumped the last two shots together). If he fired a couple of shots, paused, and the situation changed but kept firing, he could be found guilty of something like manslaughter or murder 2 (rage murder). Where it stands now we're talking about murder 1, because he allegedly took an assertive action by getting his out of his car.

Assuming Mike was "charging" (the only thing he could have been doing because Wilson had no significant wounds on him) 99% of people are not going to be charging headlong into someone who is shooting them (let alone aiming at them). Maybe if he was high on bath salts... but there's no evidence at all of that.


Bullshit. If at this point, the testimony of 4 or 5 separate people who don't know each other is discounted by a jury, then that jury is racist. It's already racist. If 4 or 5 white people were saying this about the shooting of a white teen Cpt. Johnson shot, he would be in jail. I'm not calling you racist, but the whole situation is.
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I certainly want justice brought I just don't think the witness testimony is going to be the smoking gun evidence that they need to convict. Hoping something comes of the fbi investigation and I bet it does.
 
AlimNassor said:
if you people had voted for Ron Paul none of this would have happened.
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Holy shit, man.
KuGsj.gif
 
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