Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread XIII: Leak Dynasty

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Anth0ny said:
One sad thing I noticed while watching these 1 v 1 matches is that the edge game is almost non-existent. The new ledge mechanics, while it will get rid of things like ledge camping and planking, pretty much destroys the edge game and nerfs gimping HARD. This will lead to opponents living longer, and if you combine that with the huge stages, we are going to see some really high percentage kills and some long matches. I mean, how many time outs have we seen since E3? However, I do think there were instances where players were too scared to go off the ledge and try to intercept a recovery with an aerial. Again, unfamiliarity with the new control scheme will lead to less risky play. While I saw some Bowsers go out there and chase with forward airs, most of the time the player on stage would just wait at the ledge while the off stage opponent slowly made his or her way back onto the ledge. Boring. Even the standard edge hog -> intercept your recovering opponent with a back air or down air will be missed. It just added so much depth, precision, and drama to the game and now it’s completely gone. While the game has greater hitstun than Brawl and the gameplay is faster in general, it is definitely hurt by these new edge mechanics combined with the massive stage boundaries and high percent kill moves.
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This is actually one of my favorite parts of SSB4. I've always hated the edge game. I really prefer when stocks get into the super-high percents, I feel like things are a lot more tense when you can get killed from the middle of the stage. (My favorite Melee fights were always in the bottom of Temple.) My experience with the ledge game has honestly been nothing but frustration. Emphasizing the on-stage KO options rather than the comeback ones is a-okay with me.
 
emb said:
I've seen this a lot, and I've never really understood why. Why do so many (or at least why to you) is the edgehogging version so much less interesting?

I guess I always thought it was cool just because it wasn't immediately obvious. There was a bonus for it in Melee, so I felt cool any time I could get it. Honestly I'd much rather see someone die from an edge hog than get Fsmashed off the stage repeatedly.
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I think edge hogging gives the on-stage player too much of an advantage. I mean obviously the person not flying through the air to his possible death should be at an advantage, but to me there are more tools in the on-stage players arsenal when compared to the recovering player. The most effective of these is obviously the edge hog, which is something that is pretty easy to do although it there is a large margin of error.

By removing the edge hog mechanic, you force the on-stage player to make more complex choices. Do you engage in the air for more damage? Go for a meteor strike? Forego that risk and try to finish it back on the stage? I admit it may make for longer matches and finishes are harder, but to me it is more exciting.
 
Beelzebufo said:
Ugh, no thank you, that'd be so confusing. The last thing we need is Assist Trophy versions of playable characters.
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Or you could speculate on the idea on the assumption that he may not be a fighter. It isn't fact.

Anyway Duckhunt Dog as an assist could be interesting. Basically, a bush can grow at the back which is jumps behind and then it summons ducks that bounce/fly around the screen which get shot randomly. If a duck is near you while shot you get hit. It could also do the black with white square overlay to reflect how a light gun game works to obscure the screen briefly. However sometimes the "shooter" will have a bad aim and will shoot in places where the ducks are not so you could get hit even if you're not near a duck. During these instances the "shooter" misses and the dog will of course pop back up and laugh.
 
Hypemaster said:
I know right, people are trying to trophify our playable characters. Not cool.
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Next thing you know we'll be getting "Sunshine Mario" and "Classic Donkey Kong" assist trophies. Nobody would have any clue who or what your would be referring to if you said "Mario". Sunshine Mario the AT? Doctor Mario? Mario Mario? Luigi Mario? A Mario stage? Paper Mario? It'd be terrible.

And that's without even going into having "Duck Hunt Dog" as an AT when "Duck Hunt" is a playable character, since most people are calling Duck Hunt something with "Dog" in it anyway.
 
Does anyone have the link to the menu music that is the remixed menu theme from the first Smash on the N64?

I saw it posted here a thread or two ago (yes, I know) and now I can't find it on Youtube again.

Was it just a fan remix? It sounded like it was from the new game
 
georly said:
Why does it let me complete it multiple times? I thought I did it wrong because it let me do it again, now there are 2 entries.

2014年8月23日に 予約登録済みです。
2014年8月23日に 予約登録済みです。
予約ボーナスの登録ができます。

7ackhPG.png
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Woah, you can register your game on Japanese Club Nintendo? Is there any point? They don't ship rewards to North America, do they?

emb said:
Excellent.

You don't think the Sheik's were just terrible at that matchup? I definitely got that impression more than I thought the matchup looked awful. Still, I'll be glad if Bowser is busted. Hope he's great. Now if only they could figure out a way to make Link good.
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It's entirely possible, but I really do think on paper that Bowser is better than Sheik. He's quick enough now to punish Sheik on any mistake. This was not the case in previous games. Bowser was so slow that he had basically no answers for some of the quicker characters.

Without the speed advantage, what does Sheik have over Bowser? She's light, can't kill, and has less range unless you factor in needles and grenades. Anything can happen with the final game, but I think it's safe to say Bowser has an advantage in the matchup.

I agree with the percent/screen thing, and the negative impact of the edge mechanics. I love that there's no planking, but I hate that edgeguarding is so hurt by it. Did you get any better idea of how invincibility works? I'm hoping that eventually it becomes easy enough to bop folks that grab the edge when coming back. It would actually be cool if we start seeing more off stage edge guarding from it too. And there's the possibility of grabbing the edge after they get it to put them in a poor position maybe.

Glad you're looking forward to it!
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I didn't really get a feel for the new invincibility mechanics, or even notice it that much. Again, I only really played free for alls with items on. I'm sure it'll become more apparent in longer, 1 v 1 games.

Smash definitely not a game that can be figured out from a day of playing. Even the 14+ straight hours I intend to play on launch day won't be enough. Not even close. We will always be learning.
 
Masked Man said:
That's awesome! One of my senpai (no real other word for it) ended up working there for a few years. I, too, once desired to join the Treehouse staff, but I'm pretty happy where I am now. :D Wishing you the best of luck, and let me know if I can be of help!
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Thank you for the kind words! I may take you up on that offer!

Anth0ny said:
Woah, you can register your game on Japanese Club Nintendo? Is there any point? They don't ship rewards to North America, do they?
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No, but if you know someone, maybe they can hook you up.

I signed up so I could get club nintendo picross, and maybe that other eshop game.
 
afoni why

our time together was so short

Anyhow, last night's update made me very happy. I usually have no patience for "the 3DS version is gonna be gimped" stuff, but one area that had me worried was the music. Even though I was totally happy with two tracks per stage in Melee, Brawl spoiled me, and anything less than a full playlist for every stage became a disappointment. But listening to the Spirit Tracks music and seeing the list of composers (people who worked on Galaxy, Paper Mario, and Soul Calibur? hell yeah) gives me confidence. Melee may not have had the quantity of music that Brawl had, but the tracks it did have were extremely well-chosen. Both tracks in Onett, the SMB3 Overworld tune in Yoshi's Island, Fountain of Dreams - great stuff. Here's hoping Smash 3DS has a similarly great selection.
 
Forkball said:
By removing the edge hog mechanic, you force the on-stage player to make more complex choices. Do you engage in the air for more damage? Go for a meteor strike? Forego that risk and try to finish it back on the stage? I admit it may make for longer matches and finishes are harder, but to me it is more exciting.
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I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what edgeguarding is really like. Watch this for a bit. You can basically skip to any part of the video. The on-stage player is already making tons of complex choices and grabbing the edge is in no way an overpowering option that renders other options obsolete. By removing it, you're making things less complex, not more.
 
BGBW said:
You do realise there's a difference between not believing something is indisputable fact and treating something as completely false right?
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Saying "Duck Hunt Dog will make a fine assist trophy" is either treating the leak as completely false, or would be terribly confusing, as I said. I chose the interpretation that was less close-minded on behalf of the poster.
 
Jedi Link said:
I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what edgeguarding is really like. Watch this for a bit. You can basically skip to any part of the video. The on-stage player is already making tons of complex choices and grabbing the edge is in no way an overpowering option that renders other options obsolete. By removing it, you're making things less complex, not more.
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It's just SO frustrating to be on the other side of that shit. I feel like if someone's really good at edgeguarding, you might as well just put down the controller once you get knocked off the edge. The on-stage character just has so many more options than the returning one. Yeah, it takes a lot to pull it off, but it feeds into the combo-based gameplay I've never really liked in Melee, where there's an emphasis on just totally controlling the other person. It's just super unfun for me.
 
Beelzebufo said:
Saying "Duck Hunt Dog will make a fine assist trophy" is either treating the leak as completely false, or would be terribly confusing, as I said. I chose the interpretation that was less close-minded on behalf of the poster.
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It's a joke. If the guy knew that the leak was 100% false, then he would have proven it by now.
 
After listening over and over to Multi-man Smash theme...I'm really loving the Smash 4 theme. It's just so catchy in its own way. It reminded me of that goosebump-inducing E3 Smash trailer last year.
 
Just woke up to see/hear the update.

Oh, man. Friggin' love the Walküre series music. Hiroyuki Kawada should bring some goods. Then there's Kumi Tanioka, Motoi Sakuraba, Keiichi Okabe, Yasunori Mitsuda... Man, I'm as excited this time around for the music as I was when Brawl revealed it's huge list of talent. Dis gon' be gud.
 
I would like if Sakurai was more faithfull to Bowser common style. His drop kicks and speed seems almosts as Sakurai was making fun of the character. Not a fan of the way Luigi is represented in Smash Bros as well.
 
Beelzebufo said:
Saying "Duck Hunt Dog will make a fine assist trophy" is either treating the leak as completely false, or would be terribly confusing, as I said. I chose the interpretation that was less close-minded on behalf of the poster.
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sg0U2jz.gif


Neither side is more open-minded than the other. Technically not picking a side is the only way to truly say you are open-minded.

Beelzebufo said:
As BGBW pointed out, jokes aren't allowed when it comes to the leak. Everything has to be taken completely seriously.
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Peléo;126594569 said:
I would like if Sakurai was more faithfull to Bowser common style. His drop kicks and speed seems almosts as Sakurai was making fun of the character. Not a fan of the way Luigi is represented in Smash Bros as well.
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I don't see how he's making fun of bowser
 
Jedi Link said:
I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what edgeguarding is really like. Watch this for a bit. You can basically skip to any part of the video. The on-stage player is already making tons of complex choices and grabbing the edge is in no way an overpowering option that renders other options obsolete. By removing it, you're making things less complex, not more.
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I completely disagree.
 
What are the characters with suicide attacks in smash anyway?

I know DK can grab someone and fall off the ledge with then. Then bowser had the side B bellyflop you can do right on the edge of a stage.
 
Peléo;126594569 said:
I would like if Sakurai was more faithfull to Bowser common style. His drop kicks and speed seems almosts as Sakurai was making fun of the character. Not a fan of the way Luigi is represented in Smash Bros as well.
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I dunno, Bowser seems like a badass wrestler in this game now. Drop kick, Grab into body slam, aerial kicks. I love the changes.

Luigi is just weird though, but endearing.
 
Jedi Link said:
I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what edgeguarding is really like. Watch this for a bit. You can basically skip to any part of the video. The on-stage player is already making tons of complex choices and grabbing the edge is in no way an overpowering option that renders other options obsolete. By removing it, you're making things less complex, not more.
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You can still do most of that stuff with SSB4's edge mechanics beyond canceling their edge grab via invincibility frames. That's the part I think is dull. Things like general edge guarding, grabbing the edge to position yourself for more attacks, and engaging an opponent in the air near the edge is all fine. But in the moments where M2K uses the edge hog invincibility thing, I think that's too unfair for the other opponent. There's really nothing they can do in that situation and the risk for the on-stage player isn't great enough.
 
Peléo;126594569 said:
I would like if Sakurai was more faithfull to Bowser common style. His drop kicks and speed seems almosts as Sakurai was making fun of the character. Not a fan of the way Luigi is represented in Smash Bros as well.
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I'm not sure what you mean by Bowser's "common style." He's appeared in so many different games and attacked in so many different ways (sometimes he's a huge, hulking beast like in SM64, sometimes he's smaller and speedier like in SMB3, etc.,) that he doesn't really have a set attack style. And by all accounts, Bowser is better this time around than he ever has been.

As for Luigi, he's always been something of a comic relief character. Sakurai even called him "the dreamy, comical poster boy of the Smash series" (a description which, speaking as a Luigi main, makes me very, very happy.) But he's still a dangerous fighter.
 
Berordn said:
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I hope this doesn't become a meme. Otherwise were gonna end up locking the thread like a heavily edited Wikipedia article.

The news of the composers is great news. I'm noticing alot of Idolm@ster and Katamari Damashi composers, so does that mean an Idolm@ster or Katamari stage?
 
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