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[Dabookerman]

Yup, totally gonna be queuing up for this in Akihabara on Saturday Can't wait!

 

[Nickle]

Seriously, anyone defending the leaks needs to chill the fuck out before saying absolutely no one thought Wii Fit Trainer could be in.

They are just exaggerating a bit, it's a common hyperbole. Besides, I don't think you'll find even one example of someone on the internet (before the leak) that genuinely thought that Wii Fit Trainer had a chance of making it.

 

[The Captain]

I think it was a year after Punch-Out!!; they had talked about wanting to do a sequel, and that it could have a multi-player co-op component.

Aw man, Punch-Out!! Wii was so good! Well, at least Dark Moon was awesome, and I'm pretty sure whatever they're working on next will be great as well.

 

[Sponge]

lol hardly....


and to be fair,. the other side of the argument is that he's not automatically legit just because he got some things right. Chorus Kids? Chrom? Shulk reveal? He was wrong...multiple times...whether he was legit or not, you can't be that one-sided.

There's no way he could have guessed his original leak. Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, Mega Man, Pac-Man and Little Mac? I'm pretty sure all those weren't some lucky guess. It's entirely possible he got old information. We do know that Chrom was considered because Sakurai had told us. Who honestly knows, but I won't deny his original leak.

 

[Ryce]

No. The burden of proof is not on me. If you're going to make bold statements that "literally no one thought of Wii Fit Trainer before Gematsu" then you better back it up. Your argument (speaking in absolutes) is much harder to prove, so go ahead and prove it.

...How is the burden of proof on him? He can't prove the nonexistence of something. The person who claims that Wii Fit Trainer was predicted is the one who needs to provide evidence.

 

[Macka]

Punch-Out!! for Wii just happened a couple years ago, dude! It's not like it's some dead franchise, and the dev even pushed for the idea of making a sequel.

Also, in no way would Doc have to be a clone. :v He COULD be a clone, in the same way that Dixie COULD be a clone, but Doc has plenty of things that he could do that Little Mac wouldn't.

How well did Punch Out!! Wii sell?

What I was trying to say is that there's a clear difference between Fire Emblem getting two reps in their debut to Smash and what you're asking for Punch Out!! now. Roy wasn't originally planned, so I doubt Doc would be planned for this game either.

I'm not saying Doc should be a clone, I'm saying it feels unlikely that he'd get into THIS game as a unique fighter. Just like Fire Emblem wouldn't have had two if it weren't for clone advertisement Roy.

 

[The Captain]

They are just exaggerating a bit, it's a common hyperbole. Besides, I don't think you'll find even one example of someone on the internet (before the leak) that genuinely thought that Wii Fit Trainer had a chance of making it.

I make jokes about Doshin the Giant being in as a playable character, even if his chances were slimmer than Wii Fit Trainer being in pre-E3 2013.
But I guarantee you that if Doshin the Giant did make it in, people would be saying the exact same thing: "Literally no one saw this coming."

 

[J@hranimo]

Excellent.

Also it's well deserving for Megaman to be in Top 5. I bet my one newcomer was only voted by me lol.

 

[KelpPlankton]

I love love love Punch-Out, but I think comparing an arcadey boxing game that has 3 non-arcade releases to a strategy RPG series that has 13 of them is doing both of those series a disservice.

I'd love to see another Punch-Out character but the way you're trying to "prove" that it needs one is coming across as unnecessarily aggressive and rude, not to mention dismissive of this other game series that has an awful lot of fans.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Aw man, Punch-Out!! Wii was so good! Well, at least Dark Moon was awesome, and I'm pretty sure whatever they're working on next will be great as well.

Hopefully we can see Punch-Out!! in 2015 or 16.

How well did Punch Out!! Wii sell?

What I was trying to say is that there's a clear difference between Fire Emblem getting two reps in their debut to Smash and what you're asking for Punch Out!! now. Roy wasn't originally planned, so I doubt Doc would be planned for this game either.

I'm not saying Doc should be a clone, I'm saying it feels unlikely that he'd get into THIS game as a unique fighter. Just like Fire Emblem wouldn't have had two if it weren't for clone advertisement Roy.

It sold well enough to be listed as a Player's Choice for Wii. I don't think that indicates 1 million sold, but it still required a certain threshold.

 

[Kensho]

I have an idea

Don't reply to me until you quote a post where I said that Doc Louis fans wouldn't buy the game because he's not in it.

If you do not reply, I'll just assume that you didn't bother to spend a moment to actually read what I said.

EDIT: Just to confirm

Punch-Out!! (arcades)
Super Punch-Out!! (arcades)
Mike Tyson's Punch-Out!! (NES)
Arm Wrestling (NES)
Super Punch-Out!! (Super NES)
Punch-Out!! (Wii)
Doc Louis' Punch-Out!! (Wii)

That does not warrant two characters

but six Fire Emblem games (including an unreleased one) do

lolk

I was referring to this

Well, it might be because Doc Louis fans prefer "playing" as Doc Louis over "not playing"?

And good point, I didn't know a couple of those games, and the last one brings him recognition. I still think 2 Fire Emblem main characters that are clones makes much more sense than the main Punch Out character and his trainer who could not be a clone (as funny as it could be).

With one more new Punch Out in any form, Doc Louis could very well be in Smash 5, thanks for the information.

 

[Tooi]

Damn, so close now! What do you guys think, go on a media blackout until it comes out over here or inject all the info into my veins and find out EVERYTHING.

 

[Kyzer]

There's no way he could have guessed his original leak. Wii Fit Trainer, Villager, Mega Man, Pac-Man and Little Mac? I'm pretty sure all those weren't some lucky guess. It's entirely possible he got old information. We do know that Chrom was considered because Sakurai had told us. Who honestly knows, but I won't deny his original leak.

Wait can someone explain to me how Salromano became Gematsu again?

 

[Labrynian Rebel]

Grew up playing DKC3 so yes! Guitar! Rocking that pony tail of course.

Guitar music auto-killing enemies onscreen is canon, Diddy's guitar does it in DK64.

Deepest lore.

 

[Papercuts]

It's going to be insane when the game comes out. There's going to be a hyperstorm of info with a load of trolls in the middle making stuff up.

 

[The Captain]

...How is the burden of proof on him? He can't prove the nonexistence of something. The person who claims that Wii Fit Trainer was predicted is the one who needs to provide evidence.

Because he has the harder argument to prove. He's speaking in absolutes. Even Sakurai didn't speak in absolutes:
"... pretty much no one imagined this character would join the battle"
Maybe it means that amongst the countless letters for Geno and Goku, someone sent him a request for Wii Fit Trainer.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I love love love Punch-Out, but I think comparing an arcadey boxing game that has 3 non-arcade releases to a strategy RPG series that has 13 of them is doing both of those series a disservice.

I'd love to see another Punch-Out character but the way you're trying to "prove" that it needs one is coming across as unnecessarily aggressive and rude, not to mention dismissive of this other game series that has an awful lot of fans.

Allow me, for no reason, to bold my clear statement

I'm referring to Melee getting two FE characters.

 

[Macka]

It sold well enough to be listed as a Player's Choice for Wii. I don't think that indicates 1 million sold, but it still required a certain threshold.

Fair, but you just ignored the other thing I said.

 

[KelpPlankton]

Hopefully we can see Punch-Out!! in 2015 or 16.

It sold well enough to be listed as a Player's Choice for Wii. I don't think that indicates 1 million sold, but it still required a certain threshold.

Player's Choice/Nintendo Selects unfortunately doesn't indicate any sort of numbers sold anymore, but it does only tend to get put on games that did very well. I remember Punch-Out doing pretty solidly on the Wii. I'd love to see another one on the Wii U, especially if there was some sort of multiplayer mode.

 

[Ryce]

I make jokes about Doshin the Giant being in as a playable character, even if his chances were slimmer than Wii Fit Trainer being in pre-E3 2013.
But I guarantee you that if Doshin the Giant did make it in, people would be saying the exact same thing: "Literally no one saw this coming."

But Sal Romano didn't make jokes about Wii Fit Trainer. He flat out listed her among the planned E3 reveals. Google turns up two or three joking "Wii Fit in Smash Bros." references scattered across the last five years. Sal Romano was the first documented person to earnestly anticipate her.

 

[Sponge]

Wait can someone explain to me how Salromano became Gematsu again?

iirc, Gematsu is a website Sal Romano posts for.

 

[Not]

THE ROSTER ISN'T FINAL THE ROSTER ISN'T FINAL???

 

[ffdgh]

Damn, so close now! What do you guys think, go on a media blackout until it comes out over here or inject all the info into my veins and find out EVERYTHING.

Honestly a blackout would be pointless considering most of us gotta wait until October with spoilers all over the internet lol.

 

[Dimitri LH]

So the truth shall be revealed this week....EXCITE GET!

 

[The Captain]

But Sal Romano didn't make jokes about Wii Fit Trainer. He flat out listed her among the planned E3 reveals. Google turns up two or three joking "Wii Fit in Smash Bros." references scattered across the last five years. Sal Romano was the first documented person to earnestly anticipate her.

Even people jokingly bringing in up can count as "predicting her." You were trying to argue that no one ever thought up the idea.

 

[KelpPlankton]

THE ROSTER ISN'T FINAL THE ROSTER ISN'T FINAL???

We don't know. There's a chance though, evidence is stacked up in favor of us not having seen everyone. But... don't get your hopes up.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I ignored the other thing you said because it didn't effect the "Punch-Out!! shouldn't get two characters in one iteration." That argument is entirely arbitrary and based on nothing but strict rules. It also basically prioritizes patterns over good game design.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

No. The burden of proof is not on me. If you're going to make bold statements that "literally no one thought of Wii Fit Trainer before Gematsu" then you better back it up. Your argument (speaking in absolutes) is much harder to prove, so go ahead and prove it.

Well, we did have a prediction thread on GAF before E3 and not a single person said Wii Fit Trainer. Not just the (until then unused) name, but suggesting Wii Fit anything at all.

 

[The Captain]

I ignored the other thing you said because it didn't effect the "Punch-Out!! shouldn't get two characters in one iteration." That argument is entirely arbitrary and based on nothing but strict rules. It also basically prioritizes patterns over good game design.

Well, Kid Icarus is seemingly getting three reps despite a three-game series, so anything is possible.

 

[Kyzer]

I think Salromano was too drunk or too sobre, accidentally showed he had real info, and then just fake leaked everywhere to get as far from the nintendo ninjas as possible

 

[Neiteio]

I just want to see Metal Face at this point. I don't really care about Ridley anymore (especially if it's his Other M form). I just want to see Metal Face in action. Maybe it'll start storming on Gaur Plains when he appears...

 

[Not]

We don't know. There's a chance though, evidence is stacked up in favor of us not having seen everyone. But... don't get your hopes up.

Oh wow haha it's far too late for that

 

[Macka]

Allow me, for no reason, to bold my clear statement

I'm referring to Melee getting two FE characters.

Allow me to reiterate what I'm saying.

Fire Emblem wasn't going to get two reps in Melee. Roy was added in later as promotion for the Sealed Sword.

That is very different to expecting two unique reps from a smaller franchise (even compared to Fire Emblem at Melee's launch) in the series debut to Smash.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Well, we did have a prediction thread on GAF before E3 and not a single person said Wii Fit Trainer. Not just the (until then unused) name, but suggesting Wii Fit anything at all.

Exactly. Our evidence is that nothing can be found. "Iraq doesn't have WMDs" is a statement of absolutes. Would you demand that a person prove that Iraq doesn't have them? What could they do to prove that? They would literally have to examine every inch of Iraq. What you're proposing is an Internet equivalent to that.

 

[The Captain]

Well, we did have a prediction thread on GAF before E3 and not a single person said Wii Fit Trainer. Not just the (until then unused) name, but suggesting Wii Fit anything at all.

Ash didn't say literally no one in GAF predicted her, he said literally no one ever predicted her. Somewhere online, people (jokingly or not) brought her up as a potential rep.

 

[Kensho]

Well, Kid Icarus is seemingly getting three reps despite a three-game series, so anything is possible.

Sadly Sora didn't develop a Punch Out game I wish they make the next metroid, so we get Ridley, Dark Samus and a Metroid playable...

 

[DedValve]

Holy shit the 3ds version in Japan comes out this week? Man I thought we were still a month away!

 

[zroid]

guys




please

 

[Makai]

No. The burden of proof is not on me. If you're going to make bold statements that "literally no one thought of Wii Fit Trainer before Gematsu" then you better back it up. Your argument (speaking in absolutes) is much harder to prove, so go ahead and prove it.

Show me one. Go.

FYI: The burden of proof is on you.

 

[The Xtortionist]

It's going to be insane when the game comes out. There's going to be a hyperstorm of info with a load of trolls in the middle making stuff up.

Play Smash Run 500 times - unlock Ridley

Streetpass 1000 players - unlock Mewtwo

 

[GameGuru59]

Sakurai should make the intro like the 64 one
(Where the secret characters' silhouettes appears at the end of the intro)
Nostalgia'd btw.

It really is amazing how in 3 years, Nintendo basically mastered 3D animation on the N64. You can actually see the progression, from Mario 64 (1996) to Starfox (1997- when you fight the robot especially) to Ocarina of Time (1998- basically outclassing everyone in realtime animation at that point) to the Smash intro in 1999 (and the Master Hand generally). In terms of quality, that intro still holds up. It'd be almost Pixar quality if it weren't so low poly.

 

[SmithnCo]

Let's just agree that WFT would be an astronomically lucky guess if it was one.

 

[Ryce]

Because he has the harder argument to prove.

Difficulty is subjective. That's not how the burden of proof concept works.

You were trying to argue that no one ever thought up the idea.

Where did I say that?

 

[A Link to the Past]

Allow me to reiterate what I'm saying.

Fire Emblem wasn't going to get two reps in Melee. Roy was added in later as promotion for the Sealed Sword.

That is very different to expecting two unique reps from a smaller franchise (even compared to Fire Emblem at Melee's launch) in the series debut to Smash.

Which is exactly why I listed Doc Louis as a DLC character.

 

[Sponge]

Let's just agree that WFT would be an astronomically lucky guess if it was one.

Especially alongside Villager (name dropped as such) Mega Man, Pac-Man and Little Mac.

 

[The Captain]

Exactly. Our evidence is that nothing can be found. "Iraq doesn't have WMDs" is a statement of absolutes. Would you demand that a person prove that Iraq doesn't have them? What could they do to prove that? They would literally have to examine every inch of Iraq. What you're proposing is an Internet equivalent to that.

Show me one. Go.

FYI: The burden of proof is on you.

Someone on your side claimed to find two or three examples (even jokingly).

Google turns up two or three joking "Wii Fit in Smash Bros." references scattered across the last five years.

Earnest predictions or not, people thought up the idea.

 

[Hyperactivity]

No. The burden of proof is not on me. If you're going to make bold statements that "literally no one thought of Wii Fit Trainer before Gematsu" then you better back it up. Your argument (speaking in absolutes) is much harder to prove, so go ahead and prove it.

It's your burden for multiple reasons

A. You're arguing against what was already assumed by the vast majority
B. Finding one other source is far easier and simpler vs finding a lack of any other sources

 

[Toxi]

It's fun speculating unlock conditions

Unlocking Duck Hunt - Get X,000 points in Target Smash

(If Break the Targets were in, it'd be "complete every character's Break the Targets")

 

[Chezzymann]

Wait what's with the 5 days thing, I thought it was releasing on October 3rd

 

[Hatchtag]

Does anyone have a link to the point in a thread where people started realizing how well Sal Romano's guess matched the e3 reveal? I want to see that madness unfold.