Destiny |OT5| New patch out Tues., Master Rahool reportedly crying into his robes

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SillyNonsense said:
I like how the auto rifle feels right now, while it's very true that it dominates too much. Instead of making the auto rifle more frustrating to use by nerfing it, they should buff the weapons that are lagging behind.

It will take more effort to modify multiple weapon types vs the one weapon type, but they need to focus on making things more fun, not less fun. If I pull out my AR and suddenly it has half the range, I'm going to be pissed. But if I pull out my hand cannon and realize that it now has better accuracy and can actually challenge an AR, I'm happy.
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AR's have never been useful for mid-long range though and it's bullshit these do. Halo itself the smg and AR were useless outside of the close-mid range. The fact the AR does as much damage as it does and has a huge range is huge bullshit. They need to be nerfed in accuracy at the very least. Sorry if you were having fun with it, I was too, but the fact the other weapons weren't used because in 80% of encounters the AR wins at any range is bullshit.
 
Bunta said:
X6VwIze.gif
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Classic!
 
Jarmel said:
Most of the problems stem from the content in the game. There are two major issues with the content, it's boring and there's not enough of it. Bungie has tried to 'design' around the later without fixing either problem.

Firstly the Strikes are boring. There are no boss mechanics other than some extremely minor stuff like the Nexus boss has a rotating shield. They're short missions which don't offer the player something exciting or really offer much in terms of strategy. There's no interesting lore or even story to spice the missions up. It's a bit different on the higher levels due to the need for certain types of weapons but that's more frustrating than anything else due the lack of a quick switch system. Instead of useless shit like pointing or dancing, how about Bungie let us map ammo synthesis or different weapons on the fly? Anyway most of the Strikes are only difficult on the lower levels due to the bosses being bullet sponges.

This ties into the second problem in that people might suffer through the Strikes if you had a better shot at higher level gear like Legendaries. The fact that a player has just a good a chance at getting a purple engram from a level 1 boss is embarrassing on the part of Bungie. It kills any sort of risk and reward system. The raid does alleviate many of the problems in this and the last paragraph but the problem is that there is only one raid and at the moment you have to grind to even play this singular dungeon. Also you're very limited in the amount of loot you can potentially get from a Raid.

Bungie is trying to circumvent around the lack of armor and weapons through this loot system. By making even legendaries super rare, despite being needed for the exclusive high-end content, they're stalling the player. The Queen's bounty in it's initial state would have helped this as it would have given the player a way to quickly get to level 26. It still does but it's also time limited. Why is this not a permanent addition? The bounties by being disassembled would have also gotten higher level players a bigger incentive to help lower level players. Now there is no point to the event for players who already are level 26. So, There isn't that much loot for a loot game. There's what, three or four exotics per category? I think there's only a couple of options for armor pieces. There should be a lot more legendaries and exotics. Hell, Bungie could have tiers that the player can work towards of the legendaries and exotics so the player can get a sense of progression even if they have purples. That way they can give players more legendaries earlier while still having that player want to get better loot through an organized vendor system. Yes there are loots in the same category with better stats, but it's heavily RNG based so the endgame feels aimless and can be frustrating for a large number of players already decked out. Most MMOs have this system in place so why hasn't Bungie looked at how successful MMOs handle this? So with the content that isthere, how does Bungie keep the player invested? By making those initial pieces really hard to get and making it an utter pain to upgrade them. Now what they don't seem to realize or care is that most MMOs have found better solutions to this than what is presented in Destiny. Yes you still have to grind for token or coins for vendors in games like SWTOR but there are a number of differences that doesn't make SWTOR anywhere near as frustrating. The first is that there is flat out more content, loot, and even stuff like Flashpoints. So while you're grinding, it doesn't feel like the same thing day in and out and the actual mechanics in those Flashpoints have some thought into them. Second is that you can rip out mats in your current armor or gear and put it into your new armor. That way the credits you spent getting that mat doesn't feel as wasted as the one way currency/supply dump into the gear pieces in Destiny. Third thing is that the entry level of gear you need, in that how much time you need to spend grinding, for the raids in TOR are much lower than compared to Destiny. Now you obviously need better gear for the higher difficulty levels and that can be a grind. There are two differences compared to Destiny. The first is that you can run those raids as many times as you want and if you have a group of buddies around, it increases your possibility of getting a specific item. The second is that there's no fucking Cryptarch. So you're not rolling the dice twice. With the Cryptarch, you have to roll once to get an engram and you have to roll again to get an item. The Nightfall Strike and Raid is better in this regard but it's flat out not enough. Both of these factors make it seem like to the player, that the game is randomly stonewalling you. Yes other MMOs have RNG in them but you roll the dice more in Destiny.

I feel like these patches today were Bungie giving the players the stick without offerring them the carrot. Yes stuff like the caves needed to be fixed but they were a reflection of the larger issues with the game. Ones that Bungie has not openly addressed or attempted to fix.
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FloatingDivider said:
This might be my departing post because I just feel like I'm done. It's unrelated to the cave being closed because I stopped farming a good while ago, since that shit is just degrading to your soul. It being patched does bother me however because the underlying issue remains unadressed and the only news for the future consists of a vague "we're working on it".

They act like there is an economy that needs to be checked and balanced, but there isn't. Nobody is being hurt by me being able to reach lvl 28 because I managed to complete the queens quest several times. Nobody would be hurt by me finding a good legendary auto rifle since everything is theoretically supposed to be balanced. There is no reason for the game to be as pedantic about everything as it is. It's honestly the most frustrating game I've ever played. It feels like this game actively wants to make me think about why I'm playing it, and the more I do the more I realize I don't want to anymore.

Because I've spent 3 days 12 hours 15minutes and 36 seconds playing this game and I feel like I could have stopped at 20 hours and had the same experience. I don't know why I've played this game as obsessively as I have but I shouldn't have. It's not worth it. Maybe it's because it's the first shooter with very tight controls on the ps4 but fuck me I can't deal with this progression system. I've maxed out marks and gotten up to 27, I have the shards for 28(thanks queen) but I realized gathering the materials would mean atleast several more hours of running around shooting lvl 8 dregs and opening chests. I don't enjoy doing that at all but I've spent more hours than I'd like to admit on each of the planets doing exactly that. During that time I don't think I've interacted in a socially meaningful way at all. I guess I've spent 5 minutes in between chest runs shooting at a bulletsponge with some other guys, but I'm fairly sure none of us were really into it. I've done all of the farms, grinded all of the marks and hit every unnanounced cap this game has to offer. Including the 200 marks cap, which keeps counting your marks earned despite you being unable to earn more.

I enjoy playing the harder (more bullshitty content) but there is no reward for it, and it is actually less efficient then cranking down the difficulty and blowing through everything. As an added issue I've grown tired of most of it. I run past 80% of the encounters in the pve section of the game because they are a waste of time and end up only killing the enemy I have a bounty for or the boss so I can get my marks/rep. I've done every mission so many times that I know exactly where to stand to survive 95% of all encounters unscathed. I can finish most missions/strikes while watching episodes of star trek. I rarely get off of my hoverbike before the first press square to proceed moment of every strike. Honestly I feel like a drone going through motions, chasing some sort of machinated carrot that doesn't exist.

I enjoy the pvp, I want different weapons though but unfortunately I have to grind more rep to purchase them or hope the random loot gods comply. Meanwhile I've used this legendary scout rifle for 40+ hours, I've switched in some other stuff that's less efficient to level them up but it's been pretty much that scout rifle I got when I was level 18 two weeks ago from a random blue engram. I was going to get a purple gun from the crucible dude when I hit lvl 3, (initially 2 but the mark cap put a stop to that, because that would have been too ridiculous right) but I don't want to do this same punch twenty dudes bounty again. In fact I don't want to do anything again because it's the same shit in the same toilet like some fucking looney toons version of the end of tomorrow.

I don't want to do this again because I do feel entitled. I do feel like I deserve to enjoy myself and make meaningful progress towards a goal everytime I launch a game. I do feel like I should be able to get ascendant shards in an easy to understand controllable fashion, that is not overly time consuming or ridiculously specific like running around with 3 alts at specific times to complete a public event where the same walker I shot three times previously falls from the sky. I do feel like I deserve to have a sizeable arsenal of different guns to use should it strike my fancy to do so, where each offers a meaningful difference from the previous one. What I've gotten however is 20 Shingen-E's, 50 Sidewinder shotguns, and a bunch of stuff I honestly don't care about. If you make a loot game you need a variety, if you don't have variety your loot game is dead in the water. But this is besides the point.

I'll say this again, I've spent 3 days 12 hours 15minutes and 36 seconds playing this game in the short time it's been available. But I can't anymore, I'm just fucking done. This game is a treadmill, but the goal distances are set for some arbitrary point in spacetime and you may or may not get what you want when you get there. I have a 600+ game backlog, and I'm sure 80%+ of those games will treat my time with more respect than destiny will. I'm just going to go play some of those.

My final remark is that I don't understand why they'd do this. If I burned out because I got all the legendaries and got all of the exotics I wanted I would have quit a much happier man. I probably would have returned for some more when the DLC launched. As it stands I'm just so fucking done I'm probably never returning.
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Great posts.
 
Anyone looking for an extra for the raid?

Level 28 warlock, completed it twice already.

Edit: From the beginning. Don't feel like jumping in midway through.
 
excaliburps said:
Sorely tempted to put masking tape or something to my analog stick and just enter Crucible matches for loot. It's not like I need to do anything to get stuff, right? Rewards in Destiny don't feel like achievements. Rather, you just got lucky.
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That's a whole 'nother can of worms. The stuff you get aren't rewards, they're participation items. There is very little sense of accomplishment in getting any of the gear other than the stuff in the raids. At this point, might as well just let us trade. I'm supposed to be jealous or envious of another player just because they had a better roll dice? The Exotic bounties are a step in the right direction but as with much in Destiny, it's not enough.
 
kittens said:
I'm honestly shocked at all the patch complaints. It's nothing but good news, imo.
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How are any of the hotfixes implemented today good news?

The patch notes sound promising, but they aren't out yet. What benefit do players have today, or in the foreseeable future, from the changes made?
 
Think my interest is draining a bit on Destiny. For the first time I started the game up. Sat at the map screen for a few moments and then turned the game off again.

Game will be phenomenal with more to do, but getting old doing the same stuff all the time. I do want to get some more exotic weapons and armor though so the gear quest is good in this game since the gear itself is worthwhile. But def am to a point of wanting more
 
Admiral Woofington said:
AR's have never been useful for mid-long range though and it's bullshit these do. Halo itself the smg and AR were useless outside of the close-mid range. The fact the AR does as much damage as it does and has a huge range is huge bullshit. They need to be nerfed in accuracy at the very least. Sorry if you were having fun with it, I was too, but the fact the other weapons weren't used because in 80% of encounters the AR wins at any range is bullshit.
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Exactly. Scout rifle is useless in PvP. It was my go to In Halo PvP. Hated the ARs in that. A good AR in this feels super close to the ones Titanfall released with. Those were vastly OP. I don't know if thy ever changed it though.
 
kittens said:
I'm honestly shocked at all the patch complaints. It's nothing but good news, imo.
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I'm honestly shocked you can't possibly see why people could hate it. Empathy doesn't even have to be particularly high.

And patch notes =/= that dev diary where they promise one day the game will be better. Good thing when it is, but that could be months from now
 
I think I'm going to ramp down my time with Destiny after today. I'm getting pretty tired of jumping through hoops for a chance at getting the Ascendant Energy I'm looking for. I might casually level some alts here and there, but for the most part I'd say I'm done for now. After the complete disappointment of Combined Arms and Queen's Wrath I am definitely going to hold off on future DLC until I read some impressions on here. Good luck and good hunting, Guardians.
 
Jest Chillin said:
And the reason why people go with Fusion Rifle is it's the only other close quarters option other than shotty. If they changed all the high RoF AR's into SMG's with an impact somewhere between Shottys and FR's, then you'd see more people run that too. There's a lack of selection for close quarters really.
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You want close range, CQB, brawl? You take shotty, any shotty. In theory.

You want hard counter anything with OHK in wide range spread? Take FR and learn right trigger spam.

I'm not against AR and Shotty adjustments, but wholly ignoring FR's and their performance in Crucible is just bonkers. That shit is even less balanced than either of weapons that are getting nerf hammered.

Thank God that strafe spam fucks up aim assists and gives you some play against FR's.
 
Admiral Woofington said:
if anything I'm returning daily to do my dailies at the very least. I really want to level up my scout rifle until at the very least it has the staggering ability.
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Won't that be negated on strikes/missions with the Angry modifier active?

ReaperXL7 said:
Has anyone bought an exotic engram from Xur before? I have the motes of light to buy a couple but I don't want to bother if they are just going to give me green shit.
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I never bothered looking before, but does the exotic engrams from Xur really cost MoL and not Strange Coins? That seems... weird, and at odds with the lore the game has put out about MoL; that they're not really valuable but the Speaker still patronizingly accepts them as "currency" for cosmetics.
 
DarrylMR said:
If a Striker Titan and a Bladedancer Hunter went 1 v 1 who would win?
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I've had this happen a couple of times. The first, the hunter was blade dancing, and I baited him with radar, and when he came running to me, I supercharged. Somehow the hunter stayed alive through it, and stabbed me to death, then he died immediately afterwards to the shockwave I left behind. The second time, the Hunter did not survive my supercharge :)
 
Nafai1123 said:
How are any of the hotfixes implemented today good news?

The patch notes sound promising, but they aren't out yet. What benefit do players have today, or in the foreseeable future, from the changes made?
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I was talking about the patch, not the hotfix stuff. I'm pretty ambivalent to the hotfix -- I think farming is silly and I only did it a little bit. Ascendant materials are hard to come by and I relate to people who are frustrated that a good way to get them is being removed, but if it's not how Bungie intended for character progression to happen, then it makes sense to remove it.

But the patch sounds great to me, especially the balancing stuff and the voice chat opt-in.

Admiral Woofington said:
I'm honestly shocked you can't possibly see why people could hate it. Empathy doesn't even have to be particularly high.

And patch notes =/= that dev diary where they promise one day the game will be better. Good thing when it is, but that could be months from now
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Uhhhh, I can imagine WHY people would be upset. I'm just surprised at how many people are upset and the degree to which they are.
 
On the Nightfall Strike, when I reach the boss how do I make him spawn? I didn't jump down, but as soon as I start killing the minotaurs they go behind cover and just stay there...
 
Hey guys did Bungie put a stop to the shard farming for the Queen missions. Was getting legendary gear yesterday and broke it down and always got shards. Got 2 helms today and all I got was plasteel plating.
 
I don't get the complaints about grinding in this game. I'm a husband and father who gets to play maybe 1.5 hours at a time 3-4 nights a week. I'm a level 26 with 2 vanguard legendaries from getting level 2 rep and the recent Queen events gave me the purple chest and head pieces I was missing.

Maybe I just have yet to experience the terrible grind that may be coming to gather mats to upgrade my gear, or maybe it's a difference of perspective. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
 
MuseManMike said:
They would have been mistaken -- only technically. If you had read my post more closely, you would have noticed an example of drops/time. If your goal was to collect drops, the cave was a better use of your time. So if someone decided to farm instead of, I don't know, play a strike they were, in fact, more likely to get any combination of rare to legendary engrams. Say you were 2x to get a drop during a difficult strike, if that strike takes long enough, the cave (still at the normal rate) might still have a higher yield. Introduce the element of loot being completely random (no guaranteed engrams at the end of missions), farming the cave becomes completely rational behavior.
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I literally went over that in the second paragraph that you even quoted and responded to. You're not adding anything new to the conversation with this.

MuseManMike said:
Then what are focus groups for? Or playtesters or beta testers? Why do designers (especially at Bungie) get paid good salaries? All of game design is in some way the categorization and prediction of human behavior. Games would not work and would find no audience if a large number of people did not behave similarly. Like I said above, cave farmers weren't idiots or glitchers or didn't bother playing the game (many were high level players). They were, in the overall incentive structure of the game, behaving totally rationally. For various target bounties why do I immediately go to orbit the moment I kill my target? It's because there is no reward for finishing a mission. It's because I am a moment away from being subjected to some of the worst voice-acting and writing I have ever seen in a video game, presented in unskippable cutscenes. Whatever ideal Bungie had for this game isn't manifesting in the real world.
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You think Bungie isn't aware that players will take the path of least resistance? Of course they are! They just didn't realize that the spawn time of those handful of cave spawn points (skywatch in particular) would lead to so many people standing there for hours on end. This is because they're literally building an entire game world with thousands of things that can interact in unintended ways. No game gets released without things that can get exploited like this. It's simply not possible until you have absolutely massive numbers of people playing the game 24/7 to find them.


Natiko said:
You talk about your progression to level 28 as if it's not the same exact path I took. Fine, it's a matter of opinion as is most anything when it's being critically evaluated, but in my opinion there is nothing meaningful built into this game to make the end game enjoyable. Yes, the raid is there as the final obstacle, but everything else surrounding it is regurgitated from the main game. The number of times I have done the same bounties over and over again to grind out reputation to even be allowed to buy nameless piece of armor #3 is depressing. I could have stopped playing the moment I hit 20 and not missed out on anything I've experienced since. Yes, it is my opinion and you're entitled to yours. Neither of our points are going to sway the other. Regardless, to me, this game is poorly designed once you get past level 20 and there is not nearly enough there to carry it over that time or to incentivize the grind it takes.
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Well we agree that we disagree. You don't like the progression design and I like it just fine. I play a lot of MMO's so it suits me I suppose. It's not a broken progression design though. Just one that some people don't like. Which is fine.
 
Bold One said:
Valid complaints, but with these sort of posts it usually partly from burn out, you've hit a wall and can't seem to progress. I suggest you take a break, but if you feel youre, done then peace

Bye bye
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Not hard to get burnt out when you're dealing with such a pathetically small amount of content.
 
DesertFox said:
I don't get the complaints about grinding in this game. I'm a husband and father who gets to play maybe 1.5 hours at a time 3-4 nights a week. I'm a level 26 with 2 vanguard legendaries from getting level 2 rep and the recent Queen events gave me the purple chest and head pieces I was missing.

Maybe I just have yet to experience the terrible grind that may be coming to gather mats to upgrade my gear, or maybe it's a difference of perspective. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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I've put in like 48 hours and I JUST hit 27 last night
 
FloatingDivider said:
This might be my departing post because I just feel like I'm done. It's unrelated to the cave being closed because I stopped farming a good while ago, since that shit is just degrading to your soul. It being patched does bother me however because the underlying issue remains unadressed and the only news for the future consists of a vague "we're working on it".

They act like there is an economy that needs to be checked and balanced, but there isn't. Nobody is being hurt by me being able to reach lvl 28 because I managed to complete the queens quest several times. Nobody would be hurt by me finding a good legendary auto rifle since everything is theoretically supposed to be balanced. There is no reason for the game to be as pedantic about everything as it is. It's honestly the most frustrating game I've ever played. It feels like this game actively wants to make me think about why I'm playing it, and the more I do the more I realize I don't want to anymore.

Because I've spent 3 days 12 hours 15minutes and 36 seconds playing this game and I feel like I could have stopped at 20 hours and had the same experience. I don't know why I've played this game as obsessively as I have but I shouldn't have. It's not worth it. Maybe it's because it's the first shooter with very tight controls on the ps4 but fuck me I can't deal with this progression system. I've maxed out marks and gotten up to 27, I have the shards for 28(thanks queen) but I realized gathering the materials would mean atleast several more hours of running around shooting lvl 8 dregs and opening chests. I don't enjoy doing that at all but I've spent more hours than I'd like to admit on each of the planets doing exactly that. During that time I don't think I've interacted in a socially meaningful way at all. I guess I've spent 5 minutes in between chest runs shooting at a bulletsponge with some other guys, but I'm fairly sure none of us were really into it. I've done all of the farms, grinded all of the marks and hit every unnanounced cap this game has to offer. Including the 200 marks cap, which keeps counting your marks earned despite you being unable to earn more.

I enjoy playing the harder (more bullshitty content) but there is no reward for it, and it is actually less efficient then cranking down the difficulty and blowing through everything. As an added issue I've grown tired of most of it. I run past 80% of the encounters in the pve section of the game because they are a waste of time and end up only killing the enemy I have a bounty for or the boss so I can get my marks/rep. I've done every mission so many times that I know exactly where to stand to survive 95% of all encounters unscathed. I can finish most missions/strikes while watching episodes of star trek. I rarely get off of my hoverbike before the first press square to proceed moment of every strike. Honestly I feel like a drone going through motions, chasing some sort of machinated carrot that doesn't exist.

I enjoy the pvp, I want different weapons though but unfortunately I have to grind more rep to purchase them or hope the random loot gods comply. Meanwhile I've used this legendary scout rifle for 40+ hours, I've switched in some other stuff that's less efficient to level them up but it's been pretty much that scout rifle I got when I was level 18 two weeks ago from a random blue engram. I was going to get a purple gun from the crucible dude when I hit lvl 3, (initially 2 but the mark cap put a stop to that, because that would have been too ridiculous right) but I don't want to do this same punch twenty dudes bounty again. In fact I don't want to do anything again because it's the same shit in the same toilet like some fucking looney toons version of the end of tomorrow.

I don't want to do this again because I do feel entitled. I do feel like I deserve to enjoy myself and make meaningful progress towards a goal everytime I launch a game. I do feel like I should be able to get ascendant shards in an easy to understand controllable fashion, that is not overly time consuming or ridiculously specific like running around with 3 alts at specific times to complete a public event where the same walker I shot three times previously falls from the sky. I do feel like I deserve to have a sizeable arsenal of different guns to use should it strike my fancy to do so, where each offers a meaningful difference from the previous one. What I've gotten however is 20 Shingen-E's, 50 Sidewinder shotguns, and a bunch of stuff I honestly don't care about. If you make a loot game you need a variety, if you don't have variety your loot game is dead in the water. But this is besides the point.

I'll say this again, I've spent 3 days 12 hours 15minutes and 36 seconds playing this game in the short time it's been available. But I can't anymore, I'm just fucking done. This game is a treadmill, but the goal distances are set for some arbitrary point in spacetime and you may or may not get what you want when you get there. I have a 600+ game backlog, and I'm sure 80%+ of those games will treat my time with more respect than destiny will. I'm just going to go play some of those.

My final remark is that I don't understand why they'd do this. If I burned out because I got all the legendaries and got all of the exotics I wanted I would have quit a much happier man. I probably would have returned for some more when the DLC launched. As it stands I'm just so fucking done I'm probably never returning.
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excellent post. I knew something was wrong when I started flying past the enemies in Strike missions. At that point I realized that I wasn't actually "playing" Destiny anymore.
 
If you take a step back and look at the broad scope of the game as a whole, it seems like they spent A LOT of time creating the world, and the story missions, and the lore (I know), and didn't put as much attention into the reward system. They expected that it would take people longer to get to high level end game stuff, which you can see by the fact that they hand out such little rep for doing strikes. They expected it to take a long time and be a grind. And yet it didn't take long for people to get to 26-28.

Now people have reached the point where they're kind of stagnating or feel like they're not really getting anything for their time. Or what they are getting for their time (spinmetal, etc) isn't any fun to get. It seems like Bungie's expectations for players is not what the players expect or want. People want to be rewarded for their time and more importantly they want to see progress.

And I agree with people that say the variety of weapons, armor, etc. is too limited. They didn't put enough in the game and yet I fear that we will not see any more until the expansions come out. And who knows how much they will add. Could be a lot, but it also could be a small amount. I'm still enjoying the game but it seems like if they had the time to make fixes so quickly, why haven't they addressed some of the bigger issues already? Like rewards for strikes, matchmaking for weekly strikes, the list goes on.
 
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