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[Hawkian]

In terms of running the raid once it starts, no, what difference is there? I'm not talking about a difference of actually FORMING the raid - MM is easier and thats' why I said they should add it. I mean, once it starts, there's no hidden skill or coordination bonus given to teams that are formed offline rather than through MM.

Ahh, I see where you're going wrong. Of course there is such a bonus. It's self-selecting. Anyone who cares enough about coordinating to do the raid will use such a tool; anyone who doesn't will not. The idea that just joining a matchmaking queue- no "first timer here looking for help," no "quick run, 28+", no "mics required," no "at Atheon, looking for help"- will produce groups of universally the same quality as those preformed with intent is absolutely proven wrong by history; as has been suggested by many here, such a solution often involves providing dumbed-down or numerically easier version of content to enable such groups to have a chance. Again, have you not run into anyone who idles or has no clue what they're doing during a Strike?

Just need an in-game listing board to make a fireteam. Like Monster Hunter or PSO. It solves all of these problems.

What's with the "no mics" thing? I haven't met anyone who doesn't have a microphone, and even then, you would only need a few ppl on mics to lead the group.

Well, glossing over the fact that for the moment matchmade activites don't allow voice chat- you can't control having "a few people on mics to lead the group"- or even that anyone is capable of leading the group, mic or otherwise- when you join a matchmaking queue.

Do you imagine the system would have the ability to ensure that 6 people who have never done the raid before are never grouped together? Would it prioritize groups that have at least one member flagged as having completed it, or even group together as many members that have completed it as possible? Wouldn't this eventually make it even more likely that groups that knew what they were doing were formed alongside completely incompetent ones with no coordination?

This just all seems more complicated than necessary and it's easily solvable with in-game tools.

I don't have an answer for that one, outside of dealing with it the same way you do when playing strikes with randoms. People can quit, play in a manner inconsistent with combined effort and synergy, or even idle and ruin it. The penalties would be more severe in a Raid as your chances of completing it would be much lower with the aforementioned behavior than in a Strike. Personally, I wouldn't use Raid matchmaking as the chances with a pre-organized group would have a much higher chance of success but I don't feel that warrants it's non-existence.

In a strike playlist I feel like it's a necessary evil and I have rather literally carried the entire team to the boss kill, and thus the matchmaking woes were just a hindrance and not a brick wall, because it's possible to do that. That's not the case for a raid.

I'm not saying nothing need be done. Obviously, it is ridiculous that players are forced to go to an external site to find the right fireteam. I'm saying matchmaking is simply not the answer. Guild Wars 2 experienced this exact same conundrum and resolved the problem without issue. The site that originally fulfilled this niche is now so defunct that I was getting people to use it for Destiny before the legitimate destinylfg sites came up.

 

[Nori Chan]

Earth of course.

lolwat

Nexus and moon are way quicker bro, hell even the priest one is too.

 

[commish]

Let me rephrase it slightly:

Do you not understand how by forcing players to make a little extra effort to build a group you're more likely to find commited players than you are if anyone could just press the mm button and jump in without thinking?

I know what you're getting it, but I feel it's hard to generalize like that. I've used destinylfg to get a group only to have people bail after a few minutes for whatever reason. Just because you find someone online doesn't mean they are more committed. That said, I would say that finding someone on GAF would probably mean they are more committed.

Regardless, this isn't an either-or situation. MM can be an option for those who want it, and for those who think that MM will lead to bad results... then don't use it.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

I've always found earth easiest to beat. Maybe because I've played it so many times, including in the alpha and the beta.

Edit: sorry, I thought easiest. Fastest probably nexus.

 

[Twilight Gap]

Anyone know what the quickest strike is to do?

you can skip most of the adds on summoning pits and nexus. earth is the easiest though.

 

[Diablohead]

Nightfall was just dumb. Hide behind box, shoot with arc guns. Rinse and repeat for fifteen minutes. Occasionally the other guy dies, leaves and rejoins fireteam.



Ramping up the difficulty to the point where cheesing is the only way forward is just stupid. Got yet another legendary scout rifle too, woo /s. My third one, and another one available from Vanguard.



At least I'm only 9 marks away from my sexy new sparrow. Any difference between the three the Vanguard offer? Planning on picking up the white one.

the huge use of bullet sponge bosses is upsetting in this game, there's a ton of things they could have done to change it like having to press buttons around the stage to drop shields or bait the boss into a zone for bonus damage, anything really.

as someone said earlier the first strike boss is the best in the game because he teleports around, a small but important thing to mix things up.

 

[figadapaura]

Same, I'll be able to mic up then too with work out of the way.

We should make a party because I was finding it hard to hear people sometimes.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

This is horrible and cruel. Just lock them out or raid matchmaking for 24 hours or the full week depending on how severe you want the penalty to be.

You can also add a barrier to entry like charging the player to lose a mote of light or strange coin to use the matchmaking once. However I think that's a bit needles if all the other suggested features are implemented and working well.

Yeah, those were just off the top of my head. It needs to cost you somehow and I'm sure someone could think of a fair punishment with more thought.

I should also clarify that you wouldn't be penalized for bailing until AFTER you accepted the invitation.

 

[lunlunqq]

What a wasted opportunity with the big bayonet on Monte Carlo. They should include a perk like you cause damage by running into your enemies on that gun.

 

[Namikaze1]

Earth is easy but the Dread Walker makes the strike last a bit longer.

 

[LiK]

We should make a party because I was finding it hard to hear people sometimes.

Your voice was pretty low when I played with you. Did you change the audio settings?

 

[Twilight Gap]

Yep. Same here too. We will probably have Afrocious to help us out.

And we really need a team of 29s.

me!

 

[Marvel]

We should make a party because I was finding it hard to hear people sometimes.

Yes it was, good call.

 

[pringles]

After working with a group finder in MMOs with raids far more difficult than VoG with mechanics, I can't see why VoG's normal mode can't have a matchmaking option with the option to votekick people.

Maybe you overestimate the average casual gamer. I have friends playing Destiny who have never touched MMOs, don't have any idea what it means to "raid", and often play with a beer in one hand and music blasting. These are the types of people that will join the VoG through MM, play for a bit and say "what is this shit??" once trouble hits, and quit. A very advanced MM system could filter out the more casual people, but no MM does that too and it requires a lot less work on Bungie's part.

 

[Truelize]

I think it would be fantastic if the raid matched up two 3-man fireteams. Many people have at least two friends they team up with a lot. Just join two teams together and let's roll.

 

[constantstatic]

Whats up with the almost impossible Exotic Bounty for the handgun ? I need 500 PvP kills with void damage and this fucking counter resets when i'm dying. Wtf was Bungie thinking ? "Hey lets make a bounty that only the top10 PvP players in the world can finish" ? Super shitty if you ask me. And yes i suck at PvP so this handgun is out of reach for me or what ?

It's really not that hard you get 5 points for every kill and loose 2 for every death. It took me maybe 20 games tops I used a void sniper and machine gun. The only problem with this challenge is it promotes camping but you definitely don't have to be a top level player to do it.

 

[Twilight Gap]

so, this damn audio glitch.

i've noticed it happens almost all the time on shores of time and the templar phase 2 and 3

 

[Namikaze1]

We should setup the Fireteam beforehand.

me!

Oh Twilight, you can always join any time.

 

[RedFury]

the huge use of bullet sponge bosses is upsetting in this game, there's a ton of things they could have done to change it like having to press buttons around the stage to drop shields or bait the boss into a zone for bonus damage, anything really.

as someone said earlier the first strike boss is the best in the game because he teleports around, a small but important thing to mix things up.

I think the dust palace psion flayers are by far the best "bosses". I think they are the most fun to beat because they each require a different element to beat and run around the map chasing you.

 

[Ruthless_Barbarian]

I'm up for hard raid too. Just need the raid boots to get to 30

 

[lunlunqq]

I think it would be fantastic if the raid matched up two 3-man fireteams. Many people have at least two friends they team up with a lot. Just join two teams together and let's roll.

I like that idea. Forming a 3-man team on our own is much easier than forming 6-man team. We could use a little help on that.

 

[Kalamari]

When's the patch that fixes fireteam chat volume levels? They only way I can hear anyone in fireteam chat is by using the crappy earbud mic that's included with the PS4. I can barely hear people with my Sennheiser headphones, even with my Astro Mixamp chat volume turned to 11.

 

[commish]

Ahh, I see where you're going wrong. Of course there is such a bonus. It's self-selecting. Anyone who cares enough about coordinating to do the raid will use such a tool; anyone who doesn't will not. The idea that just joining a matchmaking queue- no "first timer here looking for help, no "quick run, 28+", no "mics required," no "at Atheon, looking for help"- will produce groups of universally the same quality as those preformed with intent is absolutely proven wrong by history; as has been suggested by many here, such a solution often involves providing dumbed-down or numerically easier versions of content to enable such groups to have a chance. Again, have you not run into anyone who idles or has no clue what they're doing during a Strike?

Just need an in-game listing board to make a fireteam. Like Monster Hunter or PSO. It solves all of these problems.

Well, glossing over the fact that for the moment matchmade activites don't allow voice chat- you can't control having "a few people on mics to lead the group"- or even that anyone is capable of leading the group, mic or otherwise- when you join a matchmaking queue.

Do you imagine the system would have the ability to ensure that 6 people who have never done the raid before are never grouped together? Would it prioritize groups that have at least one member flagged as having completed it, or even group together as many members that have completed it as possible? Wouldn't this eventually make it even more likely that groups that knew what they were doing were formed alongside completely incompetent ones with no coordination?

This just all seems more complicated than necessary and easily solvable with in-game tools.

Agreed re: how it's done in MH. Love MH.

But again, this isn't an either-or. Why not give people the option? If people use the MM option and get frustrated, then they can just form their own group. I'd be happy with a MH-style raid/group board as well. Just something, SOMETHING, in-game to make getting groups easier.

 

[Hawkian]

After working with a group finder in MMOs with raids far more difficult than VoG with mechanics, I can't see why VoG's normal mode can't have a matchmaking option with the option to votekick people.

Can you describe a group finder? I'm not familiar with what that means exactly (never got into true MMO raiding)

 

[Marvel]

Count me in, nami.

Just found a new hobby in the tower, crouch and clip your face through someone's ass.

 

[LiK]

Can you describe a group finder? I'm not familiar with what that means exactly (never got into true MMO raiding)

Think of it as classifieds on the Internet.

Just found a new hobby in the tower, crouch and clip your face through someone's ass.

I go through the front

 

[backflip10019]

With all these other new games coming out, I'm really starting to lose motivation to grind my weapons/gear up just to grind my yellow bar up. Unless Bungie gives me a good reason to go back to it, I might be done with Destiny for a while. Even the raid/nightfall doesn't really interest me that much. After playing for around 36 hours, there's no tangible incentive for me to keep grinding.

 

[Namikaze1]

I hate Detsiny for the fact that it's pulling me away from my brand new game (Shadow of Mordor)
I only played a single hour of it and this damn game is not letting me go!

 

[Hawkian]

I know what you're getting it, but I feel it's hard to generalize like that. I've used destinylfg to get a group only to have people bail after a few minutes for whatever reason. Just because you find someone online doesn't mean they are more committed. That said, I would say that finding someone on GAF would probably mean they are more committed.

Regardless, this isn't an either-or situation. MM can be an option for those who want it, and for those who think that MM will lead to bad results... then don't use it.

Agreed re: how it's done in MH. Love MH.

But again, this isn't an either-or. Why not give people the option? If people use the MM option and get frustrated, then they can just form their own group.

You may not be considering the possibility of someone trying once and then getting so frustrated that they never want to try again. The idea of the Vault of Glass with no coordination sounds like absolute torture to me. D:

I'd be happy with a MH-style raid/group board as well. Just something, SOMETHING, in-game to make getting groups easier.

Yup that's all we need.

 

[bachikarn]

Can someone explain to me how your level impacts the stats of your guns and armor? Does a 250 damage gun do 250 damage regardless of your level?

How about enemies? Do higher level enemies have more HP?

 

[Zakalwe]

I know what you're getting it, but I feel it's hard to generalize like that. I've used destinylfg to get a group only to have people bail after a few minutes for whatever reason. Just because you find someone online doesn't mean they are more committed. That said, I would say that finding someone on GAF would probably mean they are more committed.

Regardless, this isn't an either-or situation. MM can be an option for those who want it, and for those who think that MM will lead to bad results... then don't use it.

My point was that by opening the raid up to mm you will absolutely increase the chances of finding players lacking commitment. You will also open it up much more to griefers and idlers.

And I believe Mm can be detrimental just by being there.

It could potentially put people off end game content due to poor experience with mm players lacking commitment. Idlers, griefers, etc... thereby diluting the amount of players interested in tackling the content.

Thereby making it harder to find a good group.

These are probably reasons why it doesn't exist right now. Sure, they could be overcome in the future if they develop the social features in game or make adjustments to the certain aspects, but that will take time.

Right now with the current state of the game the idea of mm as it works for strikes, just click and jump in, is a bad idea.

 

[Hawkian]

Think of it as classifieds on the Internet.

That's perfect. Isn't that exactly what destinylfg.net offers? That's what is needed in-game!

The differences between this and matchmaking are face-smashingly obvious to me, i feel like I'm taking crazy pills this morning

 

[Afrocious]

Maybe you overestimate the average casual gamer. I have friends playing Destiny who have never touched MMOs, don't have any idea what it means to "raid", and often play with a beer in one hand and music blasting. These are the types of people that will join the VoG through MM, play for a bit and say "what is this shit??" once trouble hits, and quit. A very advanced MM system could filter out the more casual people, but no MM does that too and it requires a lot less work on Bungie's part.

In this example, if your friends dislike playing the Raid, it should be their choice not to do it again until they feel like they're ready and willing. Raids are really never a walk in the park until you're overleveled for it, but even then, some mechanics can cause raid wipes even on the easist modes though they're way more lax.

Let your friends quit, and let another person who queued up replace them via Matchmaking/Group Finder. This issue you bring up is also prevalent in MMOs but Group Finders still work it out.

 

[E92 M3]

I hate Detsiny for the fact that it's pulling me away from my brand new game (Shadow of Mordor)
I only played a single hour of it and this damn game is not letting me go!

Pulling me away from Horizon 2

 

[TheCanisDirus]

Count me in, nami.

Just found a new hobby in the tower, crouch and clip your face through someone's ass.

That's just how i talk to Rahool.

 

[figadapaura]

Your voice was pretty low when I played with you. Did you change the audio settings?

No, I just talk louder. It's hard to hear people over the in-game noise anyway.

 

[Skele7on]

you can skip most of the adds on summoning pits and nexus. earth is the easiest though.

I personally feel the Moon Strike is quicker to beat. I have done it in 5 minutes before. You just need a good Fireteam.

Actually a lot of people say Nexus. I kind of think Nexus is faster.

Earth of course.

Cool cheers, I will do a few on each of those.

25 strikes before Xur goes.... Looks like my destiny is set for the week....

Bad JuJu better be the best gun ever.

 

[Afrocious]

That's perfect. Isn't that exactly what destinylfg.net offers? That's what is needed in-game!

The differences between this and matchmaking are face-smashingly obvious to me, i feel like I'm taking crazy pills this morning

It's more than classifieds. It's literally a matchmaking system where you queue up and you are put into a team. In MMOs, you're filtered out by what role you pick (tank/healer/dps).

 

[Hoodbury]

But your playstyle isn't the point of the bounty. The bounty is trying to get you to do something different. Using hand cannons and sniper rifles in PvP isn't my playstyle, but I sometimes pick up those queen bounties x.x

It's a challenge to overcome to get the exotic. And since Thorn will be getting a buff, it may be more worth it lol.

I know and I understand that. Just seems like a lot of work for an exotic when you can simply buy them from Xur every week, heh.

Also not a fan of losing progress. Like I said I'd be fine with slowing my progress to a turtle speed, I just want to continue making progress, not lose it and have to start over all the time if I have a bad game or two due to a bad connection.

 

[Hawkian]

In this example, if your friends dislike playing the Raid, it should be their choice not to do it again until they feel like they're ready and willing. Raids are really never a walk in the park until you're overleveled for it, but even then, some mechanics can cause raid wipes even on the easist modes though they're way more lax.

Let your friends quit, and let another person who queued up replace them via Matchmaking/Group Finder. This issue you bring up is also prevalent in MMOs but Group Finders still work it out.

I want to make totally sure I'm keeping all the ways this issue is handled by different games straight- seems like here you are using Matchmaking and Group Finder interchangeably but they're a little different, right?

It's more than classifieds. It's literally a matchmaking system where you queue up and you are put into a team. In MMOs, you're filtered out by what role you pick (tank/healer/dps).

Oh.. so you can't leave/view descriptions of the run you're joining?

 

[Zakalwe]

No, I just talk louder. It's hard to hear people over the in-game noise anyway.

Make a psn party and prioritise chat. Helps quite a lot.

 

[StoOgE]

Maybe you overestimate the average casual gamer. I have friends playing Destiny who have never touched MMOs, don't have any idea what it means to "raid", and often play with a beer in one hand and music blasting. These are the types of people that will join the VoG through MM, play for a bit and say "what is this shit??" once trouble hits, and quit. A very advanced MM system could filter out the more casual people, but no MM does that too and it requires a lot less work on Bungie's part.

And these friends are going to light farm to get to level 26?

Right.

The game already has a built in hurdle to keep casuals out of the raid which is being a pretty high level in a game that makes it reasonably difficult to level beyond 20 without doing some research.

Also, they could just ban you from matchmaking for a week if you quit out of raids.

 

[LiK]

That's perfect. Isn't that exactly what destinylfg.net offers? That's what is needed in-game!

The differences between this and matchmaking are face-smashingly obvious to me, i feel like I'm taking crazy pills this morning

I would love an alert from friends in the Roster when they ask people to group up for a Raid. That would make it so much easier. We get alerts for all sorts of stuff for drops etc but a Raid Group alert would be nice. It's not like people in my list play Raids everyday.

 

[lunlunqq]

Can someone explain to me how your level impacts the stats of your guns and armor? Does a 250 damage gun do 250 damage regardless of your level?

How about enemies? Do higher level enemies have more HP?

I think it's a bit strange. I do less to enemies at a higher level as expected. And I do less damage to enemies that are at a much lower level to me, too... Don't understand how it works...

 

[Nameless]

I don't see a way around the "bullett sponge" issue. Bosses with specific weaknesses and exploits would become cupcakes very very quickly just like the Walker.

The fun of the boss fights in Destiny is dealing with the waves of subordinates while also grinding down the main and avoiding his instakill. Shit gets intense, especially if you're alone.

 

[noomi]

So question.... can you actually ever max out your cryptarch rank? Some people are around 23, I'm barely rank 8 right now.

 

[Afrocious]

I want to make totally sure I'm keeping all the ways this issue is handled by different games straight- seems like here you are using Matchmaking and Group Finder interchangeably but they're a little different, right?

No, they're not. They literally function the same way and have different names.

You queue up for a raid you want to do, and you're matched with other people who queued for that same raid.

 

[CRA5H]

Cool cheers, I will do a few on each of those.

25 strikes before Xur goes.... Looks like my destiny is set for the week....

Bad JuJu better be the best gun ever.

I blasted through those 25 strikes just by doing phogoth runs. Run straight to phogoth and dont bother with any enemies. It was easier for me because I just cloaked through as a hunter. Now I'm waiting until Friday for Xur...

 

[hydruxo]

I hate Detsiny for the fact that it's pulling me away from my brand new game (Shadow of Mordor)
I only played a single hour of it and this damn game is not letting me go!

This is why I haven't bought Mordor yet haha. Getting Driveclub next week though.

 

[LiK]

No, I just talk louder. It's hard to hear people over the in-game noise anyway.

Hm, it was pretty soft for me. But I could hear ya so no biggie.