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[Mononoke]

This entire thread, all 118 pages, is hilarious to me, by the way

I truly believe that in the same way we dig up that Uncharted 3 review thread and say "Oh my god, that's so embarrassing, I can't believe GAF was like that back then" we're going to open this thread (and those similar to it) in a few years and have the same reaction

Maybe if things turn out to be wrong (ie, people reacting on wrong information). But really this was terrible PR from Ubi either way so the reactions aren't unreasonable. The uncharted 3 review thread really isn't comparable and I find you comparing them to be quite baffling. You are talking about people being upset over subjective opinions vs. a debate on performance and parity.

I actually think the attitude of this post is pretty shitty (although maybe that wasn't your intention). The issue might not mean something to some folks. And that's totally cool. Those people aren't wrong. But neither are those that do care about this. Always dismissing people for being upset over something as laughable is in bad form. As it pretty much leaves no room for discussion. It pretty much makes it so anytime people are upset about something, they must simply be whining or complaining.

I dunno about you, but I think some things are worth talking about (and being upset about). And even when something doesn't personally upset me, I try to understand why it upsets others and try not to dismiss it initially. I just don't understand how you can say someone being upset over a review score, is the same as someone being upset over parity and performance limitations. Unless the review had some controversy (like Kane and Lynch) -- i don't see how you can lump this issue into something like that. Again, even if you don't think it's an issue.

 

[Kezen]

I know what to expect of Ubisoft I assure you. I am not epxecting anything, but I will wait and see how this unfolds. It still feels like a "tiny" win the fact that Ubisoft even replied to this outcry.

Clarifying statements is not much but you're right that's it's something at least. Perhaps they will avoid "parity" on their next projects. But remember : same res and framerate /= parity. And I find the idea that Microsoft has anything to do with this ludicrous. I believe Ubisoft are the sole responsible for this decision.

I do feel that a community, no matter how small of the total percentage it represents can make a good impact. It could be small at first, but eventually in the long run it could have the desired effect. Maybe not for ACU but the next one in the series. Even if that happens, it is considered a win.

I hope you people will get what you want. Ubisoft sure should have tackled this issue a lot better. What were they thinking ?

 

[Chû Totoro]

900p thread?

 

[Nerokis]

if this isn't gimped, and it is running at 900p on PS4 but with higher quality graphics settings, I wonder what Ubisoft's thinking was? Do they think higher quality settings at a lower resolution gives a better return than lower quality settings at native 1080p?

what would you choose?

Well, this could be a case of stable 30fps > unstable 60fps != higher IQ. I could see this train of thought leading to 900p/30fps seeming like a potential sweet spot for both versions. It's also possible Ubisoft figured people would forgive a game like AC:U being 900p, but that 720p would have more baggage at this point in the generation. So there was more imperative to get up from 720p than there was to achieve 1080p, and so a different set of compromises were made for each version.

Just a couple thoughts!

I'm not making any "abstract declaration". I'm just saying, read my quote, that not even trying is bad. Maybe they did their best and failed. Maybe they made choices. Of course. But IF they didn't try just for parity reason, it's an awful decision. I agree that we don't know if this is the case for ACU.
...
But again, we don't have the facts and don't know what actually happened there.

Fair enough.

I can't believe some of the people in this thread. "We have no proof of anything - stop making wild accusations".
The PS4 is more powerful. That's all the friggin' proof you need.

No, if you think about it, it really isn't.

 

[Kamina]

Maybe it decreased the amount of debate they'd have in-house?

Spoiler

Fuck no.

Maybe debates with MS employees stationed at ubisoft? Lol

 

[Yoday]

I know what to expect of Ubisoft I assure you. I am not epxecting anything, but I will wait and see how this unfolds. It still feels like a "tiny" win the fact that Ubisoft even replied to this outcry.

I do feel that a community, no matter how small of the total percentage it represents can make a good impact. It could be small at first, but eventually in the long run it could have the desired effect. Maybe not for ACU but the next one in the series. Even if that happens, it is considered a win.

And I honestly believe that if we could have 200 pages on this matter it would do nothing but good for gaming in general.

Good, what good? We know the resolution and target framerate, nothing else. I will personally be pissed off if we end up with the game at 1080p but downgraded in every other department with a choppy framerate because of this outcry.

Save the rage and your money, if you are so inclined, for when we have all of the facts. I will be waving my anti-parity flag high if there is true parity, but we simply don't know that yet.

 

[Riky]

Again, like I said



The "if" part is important. And it goes the same for the Xbox One. If it can do better; it should. "It's acceptable because Watch Dogs sold well" is a shitty way to see this issue. We shouldn't settle for less than we could have just because it sells anyway. I see why they want to, but it's bullshit and we shouldn't accept it.

We don't if it could do better, there is quite a bit of difference between 900p and 1080p in pixel numbers, at the end of the day the PS4 is 40% more powerful than something not very powerful, like I've said before the difference in approx terms between an R7265 and an R7260, both mid range GPU in PC terms.

Do we really think now that the Xbox One can only run Ghosts at 720p? To think any game released so far is getting 100% of either console is silly, every game released so far could be better with more time and money. Therefore if you are only buying games that max the hardware then so far you would have no games.

I have the PS4 version of Black Flag and I've ordered the PS4 version of Unity, I suspected it may run better on PS4 but it turns out I could have gone Xbox One after all like I did with Destiny (prefer the Xbox One pad). I'm not going to cancel because another version happens to be the same that I'm not going to play.

Would these people be cancelling if the Xbox One version was still 798p? Their version wouldn't be any different.

If someone produces some physical evidence that the PS4 version was ever 1080p then I would have sympathy for what people are saying, but the only evidence is that the Xbox One version has been upgraded twice to get to 900p.

 

[Vaga]

Can't believe even after almost a year some are still thinking the power gap between PS4 and XOne is related to optimization. Stop being so delusional people.

 

[Celestial Mortal]

The Bone first destroyed 360 owners' hearts and now it is trying to destroy the game industry by having devs "hold back" on other platforms...

That's business and money for ya

 

[TsuWave]

You have no idea what they tried to do, they got to 900p/30fps on PS4, this they might think is an acceptable standard since Watch Dogs and Battlefield 4 sold millions at that resolution on PS4.

The Xbox One version was 720p, then nearly 800p, then they get the bump from the Kinect rescource removal and managed 900p also, we have evidence that the Xbox One version was at two lower resolutions during this process, we have no physical evidence at all that the PS4 version was ever higher than 900p.

this quote still exists though:

"We decided to lock them at the same specs to avoid all the debates and stuff,"

and I guess you could try and argue that it can easily be referring to the effort of bringing up the xbox version of the game, but then, wouldn't it be easier to say "I'm happy to say we succeeded in bringing up the xbox version to reach parity with ps4's" or "we're pretty happy that we managed parity" rather than a statement that implies and/or can be interpreted as one console getting the bad end of the stick because of "debates and stuff"? especially when historical evidence point to the ps4 being capable of outperforming the xbox one in regards to the subject matter...and no, its not because of optimization.

 

[zkorejo]

'To avoid all the debates and stuff'

How'd that work out for ya?

Lol.. Ubi sacrificed themselves and shot themselves in the head to stop the debates.. All for the good of the community.

They are the heroes gaming community deserves but doesn't need right now... so we will hunt them.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

The more you think about it, the more wrong forced parity is in this case.

PS4 has around double the install base of the Xbone worldwide hasn't it? So despite that fact, the majority of the game's audience (strictly speaking about next gen only) will have to put up with a gimped product.

The problem is that if this starts happening now and is accepted, it has grave implications further down the line.

 

[Paganmoon]

Avoid the debate.........yeah that's gone well, you've just created a shitstorm of epic proportions with all sorts of theories getting banded about...PR disaster!

I wasn't buying this this month because Destiny and Alien will take up my time plus my backlog...but now, think i'll wait for a patch or a sale

I wouldn't really call this a shitstorm of epic proportions, considering afaik it's just exploded here on GAF. And the pre-order cancellations are (unfortunately) going to be just a piss in the sea compared to the total pre-orders, UBI won't feel it or take note of it.

If they release at 1080p on PS4 it won't be cause of this.
God damnit, I was hoping for more 1080p AAA games this gen, hate not having my display pixelmapped...

 

[valkyre]

Good, what good? We know the resolution and target framerate, nothing else. I will personally be pissed off if we end up with the game at 1080p but downgraded in every other department with a choppy framerate because of this outcry.

Save the rage and your money, if you are so inclined, for when we have all of the facts. I will be waving my anti-parity flag high if there is true parity, but we simply don't know that yet.

Well, obviously when I expect a 1080p patch I am not expecting to receive all around downgrades in order to run in 1080p. We are talking about doing proper work like with ACIV.

 

[nelsonroyale]

Did any dev do this last gen?

 

[sirap]

Just canceled mine from Amazon. I'll buy it once they get all the patches in.

Driveclub gets my money now.

 

[NickMitch]

Numbers and Ps
So silly....

 

[Savitar]

Yeah see.

Their decision...it backfired.

At least when it comes to "ending the debate."

 

[TAJ]

I wouldn't really call this a shitstorm of epic proportions, considering afaik it's just exploded here on GAF. And the pre-order cancellations are (unfortunately) going to be just a piss in the sea compared to the total pre-orders, UBI won't feel it or take note of it.

If they release at 1080p on PS4 it won't be cause of this.
God damnit, I was hoping for more 1080p AAA games this gen, hate not having my display pixelmapped...

It hasn't even been a day yet.

 

[valkyre]

Did any dev do this last gen?

last gen res differences where not that large so most people didnt even bother to argue in such a way. Also back then there was not such a significant hardware advantage between the 2 consoles, plus their architecture was so different that direct comparisons werent that simple.

 

[Marlenus]

We don't if it could do better, there is quite a bit of difference between 900p and 1080p in pixel numbers, at the end of the day the PS4 is 40% more powerful than something not very powerful, like I've said before the difference in approx terms between an R7265 and an R7260, both mid range GPU in PC terms.

Do we really think now that the Xbox One can only run Ghosts at 720p? To think any game released so far is getting 100% of either console is silly, every game released so far could be better with more time and money. Therefore if you are only buying games that max the hardware then so far you would have no games.

I have the PS4 version of Black Flag and I've ordered the PS4 version of Unity, I suspected it may run better on PS4 but it turns out I could have gone Xbox One after all like I did with Destiny (prefer the Xbox One pad). I'm not going to cancel because another version happens to be the same that I'm not going to play.

Would these people be cancelling if the Xbox One version was still 798p? Their version wouldn't be any different.

If someone produces some physical evidence that the PS4 version was ever 1080p then I would have sympathy for what people are saying, but the only evidence is that the Xbox One version has been upgraded twice to get to 900p.

The Xbox One is closer to the R7 250x than anything else. The PS4 is a dead ringer for the R7 265 though so you are correct there.

If the Xbox One version was 798p and the PS4 version was 900p people would probably feel that they are pushing as much as they can and that is the best they could do. I would think the same but I would also think that their best is not really good enough just like it was not good enough with Watch_Dogs. The fact they can get the Xbox One upto 900p means there is GPU headroom available on the PS4 version, that is a fact. They can use that headroom to increase the Resolution, the frame rate or the effects. For me the order in which I would use the overhead (provided it is a stable 30FPS) is

1: Resolution
2: Frame Rate
3: Effects.

Others might switch 1 and 2 around but I doubt many would put effects above either the resolution or the frame rate.

That is the problem here either the headroom is not being used or they are using it in the worst possible way and neither scenario is good.

 

[aindriu80]

As a PS4 owner I'm disappointed. I do really like full 1080p and the downgrade has turned me off from making a pre order. I won't buy it unless it gets a great review and a patch to bump up resolution to 1080p.

 

[Yoday]

Well, obviously when I expect a 1080p patch I am not expecting to receive all around downgrades in order to run in 1080p. We are talking about doing proper work like with ACIV.

They have had significantly more time with the hardware this time, so that scenario is highly unlikely to happen again. You need to be asking what sacrifices would need to be made to get it to 1080p, and what sacrifices were already made to get the XB1 version to 900p. Resolution is far from the whole picture, but seems to be all anyone wants to talk about.

 

[nelsonroyale]

last gen res differences where not that large so most people didnt even bother to argue in such a way. Also back then there was not such a significant hardware advantage between the 2 consoles, plus their architecture was so different that direct comparisons werent that simple.

Well, there were generally differences between versions, and as you said hardware was closer. I mean if devs put equal effort into both versions I would expect the PS4 version to always have either advantages in res, effects, FPS, or all of the above.

 

[Stratn]

Just bought Mordor last night, I think this game will scratch that itch that AC would normally would. I just think this game is setting a bad precedent for the rest of the generation.... Keeping parity just for the sake of argument is such a horrible excuse. Good bye to my 60 bones UBI Soft!!

 

[BokehKing]

You have no idea what they tried to do, they got to 900p/30fps on PS4, this they might think is an acceptable standard since Watch Dogs and Battlefield 4 sold millions at that resolution on PS4.

The Xbox One version was 720p, then nearly 800p, then they get the bump from the Kinect rescource removal and managed 900p also, we have evidence that the Xbox One version was at two lower resolutions during this process, we have no physical evidence at all that the PS4 version was ever higher than 900p.

Is this fact or just fantasy speculation? I think you gloss over the fact that it's "locked" because one can do better than the other

I'll let you figure out the rest on your own though

 

[MrAndySchneider]

My head hurts.

I have an Xbox One. I could buy a PS4 any time I want, but there's nothing on the system that interests me so I could justify buying a second console. I like the One because of the OS, infrastructure, and because I don't like (old) Sony as a company. Also, I like Kinect. Feels like I am in the future everytime I use voice commands when watching Netflix. But I guess I'm easily excited.

That said, I couldn't care less about this whole resolution discussion. I wouldn't care if the PS4 version looks better. Let it run in 1081p, even, and the Xbox One version in 720p. I won't notice it when playing, and sure, you'll see it when both versions run next to each other, but is this really this significant?

Just play good games, have fun, and do whatever you like best.

I realize that this comment adds nothing to the discussion, but after reading some dozens of heated arguments, I just had to write this down. I'm not sure I understand the fanaticism rampant here.

 

[valkyre]

They have had significantly more time with the hardware this time, so that scenario is highly unlikely to happen again. You need to be asking what sacrifices would need to be made to get it to 1080p, and what sacrifices were already made to get the XB1 version to 900p. Resolution is far from the whole picture, but seems to be all anyone wants to talk about.

Ok let me restate this then:

If XBOXONE and PS4 are both 900p and 30 fps with the same graphical fidelity then this is wrong.

And I am pretty sure that when Ubisoft uses the parity term they refer not just to res and fps but graphical fidelity as well.

Now if the game is the same res and yet the PS4 version is like HIGH pc settings and XBOXONE is medium, ok then we can have indeed another kind of debate.

 

[Lapidus' Beard]

Thank you Ubisoft for making my decision. It's going to be crowded with releases that month and some game had to take the fall.
I will get this used after a few weeks, when there probably is a patch released and when the other games are finished.

 

[justsomeguy]

900p thread?

Dude. You win the internet today.

 

[Yagharek]

The video output will be full 1080p, as it says.

Well, I guess everything is 1080p now.

 

[Windom Earle]

Yeah, people should really buy Shadow of Mordor instead. It actually has gameplay! AssCreed is so played out and stale.

 

[jrush64]

Holy shit, 121 pages!!

 

[valkyre]

Holy shit, 121 pages!!

We need more.

 

[Paganmoon]

It hasn't even been a day yet.

Still not a shitstorm of epic proportions.

 

[FloweryMarston]

120+ pages. I stopped looking at the thread around 70 pages. Did any of you come to a conclusion? or is it still people losing their mind about their own interpretation of the PR stunt by ubisoft? Honestly, i think that there is a huge number of people that got offended because of this and i kind of understand the reason, but also think that's extremely silly on everyone's part here. In my opinion, this thread makes gaf hit a new low.


Also, going to psn and seeing that the output is 1080p on the description and claiming that they were lying is amazing. The output is 1080p, the game is rendered at 900p, so it upscales. wow magic

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

Amazing....Ubisoft managed to make the Preorder Cancelled meme a reality


Great job!

 

[Bollocks]

Lets go guys, maybe we can reach |OT2|

 

[aindriu80]

Last time around A.C got a post patch to upgrade to 1080p...no reason they can't do the same again ?

 

[CyberPunked]

Last time around A.C got a post patch to upgrade to 1080p...no reason they can't do the same again ?

The reason is, they're Ubisoft.

 

[Kaako]

I'm so glad this thing has blew right the fuck up so far in their faces. Hope it keeps spiraling and people be held accountable for this dumbass decision.

 

[Vaga]

There is only one AC game this year at 1080p. It's called Shadow of Mordor and it's better than all its predecessors.

 

[TsuWave]

I like the One because of the OS, infrastructure, and because I don't like (old) Sony as a company.

you list liking your xbox one because you "don't like (old) sony as a company" then you say this:

I'm not sure I understand the fanaticism rampant here.

lol. why does not liking "old sony" makes you like your xbox one? how are they connected?

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

Because some folks asked I made a non text version for future use of Ubisoft stupid stuff.

Also for the people who missed it last night I uploaded it late the original:

 

[boredandlazy]

900p thread?

You're not sitting far enough away from your monitor.

 

[Canis lupus]

My head hurts.

I have an Xbox One. I could buy a PS4 any time I want, but there's nothing on the system that interests me so I could justify buying a second console. I like the One because of the OS, infrastructure, and because I don't like (old) Sony as a company. Also, I like Kinect. Feels like I am in the future everytime I use voice commands when watching Netflix. But I guess I'm easily excited.

That said, I couldn't care less about this whole resolution discussion. I wouldn't care if the PS4 version looks better. Let it run in 1081p, even, and the Xbox One version in 720p. I won't notice it when playing, and sure, you'll see it when both versions run next to each other, but is this really this significant?

Just play good games, have fun, and do whatever you like best.

I realize that this comment adds nothing to the discussion, but after reading some dozens of heated arguments, I just had to write this down. I'm not sure I understand the fanaticism rampant here.

You are correct in your analysis that your comment added nothing to the discussion. PS4 is specifically made for 1080p gaming, the GPU has 32 ROPs (raster operations pipes) which is responsible for final pixel output. People are mad Ubi opted for the same 16 ROPs target as the Xbone for the PS4 version.

 

[Altered Juice]

who's next

 

[Forkball]

Wow uh, I sure did miss something.

I'm sorry, but 30 fps should not be tolerated in this day and age. This is the number one thing people should be looking for in games, especially action oriented ones.

 

[Windom Earle]

cancelled as soon as I heard about it, took my son to school walked to EB games and transferred the funds from unity to gtav.

IMO the right reaction.

 

[Buzzati]

I'm not buying this on principle. I don't mind playing games at 30 fps or a less than perfect resolution, but I don't want to endorse this type of behavior from developers. Funny enough, if they didn't admit to pegging them at parity, I wouldn't know any better.