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[EmptySpace]

It's even worse. Even Amy Hennig talks about it :O


http://www.theguardian.com/technology/gamesblog/2012/may/18/max-payne-3-story-vs-action

because game designers have yet to design a game where violence isn't involved, at that level of game development.

you.look at the biggest, most expensive game projects today and the only way to interact with something is to hit or kill them.

honestly that is the most depressing part about a lot of games today.

 

[LingeringRegime]

ohhh my goddddddd

PLEASE HD COLLECTION NOW

This. Must. Happen.

 

[Marcel]

Exactly. The story of Uncharted 4 is Drake breaking free of Sully and becoming his own man and learning that killing is bad.

And then at the end Drake has his Old Snake moment and turns the gun that he used on so many others on himself. It would be a pretty powerful moment in a Spec Ops: The Line sort of way.

 

[NipplesAndToes23]

I just noticed how many posts are talking about Drake being a mass murderer. Did people really take what the villain of 2 said seriously? This is always brought up in an Uncharted threads. It seems so silly, especially like in dozens of other games it's in self-defense.

 

[Chhem]

If you guys really have a problem with drakes murderous ways. Why keep playing them. It's a game. It's not suppose to be taken seriously. What kind of game would it be if all you did in uncharted was climb shit all day. There wouldnt be an uncharted 2,3,4 if that were the case.

 

[Alienous]

It's even worse. Even Amy Hennig talks about it :O


http://www.theguardian.com/technology/gamesblog/2012/may/18/max-payne-3-story-vs-action

How dares this "Uncharted creator" to talk about this nonsense and even acknowledge it?

No, dude. It's "pseudo-intelligent" nonsense. Eugh.

because game designers have yet to design a game where violence isn't involved, at that level of game development.

you.look at the biggest, most expensive game projects today and the only way to interact with something is to hit or kill them.

honestly that is the most depressing part about a lot of games today.

Eh...

 

[Acquiescence]

Those video games want to be realistic, "mature" and also be part movie part game. That was Naughty Dog's choice.

A movie, that had the content that Uncharted has, would be laughed out in cinemas. It's sort of like an Indiana Jones movie from the '80s, but with 20 times the body count.

I wouldn't even describe Uncharted as realistic and mature. It's a T-rated, globe-trotting romp heavily influenced by serials, there's nothing particularly mature about that. And the reason it has 20 times the body count is because it's five times longer than your average Indiana Jones movie.

 

[Wasp]

Shooting stuff is a gameplay mechanic. What do people suggest is a better alternative for the Uncharted series? No enemies whatsoever? Nazi zombies? A tranquilliser gun?

Besides, Drake obviously kills in self defence. Try holstering your weapons and walking up to one of the gun totting mercenaries and see how far that gets you. It's kill or be killed.

 

[Marcel]

I just noticed how many posts are talking about Drake being a mass murderer. Did people really take what the villain of 2 said seriously? This is always brought up in an Uncharted threads. It seems so silly, especially like in dozens of other games it's in self-defense.

I guess Amy Hennig's opinion isn't to be taken seriously, right?

 

[Servbot24]

I just noticed how many posts are talking about Drake being a mass murderer. Did people really take what the villain of 2 said seriously? This is always brought up in an Uncharted threads. It seems so silly, especially like in dozens of other games it's in self-defense.

It's just a meme. No one actually cares that there's violence in the Uncharted games.

 

[EmptySpace]

ohhh my goddddddd

PLEASE HD COLLECTION NOW

people are going to be burnt out come uncharted 4.

most ps4 owners missed out on the uncharteds.

if sony releases a collection (of 3 games), people will play through those and by the time uc4 rolls in they'd have been burnt out by the gameplay.

while some of us last played an uncharted game on 2011.

 

[Marcel]

It's just a meme. No one actually cares that there's violence in the Uncharted games.

To Naughty Dog's credit, they are thinking about the issue more than the people playing the game.

 

[……forgetit]

because game designers have yet to design a game where violence isn't involved, at that level of game development.

you.look at the biggest, most expensive game projects today and the only way to interact with something is to hit or kill them.

honestly that is the most depressing part about a lot of games today.

Because cooking mama won't sell 5 million copies. Look at the same level of development in Hollywood films. Find me a movie with a 100 million+ budget that doesn't involve dropping fools. Or at least beating them up pretty badly.

 

[Kinyou]

because game designers have yet to design a game where violence isn't involved, at that level of game development.

you.look at the biggest, most expensive game projects today and the only way to interact with something is to hit or kill them.

honestly that is the most depressing part about a lot of games today.

Yes, but ludonarrative dissonance can still be handled well. imo Last of Us did that by acknowledging that Joel is a killing machine. (and at the same time have less enemy encounters than a game like Max Payne)

 

[lotsofotherstuff]

Shooting stuff is a gameplay mechanic. What do people suggest is a better alternative for the Uncharted series? No enemies whatsoever? Nazi zombies? A tranquilliser gun?

Besides, Drake obviously kills in self defence. Try holstering your weapons and walking up to one of the gun totting mercenaries and see how far that gets you. It's kill or be killed.

I know this is probably just me, but I would love to have Uncharted (or a Uncharted-esque game) be more focused on the puzzles than the combat. Sorta like a National Treasure: The Video Game (don't hate me, I like those movies).

 

[Marcel]

Because cooking mama won't sell 5 million copies. Look at the same level of development in Hollywood films. Find me a movie with a 100 million+ budget that doesn't involve dropping fools.

Any Batman movie.

 

[Matush]

That title xD

 

[Marcel]

That title xD

The people being genuinely defensive about it are even funnier.

 

[The Tofunator]

Shooting stuff is a gameplay mechanic. What do people suggest is a better alternative for the Uncharted series? No enemies whatsoever? Nazi zombies? A tranquilliser gun?

Besides, Drake obviously kills in self defence. Try holstering your weapons and walking up to one of the gun totting mercenaries and see how far that gets you. It's kill or be killed.

I remember when everyone wanted Bioshock Infinite to be an adventure game last year because all the killing made them uncomfortable. So I guess that's what they want Uncharted to be as well?

 

[……forgetit]

Yes, but ludonarrative dissonance can still be handled well. imo Last of Us did that by acknowledging that Joel is a killing machine. (and at the same time have less enemy encounters than a game like Max Payne)

Still, The Last of Us is a very serious game, uncharted us not. A lot of people are getting the game's artstyle confused with ton. Just because it looks realistic doesn't mean you should take it seriously. Bioshock Infinite I can see the issue with. Uncharted is basically a cartoon though.

 

[SolidSnakex]

The people being genuinely defensive about it are even funnier.

Probably because while the mods are joking, it's based off of arguments that aren't jokes. You can go back to countless Uncharted threads with people complaining about this very things, and not in a sarcastic way.

 

[Red Chocobo]

The people being genuinely defensive about it are even funnier.

As are the ones being genuinely offensive.

 

[shinobi602]

The people being genuinely defensive about it are even funnier.

It's probably because others are being genuinely serious about it lol.

 

[……forgetit]

Any Batman movie.

I added for clarity. The guy was talking about general violence, so that includes beating fool into submission. I meant to add that but hit post too quickly.

 

[Acquiescence]

Probably because while the mods are joking, it's based off of arguments that aren't jokes. You can go back to countless Uncharted threads with people complaining about this very things, and not in a sarcastic way.

Was there any actual conversation in this thread about Drake being a murderer before the title change?

 

[Marcel]

It's probably because others are being genuinely serious about it lol.

Of course. Conversations about violence and ludonarrative dissonance worth having but not really in a thread like this that includes people like me who are just poking the bear.

 

[EmptySpace]

Because cooking mama won't sell 5 million copies. Look at the same level of development in Hollywood films. Find me a movie with a 100 million+ budget that doesn't involve dropping fools. Or at least beating them up pretty badly.

i don't care about movies. or are you saying 'murica just loves violence? that could be the case too. the best selling japanese games in japan aren't exactly all violent.

Yes, but ludonarrative dissonance can still be handled well. imo Last of Us did that by acknowledging that Joel is a killing machine. (and at the same time have less enemy encounters than a game like Max Payne)

yeah but that just means we won't get any other storyline that is as justified as a person trying to survive. we will get the same plot over and over as we do today. that is why i think gaming is so far behind in a lot of things. there's always a bad guy, a threat, you always need to save something or someone, etc. these are the things that dominate and pervade most game storylines.

 

[Darknight]

It's even worse. Even Amy Hennig talks about it :O


http://www.theguardian.com/technology/gamesblog/2012/may/18/max-payne-3-story-vs-action

How dares this "Uncharted creator" to talk about this nonsense and even acknowledge it?

I think its just an issue of the "good guy" having to resort to doing "bad things" to accomplish his/her goal. So Drake is a good person who had committed bad actions to get what he wants done. Simple.

Im sure when Bin Laden was found and killed, he could of stated the same to those Spec Ops. "Congratulations America, you have killed innocent people just like I have to get to me *laughs* Who is the good guy now? " *gets brain shot to bits*

 

[Wasp]

I know this is probably just me, but I would love to have Uncharted (or a Uncharted-esque game) be more focused on the puzzles than the combat. Sorta like a National Treasure: The Video Game (don't hate me, I like those movies).

Yeah, I would like that too.

Tomb Raider Anniversary had zero human enemies throughout the entire game. Not one. Just lots of animal enemies.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Was there any actual conversation in this thread about Drake being a murderer before the title change?

No, the discussion was mostly about VFX_Veteran arguing that ND isn't allowed to do things that other developers couldn't do, which in this case meant that it's not possible for them to make a game that looked like that E3 trailer and ran at 1080/60fps because Crytek and UBI couldn't achieve that with Ryse and AC: Unity.

 

[GifGafIsTheBestGaf]

jesus, i feel jelly and turned on at the same time

 

[Marcel]

I added for clarity. The guy was talking about general violence, so that includes beating fool into submission. I meant to add that but hit post too quickly.

When you said "dropping fools" I took that at face value, which means killing people. Plenty of violent games like Dishonored and Deus Ex offer non-lethal options though.

 

[Ratrat]

Because cooking mama won't sell 5 million copies. Look at the same level of development in Hollywood films. Find me a movie with a 100 million+ budget that doesn't involve dropping fools. Or at least beating them up pretty badly.

Every Pixar or Disney.

 

[Crossing Eden]

It's probably because others are being genuinely serious about it lol.

It's quite ridiculous to see people calling some a psychopath over this killing this guy and his huge army. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKkMYyidae4

 

[FF Seraphim]

If Drake being a happy go lucky mass murderer in his games are wrong, then I don't want to know whats right... because being right seems to be less fun...

 

[NotTheGuyYouKill]

But killing isn't always bad....

IT'S BLACK AND WHITE. ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. CLEARLY THERE IS NO ROOM FOR THE GRAY ON THIS BOARD.

And then at the end Drake has his Old Snake moment and turns the gun that he used on so many others on himself. It would be a pretty powerful moment in a Spec Ops: The Line sort of way.

One last punishment he must endure

 

[Red Chocobo]

people who are just poking the bear like me.

You have come across as one of those people who gets destroyed in an argument, and then pretends that they were messing around all along to avoid looking like you get proven wrong.

 

[Marcel]

You have come across as one of those people who gets destroyed in an argument, and then pretends that they were messing around all along to avoid looking like you get proven wrong.

If only you were psychic so you could know everyone's true intentions and feelings. I don't think anyone in here has 'destroyed' anyone else on either 'side'. You're making the situation out to be something it isn't.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Red Chocobo is the most casually destructive user on NeoGAF

 

[jett]

Nathan Drake is a scholar and a gentleman.



















Except when he is ruthlessly brutalizing people, of course.

 

[boredandlazy]

IT'S BLACK AND WHITE. ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. CLEARLY THERE IS NO ROOM FOR THE GRAY ON THIS BOARD.



One last punishment he must endure

And then Chloe gets married to Sully who's developed the ability to shit has pants at will?

 

[Marcel]

Red Chocobo is the most casually destructive user on NeoGAF

I have been targeted by his unjustified posting rage.

 

[Acquiescence]

No, the discussion was mostly about VFX_Veteran arguing that ND isn't allowed to do things that other developers couldn't do, which in this case meant that it's not possible for them to make a game that looked like that E3 trailer and ran at 1080/60fps because Crytek and UBI couldn't achieve that with Ryse and AC: Unity.

Ah right. So the title change is just a joke then. Or was intended as such, but ended up derailing the thread with the same tired debate we've grown accustomed to seeing so many times before in Uncharted threads.

Worth it.

 

[Jingo]

And this is why i love gaf, 17 pages for nothing, could all this talk be done in any other uncharted thread and year? Sure, but why not doing it in a supposedly new thread about uncharted 4?

 

[Wiktor]

I remember when everyone wanted Bioshock Infinite to be an adventure game last year because all the killing made them uncomfortable. So I guess that's what they want Uncharted to be as well?

Well..Uncharted doesn;t really have fascinating setting the way BioShocks did. That was actually the problem, because Columbia and Rapture ended up being just prett backgrounds. With Uncharted it's not really a problem.

Now I do think that the ammount of violence Uncharted games have kill any real genuine connection the franchise could have to old pulpy adventure stories like Indiana Jones, but it uses some elements to spice up regular action story really well. Of course you could make such story without much violence, but it wouldn't be Uncharted anymore.

 

[jett]

I remember when everyone wanted Bioshock Infinite to be an adventure game last year because all the killing made them uncomfortable. So I guess that's what they want Uncharted to be as well?

The only thing that made me uncomfortable about Bioshock Infinite is that it plays like shit.

 

[SmokyDave]

Nothing wrong with crackin' wise and crackin' skulls. Long may it continue.

 

[bwakh]

Lol whoever changed that title has really changed the course of this thread.

 

[Marcel]

The only thing that made me uncomfortable about Bioshock Infinite is that it plays like shit.

The thing that made me uncomfortable was that whole gunsmith portion of the game. Running through the same map backwards was some lazy shit.

 

[CassSept]

I think its just an issue of the "good guy" having to resort to doing "bad things" to accomplish his/her goal. So Drake is a good person who had committed bad actions to get what he wants done. Simple.

For 90% of the first two games Drake's goals are entirely selfish. I am yet to play UC3, but both in the first one and the sequel a) Drake doesn't learn that the treasure possesses supernatural qualities that may render the villain a danger to mankind until well into the story of the game b) the villain would not have gotten close to achieving his goal if it wasn't for Drake's interference.

Hell, I'm not a person who'd criticize video game for their violence for the most part, but I thought that Uncharted games suffered greatly from, well, ludonarrative dissonance due to sheer number of enemies you face throughout them.