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[Nymphae]

He's not discussing his breakfast. He's fueling and exacerbating a hate campaign against his ex, the courts can and do issue 'stfu' orders in such cases.

If there is sufficient evidence that what you say he is doing is happeneing, right.

 

[JackDT]

Not sure how many people follow Jonathan Blow on Twiter, but he's saying everything I was trying to get across earlier in the thread. Of course, he does a much better job:

This is the part that stood out to me, in his replies.

Thus #gamergate may be setting back by decades the public respect for gamers, undoing all the work done in recent times by the appearance

@Jonathan_Blow ...fallout from that any more than we are responsible for people being too stupid and blind to question the media's bullshit.

@Cyberxion_101 You are a bit late; GG already started malicious rumors about me. Look it up if you forgot. I am one of the evil illuminati.

@Jonathan_Blow You sure it was GG, man? Point me in the right direction and I'll knock some heads together.

Very funny, did you forget this whole thing? [phil fish igf conspiracy thing]

Yeah that Phil Fish and the IGF scandal, the story that was only behind Zoe Quinn in its importance in gamergate at that time, are you sure that was gamergate?

https://twitter.com/Jonathan_Blow/status/522830939265576960

 

[JC Sera]

It's shitty but I don't think it's a clear case of harassment in any legal sense.

ETA: Just saw that log. He's a dumbass who knew they were going to go nuts with it. I don't think a physical restraining order is still the right answer but he's going to have a hell of a time defending himself.

If I were in her position I would definitely get a restraining order against him. You'd get one for a stalker sending you disturbing messages constantly, why not this guy?
Also heres another one CTRL+F "Eron"

 

[tchocky]

If there is sufficient evidence that what you say he is doing is happeneing, right.

In the interview he did with buzzfeed linked a few pages back he admitted "advising gamergate leaders"

 

[Corronchilejano]

Libel is solved through suing for defamation through the courts not restraining order. He can still talk about her even with the restraining order.

I get your point. He has a legal right. Ethically though? He should just cut the crap, leave her alone and move on. Whatever emotional damage he believes she did to him can in no way be compared to the ammount damage he has done to her reputation and good name.

Just because she does not wish to sue him for libel doesn't mean he has to keep pushing it.

 

[Lime]

Is there anyone filling in for Phil Fish and his rhetorical style?

Sincere, non-rhetorical question: What can the gaming community do to turn stuff like that around?

Prove by actions that confirm that gaming culture is welcoming and approving of diversity. Signal as much as possible that all sorts of videogames and people and worldviews and cultures are appreciated and welcomed into the culture. Whether it is conferences, events, trade shows, press and media, companies, developers, fora, communities, marketing etc. Again, like I wrote earlier:

Reminder: The structural and systemic issues in the video games industry and culture are fostering the attitudes we see on display here. The lack of perspectives, of worldviews, of experiences, and of values all contribute to this environment we live in where people get told over and over again that they're awesome for buying video games and that anything being criticized for something they themselves aren't familiar with or incapable of relating to should be protected at all costs. These are people who think that saying anything critical of women in video games amount to censorship. These are people who spend tons of energy and literally hours on trying to debunk a woman's Youtube video series. And these people are never challenged because of the environment they live in never expose them to the actual diversity of the real world.

And this environment is something everyone with even the tiniest bit of power are complicit in fostering. When Polygon hires white guy Ben Kuchera almost immediately after him losing his job, while marginalized writers have to live off the good-will of people through Patreon. When Giantbomb hires two more guys despite having a chance to diversify their staff. When all the diversity discussions we have primarily and exclusively talk about women when other topics such as race, class, age, ability are downprioritized. When Polygon hires another White dude as their senior editor. When console reveals only brings men to show off the products and games. When people allow racist/sexist/homophobic slurs remain unchallenged in online multiplayer games. When people doubts a woman when she tells her own story of being discriminated against. When trade shows and huge press conferences fail to include a diversity of speakers and presenters for their games. When marketing people think advises developers to remove women from front covers of video games and their marketing. When people in the workplace don't call out the boys-club mentality and how it affects the work atmosphere.

There are so many factors and instances where everyone existing and participating in this culture are complicit in fostering this environment where Gamergaters come from. And there is not enough that is being done to change this environment. We, as in people within this culture, seriously need to be better and much more actively foster an environment that challenges oppressive and bigoted attitudes and thinking, while helping and ensuring the well-being of people affected by the structural and systemic oppression and discrimination.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

I just watched the discussion with Brianna Wu & Frederick Brennan.

I was gonna say I liked it better than the 3 GG women discussion but then Frederick had to get that final dig in. The host was so fucking uncomfortable when that happened lol.

 

[shootfast]

It's harassment, though.

It'd be the same as an ex coming to your workplace because they claim they need to "warn others" but only standing outside, and hinting at customers that go in that it would be a shame if someone spilled hot coffee on you but you'd never want it to happen.

The problem is to do with country and state, because it differs from state to state and country to country. Here in Australia it has to be physical harassment or intends physical harassment for it to be valid, from what I can tell each US state has it's own restraining order law, since I'm not his lawyer I'm not going to try and figure it out.

 

[Patryn]

Danny O'Dwyer just tweeted this article: The Sad Parents of Gaming.

It's gathered some short accounts of parents tackling the issue of Gamergate with their kids, which is an angle I hadn't really thought about. What does a parent do when they find that their child is supporting this movement that they feel is doing harm?

 

[QuantumZebra]

Sadly, it is not nonsensical. There are reasons why they focus on "small-time," female journalists. There are reasons why individual, named women are the targets. There are reasons why Anita Sarkeesian gets rape and death threats and Geoff Keighley doesn't.

Yep and no matter how much GGers try to deflect this line of reasoning - its because one has a vagina and one doesn't.

 

[cian]

Didn't mean it to be a loaded statement, just a clear one. This whole shitmess started because of the Zoe Quinn/Five Guys ugliness. I'm sure there are some good people using the tag but from inception to date it has been tainted with misogyny, harassment, and an embarrassingly myopic sense of entitlement.

I think it's hard to pinpoint a thing that just "started" it. The first use of the hashtag came from Adam Baldwin tweeting two videos about Quinn from Internet Aristocrat, the first of which was made around 10 days earlier. However it seems like it really blew up the following the "gamers are dead" articles which were released the next day.

The problem is with deciding whether the reason this story blew up was because of misogyny or because of dissatisfaction with the things that were detailed in the InternetAristocrat video. The video itself cover's the ZQ history, or at least a version of it. His complaints are about the DMCA against MundaneMatt, the gaming press jumping onto her initial story back in Dec 2013 about harassment from Wizardchan without looking further into it, the relationship with Grayson who gave her coverage in articles and the TFYC Reddit post among other things.

Now those are two guys who seem to be tied up with general anti-feminist/SJW stances so that is a bad start for the movement since clearly a lot of early supporters who were fans of these were going in with this mindset. However it was still tied to journalism ethics due to the fact that much of the ZQ outrage was tied to the perceived "sleeping with guys for good publicity" (which I'm not saying is true, just that that is a view I've seen quite a bit).

I do think a lot of it comes from a rising storm caused by friction between press and the gaming community though. It hasn't come to the forefront as much until now but for a long time a large portion of the gaming community have been unhappy with the press. I haven't been a part of it because I don't tend to frequent these sites anyway so it never bothered me but I have seen it. People have been mad about things like the closeness of the press (many perceived but unsubstantiated claims of bought reviews and journalists getting treated lavishly) and the industry and the increasing focus on op-eds that deal with hot topics like sexism. For sure there is sexism here too but I don't think that the Quinnspiracy and subsequent Gamergate could have happened in isolation. It seems almost inevitable, the Quinn part was just the spark that lit the swimming pool full of fireworks. It seems hard to say for certain that when this started, ethics had nothing to do with it.

Just for the record, I'm not an open GG supporter. I've never tweeted the hashtag and I find of the attention given by GG supporters to feminists and "social justice warriors" to be very off-putting, to say nothing of any death threats sent. So far I've just lurked around some GG havens like 8chan to see what people are saying. Most of the anti-GG stuff I've seen has just been snarky comments in unrelated threads on non-gaming sites or tweets (which are about the worst thing in all of this) so I just wanted to find a sane place to hear out the other side, but I do think there are problems here like early censorship on Reddit or the apparently tight clique of top indie devs that should be discussed and criticised, even if some people are using those for nefarious ends.

 

[Lalalandia]

If there is sufficient evidence that what you say he is doing is happeneing, right.

There's evidence here and on the last page

If I were in her position I would definitely get a restraining order against him. You'd get one for a stalker sending you disturbing messages constantly, why not this guy?
Also heres another one CTRL+F "Eron"

'We hunt the mammoths' is a blog that's been examining the IRC logs released by the GG group and by ZQ when she was lurking, he's there and he's not 'sharing his story' he's indulging his desire for petty revenge by insulting her and just blithely ignoring the hate boiling around him. This is not someone who published his break up screed as a cathartic gesture, he knew the shit it would stir and he went there to ensure it was well stirred. He defends and promotes GG because GG is the Quinnspiracy as renamed by Adam Baldwin when he tweeted the '5 guys'.

 

[BlastProcessing]

The problem is to do with country and state, because it differs from state to state and country to country. Here in Australia it has to be physical harassment or intends physical harassment for it to be valid, from what I can tell each US state has it's own restraining order law, since I'm not his lawyer I'm not going to try and figure it out.

Hmm.. a few posts ago you were much more confident:

Because it's a misuse of a restraining order.

Why would make such a definitive statement about something that you don't know anything about?

 

[andymcc]

Why would make such a definitive statement about something that you don't know anything about?

Probably because earlier in this thread he wrote this:

It is, as a recipient of racism this crap that is occurring to gamer's is exact same thing. if gamer's were a race this would out right racism what City of Dis wrote. Lets see "medication from the pain that consumes their lives" + "when these men use these same video games to escape their own shame" + "They lash out with an intense hatred only capable of a tormented and broken psyche". Replace gamers with skin colour of your choice.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

Between Brianna & the 8chan mod who was actually correct on the liability question? (if it's even a black and white issue.)

 

[Watch Da Birdie]

Danny O'Dwyer just tweeted this article: The Sad Parents of Gaming.

It's gathered some short accounts of parents tackling the issue of Gamergate with their kids, which is an angle I hadn't really thought about. What does a parent do when they find that their child is supporting this movement that they feel is doing harm?

Whoa, this weirds me out.

I mean, parents being so in-the-know about the individual names of 4chan boards, a parent comparing GamerGate to FoxNews in a negative way, etc.

Guess my parents are so old-fashioned. They saw me voting for Obama in the same way I imagine though.

 

[Ayt]

The problem is to do with country and state, because it differs from state to state and country to country. Here in Australia it has to be physical harassment or intends physical harassment for it to be valid, from what I can tell each US state has it's own restraining order law, since I'm not his lawyer I'm not going to try and figure it out.

From what I can tell, he's already been ordered to stfu about her online and stay away from her in person, but he obviously hasn't been able to do it.

http://idledillettante.wordpress.co...r-inability-to-stop-discussing-his-ex-online/

 

[JC Sera]

Probably because earlier in this thread he wrote this:

It is, as a recipient of racism this crap that is occurring to gamer's is exact same thing. if gamer's were a race this would out right racism what City of Dis wrote. Lets see "medication from the pain that consumes their lives" + "when these men use these same video games to escape their own shame" + "They lash out with an intense hatred only capable of a tormented and broken psyche". Replace gamers with skin colour of your choice.

wow
just wow

 

[Neoriceisgood]

Zoe didn't want to show up for a debate -> proof she's a liar.


Brianna did show up for a debate -> lying attention wh*ore.


Never change, YT comments.

 

[cian]

Between Brianna & the 4chan mod who was actually correct on the liability question? (if it's even a black and white issue.)

Just a note: he was a mod of 8chan, rather than 4chan. Many 4chan members migrated to 8chan when 4chan founder, Moot, banned all Gamergate discussion a few weeks back. 8chan welcomed them and was glad to get publicity. It works more like Reddit where anyone can start their own board and moderate it themselves.

I know nothing about law but I have to assume that the mod was correct since he wouldn't be talking about it openly if he was in danger of litigation and it sounded like he had looked into it much more specifically than Wu.

 

[Lalalandia]

I think it's hard to pinpoint a thing that just "started" it. The first use of the hashtag came from Adam Baldwin tweeting two videos about Quinn from Internet Aristocrat, the first of which was made around 10 days earlier. However it seems like it really blew up the following the "gamers are dead" articles which were released the next day.

The problem is with deciding whether the reason this story blew up was because of misogyny or because of dissatisfaction with the things that were detailed in the InternetAristocrat video. The video itself cover's the ZQ history, or at least a version of it. His complaints are about the DMCA against MundaneMatt, the gaming press jumping onto her initial story back in Dec 2013 about harassment from Wizardchan without looking further into it, the relationship with Grayson who gave her coverage in articles and the TFYC Reddit post among other things.

Now those are two guys who seem to be tied up with general anti-feminist/SJW stances so that is a bad start for the movement since clearly a lot of early supporters who were fans of these were going in with this mindset. However it was still tied to journalism ethics due to the fact that much of the ZQ outrage was tied to the perceived "sleeping with guys for good publicity" (which I'm not saying is true, just that that is a view I've seen quite a bit).

I do think a lot of it comes from a rising storm caused by friction between press and the gaming community though. It hasn't come to the forefront as much until now but for a long time a large portion of the gaming community have been unhappy with the press. I haven't been a part of it because I don't tend to frequent these sites anyway so it never bothered me but I have seen it. People have been mad about things like the closeness of the press (many perceived but unsubstantiated claims of bought reviews and journalists getting treated lavishly) and the industry and the increasing focus on op-eds that deal with hot topics like sexism. For sure there is sexism here too but I don't think that the Quinnspiracy and subsequent Gamergate could have happened in isolation. It seems almost inevitable, the Quinn part was just the spark that lit the swimming pool full of fireworks. It seems hard to say for certain that when this started, ethics had nothing to do with it.

Just for the record, I'm not an open GG supporter. I've never tweeted the hashtag and I find of the attention given by GG supporters to feminists and "social justice warriors" to be very off-putting, to say nothing of any death threats sent. So far I've just lurked around some GG havens like 8chan to see what people are saying. Most of the anti-GG stuff I've seen has just been snarky comments in unrelated threads on non-gaming sites or tweets (which are about the worst thing in all of this) so I just wanted to find a sane place to hear out the other side, but I do think there are problems here like early censorship on Reddit or the apparently tight clique of top indie devs that should be discussed and criticised, even if some people are using those for nefarious ends.

The problem is that people have rallied some valid concerns behind a label that was invented to harass and belittle a female game developer. The only outcomes from GG have been more harassment of women with death and rape threats not only to them but to people known to them. It has culminated in the Utah State debacle which has refocused attention onto the gamer community and what are outsiders seeing? A campaign founded on harassing a female game developer that has morphed into sending threats to more female critics and developers.

There is no nuance here GG is a poison that many thought was related to the LA article because manipulative psychos started to leverage outrage over an identity into cover for their hate campaign.

We had great threads on this forum discussing that stuff and everyone in here wishes we could get back to that but while GG has enmeshed itself into that debate we just can't. Even in here there is a cycle where we get worn down with new incidents of harassment and then every so often someone comes in repeating the same debunked Quinnspiracy stuff and we repeat the same links.

I just wish moderate folks in GG realise that leaving GG is not saying 'everything is cool bro', it's saying 'Sargon/Milo/AdamBaldwin/IA/etc you're assholes, I'm off over here having a conversation with sane people about ethics in journalism'.

 

[BlastProcessing]

I think it's hard to pinpoint a thing that just "started" it. The first use of the hashtag came from Adam Baldwin tweeting two videos about Quinn from Internet Aristocrat, the first of which was made around 10 days earlier. However it seems like it really blew up the following the "gamers are dead" articles which were released the next day.

The problem is with deciding whether the reason this story blew up was because of misogyny or because of dissatisfaction with the things that were detailed in the InternetAristocrat video. The video itself cover's the ZQ history, or at least a version of it. His complaints are about the DMCA against MundaneMatt, the gaming press jumping onto her initial story back in Dec 2013 about harassment from Wizardchan without looking further into it, the relationship with Grayson who gave her coverage in articles and the TFYC Reddit post among other things.

Now those are two guys who seem to be tied up with general anti-feminist/SJW stances so that is a bad start for the movement since clearly a lot of early supporters who were fans of these were going in with this mindset. However it was still tied to journalism ethics due to the fact that much of the ZQ outrage was tied to the perceived "sleeping with guys for good publicity" (which I'm not saying is true, just that that is a view I've seen quite a bit).

I do think a lot of it comes from a rising storm caused by friction between press and the gaming community though. It hasn't come to the forefront as much until now but for a long time a large portion of the gaming community have been unhappy with the press. I haven't been a part of it because I don't tend to frequent these sites anyway so it never bothered me but I have seen it. People have been mad about things like the closeness of the press (many perceived but unsubstantiated claims of bought reviews and journalists getting treated lavishly) and the industry and the increasing focus on op-eds that deal with hot topics like sexism. For sure there is sexism here too but I don't think that the Quinnspiracy and subsequent Gamergate could have happened in isolation. It seems almost inevitable, the Quinn part was just the spark that lit the swimming pool full of fireworks. It seems hard to say for certain that when this started, ethics had nothing to do with it.

Just for the record, I'm not an open GG supporter. I've never tweeted the hashtag and I find of the attention given by GG supporters to feminists and "social justice warriors" to be very off-putting, to say nothing of any death threats sent. So far I've just lurked around some GG havens like 8chan to see what people are saying. Most of the anti-GG stuff I've seen has just been snarky comments in unrelated threads on non-gaming sites or tweets (which are about the worst thing in all of this) so I just wanted to find a sane place to hear out the other side, but I do think there are problems here like early censorship on Reddit or the apparently tight clique of top indie devs that should be discussed and criticised, even if some people are using those for nefarious ends.

I don't know how old you are, but as someone who has been around since the beginning of video games the idea that tensions between the gaming community and the press are somehow new or escalated seems odd. Games coverage was become immeasurably better than it was 30 years ago. Those early magazines were pure publisher mouthpieces. Hell, the only games coverage I had access to at first was Nintendo Power, which was basically a corporate organ.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

Just a note: he was a mod of 8chan, rather than 4chan. Many 4chan members migrated to 8chan when 4chan founder, Moot, banned all Gamergate discussion. I know nothing about law but I have to assume that the mod was correct since he wouldn't be talking about it openly if he was in danger of litigation and it sounded like he had looked into it much more specifically than Wu.

I knew he was 8chan, I totally messed up on that x_x corrected it now.

 

[shootfast]

Hmm.. a few posts ago you were much more confident:



Why would make such a definitive statement about something that you don't know anything about?

Because I'm 100% sure in Australia it's based on physical contact(includes emails/phone calls). The problem is the US has 50 states with 50 different restraining laws but in general it would follow the same principal on physical contact for harassment.

My original answer was to why would he fight the restraining order, because his not physically harassing her. On that basis the restraining order would be dismissed as frivolous. Now I'm not sure which state they're in nor do I care really, there could have been small chance that restraining orders in that state went beyond a normal set types of restraining orders. But really I don't really care to argue this point any longer.

 

[Dawg]

I'm not up to date with any of this, but I'm seeing several people from Gawker tweeting 'hurtful' stuff... not just at gamergate supporters, but gamers in general.

Not sure if sarcasm or serious, too lazy to find out too. Especially that Sam Biddle dude is posting some questionable stuff.

Not a #gamergate supporter myself, but I feel like some of them are big hypocrites as they seem to be harassing people too, including regular gamers :/

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Internet Aristocrat is gloating on Twitter that #GamerGate is beating #StopGamerGate2014 for mentions, saying "ours is bigger". I guess with the world outside Twitter discovering who they are and universally condemning them, it must be nice to have something to cling to.

 

[BlastProcessing]

Probably because earlier in this thread he wrote this:

Well, if he isn't a lawyer, maybe he has a PHD in Sociology!

 

[Tye The Czar]

My opinions about this whole case:

What she did is fo course horrible to do. And form what Ive read the men she slept with did not receive the same amount of shit like she did. But Ive not read too much up on this.

I refuse to believe most of this stuff until:

1. There is empirical evidence of wrongdoing. Innocent Until Proven Guilty.
2. We have the other side - Zoe's reasons could be very reasonable for all I know - of the story.

For starters:
http://kotaku.com/in-recent-days-ive-been-asked-several-times-about-a-pos-1624707346
http://kotaku.com/tag/depression-quest

 

[JackDT]

Internet Aristocrat is gloating on Twitter that #GamerGate is beating #StopGamerGate2014 for mentions, saying "ours is bigger". I guess with the world outside Twitter discovering who they are and universally condemning them, it must be nice to have something to cling to.

What is GamerGate bout? GamerGate is a campaign about the media representation of GamerGate.

 

[mo60]

Because I'm 100% sure in Australia it's based on physical contact(includes emails/phone calls). The problem is the US has 50 states with 50 different restraining laws but in general it would follow the same principal on physical contact for harassment.

My original answer was to why would he fight the restraining order, because his not physically harassing her. On that basis the restraining order would be dismissed as frivolous. Now I'm not sure which state they're in nor do I care really, there could have been small chance that restraining orders in that state went beyond a normal set types of restraining orders. But really I don't really care to argue this point any longer.

He is still talking about her a lot.He even tried to leak more info about her once a couple of weeks ago, but his attempt was shut down once the restraining order started

 

[Lalalandia]

I'm not up to date with any of this, but I'm seeing several people from Gawker tweeting 'hurtful' stuff... not just at gamergate supporters, but gamers in general.

Not sure if sarcasm or serious, too lazy to find out too. Especially that Sam Biddle dude is posting some questionable stuff.

Not a #gamergate supporter myself, but I feel like some of them are big hypocrites as they seem to be harassing people too, including regular gamers :/

This was the inevitable consequence of GamerGate, it's shitty foundations and loathsome actions guaranteed that once the wider world saw it they would damn us all as the stereotypical creatures LA was pointing out we no longer are (or probably ever were).

 

[Neoriceisgood]

Not sure if sarcasm or serious, too lazy to find out too. Especially that Sam Biddle dude is posting some questionable stuff.

Context? I have no idea who that is.

 

[Corpekata]

Biddle's a knob. But here's the thing. He's not really involved for the most part. He's just one of the lookie loos. The prominent GGers have been acting like knobs for ages. They've been getting people calling them heroes for it. Biddle, at best, is going to just be ignored, and at worst is going to get everyone calling him a knob. There isn't a "Support Sam Biddle" fan club arising from all of this.

It's like the Dell guy. He was an asshole for a blip, and....that's it. He didn't become the hero of Anti-GGers like the Milos of the world did for GG.

 

[shootfast]

Probably because earlier in this thread he wrote this:

Well thanks for quoting me without any context.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

What is GamerGate bout? GamerGate is a campaign about the media representation of GamerGate.

Well of course the SJW feminazi controlled media would be against our movement to uncover the SJW feminazi conspiracy.

WAKE UP SHEEPLE

 

[plagiarize]

I'm engaging some of these people on Twitter. It is not giving me warm fuzzy feelings about the human race. Thankfully you guys *do* so I'm going to keep at it for a while.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

It's like the Dell guy. He was an asshole for a blip, and....that's it. He didn't become the hero of Anti-GGers like the Milos of the world did for GG.

I'm looking at this guy's twitter and all he seems to be doing is posting pictures of youtubers with the tag gamergate.

Can I get some context on what makes him so bad? I've literally never heard of him.

 

[Corpekata]

I'm looking at this guy's twitter and all he seems to be doing is posting pictures of youtubers with the tag gamergate.

Can I get some context on what makes him so bad? I've literally never heard of him.

The Dell Guy? Made an ISIS comparison.

 

[cian]

The problem is that people have rallied some valid concerns behind a label that was invented to harass and belittle a female game developer. The only outcomes from GG have been more harassment of women with death and rape threats not only to them but to people known to them.

That's definitely not true, there have been other, more positive effects such as the likes of Kotaku and the Escapist revising their policies on journalistic ethics. Other effects have included the likes of Intel pulling sponsorship from Gamasutra, although whether that is "positive" will depend on who you ask.

I still can't get on board with the idea that it was started with the goal of harassing a developer though. If anything, it seemed to be a turning point away from that, since previously the topic was broadly called "The Quinnspiracy". The new label made it so that Quinn was no longer the centrepiece, although I don't deny there were many who dwelled on that.

I just wish moderate folks in GG realise that leaving GG is not saying 'everything is cool bro', it's saying 'Sargon/Milo/AdamBaldwin/IA/etc you're assholes, I'm off over here having a conversation with sane people about ethics in journalism'.

I believe that kind of was tried earlier on and Jim Sterling tried to support an alternative but it never took off due to fear of fracturing the movement. A big part of the problem is the lack of any official leadership or goals. It's reminiscent of Occupy Wall Street in that it's a large group who are mad, but it's hard to know how many are mad at the right things or for the right reasons. I really wish there was some kind of way to survey this and ask supporters what their primary concern is.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

The Dell Guy? Made an ISIS comparison.

Ohh him. Yeah that was counterproductive to say the least.

I still can't get on board with the idea that it was started with the goal of harassing a developer though. If anything, it seemed to be a turning point away from that, since previously the topic was broadly called "The Quinnspiracy". The new label made it so that Quinn was no longer the centrepiece, although I don't deny there were many who dwelled on that.

Adam Baldwin literally tweeted:

Gamergate:

<ridiculous video accusing zoe quinn of shit>


the *name* Gamergate is inherently linked to the Zoe Quinn thing, Adam Baldwin made it up specifically for that reason.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

It's sad, going on other forums and seeing literally five threads worth of people just bashing women. It's really sad that the mods lock the threads and then start new ones to "continue the discussion".

Internet Aristocrat is gloating on Twitter that #GamerGate is beating #StopGamerGate2014 for mentions, saying "ours is bigger".

It's shit like this that ultimately shows how vindictive a movement GG is. The GG response to StopGamerGate has been astronomically ridiculous.

 

[plagiarize]

That's definitely not true, there have been other, more positive effects such as the likes of Kotaku and the Escapist revising their policies on journalistic ethics. Other effects have included the likes of Intel pulling sponsorship from Gamasutra, although whether that is "positive" will depend on who you ask.

I still can't get on board with the idea that it was started with the goal of harassing a developer though. If anything, it seemed to be a turning point away from that, since previously the topic was broadly called "The Quinnspiracy". The new label made it so that Quinn was no longer the centrepiece, although I don't deny there were many who dwelled on that.

And still do based on some of the tweets I've received in the last couple of hours.

If you want to talk about ethics, then do that. Why insist on doing it under a flag that has become indelibly associated with misogyny?

 

[cian]

I don't know how old you are, but as someone who has been around since the beginning of video games the idea that tensions between the gaming community and the press are somehow new or escalated seems odd. Games coverage was become immeasurably better than it was 30 years ago. Those early magazines were pure publisher mouthpieces. Hell, the only games coverage I had access to at first was Nintendo Power, which was basically a corporate organ.

Oh you're absolutely right. Honestly, my own perspective is that it is broadly improving. Especially since the GTA 5 reviews came in, critics seem a lot less liable to froth at the mouth for every big-budget release and we seem to be moving away from the old four-point-scale scores so that 7/10 is no longer becoming an unbuyable score.

I'm just saying that in the last 2 or 3 years I have noticed mounting tension between a certain subset of gamers and the gaming press. It's not that this stuff is necessarily getting worse, more that people are just increasingly suspicious of it. I think the Mass Effect 3 ending incident is when I first started seeing it and it's only gotten worse since then.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

I still can't get on board with the idea that it was started with the goal of harassing a developer though. If anything, it seemed to be a turning point away from that, since previously the topic was broadly called "The Quinnspiracy". The new label made it so that Quinn was no longer the centrepiece, although I don't deny there were many who dwelled on that.

This is demonstrably untrue. You yourself said earlier that the first use of it was a tweet by Adam Baldwin where it was attached to YouTube links to videos which were harassment in and of themselves. It is and has always been tainted. A couple of sites thought that they could diffuse the situation by clarifying preexisting ethics policies, and it didn't work because that is fundamentally not what Gamergate was ever about.

 

[Dan]

Zoë has given Fuck No Video Games access to her archive of harassment against her, and right now their twitter feed has a full breakdown of how it all started and it's enlightening evidence that it never was about anything BUT ruining a woman's life for daring to have sex. Read it there.

e: Storify version available

It's insane watching people consciously discuss how to disguise their misogyny in order to create a 'palatable' cover story. Jesus.

 

[Lime]

The misinformation and the amount of energy constantly having to debunk it can be so overwhelming.

 

[The Blackrose]

Internet Aristocrat is gloating on Twitter that #GamerGate is beating #StopGamerGate2014 for mentions, saying "ours is bigger".

Not surprised he's gloating. One of the largest boiling points of this entire shitstorm was Leigh's "Gamers don't have to be your audience" article, which originally contained the "we have an army" ending passage*. This is most likely his way to bite his thumb back at it.

*: I actually went back to this article today just to re-validate that the statement was there, and actually found it removed. Given that it was one of the points of the article that made me &#3232;_&#3232; hard, probably going to take some time to reread it.

EDIT:

The misinformation and the amount of energy constantly having to debunk it can be so overwhelming.

 

[shootfast]

He is still talking about her a lot.He even tried to leak more info about her once a couple of weeks ago, but his attempt was shut down once the restraining order started

Link?

 

[Jim Sterling]

I believe that kind of was tried earlier on and Jim Sterling tried to support an alternative but it never took off due to fear of fracturing the movement. A big part of the problem is the lack of any official leadership or goals. It's reminiscent of Occupy Wall Street in that it's a large group who are mad, but it's hard to know how many are mad at the right things or for the right reasons. I really wish there was some kind of way to survey this and ask supporters what their primary concern is.

Yeah, I supported the GameEthics tag because journos were having really good dialog about ethical concerns there. Guess who got called a shill who was trying to run interference on their precious movement? And guess who was instructing others to never support GameEthics to kill it?

Winning is more important than achieving, for GG.

 

[JC Sera]

Because I'm 100% sure in Australia it's based on physical contact(includes emails/phone calls). The problem is the US has 50 states with 50 different restraining laws but in general it would follow the same principal on physical contact for harassment.

My original answer was to why would he fight the restraining order, because his not physically harassing her. On that basis the restraining order would be dismissed as frivolous. Now I'm not sure which state they're in nor do I care really, there could have been small chance that restraining orders in that state went beyond a normal set types of restraining orders. But really I don't really care to argue this point any longer.

Yeah no http://www.aic.gov.au/media_library/conferences/stalking/willmcma.pdf
About being eligible for one in your behaviour

1. Stalking is a serious offence. It is an indictable offence carrying a maximum of 10 years imprisonment.
2. The offence of stalking contains three essential elements:
(i) the conduct of the offender;
(ii) the effect of the offender&#8217;s conduct on the victim; and
(iii) the intention (or imputed intention) of the offender.
(i) the conduct of the offender
The conduct that can constitute stalking is very broadly drawn. The major limitation is the requirement of `a course of conduct&#8217; and this has been interpreted to include a single, prolonged activity (Gunes v Pearson (1996) 89 A Crim R 297).
(ii) the effect on the victim
Apart from causing physical or mental harm, it is sufficient if the course of conduct causes
'apprehension or fear in the victim for his or her safety or that of any other person&#8217;. The word `apprehension&#8217; is not defined, but presumably means a state of mind less serious than that of fear - real anxiety, perhaps.
(iii) the intention (or imputed intention) of the offender The prosecution must prove that the offender intended to cause the victim mental or physical harm or an apprehension or fear for his or her safety or that of any other person. However, this element can be established in two other ways. Firstly, by proving that the offender was `reckless&#8217; in that he or she knew that his or her behaviour was likely to cause such harm or arouse such apprehension or fear. Finally, and most controversially, the element of intention can be established if the prosecution
proves that the offender in all the particular circumstances of the case should have understood (but
did not) that his or her behaviour would be likely to cause such harm or arouse such apprehension or fear. In other words, a person can be guilty of this offence even though he or she did not intend to cause the victim harm or apprehension or fear and did not realise that his or her conduct was likely to have that result. Simple negligence will suffice. For an offence where many of the alleged offenders may be psychiatrically impaired, this is a highly dubious approach.

About what would constitute breaking one

(e) giving offensive material to the victim or any other person or leaving it where it will be foundby, given to or brought to the attention of, the victim or the other person;
(f) keeping the victim or any other person under surveillance;
(g) acting in any other way that could be reasonably be expected to arouse apprehension or fear in the victim for his or her own safety or that of any other person - with the intention of causing physical or mental harm to the victim or of arousing apprehension or fear in the victim for his or her own safety or that of any other person and the course of conduct engaged in actually did have that result.

The guy has done these things and said he would again
Do your research before saying BS like this would fly in australia