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[CassidyIzABeast]

Doesn't seem worth it with all this negative press. If you can't show more than this small demo, just how long will the final product be? Is there seriously nothing else to show that won't spoil the story?

Then again, maybe they just don't have the time or resources to produce a new demo build.

I'd take a Youtube walkthrough of whatever non-spoiler level they have finished at this point.

 

[De_Legend]

You are going on meta critic user scores? Do you know how pointless that is. 90 percent of those killer instinct scores are probably peeps just hating in the one. The ps4 murdered the Xbox One at launch and everyone was hating on the one. It git hopelessly trashed every where. I do get your point and killer instinct is worth a much higher score than both the user and press. Killzone might be great to some. Killer instinct had a legacy and a lot of fans they could have pissed off. Killzone isn't really cared about and even us fans of the series want gorilla to make something else

gorilla.

And they are making something else, you should be happy.

 

[prwxv3]

You are going on meta critic user scores? Do you know how pointless that is. 90 percent of those killer instinct scores are probably peeps just hating in the one. The ps4 murdered the Xbox One at launch and everyone was hating on the one. It git hopelessly trashed every where. I do get your point and killer instinct is worth a much higher score than both the user and press. Killzone might be great to some. Killer instinct had a legacy and a lot of fans they could have pissed off. Killzone isn't really cared about and even us fans of the series want gorilla to make something else

He was going off of the critic reviews not user

 

[NullPointer]

Nothing that has been shown of this game looks fun gameplay wise

Neither fun, nor engaging, nor tactical, nor suspenseful without being forced.

But then again it seems to be the same scenes being written about again and again and again but treated as new.

I'd like to think we haven't seen anything representative of the heart of the thing so far, at least for my own sake.

 

[LightofRohan]

Good lord. Why the hell they can't make another demo for the game. Why is it so hard?

This whole bit about there being no proper playable demo is making me worried now. Why? Just why?

I'm curious what you all think a demo is.

Most games aren't completed in a linear fashion... the entire game is usually being made all together at once. Parts are further ahead ect. sure, but having something that is done/final and playable for hundreds is not easily achievable.

So then you are essentially asking whatever company, to stop trying to get their game to alpha/beta and instead take a tiny section and make it Gold/final. So all resources have to go into making that small chunk playable and not break, which takes a huge sum of time from everyone involved -- which would be better spent trying to get to beta/alpha for the entire game.

 

[Mike Works]

Maybe it didn't help I lacked story context, starting somewhere a few chapters in. There was no emotional manipulation for me to care about our squad making our way to one of our members who had been pinned downed, a feat I only realized we were doing after I did it.

And I felt no tinge of sadness for the other squad member that dies--good ole What'shisname--after a little scene where you drag his bleeding-out-body into cover, firing a pistol at a few swarms of enemies on the roof.

Maybe it didn't help that you lacked fucking cranial context you god damn idiot.

"So I know I started in a random chapter in a demo of a game I'd never played from the start, but for some reason, I experienced no emotional manipulation nor sadness for an NPC I'd never met because I'm playing a fucking demo of the third fucking chapter and oh God help me my fingers are typing this idiot tripe all by themselves I can't stop them this must be revenge for all those times I stick them in my facial orifices whilst I attempt to compose relevant viewpoints and thoughts that just don't come, they never come."

7/10.

 

[matrix-cat]

Avoid spoiling the story. That's why having some type of multi-player or co-op component is so crucial. You can show that instead to avoid spoiling the story and just release a trailer every now and then. Unless you're SP open-world - you can show more and focus on things not too story-centric like fetch quests, environments etc.

Marketing a linear story-based game is not quite as easy.

They need to get over this idea that anyone gives two shits about the epic, cinematic tale of Moustache Guy fighting some werewolves, then, because showing the same demo over and over isn't doing them any favours. From all the interviews I've seen it seems like the devs have bought into their own mythology so completely that they've just assumed that everyone will 'get it' from the trailers, which just isn't going to happen for a new IP.

When you keep showing the same stuff for months and months on end, at some point it switches from "I guess they're keeping stuff under wraps?" to "I don't think they have anything to show".

 

[GribbleGrunger]

This is based on the same demo that everyone else complained about isn't it?

The same demo that we've seen forever no?

Yes and yes. I find it ridiculous that people are calling a WHOLE game boring based on the same short demo. I guess TLOU was just a cover shooter based in a hotel.

 

[LightofRohan]

They need to get over this idea that anyone gives two shits about the epic, cinematic tale of Moustache Guy fighting some werewolves, then, because showing the same demo over and over isn't doing them any favours. From all the interviews I've seen it seems like the devs have bought into their own mythology so completely that they've just assumed that everyone will 'get it' from the trailers, which just isn't going to happen for a new IP.

When you keep showing the same stuff for months and months on end, at some point it switches from "I guess they're keeping stuff under wraps?" to "I don't think they have anything to show".

Or you could realize they showed a trailer not even 2 months ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NedZT-tIBLA

That showed a lot of new footage... and what does that even mean, "Dont have anything to show". Like they are fooling everyone and are going to release a 5 minute game?

 

[DarkLordMalik]

I'm curious what you all think a demo is.

Most games aren't completed in a linear fashion... the entire game is usually being made all together at once. Parts are further ahead ect. sure, but having something that is done/final and playable for hundreds is not easily achievable.

So then you are essentially asking whatever company, to stop trying to get their game to alpha/beta and instead take a tiny section and make it Gold/final. So all resources have to go into making that small chunk playable and not break, which takes a huge sum of time from everyone involved -- which would be better spent trying to get to beta/alpha for the entire game.

I wasn't really pointing towards the semantics of creating a new demo.

The thing is...... this demo has faced plenty of criticism the whole year. It has been bashed to hell and beyond. So why can't RaD focus on creating a better demo which clears the confusion around its gameplay. Unless, of course, the whole game is basically played like what is portrayed in the current demo, in which case, we can only hope that it is not as bad as it seems. Not to mention the game was delayed so they had more time.

I will be sad if all these initial impressions from various websites turn off people away from this game. The Order: 1886 is my most anticipated game on the PS4, and one of the reason I bought a PS4 so early. Sadly it was delayed to next year but still it is a day 1 purchase for me along with Bloodborne. I just want to hear something positive from the press instead of "uh, cinematic".

Or you could realize they showed a trailer not even 2 months ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NedZT-tIBLA

That showed a lot of new footage... and what does that even mean, "Dont have anything to show". Like they are fooling everyone and are going to release a 5 minute game?

The Gamescom trailer is what I would have loved to see the press getting a hands on.

Take a look at Quantum Break and see how the demo sold so many people on the game (me included). It is just weird to see that creating even a new 10-15 minutes demo is hard, because The Order: 1886 is not exactly an open world game either.

 

[LightofRohan]

I wasn't really pointing towards the semantics of creating a new demo.

The thing is...... this demo has faced plenty of criticism the whole year. It has been bashed to hell and beyond. So why can't RaD focus on creating a better demo which clears the confusion around its gameplay. Unless, of course, the whole game is basically played like what is portrayed in the current demo, in which case, we can only hope that it is not as bad as it seems. Not to mention the game was delayed so they had more time.

I will be sad if all these initial impressions from various websites turn off people away from this game. The Order: 1886 is my most anticipated game on the PS4, and one of the reason I bought a PS4 so early. Sadly it was delayed to next year but still it is a day 1 purchase for me along with Bloodborne. I just want to hear something positive from the press instead of "uh, cinematic".

The majority of reactions to the demo were positive, they even won a bunch of awards for it (even Brazil's best Game of the show). The positive opinions are just rarely made threads about, Gaf tends to enjoy the negative angle more than the positive. Don't let a few negative folks taint your whole perception of the game.

I played it at E3 and really enjoyed what I played.

 

[GnawtyDog]

They need to get over this idea that anyone gives two shits about the epic, cinematic tale of Moustache Guy fighting some werewolves, then, because showing the same demo over and over isn't doing them any favours. From all the interviews I've seen it seems like the devs have bought into their own mythology so completely that they've just assumed that everyone will 'get it' from the trailers, which just isn't going to happen for a new IP.

When you keep showing the same stuff for months and months on end, at some point it switches from "I guess they're keeping stuff under wraps?" to "I don't think they have anything to show".

Well obviously on a personal basis that's legitimate. Then again they had that Gamescom trailer and they had that brief Warewolf section at E3. They have more to show - they are just not showing it. Now that is a legitimate complaint across the board. I hope they show something new at the PlayStation Experience Event. I am almost convinced they will - would be extremely stupid AND disappointing not too.

 

[DarkLordMalik]

The majority of reactions to the demo were positive, they even won a bunch of awards for it (even Brazil's best Game of the show). The positive opinions are just rarely made threads about, Gaf tends to enjoy the negative angle more than the positive. Don't let a few negative folks taint your whole perception of the game.

I played it at E3 and really enjoyed what I played.

AFAIK, they have shown two playable demo of the game so far. One is the same old demo back from Feb, that the press is also getting their hands on. The other one is the Werewolf one from E3. Sadly even the Werewolf demo was basically a "cinematic" experience at most.

The Gamescom trailer was loads better though, and it showed a whole lot more of the game that seemed promising. Here's hoping we see something better at PS Experience.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Maybe it didn't help that you lacked fucking cranial context you god damn idiot.

"So I know I started in a random chapter in a demo of a game I'd never played from the start, but for some reason, I experienced no emotional manipulation nor sadness for an NPC I'd never met because I'm playing a fucking demo of the third fucking chapter and oh God help me my fingers are typing this idiot tripe all by themselves I can't stop them this must be revenge for all those times I stick them in my facial orifices whilst I attempt to compose relevant viewpoints and thoughts that just don't come, they never come."

7/10.

That article is awful. Not just ludicrous and incompetent, but irresponsible and unprofessional. Destructoid shouldn't be publishing previews from someone who doesn't understand how demos work. And that's a generous reading. One might believe the author fully understands how demos work and simply went out of his way to make bad faith arguments bashing a game he dislikes for no apparent reason.

 

[Shining Sunshine]

Studios should just not show anything until 1 month until the release.

 

[S.W.]

"Making a new demo" sounds easy. In real world it would shuffle a huge amount of man power to get it done. It's basically asking devs to bypass tones of scheduling and pipeline to push a certain level to demo quality (i.e. finished game). If a bunch of devs work on a demo, then they are not working towards the final game. In a perfect world this would be scheduled in the very beginning of the production, however in real world there are always more complications and shortcomings... making video game is hard

 

[hohoXD123]

Are they seriously going to keep posting articles about the same demo over and over again?

 

[S.W.]

Are they seriously going to keep posting articles about the same demo over and over again?

They generate clicks, apparently that's really important in internet journalism these days. Why do you think IGN need to review the same demo like 4 times?

 

[sinnergy]

"Making a new demo" sounds easy. In real world it would shuffle a huge amount of man power to get it done. It's basically asking devs to bypass tones of scheduling and pipeline to push a certain level to demo quality (i.e. finished game). If a bunch of devs work on a demo, then they are not working towards the final game. In a perfect world this would be scheduled in the very beginning of the production, however in real world there are always more complications and shortcomings... making video game is hard

This man speaks the truth. Everyone on GAF should read this and remember it.

 

[Seanspeed]

Is he really expecting to be emotionally invested in the story and characters with a gameplay demo?

 

[MastaKilla]

Thank God for bloodborne. Don't think there's been anything but negativity surrounding Sony's 1st/2nd party releases since freakin TLOU. So odd to see so many studios yet so much mediocrity. Still hoping for the best with the order tho, won't judge until I can actually play it myself.

 

[Adam M]

So much hate on this game...If there is no gunplay or the character don't run all the time then people call it boring, they want fast paced games but they complaining they want realistic games nowadays. I think I need more realistically paced games, that's what I loved in the last of us.
This game has a potential, even in the story side

 

[NewGame]

Reviewers will give it a glowing 10/10 "so realistic" "innovative" "visceral"

 

[Sweep14]

IIRC they already said that they will not make a new demo. Game is massive and they can't afford to divert resources on another demo.

 

[THRILLH0]

This entire section I don't even know what he is criticizing, sounds good to me.

Walking around in a room until a button prompt starts a cutscene "sounds good" to you? Ok.

 

[GlamFM]

They generate clicks, apparently that's really important in internet journalism these days. Why do you think IGN need to review the same demo like 4 times?

Didn't take too long for that bullshit "clicks" argument.
Journalist reports in demo that was shown to him. Apparently also the first time he played it - what's wrong with that?

 

[teokrazia]

I've tried it at Milan Games Week.
Was an old build with no so much combat situations, but for what I've tried as TPS it sucks. Really bad.

 

[DarkLordMalik]

They generate clicks, apparently that's really important in internet journalism these days. Why do you think IGN need to review the same demo like 4 times?

Imagine telling your friends that you are hyped for The Order, only to see them pointing towards these articles and say that the game will suck. You can't really dismiss such cases since IGN is no small site either

 

[derFeef]

They generate clicks, apparently that's really important in internet journalism these days. Why do you think IGN need to review the same demo like 4 times?

Imagine you work for an outlet that writes opinion pieces about shiny new phone hardware. You get to hold the new superPhone 7 and are allowed to write about it. What will you do?

 

[WordsintheWater]

Fine, complain about the gameplay aspect if you want, but are you really gonna complain about not being invested in characters when this was at most a 10 minute demo, what kind of ridiculous shit is that?

 

[big_z]

Thank God for bloodborne. Don't think there's been anything but negativity surrounding Sony's 1st/2nd party releases since freakin TLOU. So odd to see so many studios yet so much mediocrity. Still hoping for the best with the order tho, won't judge until I can actually play it myself.

I always hope for the best for new ip but it seems like the order is flawed at its core. Not sure if they can turn it around but who knows.

If bloodborne doesn't turn out then sony gaf will be on suicide watch and the smoke from burning ps4s will blot out the sun.

 

[Vroadstar]

If Ready at Dawn has been told that this demo is not fun by multiple people and they continue to use it, then it means two things. It is either indicative of the final product, or they don't give a hoot about getting feedback. Either one is a worrying conclusion.

There's third option why they kept doing the same demo. They are probably finishing the game and in crunch mode and they don't have enough time now to create a new demo.

 

[Jawbreaker]

Studios should just not show anything until 1 month until the release.

So the Rockstar route? I mean, with GTA, it pretty much sells itself based on name alone so they can do that. It's much different when you have a new IP like The Order.

 

[sinnergy]

There's third option why they kept doing the same demo. They are probably finishing the game and in crunch mode and they don't have enough time now to create a new demo.

You are talking to a wall It's not a option that most people want to hear

 

[TGO]

Question is why do they keep showing the same demo when they're getting negative press from it, it's not like they don't read these impressions.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

That doesn't sound too hot, but I'm sure the game will be fine. Sounds like playing an out of context segment of the game, one that's been constantly demoed for months, is going to cause the game to have some negative impressions.

I'd personally move to just showing an interactive demo of new sections from the game rather than allow a poor demo to feed into a growing sea of negative feedback/impressions, but Sony/RAD will do what they feel is best for the game...

 

[GrizzleBoy]

Lowered expectation is the best thing for a gaming product.

Especially one that has limited coverage in terms of unique released media and plot coverage.

It gives the GAME a chance to actually impress you, instead of you being told you should be impressed by gaming show awards, marketing and fanboys.

SCREW HYPE.

If the game releases and its amazing, there will be no denying it. Crow will simply have to be eaten.

Until then, ENJOY the fact that The game hasn't already been busted open content wise.


I think Forza Horizon 2s launch was a great way to do things. It was announced in June, a demo came out and it was released a mere four months after in October.

There was only limited time for media to say stuff before players got their hands on a demo to judge for themselves, which was then closely followed by a release. The game had so much good word of mouth from players well before reviews and release. Not from previewers. Players.

The order obviously suffers from being a title announced at the ps4 reveal time, but announcement to release periods of two years leaves too much room for BS to happen. Especially if the limited content you release doesn't set the world on fire.

 

[Daviii]

Thank God for bloodborne. Don't think there's been anything but negativity surrounding Sony's 1st/2nd party releases since freakin TLOU. So odd to see so many studios yet so much mediocrity. Still hoping for the best with the order tho, won't judge until I can actually play it myself.

It is unbelievable how people opinions can be molded in such an easy way.
So far we've seen little gameplay from a game which looks absolutely amazing.
And yet we're qualified enough to sentence it as "mediocre" already?

I wonder what would have happened if those devs wouldn't have said they were for a filmic look.

 

[GrizzleBoy]

It is unbelievable how people opinions can be molded in such an easy way.
So far we've seen little gameplay from a game which looks absolutely amazing.
And yet we're qualified enough to sentence it as "mediocre" already?

I wonder what would have happened if those devs wouldn't have said they were for a filmic look.

Is it as bad as you already deeming It to be absolutely amazing, based on that lack of gameplay footage?

 

[GnawtyDog]

Is it as bad as you already deeming It to be absolutely amazing, based on that lack of gameplay footage?

I think he's trying to be level headed. Some find it hard to be possible.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Is it as bad as you already deeming It to be absolutely amazing, based on that lack of gameplay footage?

Does look pretty amazing visually. Maybe that's what was meant?

 

[cornerman]

This man speaks the truth. Everyone on GAF should read this and remember it.

With as many dev diary's and behind the scenes videos of various games...with as many interviews with developers and industry insiders...with as passionate as people are about this medium to visit websites, post on forums, download podcasts, you'd think that they'd show a modicum of effort to understand how games are made. I'm not talking about learning to code or taking a course; just pay enough attention to the process before you make demands or wild accusations. If only it was as easy as just saying "make a demo" or "add coop" or "make it open world" or "1080/60 please". If only it took the time to do those things, as it took to utter the sentence.

People jump to conclusions because they don't understand how it works. People don't understand how it works, cause they can't be bothered to. What continues to baffle me is why certain people dedicate their lives to games professionally, have access to developers and publishers, and are just as clueless to the process as their viewership.

People have the right to feel how they want about what's been shown. If it doesn't excite you, that's fine. But its kind of a shame how a 6+ month old demo has been previewed and re-previewed and trotted out as if we're given new information.

 

[Dr. Buni]

No it isn't, it's filmic. The dev said so.

Same shit.

 

[Spineker]

This game has "so much failed potential" written all over it. It's going to be another Destiny tragedy but without the sales.

 

[Arondight]

Didn't take too long for that bullshit "clicks" argument.
Journalist reports in demo that was shown to him. Apparently also the first time he played it - what's wrong with that?

If this was a few previews done within a span of a few days, would seem logical to get different opinions but this demo(not even the full game) is a few months old sharing no new footage. Each article regardless of the writer is representative of the site whether it's investigation, reviews, previews etc. This already has been previewed before and the article addresses no new information, footage, criticisms that haven't already been discussed for a few months now. Basically, pointless.It doesn't even mention in the article how this is the same demo either.

I'm disappointed with what I've seen for The Order but find it dumb they'd preview the same demo as if the first preview isn't enough to gauge the type of game it is and it's weaknesses. I mean, if it was the full game or new demo, at least there's enough content to justify a new set of opinions.

 

[Guerrilla]

Imagine you work for an outlet that writes opinion pieces about shiny new phone hardware. You get to hold the new superPhone 7 and are allowed to write about it. What will you do?

You keep it to yourself because you are not a fucking clickwhore

Anyways, has there ever been a AAA game with such a negative buzz beforehand? They should go all out with a "gameplay first" message to counter this..

I will still probably buy this and I'm sure I'll have fun with it, however they need to get some positivity going...

 

[J 0 E]

Same demo, same impressions

 

[AmethystEnd]

I can't remember the last time I saw a triple-A game get trashed so hard in the media prior to launch.

 

[klee123]

It is unbelievable how people opinions can be molded in such an easy way.
So far we've seen little gameplay from a game which looks absolutely amazing.
And yet we're qualified enough to sentence it as "mediocre" already?

I wonder what would have happened if those devs wouldn't have said they were for a filmic look.

It's not just the preview videos.

Heck, the director at E3 even said when it comes to their priories when developing the game :

Gameplay is something that... it's a game, we make games, we can't get around it.

source: http://www.computerandvideogames.co...1886s-e3-demo-showcases-style-over-substance/

That above does not instill me much confidence in the overall game. The video previews which show the obscene amount of QTEs going on basically confirmed my fears.

Don't get me wrong, a cinematic presentation can lead to a wonderful experience, but NOT at the cost of gameplay.

To think that the original reveal showed so much promise.

 

[msdstc]

For now my expectations are in the gutter for this game. The impressions and showings have been overwhelmingly nrgative. I thought what I played was fine, but definite highlighted everything people have been concerned about.