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[Chariot]

I am not sure what you are arguing right now, Azula.
I mean, there is always someone who has a different view. And there are lots and lots of people who don't like homosexuality at all and would feel it forced and you can always argue that the majority of americans are straight whites and thus everything else would be deviant. And the young girl and you (and for that matter all the americans who have a problem with homosexuality) are definitely entitled to her opinion.

But the point is, that I don't think that anything is forced, just because it's not the norm. With this argumentation you could also say that Korra's skin color is forced. There are also light skinned waterbenders and most of america is light skins.

--

hmmmm not bad. I'll watch it after I'm done JLU.

Yay! I liked JLU very much, especially as it actually got story arcs. If you liked KLU you will love Young Justice, since it's way more focused and has a smaller cast of heroes, making it less confusing who the hell just jumped into the screen.

 

[BKatastrophe]

Was it ever specifically established, like via dialogue, that Asami and Korra were into guys. Like was it ever stated "I'm totally into boys," or something similar?

I don't recall

 

[Mononoke]

I am not sure what you are arguing right now, Azula.
I mean, there is always someone who has a different view. And there are lots and lots of people who don't like homosexuality at all and would feel it forced and you can always argue that the majority of americans are straight whites and thus everything else would be deviant. And the young girl and you (and for that matter all the americans who have a problem with homosexuality) are definitely entitled to her opinion.

But the point is, that I don't think that anything is forced, just because it's not the norm. With this argumentation you could also say that Korra's skin color is forced. There are also light skinned waterbenders and most of america is light skins.

Lol

I give up.

 

[Mononoke]

Was it ever specifically established, like via dialogue, that Asami and Korra were into guys. Like was it ever stated "I'm totally into boys," or something similar?

I don't recall

No it wasn't. But they had full on romance with someone of that gender. Kissing, hugging. Intimate relationships.

But I'm done arguing. The funny thing is, i actually agree with you guys. You just don't seem to agree or understand my point about how plot presents something. How people perceive characters based on plot. I agree people are fluid. That sexuality is fluid. But since storytelling and characters are to some degree static (how they are, is informed by the plot we are given)....I think I totally get why some find it jarring.

*shrugs*

 

[Toa TAK]

No it wasn't. But they had full on romance with someone of that gender. Kissing, hugging. Intimate relationships.

But I'm done arguing. The funny thing is, i actually agree with you guys. You just don't seem to agree or understand my point about how plot presents something.

Just play halo

 

[Mononoke]

Just play halo

lol

Just never post in here again.

Dat GAF meltdown.

EDIT: But I am kind of frustrated over this convo. Maybe I'm wrong. But I the way I see this purely from how story is told, I can just see it. Butt you guys can't. And since this is a very serious issue, I don't want to be on the wrong side of it. Personally, I support everything you guys are saying. But at the same time, I am able to see why others don't see it. Gah.

 

[Toa TAK]

lol

Just never post in here again.

Dat GAF meltdown.

Have faith.

 

[CreeperBlocks]

are we going to make a Avatar Community Thread?

 

[aly]

I am not sure what you are arguing right now, Azula.
I mean, there is always someone who has a different view. And there are lots and lots of people who don't like homosexuality at all and would feel it forced and you can always argue that the majority of americans are straight whites and thus everything else would be deviant. And the young girl and you (and for that matter all the americans who have a problem with homosexuality) are definitely entitled to her opinion.

But the point is, that I don't think that anything is forced, just because it's not the norm. With this argumentation you could also say that Korra's skin color is forced. There are also light skinned waterbenders and most of america is light skins.

--Yay! I liked JLU very much, especially as it actually got story arcs. If you liked KLU you will love Young Justice, since it's way more focused and has a smaller cast of heroes, making it less confusing who the hell just jumped into the screen.

Someone doesn't have to have a problem with homosexuality to think this relationship is forced. The girls were established as one way in the beginning and to many viewers the ending contradicts what we knew about their preferences. You could excuse that with saying sexuality is fluid or a number of other things, but it is an equal view to see it as forced or pandering or whatever due to the writing of bad romances in the show and how storytelling should work.

 

[BKatastrophe]

I equate Korrasami to Willow from Buffy. Granted, I think Willow and Oz will be forever, but that's because I like Oz more than Tara and Kennedy.

Either way, I didn't think it was forced at all. Just kind of eh. Like "oh it's a thing now."

 

[Mononoke]

Someone doesn't have to have a problem with homosexuality to think this relationship is forced. The girls were established as one way in the beginning and to many viewers the ending contradicts what we knew about their preferences. You could excuse that with saying sexuality is fluid or a number of other things, but it is an equal view to see it as forced or pandering or whatever due to the writing of bad romances in the show.

I don't know about the pandering.

But I think, while it's true that sexuality is fluid, and you really can't assume someone's preference is ONE WAY....

When you have a plot that is up and front, and shows them dating one gender. And then when you have a NON-PLOT (that was pushed to the back, because I assume they got pushback from the networks so they had to be careful)...that then shows them dating another gender.

I think the plot missing from the second relationship, is why some would think it's forced. I don't agree. Because I do think that sexuality is fluid. I do think you can't make assumptions. But I can see why audiences are informed purely on the plot they are given. And in that sense, I could get people thinking it felt out of no where and forced.

EDIT: But I can see I'm probably offending people. So I'm just going to stop. That was not my intention. And the fact is, I actually side with those that think Korrasami is not forced. I just was looking at this from a story perspective, and I can see why it felt jarring. But whatever.

 

[Pappasman]

I think its a bit forced just because there was no build up to it. The only things we had were the scraps of information of their friendship. In fact, that's probably one of my larger problems with LoK as a whole. The main 4 never truly felt like friends that hung out together. We were told they were friends and were expected to believe that.

I really don't like playing the "what if" game but I have to wonder what this show would have been like if it focused on the core 4 as a group like ATLA did.

 

[nictron]

Is it wrong that I just interpreted the ending as two very close friends going on a vacation/adventure together? I didn't see anything about sexuality until I went online and apparently Korra and Asami are together. I'm not against it, I just didn't see it.

Spoiler

I don't see sexual intent in human expression on a day to day basis anyway.

 

[Chariot]

Someone doesn't have to have a problem with homosexuality to think this relationship is forced. The girls were established as one way in the beginning and to many viewers the ending contradicts what we knew about their preferences. You could excuse that with saying sexuality is fluid or a number of other things, but it is an equal view to see it as forced or pandering or whatever due to the writing of bad romances in the show.

But we saw hints before the last episode, it was pretty difficult to miss it, since the Korrasami fans jumped at every single one of them. It was made for me, when Korra informed us that she only could really talk with Asami over the course of her healing days, combined with the other hints we had about the two of them. And the blush killed if of course.

Is it wrong that I just interpreted the ending as two very close friends going on a vacation/adventure together? I didn't see anything about sexuality until I went online and apparently Korra and Asami are together. I'm not against it, I just didn't see it.

Spoiler

I don't see sexual intent in human expression on a day to day basis anyway.

It's not wrong. I think it made on purpose that way, that both explanations are valid. Like the spinning top in Inception.

 

[Mononoke]

But we saw hints before the last episode, it was pretty difficult to miss it, since the Korrasami fans jumped at every single one of them. It was made for me, when Korra informed us that she only could really talk with Asami over the course of her healing days, combined with the other hints we had about the two of them. And the blush killed if of course.

We saw two friends very close. There was nothing to indicate romantic intentions. Fact is, shippers and fans jump over anything because they want their ship to happen. Even in Book 1 they were doing this.

To say that was actual plot, is kind of BS. It's not an up and front plot like them dating Mako was. If you really think the two are the same, don't know what to say. But they weren't. I theorize that because the network probably gave them pushback (which is pathetic), they had to use the close friendship plot as the actual romance plot itself. They had to dance around it and be careful. But because of that, there was no up and front romance plot like them dating Mako.

EDIT: Well, if we are going with the idea that emotions and relationships are fluid, then I suppose you can't even make assumptions one way or another, whether certain behaviors were romantic or not. Romantic tone, can be flexible. You don't need kissing, or dialogue to establish that. SO. I can admit that my above post is flawed.

Although I still don't see the two as 1:1. I think the Mako plots were obviously more up and front.

 

[Sheroking]

The assertion that they couldn't develop the relationship in the open is fair. Networks in the past have been very resistant to rocking the boat with LGBT relationships, and I can't imagine it's any better with animation geared at kids.

At the same time, that finale had to clear the same people and they let it fly. Maybe the ambiguity of it was enough, maybe they could have gotten away with it full stop. We don't know.

That'd be a fair excuse for the lack of development leading to that moment, but yeah, from a pure storytelling position, they did not earn it.

 

[Chariot]

We saw two friends very close. There was nothing to indicate romantic intentions. Fact is, shippers and fans jump over anything because they want their ship to happen. Even in Book 1 they were doing this.

To say that was actual plot, is kind of BS. It's not an up and front plot like them dating Mako was. If you really think the two are the same, don't know what to say. But they weren't.

That was the genius of it, the thing that makes it so much better than the other romances in the show. Subtlety. I think they had to do it that way, because everyone knows how sensitive the american public is to homosexuality, but it worked out pretty well. The progress felt very natural. Lovers are also friends, you know (usually). American media are just terrible at this with these love on first sight and focus on sexual attraction thing.

 

[JadedWriter]

I equate Korrasami to Willow from Buffy. Granted, I think Willow and Oz will be forever, but that's because I like Oz more than Tara and Kennedy.

Either way, I didn't think it was forced at all. Just kind of eh. Like "oh it's a thing now."

Willow skinned some dude for Tara and even flirted with Fred a bit on Angel. Her being gay is quite canon.

 

[Kinvara]

Personally, I don't mind if people find it jarring. If it challenges the audience to rethink their assumptions, then I think that's a good thing.

I've only ever been in romantic relationships with men. But if you were to assume that I was heterosexual, you would be dead wrong.

 

[Mononoke]

That was the genius of it, the thing that makes it so much better than the other romances in the show. Subtlety. I think they had to do it that way, because everyone knows how sensitive the american public is to homosexuality, but it worked out pretty well. The progress felt very natural. Lovers are also friends, you know. American media are just terrible at this with these love on first sight and focus on sexual attraction thing.

Sure. But you really can't understand why some people would find this jarring?

Personally, I don't mind if people find it jarring. If it challenges the audience to rethink their assumptions, then I think that's a good thing.

I've only ever been in romantic relationships with men. But if you were to assume that I was heterosexual, you would be dead wrong.

Lol I guess this whole discussion is stupid. Because I don't care either. Let people think it's forced. The romance itself actually had more depth then anything else. Actually felt organic and more real then most romance in shows.

 

[Chariot]

Sure. But you really can't understand why some people would find this jarring?

I told you above. Yes, I can, because there are people for everything to find jarring. But what is your point then? How is that especially more jarring than anything else?

 

[Mononoke]

I told you above. Yes, I can, because there are people for everything to find jarring. But what is your point then? How is that especially more jarring than anything else?

No. You are excusing this as some people always finding something jarring.

SMH

 

[Kangi]

Aang: straight
Korra: bisexual

Should there be another Avatar series featuring the next earthbending avatar, he/she should be gay. Cover the whole Kinsey Scale.

 

[Chariot]

No. You are excusing this as some people always finding something jarring.

SMH

Now you lost me.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Is it wrong that I just interpreted the ending as two very close friends going on a vacation/adventure together? I didn't see anything about sexuality until I went online and apparently Korra and Asami are together. I'm not against it, I just didn't see it.

Spoiler

I don't see sexual intent in human expression on a day to day basis anyway.

lol I think the interpretation that they're just friends is even worse. Then it's just Korra and Asami being like "Eh, fuck all our other friends and Team Avatar, lets get out of here"

It also makes Korra look like a turbo bitch since Mako pretty much pledges his loyalty to her like "I'll follow you into battle no matter what and always have your back," and Korra's just like "lel okie, imma go hang out with my bff who didn't just get mutilated helping me, loser. CYA"

 

[JadedWriter]

lol I think the interpretation that they're just friends is even worse. Then it's just Korra and Asami being like "Eh, fuck all our other friends and Team Avatar, lets get out of here"

It also makes Korra look like a turbo bitch since Mako pretty much pledges his loyalty to her like "I'll follow you into battle no matter what and always have your back," and Korra's just like "lel okie, imma go hang out with my bff who didn't just get mutilated helping me, loser. CYA"

Lol sounds like my last love interest.

 

[Gravidee]

Aang: straight
Korra: bisexual

Should there be another Avatar series featuring the next earthbending avatar, he/she should be gay. Cover the whole Kinsey Scale.

And the firebending Avatar after that would be trans. Now that's balance!

 

[Kinvara]

Aang: straight
Korra: bisexual

Should there be another Avatar series featuring the next earthbending avatar, he/she should be gay. Cover the whole Kinsey Scale.

Make them transgender too.

 

[CreeperBlocks]

lol I think the interpretation that they're just friends is even worse. Then it's just Korra and Asami being like "Eh, fuck all our other friends and Team Avatar, lets get out of here"

It also makes Korra look like a turbo bitch since Mako pretty much pledges his loyalty to her like "I'll follow you into battle no matter what and always have your back," and Korra's just like "lel okie, imma go hang out with my bff who didn't just get mutilated helping me, loser. CYA"

Mako really is George Constanza of the avatar world

 

[Chariot]

Make them transgender too.

Make it transbender.
"I am a airbender, born into a firebenders body."

 

[Mononoke]

Now you lost me.

Just nvm. lol honestly.

Fact is: Korra + Asami was the second best relationship on the show. It had the more depth and felt more natural than most romances. I think because Bryke prob had to tip toe around it, they did the best they could. But a result of them tip toeing around, actually made the romance more realistic and organic.

If you as a viewer, aren't accepting of people being fluid, and are only informed by the plot we are shown, then maybe you found it jarring. But if you step back and look at the bigger picture, and are accepting of the fact that I. people can be Bi. II. People can discover their preference later. III. All along both characters knew they were bi.

Then it does make sense. No question.

 

[-Deimos]

Are you guys still arguing about Korrasami? The entire overall plot of this show is nonsense. You guys are arguing about nonsense.

 

[BKatastrophe]

Willow skinned some dude for Tara and even flirted with Fred a bit on Angel. Her being gay is quite canon.

Oh I'm not arguing that it was done waaaaaay fucking better. Because it totally was. I'm just saying, they also put a lot of emphasis on her feelings for Xander and Oz beforehand. I mean, Seasons 1&2 had a huge focus on her being attracted to Xander, and then dealing with the rejection. Seasons 2&3 were solely about her getting with Oz and over Xander. Even going so far as to have her and Xander have a short fling together. Season 4 finally focused just on her and Oz, and then getting with Tara.

It was done shitloads better, but very similar to the MaKorrAsami love triangle, her sexuality towards males was very front and center. Done significantly better, but still central.

 

[Toa TAK]

Are you guys still arguing about Korrasami? The entire overall plot of this show is nonsense. You guys are arguing about nonsense.

Kuvira wasn't nonsense.

 

[Sheroking]

I just want them to make a show where the Avatar is the villain. Do it.

 

[Kinvara]

Are you guys still arguing about Korrasami? The entire overall plot of this show is nonsense. You guys are arguing about nonsense.

The A:TLA/TLOK universe and all the people in it don't even exist.

What are we doing?

 

[Mononoke]

Are you guys still arguing about Korrasami? The entire overall plot of this show is nonsense. You guys are arguing about nonsense.

You know, sometimes you get into random arguments over technical bullshit. At least this ended in a page and a half, as opposed to 4 pages with massive essays written on it.

The A:TLA/TLOK universe and all the people in it don't even exist.

What are we doing?

Lol

But thing is, I think people can really connect to these characters. They can really matter. I imagine, there are a lot of people that really cared about Korra. Who related to Korra. Who looked up to Korra. Conversely, so many gay people have to deal with shaming and no representation in media. I imagine that ending meant a lot to them.

So I mean, while they aren't real people, it can have a big impact (not that you weren't saying that). I'm just kind of talking out loud.

 

[aly]

But we saw hints before the last episode, it was pretty difficult to miss it, since the Korrasami fans jumped at every single one of them. It was made for me, when Korra informed us that she only could really talk with Asami over the course of her healing days, combined with the other hints we had about the two of them. And the blush killed if of course.It's not wrong. I think it made on purpose that way, that both explanations are valid. Like the spinning top in Inception.

Yeah, no I think its pretty easy to miss those hints.They weren't a big part of the plot like Mako's relationship was. The fun thing imo about shipping is looking for little hints and dragging them out into bigger things. The relationship could've also been looked at as Korra finding a girl friend which she never had before. Which makes the more romance like ending seem much more jarring since what you consider hints are so easily missed.

Also to this day that spinning top drives me bonkers.

Personally, I don't mind if people find it jarring. If it challenges the audience to rethink their assumptions, then I think that's a good thing.

I've only ever been in romantic relationships with men. But if you were to assume that I was heterosexual, you would be dead wrong.

But your a person and its often bad to make assumptions about people. Not so much about fictional characters where the creators should be consistent or have plot to establish things etc.

 

[JadedWriter]

Oh I'm not arguing that it was done waaaaaay fucking better. Because it totally was. I'm just saying, they also put a lot of emphasis on her feelings for Xander and Oz beforehand. I mean, Seasons 1&2 had a huge focus on her being attracted to Xander, and then dealing with the rejection. Seasons 2&3 were solely about her getting with Oz and over Xander. Even going so far as to have her and Xander have a short fling together. Season 4 finally focused just on her and Oz, and then getting with Tara.

It was done shitloads better, but very similar to the MaKorrAsami love triangle, her sexuality towards males was very front and center. Done significantly better, but still central.

Yeah true it transitioned way better and felt less jarring on Buffy. Several episodes were dedicated to Willow and her evevolving sexuality. Korra just seemed like wham now I'm bi.

 

[Chariot]

Are you guys still arguing about Korrasami? The entire overall plot of this show is nonsense. You guys are arguing about nonsense.

If people were not discussion about nonsense and fictional things, the world would be very silent.

Yeah, no I think its pretty easy to miss those hints.They weren't a big part of the plot like Mako's relationship was. The fun thing imo about shipping is looking for little hints and dragging them out into bigger things. The relationship could've also been looked at as Korra finding a girl friend which she never had before. Which makes the more romance like ending seem much more jarring since what you consider hints are so easily missed.

Also to this day that spinning top drives me bonkers.

Yeah, as I said, I think it was supposed be relatively easy be missed and be able to be interpreted two ways. They still have a scared network to please. So it could be easily be both ways, just friends or lovers. And that works pretty well. It's something for everyone and it works well both ways.

 

[nictron]

lol I think the interpretation that they're just friends is even worse. Then it's just Korra and Asami being like "Eh, fuck all our other friends and Team Avatar, lets get out of here"

It also makes Korra look like a turbo bitch since Mako pretty much pledges his loyalty to her like "I'll follow you into battle no matter what and always have your back," and Korra's just like "lel okie, imma go hang out with my bff who didn't just get mutilated helping me, loser. CYA"

Have you never felt the need to just get the hell out of wherever you are? That's what I related to, the desperate necessity of getting away. Maybe Mako wouldn't have gone? Maybe he would have asked for a couple of days to get ready? Korra saw an opportunity to go on a random road trip with someone very dear to her and took it. To me that isn't weird at all.

 

[-Deimos]

Kuvira wasn't nonsense.

Kuvira lost. Time to move on.

If people were not discussion about nonsense and fictional things, the world would be very silent.

Korra is in its own category of "fiction". The one where you ignore anything resembling a plot and enjoy people throwing rocks at each other.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

You know, sometimes you get into random arguments over technical bullshit. At least this ended in a page and a half, as opposed to 4 pages with massive essays written on it.

I could write an essay if you'd like.

 

[Mononoke]

I could write an essay if you'd like.

Nooooo.

Honestly, it wasn't even worth arguing over. Like legit, I agree with people. I was just trying to say I understand where some were coming from. But it just turned into a bunch of BS. Never again.

 

[hohoXD123]

I just want them to make a show where the Avatar is the villain. Do it.

That would be good. Much more believable for there to have been at least one bad apple out of the many avatar incarnations.

 

[Toa TAK]

Nooooo.

Honestly, it wasn't even worth arguing over. Like legit, I agree with people. I was just trying to say I understand where some were coming from. But it just turned into a bunch of BS. Never again.

Everyone is just super hot right now. The finale did just come put awhile ago.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Nooooo.

Honestly, it wasn't even worth arguing over. Like legit, I agree with people. I was just trying to say I understand where some were coming from. But it just turned into a bunch of BS. Never again.

Sounds like my kind of argument.

Spoiler

I agree with where you were coming from and what you were trying to say

 

[Gravidee]

I just want them to make a show where the Avatar is the villain. Do it.

I wouldn't mind there being one where the Avatar has essentially been used for villainous purposes for years. I guess similar to what the Red Lotus tried to achieve with kidnapping Korra when she was young.

 

[aly]

Kuvira wasn't nonsense.

lolololol @ Kuvira. She truly lost. I want someone to ask what the team was thinking with her character.

 

[Mononoke]

Sounds like my kind of argument.

Spoiler

I agree with where you were coming from and what you were trying to say

Well thank you. I didn't mean any offense by it. I was just trying to present a perspective. But blah. Sometimes its pointless to try to argue something like that.