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[Mr. Poolman]

I've said it before, but gamers are easily distracted with realism.

Art style weights a lot more, and Nintendo is really tight on this area.

 

[wildfire]

We have about one of these threads a month. Yes, art style is more important to creating timeless looks than things like polycount.

Reread the OP. He is specifically calling to attention that the Wii U unexpectedly has better textures and lighting than other games on better machines.

 

[Roo]

The IQ could stand to be a bit better as the jaggies are a little distracting given the sort of CG cartoon style of their visuals, but I've been enjoying mine over the last week.

This is (in my opinion) the next issue they need to adress in their next console.
Their games look beautiful and play amazingly well but I feel like the IQ holds everything back.
All that hard work on art style and such can't truly shine as it should due to crappy IQ.
I want to think a PS4 machine from Nintendo whenever they decide to release a new console is not that far fetched to handle their games with some AA on top.

 

[papercan55]

I think the HD Era is doing Nintendos art justice for the first time on a console of theirs.

Bingo.
Although i would say the first time since the snes.
Can you imagine how pissed you would be as an artist working on the galaxy games,skyward sword or donkey kong returns and knowing that most of your audience will be looking at your beautiful art and seeing blocky pixelated crap via a hdtv.

 

[Amentallica]

So crappy cross-gen downports like Mordor or Advanced Warfare are representative of how PS360 games look..lol

Future titles can, and will, in retrospect, make older games seem less impressive. It's happening now. That is not to say that in their own right, given their hardware, that PS3 and 360 games aren't pretty, but as you move forward, you will look back and see that they could have looked a lot better. This will always happen. When you're in the moment, you can predict that games will look better years from now, but you won't know exactly how until that future becomes the present, and when that happens, games retroactively lose their 'wow' factor.

 

[majik13]

A thread like this and no mention of MK8 in the OP?! Or does it just go without saying?

 

[Glass Joe]

Point being...? Does the Wii U hardware now have the magical property of greater understanding? Is there some special chip for that?

I'm pretty sure his point is the Wii U is made by Nintendo, so Nintendo's designers have a firm understanding of its capabilities and the console was even designed with them in mind. If Nintendo's teams were suddenly asked to create a PC game, the results may not be as impressive in terms of output vs limitations.

 

[Windom Earle]

It really has everything to do with Nintendo and nothing with the Wii U hardware (Despite providing the bare minimum of "hd muscle").

 

[Neoxon]

Nintendo has amazing artists

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

Mario Kart 8 is stunning and ZombiU is underrated in my opinion. I LOVE how that game looks.

 

[Davey Cakes]

You mean prioritized game design. As for open world, the new Zelda looks pretty impressive at this point already.

"Prioritized game design" is a great way to put it.

Nintendo are masters of resource management.

I don't give a shit if their game designs are "tempered." If the games are fun, look great, and play like a dream, that's what matters most. Nintendo are perfectly ambitious. They won't try to go beyond the call and end up delivering an unpolished mess because of it.

 

[IAmRandom31]

The Nintendo engines are not technically impressive but thanks to good color and cell shading and various other techniques it looks pleasing overall.

Seems Nintendo is working hard to take the style of its 2D titles and move it properly into the 3D realm without losing the visual appeal.

Looks good overall, but not technically impressive in any way. Low poly counts usually, simple shading, simple texturing. Keeping it clean and simple and colorful.

 

[delta25]

A thread like this and no mention of MK8 in the OP?! Or does it just go without saying?

That's next on the list.

 

[Inuhanyou]

The Wii U has nothing to do with it. Nintendo Japan has the ability to make any game look great. That's the power of discipline to ship a complete product, and also have a great artstyle to make up for technical shortcomings.

Put Wii or Gamecube games in HD and i'd say the exact same.

 

[Herb Alpert]

Point being...? Does the Wii U hardware now have the magical property of greater understanding? Is there some special chip for that?

It has been said that Nintendo didn't even provide proper technical documentation about WiiU to third parties.
You bet they understand better their hardware.

Now if they can figure how to use the gamepad...

 

[zoukka]

The credit goes to the amazing developers at nintendo, not the console itself.

 

[delta25]

Reread the OP. He is specifically calling to attention that the Wii U unexpectedly has better textures and lighting than other games on better machines.

I wouldn't say better but defiantly equally as impressive as what some of the other platforms ate doing.

 

[JoduanER2]

I currently have a PS4 but sometimes I wish I had a Wii U, that artistic direction is unmatched and those colors! Sooo beautiful and pleasing, I just dont want to miss the amazing games the playstation's first party studios will release in the future.

 

[Astral Dog]

I think it depends on the epectations of people, having a good, clean, colorful artstyle helps a lot to hide the flaws, compared to much more powerful hardware, and, the Wii U is an example that you dont need a powerful system to make pretty, (and costly!) games.

But, one important thing that is not mentioned enough, people need to keep their expectations in check, there is NO way a Wii U game will ever compare to an XBONE, PS 4, or PC game technically, just no way, we know whats on the system, so sometimes i wish people stopped comparing them that much, both favorably and negatively,

 

[Feindflug]

Future titles can, and will, in retrospect, make older games seem less impressive. It's happening now. That is not to say that in their own right, given their hardware, that PS3 and 360 games aren't pretty, but as you move forward, you will look back and see that they could have looked a lot better. This will always happen. When you're in the moment, you can predict that games will look better years from now, but you won't know exactly how until that future becomes the present, and when that happens, games retroactively lose their 'wow' factor.

So PS360 games are ugly shit because we've seen PS4 and Xbone games now. wtf am i reading?

 

[Haluko]

Superior art direction.

 

[Windforce]

It's all about the art style, and not the console, as I can bet the Xbox 360 could make similar looking games if they tried them on it.

The visuals are amazing, yes, but we shall not praise Nintendo hardware at all - we should have this good looking games in 2006-2007 already.

 

[DragonSworne]

Credit goes to the years of software drought. I don't like the fact we had to endure a lack of gaming from Nintendo for 3 years waiting for them to catch up with HD development. I don't think the visuals make up for the long wait. Hopefully the learning curve for next generation won't be as tough.

 

[The perfect Dark]

I own all next gen consoles and nintendo games on wii u are the best looking current gen games imo.

 

[Amentallica]

So PS360 games are ugly shit because we've seen PS4 and Xbone games now. wtf am i reading?

The 'ugly shit' comment was an exaggerated response on my part, but my point still stands. How about you try to actually understand what I'm saying rather than dismiss it entirely.

 

[Nightbird]

It's not about Hardware, but more about Artstyle. If we had more big-budget Games going for big colourful Artstyle on the Last Gen, Nintendos Output wouldn't even be this impressive as it is right now. And it's also the reason why it will continue to impress. Because there is basically no competition in terms of colourful Games with special Artstyles

 

[bobbychalkers]

Nintendo knows how to leverage the most out of their system with games that look nice and run great, their only issue now is IQ.

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

I own a PS4, and my Wii U wows me more regularly. Mario Kart 8 is the best art ever. That F-Zero Mute City stage is like, holy fuck. Wind Waker was like watching a Ghibli movie in some scenes. Mario 3D World has some amazing objects. I still haven't given Pikmin a spin yet.

It's a shame it wasn't worth 3rd parties' time to put resources into their ports, the hardware is clearly capable of some great stuff.

 

[Aaron D.]

Nice shots, OP. Thanks for putting them together.

 

[omonimo]

Seems like they had a very specific thermal envelope in mind. They didn't want a huge box that ran hot, which would be required for a more powerful CPU&GPU. They made a good choice with the GPU and kinda skimped on the CPU, but considering how hot even the latest PS3 and 360 revisions run I don't know that it's the worst decision. Then they took that and gave developers twice as much RAM as PS3 and 360, the biggest complaint about those systems specs.

What they came up with is good enough for some really great looking games, without getting super hot, and without requiring devs to spend oodles on "more graphics" like the other newgen systems. It's a good mix.

It was the worst, unfortunately. That's not normal an hardware with the double of the RAM can't handle the same fps of the ps360 multiplat. The merit of nintendo it's to reach their graphic target although the hardware handicap.

It's a shame it wasn't worth 3rd parties' time to put resources into their ports, the hardware is clearly capable of some great stuff.

They put the same time of the ps360 version, it seems the problem it's more the hardware bottlenecks.

 

[Inuhanyou]

It's not about Hardware, but more about Artstyle. If we had more big-budget Games going for big colourful Artstyle on the Last Gen, Nintendos Output wouldn't even be this impressive as it is right now. And it's also the reason why it will continue to impress. Because there is basically no competition in terms of colourful Games with special Artstyles

Until RIME, or a game like El Shaddai comes or Okami comes along again, your right. The industry needs more of those kinds of games

 

[The Main Event]

Wii U's excellent digital output helps too, produces great IQ.

 

[SmokedMeat]

I've said it before, but gamers are easily distracted with realism.

Art style weights a lot more, and Nintendo is really tight on this area.

Realism can be beautiful as well. A great looking game is a great looking game regardless of whether the artists are going for realism, or a whimsical cartoony world.

The Wii U's games look great. While it may not be on the cutting edge of technology we've reached the point in gaming where that's no longer needed to produce outstanding visuals.

 

[Fularu]

It was the worst, unfortunately. That's not normal an hardware with the double of the RAM can't handle the same fps of the ps360 multiplat. The merit of nintendo it's to reach their graphic target although the hardware handicap.

Nothing to do with the hardware and everything to do with the third party developpers toolchains.

 

[Hiko]

I'm pretty sure his point is the Wii U is made by Nintendo, so Nintendo's designers have a firm understanding of its capabilities and the console was even designed with them in mind. If Nintendo's teams were suddenly asked to create a PC game, the results may not be as impressive in terms of output vs limitations.

You completely missed my point. If Nintendo had designed something like a ps3 or 360 or literally anything else in the same power bracket, their results would be more or less the same.

There is no special chip in the Wii U that prevents screen tearing and smooths out edges or creates "more" color. It's just a low powered IBM CPU paired with a AMD GPU and some RAM, not much different from other consoles. There is no black magic going on here. I mean, the fact that the few Wii U third party games look and run no differently than their ps360 counterparts shows there is nothing special going on under the hood. Nintendo games look the way they do because Nintendo prioritizes different things and goes for a different look than anybody else.

 

[StoOgE]

I own a PS4, and my Wii U wows me more regularly. Mario Kart 8 is the best art ever. That F-Zero Mute City stage is like, holy fuck. Wind Waker was like watching a Ghibli movie in some scenes. Mario 3D World has some amazing objects. I still haven't given Pikmin a spin yet.

It's a shame it wasn't worth 3rd parties' time to put resources into their ports, the hardware is clearly capable of some great stuff.

Isn't the long running conventional wisdom that Nintendo holds back on the developer support for 3rd parties to ensure first party games look the best?

I thought that's more or less been the case dating back to the SNES.

 

[Beren the Empty-Handed]

wind waker has some pretty spectacular lighting .

I'd argue that the lighting in WWHD is one of the few things that's disappointing. The torchlight work is pretty inconsistent with the rest of the game, as seen here. It also points out a few other lighting problems. I think they also overdid it on the bloom. This is pretty nitpicky, and overall the game looks great, but I wouldn't say it has spectacular lighting.

 

[marc^o^]

Captain Toad has some scenes with the best lightning/textures on Wii U so far OP, you should try it.

 

[Neuromancer]

I agree, some of the games that have come out of Nintendo look amazing. Captain Toad's Treasure Tracker is another beautiful game.

By the way OP you should add a space between each image so they don't run into one another. It would look better.

 

[omonimo]

Nothing to do with the hardware and everything to do with the third party developpers toolchains.

Toolchain are part of the problem but say the hardware limits has nothing to do with the bad performances in the multiplat it's absolutely false.

 

[sörine]

Toolchain are part of the problem but say the hardware has not problem it's absolutely false.

The hardware demands a different approach to get full performance. In layman's terms think of PS360 as CPU focused while Wii U's GPU focused (as are PS4/XBO btw). It's not a "problem" exactly so much though, it's just a different architecture prioritization.

Developers who tried to "brute force" ports on Wii U tend to run into performance issues (especially with forced vsync throttling framerates). Those that take their time to really maximize Wii U's more modern architecture though have had impressive results, like Criteron with NFSMW, Frozenbyte with Trine 2 or Beetribe with Bayonetta to give several examples.

 

[prag16]

They put the same time of the ps360 version, it seems the problem it's more the hardware bottlenecks.

There's absolutely zero chance the Wii U version of those multiplats were given equal effort. Zero.

Of course you could argue that Nintendo should have made the hardware powerful enough that multiplats could be plopped on there and run at least on par without a large effort. But that's another discussion entirely.

 

[alterno69]

You have a preference for their art style. That's about it, really.


3d World looks great. I played it before ever playing any PS4 games. And yeah, it looked really great. But then going back and playing it, the game looks very simple.
First of all, it's 720p so its already blurry. And then the environments are remarkably simple and small. And the amount of action going on screen seems small and very controlled.

Nintendo is very good at working and achieving realistic goals of the hardware. Their games seem to be designed within the constraints of the hardware in mind. This is why their games look so good, feel polished, and have steady frame rates. A game like Captain Toad isn't trying to break down any walls of game design. It's pretty simple by nature. And the design of the game seems very obtainable. And thus the game didn't need to make any serious compromises. This means a very complete visual look with a perfect frame rate.

I'm sorry but i don't agree about 3D world, i've had a Ps4 since launch and an Xbox One for almost a year and i still think 3D World is an impressive looking game, i don't have the sharpness on my TV cranked all the way up so i don't see many jaggies ad it looks sharp enough, i certainly don't think it looks blurry at all. And who cares if the worlds are small and simple? It looks great and that's what matters.

Take this from someone who has had a WiiU for less than a week and whose last Nintendo system was a SNES more than 20 years ago.

 

[ninjablade]

It's not about Hardware, but more about Artstyle. If we had more big-budget Games going for big colourful Artstyle on the Last Gen, Nintendos Output wouldn't even be this impressive as it is right now. And it's also the reason why it will continue to impress. Because there is basically no competition in terms of colourful Games with special Artstyles

this right here. Nintendo colorful games get the biggest budget, i think it's the only company that can even get great sales from colorful cartoony games, cause the xbox and playstation crowd don't seem to buy them anymore.

 

[omonimo]

The hardware demands a different approach to get full performance. In layman's terms think of PS360 as CPU focused while Wii U's GPU focused (as are PS4/XBO btw). It's not a "problem" exactly so much though, it's just a different architecture prioritization.

360 it's not cpu focused and no wiiu not has different approach to get more power, where coming from? cpu it's simply unbalanced for such hardware. Should be more powerful of the ps360 not weaker, because gpu more power it's useless with a proper cpu.

 

[Seanspeed]

Isn't the long running conventional wisdom that Nintendo holds back on the developer support for 3rd parties to ensure first party games look the best?

I thought that's more or less been the case dating back to the SNES.

Really? I'm not doubting cuz I don't know much about Nintendo's corporate or development 'culture', but that's definitely quite amazing to hear.

And awful. I mean, its normal for 1st party devs to get the cream of the crop and latest tools and all, but deliberately holding back on 3rd party developers? No wonder 3rd party support for them has become so poor.

Anyways, I'm still far more impressed by the art style of these games than its tech. I can see some half decent textures(nothing spectacular), some nice DoF effects, decent lighting. But better hardware could do all that and more, plus with higher resolution and general higher image quality. Its still a highly disappointing machine in terms of 'what it can do' by modern standards.

 

[LiveFromKyoto]

Isn't the long running conventional wisdom that Nintendo holds back on the developer support for 3rd parties to ensure first party games look the best?

I thought that's more or less been the case dating back to the SNES.

Sure, and Sony and MS as well, though perhaps to a lesser degree - I think it's no accident that Naughty Dog, God of War and Halo & Forza looked a notch above everything else on their respective systems, beyond focused single-platform development. And the fact that the bulk of serious 3rd party Wii U development took place early on meant there weren't even great tools in the first place.

But what I was referring to was the Wii U having a different architecture and no 3rd parties putting significantly large teams on ports to maximize that. Straight Right and the Call of Duty & ZombiU teams were probably the best we got.

 

[Herb Alpert]

Isn't the long running conventional wisdom that Nintendo holds back on the developer support for 3rd parties to ensure first party games look the best?

I thought that's more or less been the case dating back to the SNES.

More simply, they don't seem to feel the need to help third parties with their bizarro hardware. They probably just give devkits and there you go.

 

[sörine]

360 it's not cpu focused and no wiiu has problem because the cpu it's completely unbalanced for such hardware. Should be more powerful of the ps360 not weaker, because gpu power it's useless with a proper cpu.

Are you kidding? 360 is heavily CPU multithreading dependent to achieve high performance. 360 doesn't even have a dedicated sound chip, that's offloaded on CPU resources too. The CPUs on both 360 and PS3 were incredibly overengineered for their day, while all the consoles this gen take a reverse approach to architecture balancing.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

Mario Kart's aliasing is an absolute eyesore, especially on 4player