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[LiquidMetal14]

As others said in the other thread, this is definite PR to lessen the blow back when they announce the game is 30fps. Expect more of these types of quotes all the way up to release.

Why should this ever be so questioned though? Let them make and design their game how they want. This news about 30/60fps is making something out of nothing. There is nothing to defend.

On tip of this being a powerful but, still, limited console.

 

[Seanspeed]

I'd rather have all those effects than have none of them running at 60fps.

I'm not doubting it. Graphics are top priority for many people. I just think that's a shame.

 

[tassletine]

More of this experience bullshit, heh?

It's not like Uncharted has great gameplay. They're more about the story than anything else.

 

[Silky]

Gross.

Multiplayer probably won't be at 60 either. Shame.

 

[vanx0]

I prefer all the bells & whistles at 30fps

 

[Stereogatari]

I'm not doubting it. Graphics are top priority for many people. I just think that's a shame.

Especially when the key aspect of this medium is the pressing buttons and manipulating object on screen part.

 

[Agent Gibbs]

who cares as long as the game is good, nobody kicked of with anything last gen being an unplayable mess

people are just buzz word babies these days

 

[IcyEyes]

Awesome news to me.

 

[GribbleGrunger]

That's an interesting and well argued point you bring up, i hadn't thought of that, i'm totally swayed now.

I just don't want a voice like yours to be taken as the 'norm'. You are welcome to your opinion but I want next gen not last gen at 60fps.

 

[Fret]

Oh, I see what's going on here.

The Last of Us, a port of last gen game has people convinced that the only difference between 30 and 60fps is slightly better shadows, LOL

Let's get Last Gen as an example, because we only have Uncharted on Last Gen Systems:

This is a non bullshot of a 60fps game on Ps3, one of the few Ps3 games that actually runs close (but not quite) to locked 60fps:



This is Uncharted 2, a 4 years older games running at 30fps:


But sure. The difference is slight and only comes down to a few effects being present

What? I'm not "convinced" of anything like that.

And uh, yes, a few effects can definitely raise the fps of a game to 60 (AA, texture quality, particles, etc). Do you play on PC? Or are you only a console gamer? Because those two games are from completely different developers with completely different engines... those images are irrelevant and didn't help your argument at all.

 

[Kyoufu]

I don't have a problem with 30fps, I just don't understand why they showed that 60fps teaser trailer at E3 and claimed that they're aiming for it when obviously they're not.

 

[TheLegendOfMart]

I'm not doubting it. Graphics are top priority for many people. I just think that's a shame.

It's a tough sell. For the core/mainstream if you make a game that runs at 60 but looks like a HD PS3 game or at least not noticeably better then they would question why they have to pay $xxx more for a new console.

I'm not saying this is right but it's one of the determining factors.

 

[tuna_love]

who cares as long as the game is good, nobody kicked of with anything last gen being an unplayable mess

people are just buzz word babies these days

Yes. 60fps is a buzz word.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

There are very few times I am proud that the mass market at large doesn't reflect the attitudes of the elite few but the 30 vs 60 is definitely one of them. I can't recall one time in my life discussing a game with someone and them noticing a game was 60 or lamenting that it was 30.

 

[MUnited83]

No shit. Still boggles my mind that people actually thought the game would ever run and look like the reveal trailer.

 

[Betty]

It's not like Uncharted has great gameplay. They're more about the story than anything else.

The stories aren't that great though, it's more the acting and writing that work best.

Gameplay is fine.

 

[Melchiah]

Sounds like they are laying the ground work to soften the landing, that the game will be 30fps.

Could be. In retrospect, they probably shouldn't have said anything about it, when the game was revealed.

 

[Damian.]

Says they won't compromise the user experience, debunks that in said statement. Interesting logic there.

 

[RavenValor95]

A locked 30 is smooth but 60 is awesome, especially since they put so much effort into the animation.

That's one of the biggest things I noticed about going to 60FPS The Last of Us, so many animations have a bunch of detail in them that become way more obvious at 60FPS, the animation team at Naughty Dog are amazing.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Thank god its 30fps.

No motion sickness for me.

 

[MUnited83]

It's a tough sell. For the core/mainstream if you make a game that runs at 60 but looks like a HD PS3 game then they would question why they have to pay $xxx more for a new console.

I'm not saying this is right but it's one of the determining factors.

I dunno, CoD and FIFA sell pretty damn well....

 

[UrbanRats]

It's not like Uncharted has great gameplay. They're more about the story than anything else.

Uncharted (form 2 onwards, anyway) does have great gamaplay.
Unfortunately it never really got to a point where they were able to exploit it to its full potential, and that U4 demo showed a lot of promise in that sense.

So it's too bad to see that instead they're still more focused on other aspects of this franchise, primarily.

 

[tuxfool]

I don't have a problem with 30fps, I just don't understand why they showed that 60fps teaser trailer at E3 and claimed that they're aiming for it when obviously they're not.

Aiming isn't the same as achieving.

 

[Yaphett Kotto]

Talked all that good shit about 60fps during and after TLoU development and now they are slowly going back on those statements.

What a overestimation.

 

[Putty]

As expected and perfectly happy with that.

 

[Kiant]

I would of loved 60fps, but long as the 30 lock is solid I don't mind.

 

[Corpekata]

There are very few times I am proud that the mass market at large doesn't reflect the attitudes of the elite few but the 30 vs 60 is definitely one of them. I can't recall one time in my life discussing a game with someone and them noticing a game was 60 or lamenting that it was 30.

Doubt the masses could tell you about 720p (or 900p) or 1080p either. Doesn't mean they're not noticing it, or that resolutions shouldn't matter.

 

[UrbanRats]

I just don't want a voice like yours to be taken as the 'norm'. You are welcome to your opinion but I want next gen not last gen at 60fps.

Well that really depends, if "next gen" to you is exclusively eye candy.
To me it's not.

They could chop the framerate even more and render at higher resolution or include even more little details to show off at a panel.
it's a matter of compromise.
i'll take the compromise that favors gameplay, for a game that is as fast paced as Uncharted.

Especially because they are so talented, they would make a great looking game even at 60.
if you talk about Bloodborne, i don't know WHAT that game would've looked like at 60, probably a lot worse than anything ND could squeeze out.

 

[Gbraga]

Ok... Can we at least get 60fps multiplayer?

It's not like Uncharted has great gameplay. They're more about the story than anything else.

The gameplay they showed was actaully pretty great.

 

[old manatee]

I'm replaying The Last of Us on PS3 and I definitely think the low frame rate makes it look and play shittier.

 

[BigTnaples]

Says they won't compromise the user experience, debunks that in said statement. Interesting logic there.

If my immersion would be negatively effected, or level design, or AI, or anything of the like would be negatively impacted by 60fps and having to compromise, then I chose 30fps. Every, single time.



When will people learn that for consoles. You have to pick. You can't have both.


If you want the highest fidelity, and best graphics, get a PC. If you want console exclusives like Uncharted and Halo. You're going to see compromise.

 

[SmokedMeat]

As long as the input lag isn't bad I'm fine. Just because a game is 60fps doesn't mean it's automatically smooth in response time. Metro Redux at 60fps feels more sluggish to me than Far Cry 4 at 30fps.

I like the concern I see from the familiar guys that don't play on consoles though. Good to see you guys continue to show so much interest in something you'll never play.

 

[Auto-Reply]

Has it been declared what exactly would be considered as an Impact on the player experience?

If not = useless statement!

 

[Seanspeed]

It's a tough sell. For the core/mainstream if you make a game that runs at 60 but looks like a HD PS3 game then they would question why they have to pay $xxx more.

I'm not saying this is right but it's one of the determining factors.

A 60fps title doesn't have to look that bad, though. Advanced Warfare is a pretty nice looking game that runs at 60fps, for instance. And that's a multiplatform title.

As long as the input lag isn't bad I'm fine. Just because a game is 60fps doesn't mean it's automatically smooth in response time. Metro Redux at 60fps feels more sluggish to me than Far Cry 4 at 30fps.

I like the concern I see from the familiar guys that don't play on consoles though. Good to see you guys continue to show so much interest in something you'll never play.

Ya know, most of us PC gamers still own and use consoles man.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I just don't want a voice like yours to be taken as the 'norm'. You are welcome to your opinion but I want next gen not last gen at 60fps.

Thankfully you won't ever have to worry about it being the 'norm'.

Doubt the masses could tell you about 720p (or 900p) or 1080p either. Doesn't mean they're not noticing it.

I have actually had conversations with people that notice the native res difference funny enough but honestly not once, not even once have I seen this conversation pop up anywhere outside of gaf.

 

[Lord Phol]

It really is another generation of 30fps for consoles, a shame. I wonder if things will change with morpheus, but I doubt it.

 

[jett]

Oh, I see what's going on here.

The Last of Us, a port of last gen game has people convinced that the only difference between 30 and 60fps is slightly better shadows, LOL

Let's get Last Gen as an example, because we only have Uncharted on Last Gen Systems:

This is a non bullshot of a 60fps game on Ps3, one of the few Ps3 games that actually runs close (but not quite) to locked 60fps:



This is Uncharted 2, a 4 years older games running at 30fps:


But sure. The difference is slight and only comes down to a few effects being present

Fortunately, we don't play screenshots, or at 1 frame per second. In motion the framerate makes a huge difference for MGR. The increase in visual feedback, input responsiveness and animation fluidity is huge. It's ironic though that MGR is usually pumping a bunch of particle effects on screen, undoubtedly more often than UC2 does.

You're also comparing a massive "blockbuster" undertaking to a game that was rescued from the ashes of a failed project and was completed in a relatively short amount of time, by a smaller developer and with a smaller budget.

This is what a "big" 60fps title looked like in 2008:

You can get "good graphics" despite having 60fps as your base line, as long as it's designed carefully from the ground up. And in motion the different is vast.

 

[Twookie]

37 fps? That doesn't sound like aiming for 60fps to me.

gee, 37 fps is really good for an pre-alpha build, and besides optimization comes later in the dev cycle

 

[UpUpDownDown]

Oh, I see what's going on here.

The Last of Us, a port of last gen game has people convinced that the only difference between 30 and 60fps is slightly better shadows, LOL

Let's get Last Gen as an example, because we only have Uncharted on Last Gen Systems:

This is a non bullshot of a 60fps game on Ps3, one of the few Ps3 games that actually runs close (but not quite) to locked 60fps:



This is Uncharted 2, a 4 years older games running at 30fps:


But sure. The difference is slight and only comes down to a few effects being present

Is this serious?

The entire ground area in MGR is one giant flat polygon...and I could go on. Use your fucking eyes man.

 

[R_Deckard]

And the point is, which of those features are more important than 60fps? You're gonna have diverging opinions on it, but personally i'd take 60 fps over hair that gets wet or a moving shirt that, as cool as it is, i won't see and forget about while i'm actually playing the game.
Great stuff to post as gif on forum console wars, but beyond that, i wouldn't prioritize it over something (like 60fps) that actively helps responsiveness and fluidity.

Totally agree, but this is developers decision and has always been the case. Console/platform wars are pointless waste of everyone's time and this is certainly not what ND (or any dev for that matter) has an interest in.

What we have see is a small slice of the game, but if the game extends the physics to weight (like the example of being pulled off the edge of a cliff is near by an enemy as you throw them.

Or having scenery breakdown based on impact/time. This does not even factor in the AI side shown from the demo with line of sight/sound all playing into the dynamics. These are more important to me than 60 if a locked 30 with much better motion blur than in that demo.

I think IF they fail on the 60fps target (and the visual quality of the game still tells me the aim for 60 is very much in the game plan) then it will look significantly better at launch if the 30 lock is implemented.

Explain what the AI is doing that is super special? :/

Everything else you mentioned is just there for more impressive graphics appeal, like I said. You're basically proving my point.

Ok I can see you are lacking understanding of basic software/game design here outside of how many wows are rendered.

Talking about physics/dynamic actions like Line of sight loss, sound reaction, close qtr recognition, expansive world interaction from wind, Nate and NPC's along with bullets etc.

Not too mention the context sensitive and reactive animations based on location and proximity of characters. NONE of these things are "Graphics" as you try to put it as the demo was far more Function than form in play aside a few demonstrations of lighting, water etc (oh and inverse kinematics which most will never notice)

 

[BigTnaples]

Fortunately, we don't play screenshots, or at 1 frame per second. In motion the framerate makes a huge difference for MGR. The increase in visual feedback, input responsiveness and animation fluidity is huge. It's ironic though that MGR is usually pumping a bunch of particle effects on screen, undoubtedly more often than UC2 does.

You're also comparing a massive "blockbuster" undertaking to a game that was rescued from the ashes of a failed project and was completed in a relatively short amount of time, by a smaller developer and with a smaller budget.

This is what a "big" 60fps title looked like in 2008:



You can get "good graphics" despite having 60fps as your base line, as long as it's designed carefully from the ground up. And in motion the different is vast.

That game looks like shit compared to Uncharted 2-3 fidelity wise.

Is this serious?

The entire ground area in MGR is one giant flat polygon...and I could go on. Use your fucking eyes man.

Your sarcasm meter is way off.

 

[sobaka770]

As long as it's a locked and stable 30FPS I'm very happy with that. I'd rather them create magnificent set pieces and experiences for Drake rather than limiting themselves to 60FPS.

 

[nib95]

I'd much rather them go 30fps with bigger, richer levels and environments, better visuals and effects etc. Honestly, 60fps is not necessary for a game like Uncharted. Just go 30fps locked with some back end to help with input response.

 

[Cave Johnson]

I dunno, CoD and FIFA sell pretty damn well....

So is Mario but you know it gets ignored.

 

[Marvel]

Fine with it, graphics are more important to me. (except for fighters)

 

[jett]

That game looks like shit compared to Uncharted 2-3 fidelity wise.

DMC4 came out over 18 months before Uncharted 2, and it was one of the best looking games available at the time of release.

It never looked like shit. It's sad to see fanboyism makes people say all kinds of insane shit.

 

[Bishop89]

Let them do whatever they want.

People either have loved their games or not, and if not it wouldnt be because of the games performance.

 

[Schweinehund]

Never expected 60 even though they said that was their goal.

Bloodborne being 30 hurts more though.

 

[IcyEyes]

... and this link will help all those people that post "funny" replies :

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=967421

 

[Reckless Onion]

Just give me 60fps in MP please, that's where it matters the most anyway.