The Order: 1886 |OT| Gears of Yore

Lord Error said:
I've heard that - not seen the ending yet - but that's a shame. Even if someone would say that it's not a net positive over their games, I simply don't see how it can be valued so much *less*, when in some important ways this game is better, and offers more than a typical telltale game. Yes it comes at a higher price tag, but I just don't get this obsession over 'value' in games, when reselling them is such an easily available option for those who want to do it.
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I agree. I also agreed with Sterling on the Jimquisition today, save for the part where he didn't like the game at all. But about the value vs quality stuff, definitely.
 
antitrop said:
I'm going to do a second run on easy to pick up the Platinum and appreciate the detail of the game a bit more. Play with headphones, instead of my TV speakers, too.

Game looks too good to trade in, yet.
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I think this is a game I might revisit once in a while. I got digital so no trading it in :(

I want to see what its like on easy with auto aim on. I might as well go for the platinum. Heh. It would be my first. I'm not much of a trophy guy.
 
SketchTheArtist said:
So, what, the game changes rules when its deeming it necessary depending on the set-pieces? Zero coherence or logic?

This game's really lazy, jesus.
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That is for sure one of the odd things about the game. I guess they realized they need to do a whole new set of animations for cover based movements while holding the lantern, and couldn't do it. Of course an obvious solution would be to let you put the lantern down on the ground while you're in combat, but they don't let you do that (at least I don't think so)

That's the thing that's frustrating me about the game so far. For every obviously dumb thing that I've encountered (they don't bother me much yet, but they're dumb nonetheless) I could always come up with an incredibly simple solution/improvement that would take someone like a day of work to implement. It's baffling considering that the game is so super polished in so many ways that it would be insane to call them lazy. You can tell they must have poured blood and sweat into this, but it could still use more time in the oven.
 
So I have some questions:
Who the hell is Bobby Paige? Is he even a thing in this game? What is the the point of Sony to show him in a trailer when in fact, there isn't his presence or even the slightest piece of information in this game?
 
One thing this game desperately needs is a roll. The roll animation is already in the game as a contextual action for grenade throws, so I'm confused why they didn't just map the action to the X button.
 
Lord Error said:
That is for sure one of the odd things about the game. I guess they realized they need to do a whole new set of animations for cover based movements while holding the lantern, and couldn't do it. Of course an obvious solution would be to let you put the lantern down on the ground while you're in combat, but they don't let you do that (at least I don't think so)

That's the thing that's frustrating me about the game so far. For every obviously dumb thing that I've encountered (they don't bother me much yet, but they're dumb nonetheless) I could always come up with an incredibly simple solution/improvement that would take someone like a day of work to implement. It's baffling considering that the game is so super polished in so many ways that it would be insane to call them lazy. You can tell they must have poured blood and sweat into this, but it could still use more time in the oven.
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Earlier, I posted my ideas for a simple control overhaul, one that also worked in a way to put away the lantern!

antitrop said:
Here's how I would overhaul the controls:

There doesn't need to be two buttons to switch between Primary or Secondary weapons, I would map that as a Toggle to Left on the d-pad.

There doesn't need to be two buttons to switch between Smoke or Frag Grenades, I would map that as a Toggle to Right on the d-pad.

There doesn't need to be a "Directive" button, at all. I would remove that completely and map Blacksight to R3.

L1 would now become the "Throw Grenade" button.

That leaves Up and Down on the d-pad freed up for possibly something else, like turning off your lantern. More use could be made of the touchpad, as well. Especially since Camera Bias is Off by default...
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jackdoe said:
One thing this game desperately needs is a roll. The roll animation is already in the game as a contextual action for grenade throws, so I'm confused why they didn't just map the action to the X button.
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yeah the roll is there (mapped to X) when evading werewolf attacks also. Why not have it available at all times is another one of those mildly annoying puzzling decisions.
 
XxRampage07xX said:
So I have some questions:
Who the hell is Bobby Paige? Is he even a thing in this game? What is the the point of Sony to show him in a trailer when in fact, there isn't his presence or even the slightest piece of information in this game?
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Not in the game, not even mentioned. It was just a cool way to flesh out the world, nothing more.
 
Just got the game this morning and powered through for most of the day. I really like it. There is definitely more gameplay than I was led to believe reading reviews and stuff. Voice acting, characters and graphics are top notch. Shooting feels tight, and some of the guns are pretty fun to play around with. Glad I decided to stick with my pre-order. Totally worth it so far.
 
antitrop said:
There doesn't need to be a "Directive" button, at all. I would remove that completely and map Blacksight to R3.
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I had no idea such a button even existed. Why? There really aren't any situations in which you can get lost.
 
Since they had Tesla making weapons and gear for them, I'm surprised he didn't come up with the idea to slap a flashlight on one of the guns or on their armour so they wouldn't need a lantern.
 
LookAtMeGo said:
Since they had Tesla making weapons and gear for them, I'm surprised he didn't come up with the idea to slap a flashlight on one of the guns or on their armour so they wouldn't need a lantern.
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Had the same thought when I reached that part in the game. The extent to which we often have to suspend disbelief as players in video games is a damn shame. I wish more developers valued believable settings with consistent rules and logic over wanting to hamfist in a gimmicky set piece. I mean sure, lanterns do add some atmosphere, but their continued use in a world powered by electricity that also contains devices like long-range wireless communicators is just too much.
 
http://darkzero.co.uk/game-reviews/the-order-1886-ps4/

There is no one singular thing wrong with The Order – it’s an ever increasing number of issues that build up over its short run that’s the culprit here. Offering more options to players is not the fix. It does not need a multiplayer option to inflate its replay value, nor does it need a co-op mode to play with your friend. Extra hours of gameplay is not the fix either. More hours of The Order in its current state would arguably further hinder rather than help the game’s appeal. The solution is not to offer more, instead The Order just needed to be a better game – but thats something much easier for me to demand than it is to accomplish.

Some may say that the following may very well put everyone involved in the industry out of business some day, but this really is one of those games where you gain nothing by playing it. So, loading up a Let’s Play with a host that does not make your ears want to bleed, and viewing The Order through the actions of others seems like the correct approach – if you have an insatiable urge to experience this one.

Regardless of quantity concerns (which is a valid complaint), where The Order more crucially falls apart is in regards to quality. It does not matter if a game is one or one hundred hours long, you need to enjoy playing it, and The Order fails at that most crucial of tasks. This is unforgivable, and instantly makes it impossible to recommend.
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jackdoe said:
One thing this game desperately needs is a roll. The roll animation is already in the game as a contextual action for grenade throws, so I'm confused why they didn't just map the action to the X button.
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Yes, this would have worked great, like in the fight against the
Lycans
not just forward roll, but to the sides as well.
 
Lord Error said:
That is for sure one of the odd things about the game. I guess they realized they need to do a whole new set of animations for cover based movements while holding the lantern, and couldn't do it. Of course an obvious solution would be to let you put the lantern down on the ground while you're in combat, but they don't let you do that (at least I don't think so)

That's the thing that's frustrating me about the game so far. For every obviously dumb thing that I've encountered (they don't bother me much yet, but they're dumb nonetheless) I could always come up with an incredibly simple solution/improvement that would take someone like a day of work to implement. It's baffling considering that the game is so super polished in so many ways that it would be insane to call them lazy. You can tell they must have poured blood and sweat into this, but it could still use more time in the oven.
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As a dev, I had the exact same reaction towards the little problems where I could find an easy solution to make it more interesting.

The pacing is all off, there's no tension with any situations, the werewolves are introduced in an uninteresting manner and you dispatch fairly easily three at once and the AI for them is extremely basic and predictable. Then your character reacts to this attack in a bored ''been there done that'' attitude and then the game continues to flatline with every interesting opportunity it has. It's quite depressing since the art direction and the crafting of these visuals is jaw-dropping. But the rest of the game is so boringly executed.

You walk around an area with NPCs scattered through the environment and then they do their little scripted animations and when you approach them they don't even notice you and stop moving once they're done with their little storytime. It's like they haven't grown past the design barrier for PSP.

They've done really good spin-off titles from other established IPs. I'm a big fan of their God of War titles, but holy god is it a very, very basic put together game. It has so much potential and barely tries to make it entertaining.
 
Welp, just finished it up and I got to say I really enjoyed it! It was fun, looked gorgeous, amazing sound mix (play with headphones!), & I didn't really mind the decision to focus on "cinematic story" or whatever you want to call it. Loved the art direction in the game & the gun play was a lot of fun for me. I can see how some people would be turned off on parts of the game, but I never felt like the game was "bad" or "lazy/boring/uninspired." The Order is on the short side however, and that's probably my biggest negative. I just wanted the game to keep going!

That was a hellofa ending title card sequence thing though (though rather abrupt and leaving many things unanswered). I'm in for a sequel though!

More game + more unique guns + more enemy variety & same great sound/art/cinematic direction and I think RAD could really have a great franchise on their hands!
 
LookAtMeGo said:
No. Watching this game on youtube instead of playing it is terrible advice. For any game.
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When the game is straight forward and offers little exploration there will not be much if any variation or personal experience. Sure you could stare at some curtains for an hour and soak in the carefully crafted atmosphere but it's not going to change the game.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
When the game is straight forward and offers little exploration there will not be much if any variation or personal experience. Sure you could stare at some curtains for an hour and soak in the carefully crafted atmosphere but it's not going to change the game.
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Dude come on, playing the game is different than watching it, you don't get to feel what the combat is like, it's not like you can just skip over the combat in this game and continue on.
 
One of the things I really like about this game that I haven't seen mentioned (possibly because it's a small thing or I just missed it), is that during the action sequences the game automatically speeds up your character. You automatically start running and pushing in the stick makes you run even faster. I don't recall seeing that in a game before and I think that's a really neat idea.
 
Ellite25 said:
One of the things I really like about this game that I haven't seen mentioned (possibly because it's a small thing or I just missed it), is that during the action sequences the game automatically speeds up your character. You automatically start running and pushing in the stick makes you run even faster. I don't recall seeing that in a game before and I think that's a really neat idea.
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I believe the Uncharted games do that if I am not mistaken
 
WordsintheWater said:
Dude come on, playing the game is different than watching it, you don't get to feel what the combat is like, it's not like you can just skip over the combat in this game and continue on.
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Unless they are doing something new, I'm pretty sure the combat feels like every other over the shoulder TP out there. I understand that playing it is the preferable experience, but when the game is a linear story with no choice, no exploration, you can watch it and still get the same result.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
When the game is straight forward and offers little exploration there will not be much if any variation or personal experience. Sure you could stare at some curtains for an hour and soak in the carefully crafted atmosphere but it's not going to change the game.
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But the best parts are shooting people. I would just never give that advice myself. Watching playthroughs on youtube is almost on the same level as pirating a movie IMO. If you want to play it then rent it at least. Why is it ok to watch entire games on youtube? Or encouraged like in that review? Its bullshit if you ask me. No matter how shitty you think the game is.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
Unless they are doing something new, I'm pretty sure the combat feels like every other over the shoulder TP out there. I understand that playing it is the preferable experience, but when the game is a linear story with no choice, no exploration, you can watch it and still get the same result.
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No you can't get the same results. You don't feel the emotion of scenes, you can't feel how visceral the combat is, it's harder to put yourself in that characters shoes. Make the debate if you want with the story, but the rest is not the same as watching it on youtube.
 
I picked the game up today after spending the weekend thinking about it. If anything, at least I get to support a good developer that I want to see grow and thrive.

So far I am enjoying the game quite a bit. The game controls smoothly, it looks gorgeous, performs well and has some great voice acting. I actually enjoy the lengthy cutscenes (which are nowhere near MGS4 levels of long). The story and setting are a lot of fun and the setup at the beginning was intriguing.

I can see why some may have issues with it, though. Gameplay wise, it is a by-the-numbers cover shooter that includes just about every cliche, last gen element thrown in. We're talking hidden collectibles, audio logs, cinematic quick time events, whack-a-mole combat scenarios, the works. If you're looking for a new, unique gameplay experience, this game is not for you.

If you don't mind the well designed but typical gameplay and like to play games for the experience and not necessarily a challenge or groundbreaking game design, you will definitely dig The Order. It's all about the journey, the set pieces and the story. The game reminds me of Ruse: Son of Rome a lot. Great looking game, cool setting, fun story, but the gameplay is fairly easy and nothing revolutionary and it doesn't last long.
 
WordsintheWater said:
No you can't get the same results. You don't feel the emotion of scenes, you can't feel how visceral the combat is, it's harder to put yourself in that characters shoes. Make the debate if you want with the story, but the rest is not the same as watching it on youtube.
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How can I not get the "emotion" of the scenes? Me shooting some guys in the face who all rush in from one side automatically make me more invested in the scene? Pushing the left thumb stick in makes myself more invested?
 
ProvenDeadly said:
How can I not get the "emotion" of the scenes? Me shooting some guys in the face who all rush in from one side automatically make me more invested in the scene? Pushing the left thumb stick in makes myself more invested?
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You're right it's the same exact thing, I don't know why you play games in the first place, just watch them on youtube.
 
LookAtMeGo said:
But the best parts are shooting people. I would just never give that advice myself. Watching playthroughs on youtube is almost on the same level as pirating a movie IMO. If you want to play it then rent it at least. Why is it ok to watch entire games on youtube? Or encouraged like in that review? Its bullshit if you ask me. No matter how shitty you think the game is.
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Playing the game is absolutely always the first option. One of 60$, the other is free. This seems like a rent at best game to me, so I would rather watch it than pay money.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
Playing the game is absolutely always the first option. One of 60$, the other is free. This seems like a rent at best game to me, so I would rather watch it than pay money.
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Then go ahead and do it, but don't come in here pretending you're getting the full experience or it's the same thing as playing it because it's not, no matter how much you say it.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
Unless they are doing something new, I'm pretty sure the combat feels like every other over the shoulder TP out there. I understand that playing it is the preferable experience, but when the game is a linear story with no choice, no exploration, you can watch it and still get the same result.
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So basically we could've just watched games like Gears of War, Uncharted, etc to 'experience' them.

Ok.
 
I'm really liking it so far and I like the pacing, the slower sections so far are fine and look amazing, I still remember the old threads when we were hoping they'd be able to pull these designs off from the art, and since I really like the setting and VA work I'm enjoying the cutscenes, though I've always loved story cutscenes thanks to Square, JRPGs, Metal Gear Solid etc. The gunplay is really good thanks to the feel of the weapon even if it's not "revolutionary". Also, there's plenty of gameplay in this in my opinion.

jackdoe said:
One thing this game desperately needs is a roll. The roll animation is already in the game as a contextual action for grenade throws, so I'm confused why they didn't just map the action to the X button.
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That would be cool.

LookAtMeGo said:
Since they had Tesla making weapons and gear for them, I'm surprised he didn't come up with the idea to slap a flashlight on one of the guns or on their armour so they wouldn't need a lantern.
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Haven't finished the game yet but would not be surprised if that's one of the things he does next should the game get a sequel. It's neat that they have an cool way to build in stuff like that both in the game and in the story.
 
The lantern thing is similar to Doom 3, they made that decision to change the mood.

Lord Error said:
yeah the roll is there (mapped to X) when evading werewolf attacks also. Why not have it available at all times is another one of those mildly annoying puzzling decisions.
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I'd say it's not there the majority of time because it would be easy to nerf most combat by rolling up to enemies through cover positions and taking them out with melee.

Removing the roll from the majority of combat situations means you have to be aware of enemy positions (ie. flanking, high points) a lot more too.

I abused the hell out of rolling during The Witcher 2 so I can understand trying to avoid that.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
Unless they are doing something new, I'm pretty sure the combat feels like every other over the shoulder TP out there. I understand that playing it is the preferable experience, but when the game is a linear story with no choice, no exploration, you can watch it and still get the same result.
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There are plenty of opinions I disagree with but this is one I can't even give a shred of respect to. Anyone knowledgeable enough about games to be on GAF should know how wildly inaccurate this is.
 
shinobi602 said:
Well, everyone has their opinion, though I disagree with that assessment :)


I wasn't saying not to bring up ideas, I just personally feel things like that aren't in the best interest of improving the game they set out to make. I'm thinking things like expanding on the level design, implementing more dynamic enemy encounters, enemy variety, AI and slightly less cutscenes vs gameplay would drastically improve the IP, to me at least.
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Agree 100% I just have the need to say it.
 
shinobi602 said:
So basically we could've just watched games like Gears of War, Uncharted, etc to 'experience' them.

Ok.
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Those games are not 50% QTEs and Cutscenes. What I'm saying is, the gameplay is not so involved and instrumental to the game that they are required. In Uncharted and Gears, which is more game than playable movie, they should be played, because the gameplay is the majority of the product.
 
ProvenDeadly said:
Those games are not 50% QTEs and Cutscenes. What I'm saying is, the gameplay is not so involved and instrumental to the game that they are required. In Uncharted and Gears, which is more game than playable movie, they should be played, because the gameplay is the majority of the product.
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Gameplay is the majority of this game too.
 
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