Ya everyone is spot on with the vials stuff. There's no challenge to farming, no fun, and adding in the loading times it has caused me to put the game down for the day several times during my first play through. "Oh look I'm outta vials... well I wanna fight the boss some more.... but no vials and I'm not in the mood at looking at 10 minutes of loading screens". Only thing vials do is discourage people from playing.
Bloodborne |OT+++| ...and so the Nightly Hunt continues
- Thread starter Robot Pants
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Well, I'm personally just teasing with my last reply (since making a joke of the game actually gets easier if played 12+ hours in a row. lol). Blood vials are easy to get if you just buy them. More so later on in game when echos dropped from enemies are like 3k each.
Though, I do really hate when I run out. Wish they had a flask system.
What is menial and boring are the chalice dungeons somewhat. Those can get tedious. Esp if you want to do co-op with someone.
I think people are hating and being sarcastic because you were calling people's opinions "acting". Not everyone is as bothered by the blood vial system.
*eyeroll*
God forbid people don't want to spend time doing dull, meaningless tasks that add nothing to the experience.
Souls games have always been played like that, lol. Only exception is Dark Souls 2 where they got rid of the invulnerability on the fog gate.
Difference here? You don't replenish healing items at a lamp.
You can buy them or easily get them if you don't run past every enemy. I don't see the problem.
I don't run past every enemy, except for unseen village. The vials increase in price, and early/mid game they're a real pain to farm even with souls. End game it's no prob, one pig and you're set but starting out it's very very annoying. If anyone could give me a reason why vials are a good thing I might change my mind, but I only see people commenting on how to make it not suck as bad.
When you get to the chalice dungeons, you don't even run past any enemies to get to the boss. So actually in that case you have to go out of your way to kill them.
Otherwise, most people just speed run to boss rooms. Why? Killing enemies they've already killed ten times over, that add no challenge, is a waste of time.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
Why shouldn't you be able to run past the enemies? It worked fine in the other Souls games and the healing system was already perfected in Dark Souls. It adds nothing positive to the experience.
Well, in the beginning it's true. I spent every vial and bullet I had on Father G. but it was still easy to earn enough items.
It's like a certain group of posters are just talking past everyone's points. The difficulty or ease of getting vials is not the core issue. It is that at its core it is a mechanic that adds nothing of value to the core experience. For all the steps forward bloodborne takes over its predecessors. This is an area it doesn't.
It the counter to the tediousness argument is that they are easy to get, then the counter to that is simply then what is the point of having them be finite in the first place? For people good at the game it adds a slight deviation from enjoying the core game to replenish. For those having rough patches it adds a level of grinding that takes away from better uses of time.
No matter the level of tediousness, you are agreeing that it exists. The question is now what is the justification for it? And I'm struggling to find a good justification in the face of the alternative system we've been given in past games.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
If you don't find flask shards your estus flask will continue to heal at the same rate regardless of how much health you have. Vials level with you. ^.^
Lostconfused
Member
Well it makes the first area easier for new players. Instead of 5 Estus Flasks you can go through way more blood vials depending on the drop rate/luck.
Which has nothing to do with them being finite.
Which is exactly the issue. There's no challenge to getting more vials, it's busy work. It adds no challenge, it's a cheap artificial difficulty that other games are slammed for but this game gets a free pass. Aren't these games suppose to known for being difficult but fair?
callmeJackz
Member
Welp...reached my mental limit... GGs GAF, the game was fun while it lasted......
Are people seriously complaining about fucking blood vials of all things? Good grief. Git gud and don't waste them and you wouldn't be bitching about having to go somewhere to grab more. Or stock 99 of them so you don't have to keep going back and forth. Just a thought.
Since I don't know where to fucking go, I went back to Grand Cathedral and killed E
. Now I have the
Set and thinking of getting the Blades of Mercy, but not sure yet. Are they any good?
Since I don't know where to fucking go, I went back to Grand Cathedral and killed E
ileen
Crow
Made it to the second lantern, but it was pretty damn tough. Enemies seem to hit harder and are way more aggressive than they were in
Yarnham
respawn
I'll get through it, but it's harder than I'm used to.
Just run past the room, gogogoogo
You should because you aren't making any real points.
They are amazing and their combo stuns enemies so they won't evade until you deplete your stamina.
Alebrije
Member
Welp...reached my mental limit... GGs GAF, the game was fun while it lasted......
And they are cute compared with the ones you will find later, if you keep playing
I am not convinced vials as items instead of estus flask style was a good idea and I'm not convinced that starting with a limit of 20 was smart either. I would have preferred 10 that always replenished and then 15/20. It's too easy to tank early on instead of learning movesets
That said, I'm at the point in the game where I can buy 90+ vials after clearing a single room of enemies in a depth 5 chalice dungeon so it doesn't bother me now.
And given that the game is so non-linear, the "I've run out of vials" can be read as a sign to maybe try something else for now. Certainly felt that way to me a couple times.
That said, I'm at the point in the game where I can buy 90+ vials after clearing a single room of enemies in a depth 5 chalice dungeon so it doesn't bother me now.
And given that the game is so non-linear, the "I've run out of vials" can be read as a sign to maybe try something else for now. Certainly felt that way to me a couple times.
It's like you completely missed the point of the concersation and at the same time want to insult people...
Good stuff. Never thought id be told to get good at souls games.
Snkfanatic
Banned
Lol...I tried that last night. It wasn't pretty.
WhiskerFrisker
Member
But it's not difficult?
He'll run into a hunter while having those spiders chase after him.
Isn't it an inherent challenge the fact that you can be low and/or run out of vials?
I tried but it adds nothing to the topic.
Since they went for more of a horror theme, having limited resources adds to the experience. And I know you will say that I am justifying vials again but they make you more careful with resources. I agree they are tedious sometimes, but they don't make the game bad for me.
The_Darkest_Red
Member
I think this sums it up.
For the record it's not a big deal to me. I love the game overall and I don't despise the blood vial system, I just think it's a needless step back from what was already an excellently designed healing system in Dark Souls. It's a minor design issue that I don't understand, is all.
Phat Michael
Banned
Ok 2 areas that will stop me doing ng+. Unseen village and forbidden woods. Hated both of those.
I defeated the one reborn, should I next go up the stars to the nightmare or get captured by the monster in the ceiling and go to the nightmare lecture Hall place that way first?
I defeated the one reborn, should I next go up the stars to the nightmare or get captured by the monster in the ceiling and go to the nightmare lecture Hall place that way first?
If he keeps running past the hunter they'll eventually reset into the room with the neutral little guys. He can then go back into the hall and fight the hunter.
That music, the lore hints when you first get there... So good, so goooooooood.
Bloodborne is ridiculous. I think about it all day at work, I lose sleep thinking about it, this shit is my life right now.
Don't give up, skeleton!
You joke, but runing past enemies is a very effective way to play any Souls game, it's how speedruns are done, after all.
Lostconfused
Member
But this works for Estus Flasks as well since they are a fixed non replenishing resource, which sends the exact same message. It also gives you consistent feedback about your progress.
Why waste time learning move sets of trash mobs that won't even be a challenge later on?
Welp...reached my mental limit... GGs GAF, the game was fun while it lasted......
I think you can hug the wall to the right, go up the stairs. Kill one spider on the ceiling. Grab an item and then there is a bridge up top and you can jump off and run past them if you want.
Which can easily happen with estus. Except if you lose you can just go right back in and try again. Since when have we ever considered farming/grinding in rpgs "good"?
WhiskerFrisker
Member
The surprise when he sees him would be hilarious lol.
I think you miss my point because the flask system definitely does not do this. I mean "I have tried to beat this boss so many times I ran out of stocked vials, maybe the game is telling me to explore elsewhere for now" which is something the infinitely restocking flasks never do.
I would prefer a flask system, I think, and I would prefer the 10/15/20 of old, but it's certainly not a deal breaker for me.
As for your other point, I was talking about bosses, but believe me when you get to NG+ and the first area enemies have 5-10 times as many hit points as they used to, you'll find it valuable to know their movesets.
Yeah, it seems like the shit just hit the fan. I have no idea what's going on, but I love it.
No I didn't miss the conversation. People are trying to make the blood vials out to be this evil mechanic when in reality, the "shield" of Bloodborne is the Blood Vials. Knowing how vital they are to getting around the game and staying alive, I would think people would see their usefulness instead of saying they are an unneeded mechanic that is a waste of time. Different strokes.
As for you, I seem to recall you saying the game was the easiest of all the Souls games, so I can't imagine why you'd be taken aback by my comment.
So...that makes it easier and not more challenging...I don't see the point of your argument. Then again, I haven't had to grind or farm at all in BB, so I don't really see an issue to being with.
Hey guys, I'm just about done with the game, at the last boss. the only loose end I have left is to go beat
and I might do some chalice dungeons. I'd like to level up as much as possible... Is there a consensus on the best way to get the most blood echoes? like a good spot to farm or anything other things i can do?
Martyr Logarius
The_Darkest_Red
Member
Right, because running through a bunch of easy to kill enemies to farm currency is so challenging...
Neither option is more challenging but one is more of a waste of time.
Lostconfused
Member
How is that different from you've ran out of flasks and can never beat this boss?
Well, that's not what I said at all...
No it doesn't make it easier. Getting your flasks refilled auto vs going to grind vials are no different in difficulty. No one finds getting vials difficult, it's just time consuming and boring and filled with many load screens.
I'm with you, especially early in the game when stocking up on a surplus of vials isn't trivial.
Later in the game there's opportunity to do very few "runs" and end up with enough vial drops and echoes to get dozens of vials very quickly. But yeah, that's still busy work.
In the end though, do I want a completely streamlined experience with this style of game? I actually appreciate it for its obtuseness and archaic game design. It's a very unique experience in this day and age, and I'd hate for it to lose its weird "charm" so to speak by polishing away every rough edge it has.
But as you say, they are easy to get for most. The only people it affects are people that are struggling. For everyone else it just adds a layer of tediousness. So it hurts struggling players and forces them to spend time they could spend learning the mechanics and enemy tendencies to grind vials. For everyone else it's just a unnecessary time waster.
If you are going to go the route you speak of then the game should of limited vials more and scaled their cost and such as the game progressed. Balanced the game differently. But then that would compound the issue with bad or struggling players.
To me there just isn't any real good argument I can come up with to defend this system over alternatives. The game is still my favorite game in years. In fact the overall package is my favorite souls game so far, this and the loading times are my only gripe in a otherwise flawless game to me.
Pretty much this. I think a good alternative would be a higher storage limit for vials and bullets.
super-famicom
Member
For ~20k in about a minute: Go to
Lecture Hall, first floor. A classroom will have a ton of enemies inside. Go through the door from the main hallway and back out. They will all funnel through the door and you can pick them off. With two Moon Runes equipped, you'll get about 20k total. Each enemy also has a chance to drop 3 bullets, so you can stock up on those and not buy them. Use a Bold Hunter's Mark to warp back to the lamp and repeat.
Alebrije
Member
Pro tip :
Go inside the hall until the spiders fall then run back outside the building and stop at the entrance, all the small spiders will follow you and you can kill them easily from outside , the big one will be stuck on an small door inside so you can use a hit and run tactic until it dies
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