Daniel Bryan pulled from Euro tour (UPDATE: Concussion unrelated to prev injuries)
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Deleted member 47027
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I don't even know who that guy is. Assuming it's from American baseball, and that sport is dying.
No crossover. Not like Brock and Pank.
What did Punk ever cross over with while in WWE?
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Deleted member 47027
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Walking Dead bullshit for one. Understandably, most of his crossover "proof" is after he left WWE and was free to pursue things, but he's been on AMC plenty of times.
If AMC is mainstream crossover then being in the World Series parade is, too.
The one thing both have in common is neither were ever mentioned on RAW, of course.
Don't downplay Punk's appeal just because people are talking shit about D-Bry. He's been all over the place, from Talking Dead to Nerdist stuff to Maron to rock shows to comic books etc. etc. He definitely has more crossover appeal than Bryan if for no other reason than he's a real self-promoter and he has a really big-ass social and professional circle. Bryan does not put himself out there the way Punk has done at all.
I don't think that means Bryan couldn't be a crossover guy, but he pretty clearly isn't trying to be. Dude just loves being a wrestler and that's the #1 biggest reason he was never going to get a really long run at the top in WWE. That and the need to really make as much money as he could before having to retire is probably why he came back too early, which fucked up the build to Wrestlemania 31 and resulted in these new medical concerns. I'd absolutely hold that against him, even if he is one of my top favorites, a very close second behind Brock.
I don't think that means Bryan couldn't be a crossover guy, but he pretty clearly isn't trying to be. Dude just loves being a wrestler and that's the #1 biggest reason he was never going to get a really long run at the top in WWE. That and the need to really make as much money as he could before having to retire is probably why he came back too early, which fucked up the build to Wrestlemania 31 and resulted in these new medical concerns. I'd absolutely hold that against him, even if he is one of my top favorites, a very close second behind Brock.
I like Punk. I liked Punk a lot when he was 100% committed and I liked him a lot more before his post-retirement bitchfest.
In what world is the bolded is crossing over? A bunch of nerd stuff and a comedy podcast? That's barely branching out.
The way Vince works, he either ignores the fact that a wrestler is known outside of his bubble at all, or he takes total control of a wrestler getting known outside the bubble and smothers it. Most recent example I can think of was Fandangoing.
It's stuff that isn't wrestling and covers different audiences? I'm also leaving stuff out like that Kimmel appearance and the stuff he's done related to his NHL fandom and the fact he crossed over to UFC in the first place.
"Nerd stuff" is not some super niche little ghetto anymore anyway. Like going on Talking Dead meant being on the post-show for one of the highest rated shows on TV, for example.
Anyway, I'm just comparing Punk to Bryan. I'm not saying he's a high profile celebrity or something, but relatively, as far as WWE guys get while still being active full-time roster members, he had one of the highest profiles outside the business in recent times.
And of course I forget the most obvious thing lol. Not that I was trying to give more than a cursory overview.
Agreed. Kimmel and ESPN, etc. were Punk crossing over into a more mainstream audience.
The Walking Dead is that highly rated on cable TV? I don't understand the world anymore.
American baseball ball isnt dying.
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Deleted member 47027
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We live in a world where Vin Diesel wrote the foreward to a Dungeons and Dragons book.
Which is super fucking dope.
This also doesn't mean that many people stick around for Talking Dead, though
Barrage
Member
Angles can draw. Storylines can draw. By all admissions, Micheals VS Jericho in 2008 (One of the best feuds ever) drew great money at house shows and events and was organically extended. Because people were willing to pay to see Jericho get his comeuppance.
FallingEdge
Member
After Punk dropped his pipebomb promo, Jim Rome went on a rant for a bit saying how much he loved it.
most of Punk's crossover stuff has happened after he left WWE, (same with Brock) so that shouldn't really be compared to any full time, active wrestlers, who just don't have the time for that.
I think only Hogan and Cena really had any crossover fame while being full time (or disappearing for a few months to film something, then returning full time). even The Rock wrestled only for a few months at a time then had sporadic appearances after Scorpion King before he left.
but you're definitely right about Punk's self-promoting and large network. in a few years I bet he'll end up doing the same thing Brock has, and come back to WWE for bigger paycheck and a small fraction of the work schedule.
You're missing someone
I think Cena actually has less crossover fame than Punk. When was the last time Cena did anything that got national buzz?
I was intentionally listing things that happened while he was with WWE for a reason.
Letting dudes get the opportunity to do that more often would probably be a good move for them in general. I can understand the fear of losing a dude to show business though and I understand that those opportunities are not just falling from the sky.
Foot Locker commercial.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Punk vs. Brock had a slightly longer, much more personal story, was promoted as much as Cena vs. Bryan, and featured two guys who were established stars. Bryan was a tag team guy two months prior to Summerslam, and he didn't really get built up much leading into it. He was a fan favorite, but not a guy with broader exposure. I just never quite understood why the guy who was trying to make his mark got all the blame for the show, rather than the two established guys. Heck, why does the blame need to go on any specific person? Why is it so impossible that the show did less because of blind statistical chance?
CM Punk was much bigger.
After his "pipebomb" I saw random CM Punk shirts out in public. I saw CM Punk coverage on ESPN. I saw CM Punk coverage on non-wrestling websites, message boards, and chatrooms. I heard people talking about CM Punk in random Team Fortress 2 matchups and in other games.
I haven't seen that kind of mainstream fire about wrestling or a wrestler since Austin.
DUFFMCWALIN
Member
Don't be dumb Sunny. Baseball is making more money than ever and attendance is up.
Cena took away yet another rub by breaking rusev's streak.
Almost everyone Cena feuds with ends up worse off from it.. He elevates no one.
and I said "most" for a reason. pre-2014, I'd say he was about as crossover as Chris Jericho, who was on talking dead, the nerdist, and did similar things. I wouldn't call Jericho crossover (some might disagree), Punk was at about that level
I agree. part of me feels that just by having having formed WWE studios, they were inherently allowing for the possibility of someone to break out and end up doing films for other studios and leaving WWE, even if no one has really broken out from that yet
it definitely wasn't "national buzz" but being on a cereal box and cereal commercials is pretty crossover. but that was a couple of years ago, today I definitely agree that more non-kids (like teenagers, adults) might know who CM Punk is.
Chris Jericho dreams about having as much mainstream attention as Punk
pre-2014
Jericho was also on Dancing with the Stars a few years ago, and I still don't think that many people know who he is
Chris Jericho dreams about having as much mainstream attention as pre-2014 Punk.
The pipebomb promo put Punk on the mainstream map and put WWE back in the public eye. Then HHH and Kevin Nash got involved and it all got ruined. The reason Punk leaving WWE and going to UFC was treated as such a big deal was because he was viewed as a big star due to the pipebomb promo and his title run after that.
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Deleted member 47027
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Pretty crazy how many opportunities Jericho has had (hosting a game show, DWTS, etc) and has blown them all because people just...pretty much don't like him.
I'll just agree to disagree (not about the HHH and Nash thing)
I think UFC made a big deal out of Punk and signed him because their PPV buy rates have sunk like a stone in recent years. in the time when they had Brock/GSP/prime Silva, Punk would have probably started in Strikeforce.
brutal but true
Sadly, many people do...
It gets more viewers than pretty much most shows on cable and even some networks
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
I've said this for years and WrassleGAF and others vehemently disagreed. He wasn't a good draw.
Jericho has some kind of weird anti-charisma about him
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
He doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve in any way. He's so fake that he's impenetrable and unremarkable. It's a contrast to Punk who has his fans and gets attention because he can form that connection and trust, even if he's just being a whiny shitbaby.
When I think about it, that is true. He's almost like a indie movie star that does alot of stuff but gets no recognition. He definitely stays busy, but never shot to the main spotlight like others before (and after) him.
ShadowsFell
Member
I love Jericho as a performer, but outside of when he's in a character, he comes off as fake, and a sometimes an asshole. Which I suppose, is masked when he's playing a fake character whilst wrestling.
ShadowsFell
Member
Agreed. It was the same bullshit that occurred with Bray Wyatt at Wrestlemania last year.
Then we don't really disagree about what level he was at, since I was thinking of Jericho too. I guess we just disagree with what's in the parenthesis.
Guys accomplishing most of what they can AFTER they leave seems to be pretty typical. Look at Batista. If he never quit, I'm sure he'd go on the rest of his life with his biggest credit probably being that Scorpion King movie, if even that. I bet WM27 would have been better with him there though. :/
I have to agree with what Sunny and Liu Kang said about Jericho also. Really annoying because I used to be a big fan.
Era of the draw is over, WWE brand is more of a draw than the wrestlers, sad but true.
I don't think it has to be this way though. If someone interesting comes along it could usher in a new era. An age of enlightenment so to speak.
Is that Matt Cross on the left? The guy from Tough Enough?
Nobody under the age of 40 watches baseball
I wouldn't be surprised if it's intentionally more about the brand than the stars now. It means top guys can't really hurt them too badly by holding them up or ditching them. Punk was a big loss but the company's kept trucking along just fine.
Just think of how all the top faces are portrayed on TV anymore. They're all shown to be guys who need the company more than it needs them, including Cena.
Just think of how all the top faces are portrayed on TV anymore. They're all shown to be guys who need the company more than it needs them, including Cena.
You could say the same for wrestling
It not about the talent it is more about vince not wanting people to be bigger than the wwe.
John Cena wouldn't exist if that was true
Dat John Cena Merch doe
No. You really can't.
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