I don't expect this game to be anything other than what's in the demo, and what they will show from here on out. I hope that it can nail the feel of an FF title in a unique way (like XII did), and that the story and dialogue isn't a clusterfuck of events/words that hold no value to me (like XIII was).
Stella has been removed from FFXV; Itamuro writing game; Demo 2 June 9; FFXV not @ E3
- Thread starter LiK
- Start date
100% agree but I guess that most people are pissed off because Tabata didn't say this earlier, am I wrong?
Dark_castle
Junior Member
The Stella Gate is kinda understandable at this point, but we, players can't do shit about that. But when you look at the global mess around how the game was (is) handle, even if you truly trust Tabata and co., I don't think it's rightful to make the FF XV demo something cashy... It's like self promoting Type-0, which is an average game.
Well, I will reconsider my talk if the game come on Steam/SquEnix Launcher. I was hyped for VXIII, not anymore for XV. Please understand. (Hope it turn great)
It would be healthy to, also, change how the production of the mainline title is directed. Like a new team/staff for XVI, then for XVII, etc. Every FF are standalone game so it's not awkward to shuffle the ideas a bit. I would love to see young underdog scenarist, new chara designer, etc.
Because I think a lot of the big head are stressed leading big project like that and flirting with the burnout is not cool, and Toriyama is getting on my nerves...
And I would like to see FF XII IZJ on PSV cause I not sure that FFX need to be the new FFIV at this point >.> (I never play FFX and I planning to buy it on Vita btw.) Also, an Ivalice FF is something I want to see again.
Well, I will reconsider my talk if the game come on Steam/SquEnix Launcher. I was hyped for VXIII, not anymore for XV. Please understand. (Hope it turn great)
It would be healthy to, also, change how the production of the mainline title is directed. Like a new team/staff for XVI, then for XVII, etc. Every FF are standalone game so it's not awkward to shuffle the ideas a bit. I would love to see young underdog scenarist, new chara designer, etc.
Because I think a lot of the big head are stressed leading big project like that and flirting with the burnout is not cool, and Toriyama is getting on my nerves...
And I would like to see FF XII IZJ on PSV cause I not sure that FFX need to be the new FFIV at this point >.> (I never play FFX and I planning to buy it on Vita btw.) Also, an Ivalice FF is something I want to see again.
They don't use the SquEnix launcher anymore, they realized it is garbage.
BossDarkseid
Member
I presume Final Fantasy XV IOTI STELLAAAAAAAA! Has already been suggested?
All jokes aside, I'd hope that by that point people are interested in actually discussing the game rather than what could have been. Separate reminiscence or "wtf cindy" topics are fine, obviously.
sensui-tomo
Member
Not gonna happen, people are going to see FF15 and be like "What happened here? I thought I could switch characters. PRODUCT PLACEMENT???, Where's mah female party members" because they didnt keep up with it, did a media blockout, because they saw a trailer YEARS ago and its nothing like what today's build is or because they want to just complain/whine/another word when they've done so in almost every FF thread.. The OT is going to need to be heavily moderated, that much I'd bet anything on.
The Last One
Member
People calling Nomura's work on Versus XIII "empty" is breaking my heart. You can call it concepts, unfinished product, amazing prospect, vaporware or whatever.
But empty? Holy shit. Lightning Returns XIII to Gamestop is empty. Geeeezz...
This is a hugeeee diference... massive even. The screenshots are speaking volumes in every single scene.
Stella is confidence and action in every other scene. Luna is empty and dead inside, no matter how you look at it.
Look at the screenshot.
Anxious in every scene. It's fine. I like variety. But how can you not see the big departure from Stella?
YEP! Luna is dead inside. OMG, she was sitting in there, in that... what was that? a chair? SHE'S DEAD!
TABATA, CANCEL THIS CHARACTER RIGHT NOW!
Is she using the chair as support? Spineless character confirmed!
Jumping on the bandwagon... sorry
I suppose a new 2.0 thread will pop up some time tomorrow.
Dunno who's doing it. I also don't know what's new in the updated demo and how to find it.
YankeeDonB
Member
Real ladies do wall squats when they sit.
BossDarkseid
Member
Oh, I am
I'm just sorta having fun. I'm looking forward to XV and have no interest in crying over what might have been. The prospect of playing a non Toriyama'd mainline FF for the first time in a decade is pretty nice. ok, SP mainline. I love XIV.Whaaa? Since when? It's been a while since a played FF XIV ARR (move recently but no decent internet connection, just enough to thing like neogaf)
sensui-tomo
Member
I dont know if this was ever mentioned in the past of this thread... I just remembered this book. Needs to be edited obviously with someone with better photoshop skills than I.
Thanks; will go there.
You could say we pretty much know everything about Luna.
Likes:
Sitting
Nodding
Breathing (?)
Dislikes:
Standing
Using this information I've deduced the entire plot of FFXV. Please look forward to it.
I wasn't talking about the XIV launcher which is understandable, I was talking about that horrible FFVII/VIII remake/port launcher.
MagnaderAlpha
Member
That's probably how half of the "info" we "know" of FFXV(and Versus) actually came into being. It sure wasn't from Square(if anything from what was hinted, Gamescom might be the first REAL push, as far as REAL info release is concerned).
Again, there is a small part of me that laxes the blame on people and jabs a bit into Square. When you tease something and then leave the majority of the fanbase in the dark, imaginations tend to go wild with speculation, and out of years of hearing the same "theories", some of those "theories" become fact to some people(like the saying, the more you tell yourself something, the more you start to believe it to be true).
It's quite hard to make a big game of this scale with only 12 or less people working on it.
The only reason why it's tangible now is because Square finally put a full team behind the game, and they also wanted Kingdom Hearts 3 to finally be made so they kicked Nomura off XV and put Tabata in place.
Again, Nomura only has 12 people or less working on Versus 13. How is that failing? That's simply not getting attention or the support it needed. It was even stated at one point the team shrunk to just 5-7 people.
Case and point, Final Fantasy 12 took 5 years with a full team as opposed to XV that is taking 8+ years because for the first 6-7 years it only had a dozen people. The game is only now reaching completion because there is finally enough staff behind it, it's in no way because Tabata took lead.
This post is pretty hilarious. Reminds me of someone trying to sell me something.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
He will probably do some for the Ultimania. FFXII's rare Amano art also first showed up in the corresponding Ultimania.
did he? wasn't the game constantly under staffed?
XIII sequels and XIV pretty much ate up the available people.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
Damn you Lightning!
I know why it's in the place that it currently is. The fact still remains that in terms of what is and what isn't. Tabata's team currently is actualizing a product. The variables outside of it don't a matter beyond what is and what is not. They explain it, they don't change it.
So it's nonsensical to complain about the guy working with what he was given based on the environment. It may have been a poltical reason that he's now the director or an optimization of assets reasoning, but it's silly to grieve that he's trying to bring to fore what nomura's team had laid the ground work for. It's a project SE wanted finished.
I'm pretty damn sure Tabata'd prefer working on his sequel to his game that he actually demo'd
Well why didnt they finish Versus and then pump out XIII sequels? did they not make enough money off of XIII or was the reception and XIV bombing force their hand? Their priorties seem so misplaced. Why work on a FF IXV at all when you had an understaffed Versus you announced in 2006 needing to be worked on?
IXV shouldn't have been a concept until Versus was out the door.
VanillaCakeIsBurning
Member
Can't wait for the demo update tomorrow.
It's going to be good.
It's going to be good.
They had a ton of FFXIII assets that were reusable for future games, and there was actually a lot of cut content from FFXIII that could have (and presumably has been) used for FFXIII-2 and LR.
FFXIV is essential and the most important revenue stream for SE. That game can end up as the most profitable FF at some point, surpassing FFXI, their last MMO.
VSXIII was lower on the priority list and was further behind than FFXIII sequels and FFXIV. It was less important to SE.
And honestly, announcing all those games at the same time probably comes down to arrogance and an underestimation of their technical staff and management. One mistake led to another, and this is where we are today.
xxdoshiyarovexx
Member
I am sick of people saying 'Nomura failed, Nomura can't ship a game'
If he failed on FFXV, he would have been fired by now. If he wasn't capable of shipping a game as a director, they wouldn't have moved him to ship KH3.
Stop bitching and saying Nomura can't do anything, and instead observe the facts that he actually ships 3-4 games annually.
Thank you.
If he failed on FFXV, he would have been fired by now. If he wasn't capable of shipping a game as a director, they wouldn't have moved him to ship KH3.
Stop bitching and saying Nomura can't do anything, and instead observe the facts that he actually ships 3-4 games annually.
Thank you.
Gamer @ Heart
Member
What? An MMO is a constant revenue stream. And they royally fucked up 14 and needed to save it. It makes perfect sense why you would divert staff toward that project rather than one director's vanity vaperware.
MMO games are cash cow, I can understand why financially XIV was 'rebooted'.
For XIII, it's just misplaced pride, the game bombed and they cannot handle it. Also it's the mainline FF flagship game...
Whaaa? Ain't Nomura's fault if the Crystal Tool Engine was a failure, if FF XIV was bad and if FF XIII was a huge disappointment. This guy had no team to work.
I had more hype for Versus than I ever did for XIII. What was the general sentiment of XIII before it came out? It seems looking back from my perspective people were more excited about then VersusXIII and I wonder if that played a role in the expectations of XIII. Looking at the Stella reactions, people seemed heavily invested in what little they showed of the game over the years than XIII had I guess.
artsi
Member
But it's been 9 years, something went wrong. Something went wrong right in the beginning when those trailers were released, they never should have been.
If you wish to analyze how he fares as a director you should look at what he has actually directed, being a designer in many projects doesn't really say how effective he is in overseeing the whole development.
So let's observe. Yeah, some executive might look at this data and come to a conclusion which leads to Nomura being transferred to the KH3 project.
Angelcurio
Member
I'm worried about the change in direction of the core story. The original FFVXIII was a going to be a dark FF title, and instead we are getting a roadtrip movie like game. Even though most of the settings and characters are the same, I was more interested about the conflicts of Noctis and Stella Kingdoms, than the adventures of a group of friends that go on a trip.
The original was also going to be a road trip.
diesturbia
Member
The whole roadtrip adventure was always stated since the Versus days.
The war conflict and the road trip were both part of the original title as well as FFXV.
They still haven't shown us a story trailer, so in gameplay only segments is only natural we see more of the roadtrip.
APZonerunner
Member
Nomura is valuable. He was smart enough to negotiate some sort of contract that meant his name appeared even on art renders and the title screens of games as a credit, and he and his art style have become synonymous with Final Fantasy and Square Enix. Don't just take it from me - Yoshinori Kitase himself said as much: "Nomura's [art] direction is perfect. That's the kind of visual concept that Final Fantasy should stay with."
What I'm saying is that no matter how badly he fucked up, Square Enix would - and likely did - all they can do in order to hold on to him. He's a figurehead. An important name. An important style, to them. So they've kept him. It's pretty plain that he walked from FF15 before he was forcibly pushed, though, and it's seeming fairly likely from some of the comments made by Tai Yasue in interviews he did around KH2.5's release that he is in charge of KH3 overall, not Nomura. But Nomura is worth keeping around; he can piddle around and contribute art to a variety of projects, but I think it's pretty likely that most of his actual directorial power has been stripped from him as a response to his failures. They'd never fire him, though. That'd be too much of a loss.
It's not like this sort of sidelining would be new for Square anyway - this is what happened to Sakaguchi post-TSW, with them sapping duties and power from him left and right but keeping him around for a few years as a figurehead. They'd trot him on stage at the occasional show, but for that last stretch at Square Sakaguchi wasn't doing nearly as much, the price of his failure. The difference with Sakaguchi was that he was a maverick and a rebel at least by Japanese standards - it's how he found his success (see also: Kojima), and after a bit of time on the leash in that manner he said 'yknow what, fuck it' and left and did his own thing. Nomura is I believe a bit of a diva - as people so hugely talented often are - but doesn't have that streak either. I think he likes Square (despite his 'burning anger' mentioned in the Famitsu interview after leaving/being kicked from FF15) and likes the comfort.
I think his days of directing alone are over, though. Done. I don't think Versus' long development time was entirely down to him - there were other contributing factors including Crystal Tools being a fucking mess and people from all SE Japan teams - including that team - being parachuted into the failures of FF13 and FF14 development to finish & fix them respectively, but it's clear from the meandering development we saw and the lack of focus in what we saw over the years that there were issues with the vision for the game. The buck for that stops with him, and he paid for it in the end.
The Last Wizard
Member
Which is why the argue meant from people saying at least Tabata is showing the game even more baffling, I mean have you guys not paid attention to the woes of square?
xxdoshiyarovexx
Member
But it's been 9 years, something went wrong. Something went wrong right in the beginning when those trailers were released, they never should have been.
If you wish to analyze how he fares as a director you should look at what he has actually directed, being a designer in many projects doesn't really say how effective he is in overseeing the whole development.
So let's observe. Yeah, some executive might look at this data and come to a conclusion which leads to Nomura being transferred to the KH3 project.
Yeah in game development, when 'something' has gone wrong it can be anything, it can be multiple things:
-Upper management
-The engine doesn't work
-The team(s) is not properly staffed
-There is not enough budget
-Other projects are priorities within the company
OH HEY, doesn't this sound like a lot like Square Enix in the past 9 years :|
My point is: No one knows what happened, there are no facts that say just and only Nomura is the cause of FFXV's apocalypse . So it's not fair to point fingers just yet and blame one person.