Rise of the Tomb Raider coming to PC Early 2016. PS4 Holiday 2016

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Bear Cub in Sky said:
Yeah. If anything, we should be comparing it to FFVII Remake. First on PS4 is pretty vague much like the way Rise of the Tomb Raider has been handled.
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I don't understand why comparisons need to be made for this kind of ridiculous practice to shift blame anyway. Sony did things 20 years ago when they had clout that were pretty anti consumer, and even today with timed DLC and shit like that.

But i'm not someone who is going to be unrealistic about the modern gaming industry obviously things like DLC and junk are going to be apart of these kinds of marketing tactics, the same as MS did all last gen.

But blocking entire games from 2/3rds of the player base just because of behind the counter deals is just wrong, and i don't see how people in the modern industry, not 20 years ago, can try and wave it off.
 
Inuhanyou said:
But blocking entire games from 2/3rds of the player base just because of behind the counter deals is just wrong, and i don't see how people in the modern industry, not 20 years ago, can try and wave it off.
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Basically, yeah.

Even as an Xbox One gamer, this is a deal that doesn't benefit Xbox gamers in any way. We were going to get the game anyway. They didn't pay for us to get a better experience; they paid for everyone else to have a lesser one.

That's not something anybody on any side of the gaming fence should support.
 
Ishan said:
I have no problem with exclusives and I'm even okayish on timed exclusivity . The point I was making is the vast majority of tr fans were ps gamers going back to the ps1 gen that's why the fan base is mainly still there . PC/Saturn were non factors in that gen.
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Do you have something to back up that opinion?
 
Garlador said:
Basically, yeah.

Even as an Xbox One gamer, this is a deal that doesn't benefit Xbox gamers in any way. We were going to get the game anyway. They didn't pay for us to get a better experience; they paid for everyone else to have a lesser one.

That's not something anybody on any side of the gaming fence should support.
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Exactly.

And don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to be unreasonable. I support first party exclusives and third party exclusives alike.

If MS wants to fund Dead Rising 3 exclusively for their platform through financial and technical assistance, i don't have an issue at all, just like i didn't have an issue with Titanfall being full exclusive(until we found out it was not supposed to be before MS and EA stepped in).

But if your taking a game that was already on the way, already in development, fully funded by the publisher, already planned for other platforms, and a competitor is just paying money to keep it away from them for however long or permanently, that's where i draw the line.
 
Inuhanyou said:
Exactly.

And don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to be unreasonable. I support first party exclusives and third party exclusives alike.

If MS wants to fund Dead Rising 3 exclusively for their platform through financial and technical assistance, i don't have an issue at all, just like i didn't have an issue with Titanfall being full exclusive(until we found out it was not supposed to be before MS and EA stepped in).

But if your taking a game that was already on the way, already in development, fully funded by the publisher, already planned for other platforms, and a competitor is just paying money to keep it away from them for however long or permanently, that's where i draw the line.
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Yeah, I sort of agree.

Good = DR3, Bayonetta, Titanfall

Bad = FFVII Remake, RotTR

Somewhere in between = SFV

All that said, I can still deal with money hats. I just buy the console that has the games I want.
 
JayhawkerStL said:
I always thought of it as a PC game. Then Sony bought up the franchise to prevent Dreamcast and Nintendo owners from having access to it.

For me, I played it on the PC, and then really enjoyed Legend and Underworld on the 360. I didn't get to play on TR games on my GameCube and Dreamcast, not because Sony care more about the franchise, but because they wanted to use it increase their bottom line.

Now, considering the fact that this is only a timed exclusive, explain to me how this is worse than what Sony did that somehow convinced you that this is a Sony franchise?
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I played through two Tomb Raider games on my Dreamcast, which is pretty amazing considering how many consoles were sold and how soon it died on the market.

Synth said:
AKA the first time Tomb Raider exclusivity was bought (at the expense of the Saturn).
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Can you find me evidence for this, because as I recall TR2 development was stopped for Sega Saturn (and N64) because it's sales were shit, it was awful to develop for and it just about manage to run the first game. I remember Sony got exclusivity by default, not because they bought it to keep it off the Saturn.

And I was huge Sega fan, so I remember this happening and I was gutted, but the game was never coming out on Sega Saturn, the machine was a mess for 3D.
 
Bear Cub in Sky said:
Yeah. If anything, we should be comparing it to FFVII Remake. First on PS4 is pretty vague much like the way Rise of the Tomb Raider has been handled.
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I believe Nomura has stated in the Famitsu interview that the platforms outside of the PS4 have been undecided. Sony and SE have been vague because... well, they don't know the terms themselves.
 
Garlador said:
Basically, yeah.

Even as an Xbox One gamer, this is a deal that doesn't benefit Xbox gamers in any way. We were going to get the game anyway. They didn't pay for us to get a better experience; they paid for everyone else to have a lesser one.

That's not something anybody on any side of the gaming fence should support.
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Well said.
 
Bear Cub in Sky said:
Yeah, I sort of agree.

Good = DR3, Bayonetta, Titanfall

Bad = FFVII Remake, RotTR

Somewhere in between = SFV

All that said, I can still deal with money hats. I just buy the console that has the games I want.
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We already know the terms of SF5, Sony stepped in and made it happen. Regardless of what one wants to say, Capcom refused at that time to use their own money and Sony gave the backing, which let the project go forward.

What i don't understand is why you include FF7 anywhere apart of this. Nomura has said they dont even know the terms of any contract yet, they just want to boost the sales of PS4's SE user base in Japan and westward, and they'll think about additional platforms later.

There doesn't even need to be a deal with Sony anyway considering the relationship there by default in both the fanbase perspective and the two companies. Nobody is stealing mindshare away from there with lack of a deal.
 
Bear Cub in Sky said:
Yeah, I sort of agree.

Good = DR3, Bayonetta, Titanfall

Bad = FFVII Remake, RotTR

Somewhere in between = SFV

All that said, I can still deal with money hats. I just buy the console that has the games I want.
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The FFVII thing could be a mixture of moneyhats and that the Xbox platform isn't very good for selling games in that genre unless we want to imply all of SE's PS only games came part of the FFVII package.
 
Garlador said:
Basically, yeah.

Even as an Xbox One gamer, this is a deal that doesn't benefit Xbox gamers in any way. We were going to get the game anyway. They didn't pay for us to get a better experience; they paid for everyone else to have a lesser one.

That's not something anybody on any side of the gaming fence should support.
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I agree. You just forgot "and both companies uses this practice", which is the origin of the debate, not people supporting it.
 
shinnn said:
I agree. You just forgot "and both companies uses this practice", which is the origin of the debate, not people supporting it.
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True. I remember being outraged way back when Arkham Asylum came out with Playstation exclusive Joker content. I asked a representative why I was being asked to pay the same price for a version with less content.

Granted, that was just optional content, not a full game.
 
shinnn said:
I agree. You just forgot "and both companies uses this practice", which is the origin of the debate, not people supporting it.
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Of course the contention started from the suggestion that since all 3 companies(Sony, MS and Nintendo) did it at some point, MS doing it now is okay. No it definitely is not okay. And considering the thread is about TR, bringing another entity into it matters very little.

The fact of the matter is, i have to wait for TR for a year, and PC guys have to wait for a few months and there's no real reason for that in terms of actual ability for CD or Nixxes to bring the game to these other platforms considering how they are already fully planned for that to be the case.
 
Inuhanyou said:
Sony did things 20 years ago when they had clout that were pretty anti consumer, and even today with timed DLC and shit like that.
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Sony doesn't usually do timed DLC. Sony usually negotiates extra content like the Joker levels in Batman or the extra missions in LA Noire. When a publisher that has been doing timed exclusive DLC on Xbox Live for years now offers that on PSN, I imagine that said publisher has resisted adding extra content and offered timed DLC instead. Activision is a despicable company.
 
I winder how much Square got paid for this. As i reckon they will lose a lot of PS4 Sales. Uncharted 4 will release in 2016 will any PS4 owners care for Tomb Raider after Uncharted. If Tomb Raider came out for PS4 this fall it would have sold quite a lot with Uncharted 4 delay.
 
KAL2006 said:
I winder how much Square got paid for this. As i reckon they will lose a lot of PS4 Sales. Uncharted 4 will release in 2016 will any PS4 owners care for Tomb Raider after Uncharted. If Tomb Raider came out for PS4 this fall it would have sold quite a lot with Uncharted 4 delay.
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How much does the publisher get from a 60$ game? What are the logistics fees, platform fees and developer cuts?

Edited "publisher" instead of "developer".
 
etta said:
How much does the publisher get from a 60$ game? What are the logistics fees, platform fees and developer cuts?

Edited "publisher" instead of "developer".
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video-game-dollars.jpg
 
KAL2006 said:
I winder how much Square got paid for this. As i reckon they will lose a lot of PS4 Sales. Uncharted 4 will release in 2016 will any PS4 owners care for Tomb Raider after Uncharted. If Tomb Raider came out for PS4 this fall it would have sold quite a lot with Uncharted 4 delay.
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Uncharted will carve an audience that will buy games like Tomb Raider not the other way round, same reason why JRPG's sell significantly more on PlayStation than Xbox, it's not that lack of sales is happening on Xbox because Final Fantasy Type-0 is eating all the JRPG sales.
 
I still haven't finished the first one and unless I absolutely love the rest of the game, then it looks like I won't be playing the new one until a price drop in 2017.
 
Three said:
Well yes we are going in circles but I keep saying that it wasn't just amazon who had the listing and that listing confirmed all other versions including PS4,PC and 360 which we did not know about at the time. You can discredit that and say it's not concrete but I don't see how you believe that anything unofficially is not evidence when the entire point is that we're trying to find out about an unannounced perhaps now cancelled game. I'm also giving viable reasons to its crossgen nature but you simply keep repeating that you don't know why they would allow a 360 version. Splits on Titanfall are irrelevant because this isn't trying to compete with the other as long as the crossgen game is viable and profitable but for some information when Titanfall released on 360 it went to no 1 and had a
71% xbox 360
vs
27% XB1 split.
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The article you posted referenced the Amazon posting. Anything not referencing that and do you have a link confirming that split?
 
Inuhanyou said:
I don't understand why comparisons need to be made for this kind of ridiculous practice to shift blame anyway. Sony did things 20 years ago when they had clout that were pretty anti consumer, and even today with timed DLC and shit like that.

But i'm not someone who is going to be unrealistic about the modern gaming industry obviously things like DLC and junk are going to be apart of these kinds of marketing tactics, the same as MS did all last gen.

But blocking entire games from 2/3rds of the player base just because of behind the counter deals is just wrong, and i don't see how people in the modern industry, not 20 years ago, can try and wave it off.
Click to expand...

It's not blocking 2/3rd of gamers from playing the game. They can purchase an XB1 and play it now or WAIT until it's exclusivity period is over and play it on PC or PS4. It is a delay, not an exclusion.

Secondly, when people say this doesn't benefit XB gamers they are wrong. The timed exclusivity adds appeal to the platform, which will hopefully lead to more sales, more platform support, more exclusives, ect...

This thread comes off as hypocritical bitching to me. You can't complain about this deal while excusing other exclusive deals like the Neir sequel, Star Ocean, or potentially even the FFVII remake. Where are the 40+ pages of criticism for these deals? These deals are truely excluding millions of XB owners from playing these games.
 
NoMoChokeSJ said:
This thread comes off as hypocritical bitching to me. You can't complain about this deal while excusing other exclusive deals like the Neir sequel, Star Ocean, or potentially even the FFVII remake.
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Except those games aren't exclusive because of deals at all. They're exclusive because it makes no sense to port them to the Xbone since there isn't enough of an audience for them to justify a port. As for FFVII, I wouldn't be surprised if Square is waiting for KH3 and Ff15 numbers before they commit to a Xbone port.

Where are the 40+ pages of criticism for these deals? These deals are truely excluding millions of XB owners from playing these games.
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If the general Xbox audience actually cared about the games they would've purchased their predecessors so this kind of thing doesn't happen in the first place.
 
NoMoChokeSJ said:
Secondly, when people say this doesn't benefit XB gamers they are wrong. The timed exclusivity adds appeal to the platform, which will hopefully lead to more sales, more platform support, more exclusives, ect...
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That will only happen if the whole genre ends up being preferred on the system over the competition and one game alone is not going to do that for example...

This thread comes off as hypocritical bitching to me. You can't complain about this deal while excusing other exclusive deals like the Neir sequel, Star Ocean, or potentially even the FFVII remake. Where are the 40+ pages of criticism for these deals? These deals are truely excluding millions of XB owners from playing these games.
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Nier and Star Ocean are not deals, or are we going to say Sony opened their wallet to Persona, Disgaea, Tales of Zestiria, Dragon Quest Heroes, see now this is adding appeal to the platform which leads to more sales which gets more support, more exclusives etc, and it didn't cost Sony a dime per game.
 
NoMoChokeSJ said:
Secondly, when people say this doesn't benefit XB gamers they are wrong. The timed exclusivity adds appeal to the platform, which will hopefully lead to more sales, more platform support, more exclusives, ect...

This thread comes off as hypocritical bitching to me. You can't complain about this deal while excusing other exclusive deals like the Neir sequel, Star Ocean, or potentially even the FFVII remake. Where are the 40+ pages of criticism for these deals? These deals are truely excluding millions of XB owners from playing these games.
Click to expand...

It doesn't benefit Xbox gamers, it benefits Microsoft because they have the game on their console before the others can get. It stagnates sales of the game because it won't be selling on the PS4 which is outselling X1 world wide.

Neir sequel and Star Ocean? I don't recall either of those as having deals attached to them. They are being put on the PS4 because Square is trying to push Japanese-centric titles on the Japanese console.
 
Cthulhu_Steev said:
Can you find me evidence for this, because as I recall TR2 development was stopped for Sega Saturn (and N64) because it's sales were shit, it was awful to develop for and it just about manage to run the first game. I remember Sony got exclusivity by default, not because they bought it to keep it off the Saturn.

And I was huge Sega fan, so I remember this happening and I was gutted, but the game was never coming out on Sega Saturn, the machine was a mess for 3D.
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Was asleep sorry. As per Wikipedia (sourcing Business Wire):
In September 1997, Sony Computer Entertainment America signed a deal with Eidos to make console releases for the Tomb Raider franchise exclusive to the PlayStation, preventing the Sega Saturn or the Nintendo 64 from having any Tomb Raider game released for it until 2000, a deal that would prove very beneficial to Sony both in terms of revenue dollars and also in further cementing the PlayStation's growing reputation as the go-to system for must-have exclusive titles.
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Tomb Raider II may have been cancelled as a result of technical issues, but the deal prevented them creating a later port (like Wipeout 2097 received), or releasing any other Tomb Raider games, for either Saturn or N64. This lasted until 2000 when the Dreamcast saw the release of Tomb Raider IV: The Last Revelation.

Inuhanyou said:
Capcom refused at that time to use their own money and Sony gave the backing, which let the project go forward.
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Again, where does this come from? You were talking about me taking an Ono tweet out of context (despite that having a direct, unambiguous meaning)... yet this all seems to be based on a tweet from Ono saying he didn't have the R&D budget or staff for Street Fighter V, only for Ultra Street Fighter IV. He could tweet that he doesn't have the R&D budget or staff for Street Fighter VI right now, and it'd almost certainly be true. It just means it's not something they're currently creating, not necessarily something that Capcom won't create.
 
NoMoChokeSJ said:
This thread comes off as hypocritical bitching to me. You can't complain about this deal while excusing other exclusive deals like the Neir sequel, Star Ocean, or potentially even the FFVII remake. Where are the 40+ pages of criticism for these deals? These deals are truely excluding millions of XB owners from playing these games.
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Xbox owners don't care about Japanese games. Sorry. I am American, i enjoyed Xbox and 360, but its the American only console. And when that demographic doesn't play Japanese games, it only makes sense to not put those games on the platform.

If anything, you can do two things: blame MS for not prioritizing those titles, or the audience for not creating a big enough stir for those titles. Not the devs or publishers for making common sense business choices.
 
Inuhanyou said:
Xbox owners don't care about Japanese games. Sorry. I am American, i enjoyed Xbox and 360, but its the American only console. And when that demographic doesn't play Japanese games, it only makes sense to not put those games on the platform.

If anything, you can do two things: blame MS for not prioritizing those titles, or the audience for not creating a big enough stir for those titles. Not the devs or publishers for making common sense business choices.
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I mean... the 360 did have quite a niche in Japan. And I certainly like Japanese games. I do agree a big chunk of the market isn't there unfortunately however.
 
Not trying to stir anything else up here, just a question: do we know for sure that Sony hasn't made a deal on FF7 similar to Tomb Raider? I'm asking because I may have missed it, is all. There is a lot of "First on Playstation" stuff, but no clear explanation as to when it's coming to PC/Xbox. My point is this: If we don't know the terms of the deal (and if we do, then disregard this), how is this different than what Microsoft did at the ROTTR announcement just with different language? The fact that Square will only say that they'll talk about other platforms at a later time screams "deal" to me. I know it's not the same thing, again, but IN MY MIND it sounds similar.
 
Snorlocs said:
Man I hate those sweeping generalizations. Can you at least say most? I have an xbox and I would buy Japanese games for it. I'm not the only one either.
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Most Xbox gamers don't care about Japanese games then. I'd think everyone would know its not 100%, but i guess that's not the case.
 
Inuhanyou said:
Most Xbox gamers don't care about Japanese games then. I'd think everyone would know its not 100%, but i guess that's not the case.
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Well next time make sure that you don't paint every single xbox owner with a single brush. That way confusion like this won't happen.
 
Inuhanyou said:
Xbox owners don't care about Japanese games. Sorry. I am American, i enjoyed Xbox and 360, but its the American only console. And when that demographic doesn't play Japanese games, it only makes sense to not put those games on the platform.

If anything, you can do two things: blame MS for not prioritizing those titles, or the audience for not creating a big enough stir for those titles. Not the devs or publishers for making common sense business choices.
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I don't care about Japanese games?
 
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