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Rumor (with a side of salt): Shovel Knight coming to Smash Wii U/3DS?

jacobeid said:
Does the poll not factor into this at all?

Again, I don't really disagree with you other than the fact that you feel like SK should just be straight up disqualified.

Can anyone explain to me why they feel that including SK cheapens Smash for them?
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I think Ryce summed it up perfectly.

Ryce said:
I sort of agree with the whole “roster cheapening” aspect of a potential Shovel Knight inclusion.

I’m open to pretty much any Nintendo character making the cut. Smash Bros. is a Nintendo game celebrating Nintendo’s history, and there are bound to be a few C-listers in a roster of over 50 characters. On the other hand, I think guest characters should be super important industry icons with rich histories who fully deserve to crash Nintendo’s private party. They’re a special occasion. Up until now, each of the five Smash Bros. guest characters have fulfilled this criteria. Shovel Knight doesn’t. He’s way too new and way too obscure. He appeared in one game last year that sold 700,000 copies.

Don’t get me wrong — I’m not calling Shovel Knight a bad game or anything. I just don’t think he should be in Smash Bros.
Click to expand...
 
Shovel Knight would cheapen the roster but the clones in Melee or Smash 4 don't?

He wasn't my first choice by quite a margin, but if he's in SK should be great to fight as nonetheless. Plus he can represent Nintendo's growing 'indie' support, rather than an outright icon like the others. It's really not that horrible history /representation wise if he got in.
 
I wonder how Ubisoft will feel if Shovel Knight gets in over Rayman LOL

superNESjoe said:
The bolded I kind of have an issue with. 700k in one year is better than some Nintendo games do. The game has only been out one year, and 700k is a pretty good number for a small game like that. Shovel Knight isn't really obscure. Something like Wonderful 101 is obscure, but Shovel Knight has sold quite well in that first year and continues to sell well on a monthly basis.

Not that I'm necessarily arguing that he should be in the game or that other points aren't valid, but I wouldn't call Shovel Knight obscure or make light of 700k moved units.
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To be ever so slightly fair, its easier to do 700k when you're out on 5+ platforms instead of 1-2.
 
Ryce said:
Third-party characters should be in the company of Sonic, Pac-Man, Ryu, and Mega Man, not Lucas, Roy, and Shulk.
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I agree with this. That's why I think Bomberman or Simon Belmont are more deserving characters with a combination of long-lasting video game history and Nintendo history.

I'm just trying to add a voice to the opposite side that Shovel Knight isn't as Earth-shatteringly ludicrous as people are making it out to be. Especially if he did really well on the poll.
 
Frofro said:
Xenoblade sold 1.1 Million on the wii
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Is this Chartzzzz because I've never seen this number. The game sold over 200k in Japan and sold "better in the west" despite being a Gamestop exclusive. Even if we optimistically say it sold 400k in the west that's still less then Shovel Knight. Had Shulk not been in Smash I feel like more people would have recognized Shovel Knight as this juncture then would recognize Shulk. Heck we had people adamant Shulk WOULDN'T be in Smash for reasons including one guy who offered to suck everyone off if Shulk was include :P
 
jacobeid said:
Does the poll not factor into this at all?

Again, I don't really disagree with you other than the fact that you feel like SK should just be straight up disqualified.

Can anyone explain to me why they feel that including SK cheapens Smash for them?
Click to expand...

Yes, he should have zero percent chance of getting in because of the factors I just mentioned. It's cool if you like him, I don't dislike him as a character or anything. The game Shovel Knight looks very good with nice graphics and an amazing soundtrack, and I'm sure they could think up a moveset for him if they wanted to.

But he doesn't belong in Smash for the reasons I just mentioned. He is not eligible for being a smash character yet. It's that simple.
 
Zalman said:
I think Ryce summed it up perfectly.
Click to expand...

Fair. Valid.

I disagree, but then again maybe I'm not taking Smash as a holiest-of-holies not to be messed with.

If SK did well in the poll {hell, this is a new way to provide fan feedback that we haven't had before....things are different?) and Sakurai likes his design, game, moveset, etc. I guess it just doesn't matter to me that there's only one Shovel Knight game.

I think that we might just value different things?

Jumpslash said:
Yes, he should have zero percent chance of getting in because of the factors I just mentioned. It's cool if you like him, I don't dislike him as a character or anything. The game Shovel Knight looks very good with nice graphics and an amazing soundtrack, and I'm sure they could think up a moveset for him if they wanted to.

But he doesn't belong in Smash for the reasons I just mentioned. He is not eligible for being a smash character yet. It's that simple.
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Clearly not lol. Again, quite literally what I was asking is what everyone meant by how his possible inclusion cheapened the game, not about why you think the character should be disqualified.

I think the side of salt in the thread title needs to be changed to truckloads of salt. Binders full of salt. (Not directed at you jumpslash, directed at the thread as a whole).
 
superNESjoe said:
The bolded I kind of have an issue with. 700k in one year is better than some Nintendo games do. The game has only been out one year, and 700k is a pretty good number for a small game like that. Shovel Knight isn't really obscure. Something like Wonderful 101 is obscure, but Shovel Knight has sold quite well in that first year and continues to sell well on a monthly basis.

Not that I'm necessarily arguing that he should be in the game or that other points aren't valid, but I wouldn't call Shovel Knight obscure or make light of 700k moved units.
Click to expand...

It's also likely to get two sizable boosts in the near future between the plague of shadows expansion and the physical release
 
Jumpslash said:
Yes, he should have zero percent chance of getting in because of the factors I just mentioned. It's cool if you like him, I don't dislike him as a character or anything. The game Shovel Knight looks very good with nice graphics and an amazing soundtrack, and I'm sure they could think up a moveset for him if they wanted to.

But he doesn't belong in Smash for the reasons I just mentioned. He is not eligible for being a smash character yet. It's that simple.
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I mean I guess we'll find out tonight if Sakurai agrees with you :P
 
It's all but confirmed.
But holy shit when I saw the news I thought gaf would be on fire postin Gif's and shit but seeing so much not really hate but people being against it surprises me.
That being said I feel kinda the same.
While I think Shovel Knight is cool, fits in perfectly and am not really against it I also feel like most here say feel like he didn't do anything more to deserve this spot, and considering there are more than enough Nintendo characters to use I am slightly disappointed.
 
MaverickHunterAsh said:
I wasn't going to post about this initially, but I guess it might be worth it now.

An anonymous source reached out to me on Twitter yesterday saying Shovel Knight is absolutely coming to Smash and that I can "quote them on it." Of course I don't believe anything like that sight unseen, and I let them know as much, but they proceeded to give me very, very specific details about Shovel Knight's supposed moveset and stage - too many details for them all to be lucky guesses.

Who knows if any of it is true, but they also said he's getting revealed at PAX... so at least I don't have to wait long to find out if they're full of it or not. I have reached out to them again in light of the amiibo getting leaked, but haven't heard back yet.

I'll keep you guys updated, for anything this little situation is worth.
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My only question is, did they tell you if it would be revealed at PAX proper or does tonight's Nindies event count?
 
Hey all, I'm setting up our booth at PAX today, so don't necessarily expect to hear from me very much.

That said, I just want to stress that I have absolutely no reason to trust the validity of my source and you don't either. The safest thing to do is assume they're trolling me unless they prove otherwise.

This is not like the SourceGaming thing. There's no "80% chance it's true" here. I have no reason to trust this source; I have no idea who they are. They could be anyone.

I just don't want my part in this to snowball into something it isn't. As far as I'm concerned, the most solid hope for Shovel Knight right now is SourceGaming backing it because their sources are trusted. Mine absolutely is not.

I just really don't want to mislead anyone, either intentionally or unintentionally!
 
The Smash cycle of how the character you don't like ruins things but there are so many rules in place where the characters you do like that are similar don't.
 
Jumpslash said:
Yes, he should have zero percent chance of getting in because of the factors I just mentioned. It's cool if you like him, I don't dislike him as a character or anything. The game Shovel Knight looks very good with nice graphics and an amazing soundtrack, and I'm sure they could think up a moveset for him if they wanted to.

But he doesn't belong in Smash for the reasons I just mentioned. He is not eligible for being a smash character yet. It's that simple.
Click to expand...

It's not that simple because you don't make the rules for Smash character selection. None of us do, all we can do is speculate and discuss it. Just because you said so and he doesn't fit your list of rules doesn't make it definitively so. We all have criteria for how we would select characters, and for some of us that criteria means Pac-Man and Ryu would've never ended up in the game.

But that doesn't effect who belongs in the game. Sakurai and Nintendo determine who belongs in the game.
 
balladofwindfishes said:
I really do wonder if it's sunken into the devs yet just how lucky they are.

This is pretty much the highest honor an indie character could possibly have, to be considered on the same level as Mario, Sonic, Ryu, Pac Man, Bowser, and so on. To be immortalized for generations. To have people fight and argue on the internet about your character returning for Smash 15 and how much they miss when they did 5% on the forward smash instead of 2%. To have your character be a skin or bonus in tons and tons of games as an Amiibo.

If Shovel Knight gets into Smash he'll be immortalized as a Smash character, forever. The same immortality that can keep an old race car driver relevant, or a forgotten Pokemon around, can breath new life into an old NES series, and introduce millions to a quirky, niche RPG series.
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Amazing post, and went from being okay if he's in the game even at the cost of a certain reptile to glad. Also, #teamrealwhatever!
 
MaverickHunterAsh said:
Hey all, I'm setting up our booth at PAX today, so don't necessarily expect to hear from me very much.

That said, I just want to stress that I have absolutely no reason to trust the validity of my source and you don't either. The safest thing to do is assume they're trolling me unless they prove otherwise.

This is not like the SourceGaming thing. There's no "80% chance it's true" here. I have no reason to trust this source; I have no idea who they are. They could be anyone.

I just don't want my part in this to snowball into something it isn't. As far as I'm concerned, the most solid hope for Shovel Knight right now is SourceGaming backing it because their sources are trusted. Mine absolutely is not.

I just really don't want to mislead anyone, either intentionally or unintentionally!
Click to expand...
Just make a 30 minute 'name and shame' video about your source on GameXplain if this turns out fake.
 
Aside from deserving it, it could also be used as a business move. Nintendo is courting indies now more than ever. Probably more actively than any other platform right now. DOing a move like this could be great for indie relations
 
ShockingAlberto said:
The Smash cycle of how the character you don't like ruins things but there are so many rules in place where the characters you do like that are similar don't.
Click to expand...

Indeed, I don't bother setting up arbitrary rules regarding smash bros roster because at the end of the day it's totally at the developer's discretion.
 
superNESjoe said:
It's not that simple because you don't make the rules for Smash character selection. None of us do, all we can do is speculate and discuss it. Just because you said so and he doesn't fit your list of rules doesn't make it definitively so. We all have criteria for how we would select characters, and for some of us that criteria means Pac-Man and Ryu would've never ended up in the game.

But that doesn't effect who belongs in the game. Sakurai and Nintendo determine who belongs in the game.
Click to expand...

ding ding ding ding ding.
 
From Tamaki posted over at the Smashboards

Something to remember: the rumours claim that Shovel Knight being in Smash is something that will be revealed within the next month or two; not necessarily tonight. It looks like the amiibo for Shovel Knight could be revealed tonight, but not necessarily everything at once.

Another thing to add that I have learned today is that they claim it is one of the ballot-voted characters. I don't think I mentioned that in my video.

Again, I am just reporting on these claims. They are not my own. I am just a messenger, please don't shoot me!
Click to expand...
 
Also, want to make it clear that I'm arguing this because I want SHovel Knight in smash, not because I feel this rumor is necessarily true (I'm about 50/50 right now)
 
Code: 
Are they Mario ----YES----▶︎ Keep them in Smash
         |
        NO
         |
         ▼
Keep this worthless
mass of pixels out!
 
BassForever said:
Is this Chartzzzz because I've never seen this number. The game sold over 200k in Japan and sold "better in the west" despite being a Gamestop exclusive. Even if we optimistically say it sold 400k in the west that's still less then Shovel Knight. Had Shulk not been in Smash I feel like more people would have recognized Shovel Knight as this juncture then would recognize Shulk. Heck we had people adamant Shulk WOULDN'T be in Smash for reasons including one guy who offered to suck everyone off if Shulk was include :P
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Will Shahadan ever live that down LOL
 
Ryce said:
I sort of agree with the whole “roster cheapening” aspect of a potential Shovel Knight inclusion.

I’m open to pretty much any Nintendo character making the cut. Smash Bros. is a Nintendo game celebrating Nintendo’s history, and there are bound to be a few C-listers in a roster of over 50 characters. On the other hand, I think guest characters should be super important industry icons with rich histories who fully deserve to crash Nintendo’s private party. They’re a special occasion. Up until now, each of the five Smash Bros. guest characters have fulfilled this criteria. Shovel Knight doesn’t. He’s way too new and way too obscure. He appeared in one game last year that sold 700,000 copies.

Don’t get me wrong — I’m not calling Shovel Knight a bad game or anything. I just don’t think he should be in Smash Bros.
Click to expand...

Nintendo could be using his hypothetical inclussion as an statement, a message to indies "see indies? this could be you if you side with nintendo", which in itself, nintendo embracing indies to this level could be significant enough to cause a ripple on how the industry treats indies.

However i personally believe, if he is in, Sakurai will be all like "I thought he looked cool, the game was nice so i said 'okay, let him in' because i felt it on my left nut that he should be in."
 
I'd be totally cool with him getting in. Never played the game but I've heard great things from fans and I'm sure the move set would be fun to use.

A lot of the disappointment surrounding this rumor reminds me of Rock Band DLC and set list announcements. People would be angry that an artist or song would get in over a more requested artist or song. I think it's fine to be disappointed, but who's to say you won't see that character (or song) released in the future?
 
The Holy Book of Smash Bros. has kept out:

- Lucas (characters without international appeal)
- Ryu (characters that originated in fighting games)
- Villager (characters without move set potential)

Thank God they have been kept out. Can you imagine how Smash Bros. would be with them?!
 
ShockingAlberto said:
The Holy Book of Smash Bros. has kept out:

- Lucas (characters without international appeal)
- Ryu (characters that originated in fighting games)
- Villager (characters without move set potential)

Thank God they have been kept out. Can you imagine how Smash Bros. would be with them?!
Click to expand...

It'd be fucking cheap man. Fucking CHEAP.
 
superNESjoe said:
It's not that simple because you don't make the rules for Smash character selection. None of us do, all we can do is speculate and discuss it. Just because you said so and he doesn't fit your arbitrary list of rules doesn't make it definitively so. We all have criteria for how we would select characters, and for some of us that criteria means Pac-Man and Ryu would've never ended up in the game.

But that doesn't effect who belongs in the game. Sakurai and Nintendo determine who belongs in the game.
Click to expand...

What I meant is he shouldn't be eligible for being a character in Smash. Of course it isn't definitive because I'm not Sakurai or part of his team, I thought so much was obvious.
 
ShockingAlberto said:
The Holy Book of Smash Bros. has kept out:

- Lucas (characters without international appeal)
- Ryu (characters that originated in fighting games)
- Villager (characters without move set potential)

Thank God they have been kept out. Can you imagine how Smash Bros. would be with them?!
Click to expand...
Don't forget Snake because he's M rated and a Sony character.
 
Escalario said:
No they don't. What they've done for Nintendo? Nothing. Outside of releasing their games with much more content on other platforms, that is.
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Without indies the WiiU catalog would look really empty, because they are the only third party making games for this thing. And what's this "much more content on other platform"-talk? Shovel Knight has Nintendo-exclusive features on WiiU and 3DS and will get more according to his Amiibo description.

All this deserving and roster-cheapening talk is so not for me (alongside all these weird rules for characters to get in). Smash is not the holy video game grale and you don't have to play or even buy him. You make a drama like he would ruin the whole game.
Shovel Knight is an amazing game and I think his inclusion in Smash would be an great Kickstarter success story.

But I ultimately don't believe these anonymous sources yet. #TeamFake
 
Shovel Knight is more important to modern gaming than Sonic, Pac-Man, or Mega Man. Frankly, the fact that most of the third parties in Smash are included more for their retro appeal than any sort of modern significance is kinda lame, so having Shovel Knight would lead to a more balanced roster that is indicative of games that matter today.

While I can see the whole "third parties in Smash must be really important to Nintendo!" argument, it was literally broken with the very first third party character to be included being mostly an advertisement to buy a PS3.
 
i've long given up the fight of not having 3rd party characters in it, i don't care anymore as long as we don't get Snake back i'm fine.
 
You guys do know that Snake got in not because he was super special or something about his "history with Nintendo", but because Kojima requested right? Stop putting arbitrary reasons or qualifications!
 
James Scott said:
The whole amiibo thing makes the whole a bit odd. It doesn't sound like a smash one and I don't see him getting 2
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It's possible that it is the Smash amiibo but they don't want to announce that yet. I'm interested to see what the functionality is going to be. Maybe there will be a reason to announce the amiibo ahead of announcing Shovel Knight as a DLC character.
 
Furthermore with Smash Ballot popularity is the primary measure that will determine whether a character will join the roster. All other arguments go out the window when Nintendo has put up a website that basically asks, "which characters do you want in Smash?"
 
Okay, okay, maybe Shovel Knight's inclusion would actually lead me to a third DK rep at last, Cranky Kong as a modified clone!
Bare with me...

Shovel = Cane
Anchor = Banana Bunch
Mobile Gear = Rambi/Phonograph on wheels/Rocking chair
War Horn = Snowmad Horn
Phase Locket= Banana Juice
Alchemy Coin= Banana coin

....No I'm not getting desperate at all.

Back to normality: are we taking sides again? because at this point all I know is you can't predict smash at all and I'd have considered SK to a have a snowballs chance in hell before, therefore my perceptions will be dashed once again.
 
backlot said:
It's possible that it is the Smash amiibo but they don't want to announce that yet. I'm interested to see what the functionality is going to be. Maybe there will be a reason to announce the amiibo ahead of announcing Shovel Knight as a DLC character.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure why people are hung up on what design is on the amiibo box. A third party amiibo will obviously work with all relevant games regardless of what box it comes in.
 
On a level that surely no one at Nintendo is actually concerned with but is still interesting to think about, Shovel Knight kind of represents the Yin to Mighty No. 9's Yang. People who were sorta only kind of known but didn't have a big name attached asked for money to make a retro love letter to Capcom-style NES games even though none of them ever worked at Capcom. The game gets delayed and they're extremely apologetic and communicative and want everyone to understand why. Then the game comes out, it's amazing, there's significant DLC planned for free, and they do well enough to the point where they can publish the game on their own.

It's like the total opposite of MN9.
 
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