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[Xpike]

What was EVA doing during this game

who knows, probably looking for Eli or taking care of David. Maybe helping the real Big Boss create Outer Heaven.

Side Ops

As we all know, completely unfinished product. Kojima probably wanted more variety but time ran out so just put things to extract in the bases and call it a day.

 

[Chariot]

I like how Kaz goes from "u-uhm what are you d-doing, Boss?" to "Oh, that makes sense" once Venom explains the ashes -> diamonds things to him while having his face covered in ashes.

He realizes that this would be kinda hot in his fantasies about Big Boss.

 

[akidnamededdy]

Isn't she supposed to be a lead in the Les Enfants Terribles project? So I guess she is running around with a rolled up newspaper in africa screaming Eli's name, yelling all the things she is doing to his television schedule when he finally comes back.

I thought the project was abandoned some time before the events of this game (or maybe even PW) and the U.S. just dumped Eli off on the British while they made David run laps around the pentagon or some shit.

Actually, why the British? They weren't a member of the Philosophers, why did they end up with this super valuable asset? Shouldn't Eli have gone to the Russians or Chinese?

 

[Davide]

Nah, ponytail is way better.

Yeah agreed.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I need a comic where Naked Snake in Snake Eater kills a guard, an exasperated Skull Face then comes along and moves the body, mops up the blood, and wipes the sweat off his brow. Then Snake comes back through and kills another guard and Skull Face swears eternal revenge.

 

[ThatArcher]

Kaz didn't knew. Only Zero, real BB and Ocelot did.

Okay! And during MGS V BB is rolling around posing as the avatar doing... something?

 

[DannyDanger]

So the next MGS would've been dual protag

Playing as Solid and Liquid growing up as child soldiers

I want it

 

[Jawmuncher]

Ponytail is better but I will agree it doesn't look right with the sneaking suit.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Sometimes I feel like including Africa was just part of the ruse, as we recognize it as a central location in the MG lore and very important to Big Boss creating Outer Heaven and putting everything in motion for the rest of the series. There's also like you say big stuff that happened with Gray Fox and Solidus Snake there in a similar time period. It's almost like Africa was implemented to get our hopes up about this actually connecting with MG1 and being the missing link only to be trolled by the ending and for it not to be all that relevant in the end.

As far as Venom Snake's story goes was Africa really essential for this game? I felt the opposite before release for obvious reasons, but actually experiencing this game's story myself it felt like the main setting was really Soviet occupied Afghanistan and Africa felt tacked on. Bulk of the missions are set in Afghan, the region we could explore was bigger and it's also where Sahelanthropus and XOF's headquarters were located. Final mission of Chapter 1 to get revenge on Skull Face brought us back there too. Quiet's final mission is also set there and she obviously got more attention than other areas of the story did. All you'd really need to do is relocate Code Talker and remove the child soldier subplot (who I thought were very disappointing in that they didn't do much with them, plus they cut Eli's ending anyway) and it would be kind of the same campaign I think just with even less variety in locale.

I mean, I know some people think the "real Outer Heaven" is referring to Zanzibar Land, but in the ending timeline if we're taking it verbatim it states that real Big Boss (not the phantom) created the Outer Heaven fortress in Africa while commanding Foxhound, but only states it's the phantom who perished there in the end. So I assume those events in Africa we were expecting to happen with Gray Fox and Naomi all actually happened behind the scenes where the story of the real Big Boss was occurring around the same time.

If my interpretation is correct and Venom didn't create the fortress from the original game, then I feel like Africa as a location really had little relevance to telling Venom's story and was tacked on to sell the idea that it was a straightforward Big Boss' closing the loop story as everyone expected.

I think they chose Africa because there is plenty left for MGS to do in that part of the world before we move to MG1, as you said Gray Fox, Solidus, resolving the Eli plot, etc. It cuts down on cost.

 

[CassSept]

Konami's youtube channel will be livestreaming from TGS, here is the schedule:

MGSV - 9/16 10:30pm - 11:20pm EST
MGO - 9/17 1:40am - 2:30am EST
MGSV - 9/17 10:30 - 11:20pm EST
MGO - 9/17 11:30pm to 12:10am EST

What. Does. It. Mean????

Well, it's quite likely Konami's last well-reviewed multi-million selling AAA game. What else could they show at TGS.

 

[Chariot]

I thought the project was abandoned some time before the events of this game (or maybe even PW) and the U.S. just dumped Eli off on the British while they made David run laps around the pentagon or some shit.

Okay! And during MGS V BB is rolling around posing as the avatar doing... something?

Yeah, I don't know. Let's just combine these two holes and let EVA and Big Boss as the Medic hook up somewhere for a few years.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

So the next MGS would've been dual protag

Playing as Solid and Liquid growing up as child soldiers

I want it

You play as an entirely silent Solid Snake. Then at the end he says "Maybe I should stop dying my hair again" in a British accent.

That's honestly not that different from this game.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Why wasn't Skull Face eliminated right after the events of Ground Zeroes anyway? Didn't Zero see how crazy and unpredictable the guy was? Seriously?

 

[Dawg]

He realizes that this would be kinda hot in his fantasies about Big Boss.

 

[Prototype]

so I either have to mod my game or start a new file to get Quiet back?

I'm pretty sad about losing her.

 

[akidnamededdy]

So the next MGS would've been dual protag

Playing as Solid and Liquid growing up as child soldiers

I want it

Nah the next one would've been another Big Boss interquel meant to explain how he and Venom had a falling out. It takes place in Antarctica and the last boss is Cold Coldman with Metal Gear Anubis and introduces a third Big Boss double. Also The Fear is alive. No questions are answered.

THE MISSING LINK IN THE SAGA

 

[ponpo]

So the next MGS would've been dual protag

Playing as Solid and Liquid growing up as child soldiers

I want it

Solid isn't a child soldier though.

I like my previous idea where you play as a young adult Eli and the FOXHOUND members are your buddies.

 

[Dick Justice]

so I either have to mod my game or start a new file to get Quiet back?

I'm pretty sad about losing her.

Just a few lines of LUA code to get her back.

 

[Xpike]

I thought the project was abandoned some time before the events of this game (or maybe even PW) and the U.S. just dumped Eli off on the British while they made David run laps around the pentagon or some shit.

Actually, why the British? They weren't a member of the Philosophers, why did they end up with this super valuable asset? Shouldn't Eli have gone to the Russians or Chinese?

Zero was British.

 

[Broken Joystick]

Someone please tell me you don't need the Butterfly codename for 100%
please
please

 

[Chariot]

Why wasn't Skull Face eliminated right after the events of Ground Zeroes anyway? Didn't Zero see how crazy and unpredictable the guy was? Seriously?

My pick was that Skullface was too good at intel, but then I heard in one of the tapes that Zero banished him to africa, which means that he had enough autority for something. I don't know how Cipher wouldn't be able to send a bunch of assassins and airstrikes after Skullface.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Honestly, if Konami is going to make a new Metal Gear (and we know they are), I hope they bring back Fukushima to write it. Whatever amount he asks for is going to be less than Kojima spends on his own.

 

[ponpo]

Someone please tell me you don't need the Butterfly codename for 100%
please
please

Missions, Sideops, Animals, Mission Tasks.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Solid isn't a child soldier though.

I like my previous idea where you play as a young adult Eli and the FOXHOUND members are your buddies.

I'd prefer playing as Decoy Octopus, the master of disguise, infiltrating places with a forever changing identity to "fit in" or imitating a guard like that part with Raikov in MGS3, Mission Impossible style.

A Liquid game would probably be cool though, but I'd like a Solidus game where we really become demons, for real this time... and then become the President.

 

[SJRB]

Why wasn't Skull Face eliminated right after the events of Ground Zeroes anyway? Didn't Zero see how crazy and unpredictable the guy was? Seriously?

Massive error in judgement from Zero. For all his craziness, Skull Face was still a very useful asset and Zero didn't want to put him to pasture just yet, so he sent him away to some shithole in Africa. "Out of sight, out of mind", an ironic mistake considering how obsessed Zero is with information control.

Zero's arrogance was his downfall. It's interesting how it turns out that Zero is all but the antagonist. If any, he's Big Boss' most valuable ally.

 

[Broken Joystick]

Missions, Sideops, Animals, Mission Tasks.

oh thank god
thank you

 

[Ruruja]

Honestly, if Konami is going to make a new Metal Gear (and we know they are)

The Misadventures of Johnny Sasaki. YES.

 

[Not Spaceghost]

As we all know, completely unfinished product. Kojima probably wanted more variety but time ran out so just put things to extract in the bases and call it a day.

Literally the only possible explanation but it's not like the resources werent in the game to make a poonyan mission type deal, or a maybe even a hijack the truck and escape the hotzone type thing.

There was just so little effort with side ops compared to PW.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

My pick was that Skullface was too good at intel, but then I heard in one of the tapes that Zero banished him to africa, which means that he had enough autority for something. I don't know how Cipher wouldn't be able to send a bunch of assassins and airstrikes after Skullface.

That's what i mean, since I heard that tape too. Made me wonder why the hell wouldn't Zero be able to eliminate him by setting him up in a trap. If TPP was anything to go by, he wasn't hard to locate and kill at all. Venom Snake finds him relatively easily.

Honestly, if Konami is going to make a new Metal Gear (and we know they are), I hope they bring back Fukushima to write it. Whatever amount he asks for is going to be less than Kojima spends on his own.

I honestly think Fukushima is gone for good, unfortunately. His last game credit was on "Rain" for PS3 as a "Special Thanks". No idea what the dude is doing nowadays, but I'd play a game penned by him, for sure.

 

[ElFly]

who knows, probably looking for Eli or taking care of David. Maybe helping the real Big Boss create Outer Heaven.

MGS4 suggests David never met Eva at an age where he could form memories.




Volgin is such a random inclusion in this game. I think that they felt bad only including psycho mantis from the future games, and wanted one from the past games, and went hey, how about Volgin, only this time he is made of fire instead of lightning.

His presence in the game does nothing.

 

[aly]

Solid isn't a child soldier though.

I like my previous idea where you play as a young adult Eli and the FOXHOUND members are your buddies.

I would've loved that. I mean we already had baby mantis and whiny liquid hanging out. Let's just bring in the whole group.

 

[Tecl0n]

The only problem with that is that it would have to have happened in the small timeframe between BB waking up and formulating the plan with Ocelot and Venom waking up, which is weird since why wouldn't BB just tell Kaz himself at that point. So with that in mind, I guess it'd make more sense that it happened after the main game.

At that point, it is unlikely he knew. He at least didn't know when they were testing Eli's blood, because why would he even bother?

So. Venom is envisioned as a BB replacement. Kaz was left in the dark as the fiddle he is. Oceleot wipes his own memory of the switcheroo. At some point after the game, the "trigger" happens and Ocelot remembers and fills Kaz in. Kaz doesn't take it well.

This is the timeline?

 

[Edzi]

So. Venom is envisioned as a BB replacement. Kaz was left in the dark as the fiddle he is. Oceleot wipes his own memory of the switcheroo. At some point after the game, the "trigger" happens and Ocelot remembers and fills Kaz in. Kaz doesn't take it well.

This is the timeline?

As far as I can tell, yes.

 

[ThatArcher]

MGS4 suggests David never met Eva at an age where he could form memories.




Volgin is such a random inclusion in this game. I think that they felt bad only including psycho mantis from the future games, and wanted one from the past games, and went hey, how about Volgin, only this time he is made of fire instead of lightning.

His presence in the game does nothing.

Yea that mini fight you have with Volgin left me hungry for more, but then he lets himself be run over.
Also does anyone know why Psycho is called the Third Child? Seems like a play on words suggesting he is a clone but that can't be true

 

[SJRB]

MGS4 suggests David never met Eva at an age where he could form memories.




Volgin is such a random inclusion in this game. I think that they felt bad only including psycho mantis from the future games, and wanted one from the past games, and went hey, how about Volgin, only this time he is made of fire instead of lightning.

His presence in the game does nothing.

Volgin is a plot point added to keep the ruse up. You're supposed to think that Big Boss is hallucinating, or that otherwise something crazy is going on, steering away attention to the fact that you're not actually Big Boss.

Only at the end of the Volgin "quest" it is revealed that Volgin finally realises this very fact and backs off. His quest for revenge rendered moot since he has been chasing the wrong man all this time and without Mantis to keep his body going he finally died.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

MGS4 suggests David never met Eva at an age where he could form memories.




Volgin is such a random inclusion in this game. I think that they felt bad only including psycho mantis from the future games, and wanted one from the past games, and went hey, how about Volgin, only this time he is made of fire instead of lightning.

His presence in the game does nothing.

I feel like Volgin was there to placate people like me who love MGS3 more than the other games. So in the trailers for the final story of Big Boss, they play up what appears to be Big Boss' biggest fear from deep within his psyche made manifest by Psycho Mantis' powers.

Instead it turns out it's actually literally Volgin and after he figures out it's not Big Boss he just dies forever.

 

[Dawg]

Honestly, if Konami is going to make a new Metal Gear (and we know they are), I hope they bring back Fukushima to write it. Whatever amount he asks for is going to be less than Kojima spends on his own.

What's he been doing since 2005 anyway? Hardly find any info on the guy after Metal Gear Solid 3.

 

[akidnamededdy]

Volgin is such a random inclusion in this game. I think that they felt bad only including psycho mantis from the future games, and wanted one from the past games, and went hey, how about Volgin, only this time he is made of fire instead of lightning.

His presence in the game does nothing.

He was supposed to be a villain in MGS Rising, Konami's original vision for the game when it was to take place between MGS2 and 4 and be developed by KojiPro.

I'd bet money that they just wanted to reuse the assets they developed for that project.

 

[MarcoZombieCannon]

And Ocelot's hypnosis eventually stopped working, seeing as how he discussed it with Kaz post-game.

Looking back on it, mission 31 might have been around or after that moment (the hypnosis wearing off). Ocelot sounds so condescending over the radio during the fight.

"Well done... Boss"

 

[Sumio Mondo]

As far as I can tell, yes.

What's weird is that Solid Snake gets trained by both Big Boss and Master Miller during Solid Snake's early days at FOXHOUND, so the fall out between BB and Miller must have been premature? Or did Kojima forget that Miller trained SS and only remembered that Miller tells Snake to set Big Boss on fire at Zanzibar Land during MG2?

What's he been doing since 2005 anyway? Hardly find any info on the guy after Metal Gear Solid 3.

Special Thanks on Rain for PS3, that's it. Really weird how he's just disappeared like that. Then again, so has Shinta Nojiri, who directed the AC!D games and Ghost Babel.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Double post, sorry.

 

[SomedayTheFire]

The more time goes by the more I hate the story in this game hah and I HATED it initially.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Special Thanks on Rain for PS3, that's it. Really weird how he's just disappeared like that. Then again, so has Shinta Nojiri, who directed the AC!D games and Ghost Babel.

From anecdotes, it seems like working with Kojima is no picnic. Maybe they got frustrated and left development but could be lured back now.

 

[ElFly]

Volgin is a plot point added to keep the ruse up. You're supposed to think that Big Boss is hallucinating, or that otherwise something crazy is going on, steering away attention to the fact that you're not actually Big Boss.

Only at the end of the Volgin "quest" it is revealed that Volgin finally realises this very fact and backs off. His quest for revenge rendered moot since he has been chasing the wrong man all this time and without Mantis to keep his body going he finally died.

The ruse is up after you fight him on the lab and blast some water towers over him.

I think that Ocelot also gives credence to the idea that the man on fire was real from the beginning.

The fucked up thing is that nothing means anything, since Kaz and Ocelot are in the initial cutscene where Paz was in, so Phantom BB also hallucinated them there.

They really do very little with the possible mental effects of the explosion on Venom.

 

[Chariot]

That's what i mean, since I heard that tape too. Made me wonder why the hell wouldn't Zero be able to eliminate him by setting him up in a trap. If TPP was anything to go by, he wasn't hard to locate and kill at all. Venom Snake finds him relatively easily.

Yeah, Zero would have an even easier time. Cipher controls information after all and Skullface got to be throuwing around huge amounts of money for Metal Gear, Walker Gear, false nuke information spread, Parasite research and his own private forces with insane equip.

Also does anyone know why Psycho is called the Third Child? Seems like a play on words suggesting he is a clone but that can't be true

No big reason. He was just the third child of the russian experiments.

 

[Soriku]

Reference to the now infamous Skull Face line where he freaks out over Metal Gear/Mantis turning on him.

From the game. Obviously spoilers to mission

Spoiler

30

.

But if you must know.

lol, pretty good

 

[Xpike]

Honestly, if Konami is going to make a new Metal Gear (and we know they are), I hope they bring back Fukushima to write it. Whatever amount he asks for is going to be less than Kojima spends on his own.

I think that wouldn't work either that we'd get a good story, but extremely grounded and with gameplay lacking all the traditional Kojima-isms of the series.
He'd be better off joining Kojima in his next studio.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

^There may have been some argument for all we know. Fukushima was working on MGS4's story at some point.

From anecdotes, it seems like working with Kojima is no picnic. Maybe they got frustrated and left development but could be lured back now.

Fukushima was listed as "Codec writer" for MGS1, MGS2 and MGS3 also, so that might explain why there's so little of it in the later games. He was also listed in the co-writer field of the credits for MGS4, for the first trailer, when it was all going to be set in the Middle East, then after that first trailer, his credit is no longer there and it was revealed there was multiple locations for MGS4, so, it does lead one to think he had at least some influence over the story.

Kojima always got the credit, I'd imagine that ticked him off.

 

[Edzi]

What's weird is that Solid Snake gets trained by both Big Boss and Master Miller during Solid Snake's early days at FOXHOUND, so the fall out between BB and Miller must have been premature? Or did Kojima forget that Miller trained SS and only remembered that Miller tells Snake to set Big Boss on fire at Zanzibar Land during MG2?

It doesn't make a whole lotta sense. Maybe it was actually Venom and Miller who trained SS? I don't like it either way, but that's always a possibility I guess.

 

[Hellwarden]

So...is there ever a reason we don't give Miller some sick robot parts?