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[A-V-B]

skull face holding onto the back of the unmanned rocket lander as it falls into the jungle

skull face hiding behind snake in the swamps with a second crocodile mask

skull face dropping calorie mates all over the storerooms

skull face giving granin a bottle of booze

skull face dangling underneath the bridge whacking a girder with a stick to make sure it collapses with the shagohod when the explosives are shot

skull face holding onto the back of the plane as snake and eva fly away. he falls off into the lake and awkwardly shares a glance with ocelot

didja see the last post of the previous page :3

you could even combine it with the raiden time travel story

 

[WrenchNinja]

Holy fuck, I got to the jeep scene while a couple of my friends were over.

My lungs almost ran out of air entirely when Sins of the Father started in full swing while Skull Face and Big Medic awkwardly gaze at each other.

Like holy fuck, was there really no other place they could have played that song in game?

Shocking alberto mentioned how it would have made sense that the song would be playing during the Liquid battle in mission 51

 

[KorrZ]

Skullface secretly convinces Ocelot that Big Boss is a really cool dude and they should be BFFs.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

didja see the last post of the previous page :3

you could even combine it with the raiden time travel story

yes but in my vision he's actually hiding under the desk in the office and he's looking at ocelot through the window and motioning like "SHHHH DON'T ACT LIKE YOU SEE ME"

 

[KarmaCow]

That is really dumb and completely diminishes MGS3 if so, I just can't believe that.

Why not just have the XOF strike force do the operation at that point if they were actually ahead of him and consisted of several people that somehow came in and out of Russia completely unnoticed by Volgin, the Boss and the Cobra unit, while Naked Snake failed doing so. Makes no sense at all.

The point of the mission was to create the legend of Big Boss.

I mean it's dumb because XOF and Skull Face existing isn't revelatory or add anything interesting to the story but it's not really contradictory either. It's just unneeded bloat to a (relatively) lean story.

 

[Drencrom]

Holy fuck, I got to the jeep scene while a couple of my friends were over.

My lungs almost ran out of air entirely when Sins of the Father started in full swing while Skull Face and Big Medic awkwardly gaze at each other.

Like holy fuck, was there really no other place they could have played that song in game?

It was probably supposed to be the final boss fight theme between Eli in mission 51 or something. The song deserved better than just being shoehorned at the end of some crummy exposition scene.

The point of the mission was to create the legend of Big Boss.

I mean it's dumb because XOF and Skull Face existing isn't revelatory or add anything interesting to the story but it's not really contradictory either.

Oh my god, it just gets worse with each explanation really.

Why not just have Skullforce or the members of the XOF force be the ones that become the legend instead if so?

Fucking hell Big Boss have been retconned to the most jabroniest character in the series, goddamn.

 

[The Xtortionist]

Holy fuck, I got to the jeep scene while a couple of my friends were over.

My lungs almost ran out of air entirely when Sins of the Father started in full swing while Skull Face and Big Medic awkwardly gaze at each other.

Like holy fuck, was there really no other place they could have played that song in game?

There needed to be some breathtaking activity in the background or something when the song comes on. Something...other than empty desert (dark empty desert, in my case, since I played it at night).

 

[aly]

Did I understand it right that mantis was being transported via a civilian commercial airliner?

Yeah that's what I understood. I guess they did'nt think his powers were dangerous enough at the time.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

skull face is the guy who put night vision goggles and a shotgun in the middle of a dark cave

 

[A-V-B]

There needed to be some breathtaking activity in the background or something when the song comes on. Something...other than empty desert (dark empty desert, in my case, since I played it at night).

Could've played it during the climactic Quarantine mission.

 

[mgs2master2]

yes but in my vision he's actually hiding under the desk in the office and he's looking at ocelot through the window and motioning like "SHHHH DON'T ACT LIKE YOU SEE ME"

I am visualizing this actually happening, and I am laughing pretty hard.

 

[Berserker976]

skull face holding onto the back of the unmanned rocket lander as it falls into the jungle

skull face hiding behind snake in the swamps with a second crocodile mask

skull face dropping calorie mates all over the storerooms

skull face giving granin a bottle of booze

skull face dangling underneath the bridge whacking a girder with a stick to make sure it collapses with the shagohod when the explosives are shot

skull face holding onto the back of the plane as snake and eva fly away. he falls off into the lake and awkwardly shares a glance with ocelot

Yes but where was he when Volgin decided to fire that nuke? Pretty sloppy work if you ask me.

 

[KorrZ]

The point of the mission was to create the legend of Big Boss.

I mean it's dumb because XOF and Skull Face existing isn't revelatory or add anything interesting to the story but it's not really contradictory either. It's just unneeded bloat to a (relatively) lean story.

That wasn't a part of Snake Eater at all. He wasn't even Big Boss at that point.

All of that was a result of the aftermath of the Boss' death. Zero & Big Boss both did everything after the fact in pursuit of their version of the Boss' will. It wasn't the intention all a long.

 

[JayEH]

The point of the mission was to create the legend of Big Boss.

I mean it's dumb because XOF and Skull Face existing isn't revelatory or add anything interesting to the story but it's not really contradictory either. It's just unneeded bloat to a (relatively) lean story.

The point of snake Eater was to get the philosopher's legacy. It had nothing to do with creating a legend.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

how did skull face get there and get out.

big boss had these fancy halo jump and supersonic rocket things and everyone else like the boss and eva and ocelot used their charismatic spy skills to infiltrate volgin's organization. skull face is a man whose face is a skull and i don't think he could have done that second thing.


did skull face just like walk into the jungle a week before the virtuous mission, then waited there after the nuke went off until operation snake eater, and then just walk out again

 

[SuperStiltzkin]

skull face is the guy who put night vision goggles and a shotgun in the middle of a dark cave

Skull Face wrote the cell door frequency on the back of Johnny's family photo.

Also if you look closely, you can see him standing next a cab at the end of MGS2.

 

[Neiteio]

I know what you mean. Like Ada in Separate Ways in RE4. Except there's no reason not to kill every living person in Snake's path and just say "well there's no patrols here cause of crocodiles and poisonous spiders." And wouldn't the 3 other russians wonder where there friends are? Wouldn't by the time Snake entered an area it would be during a caution state because clearly some nefarious shit has gone down that has rendered 3 of their men missing? Any point that Skull face could have helped, he didn't. He let EVA help first, which is fine. But when you start waiting to the last minute that even a goddamn ghost is helping Snake before you do, then you have to start reevaluating your methods.

I was giving an example. It could've been something far more subtle than literally killing guards. Maybe he was able to meddle with patrol assignments -- who would be where, when, and in what numbers. I mean, the sky is the limit for how a second unseen agent could make things easier for the other agent. Snake was the muscle, the rubber that hits the road, but Skull Face worked in subtle ways to stack the odds in Snake's favor. Snake, and thus the player, is none the wiser because Skull Face did his job well.

 

[Reebot]

how did skull face get there and get out.

big boss had these fancy halo jump and supersonic rocket things and everyone else like the boss and eva and ocelot used their charismatic spy skills to infiltrate volgin's organization. skull face is a man whose face is a skull and i don't think he could have done that second thing.


did skull face just like walk into the jungle a week before the virtuous mission, then waited there after the nuke went off until operation snake eater, and then just walk out again

He hopped on the same plane Ocelot took to get home in time for Big Boss's handshake.

 

[Reebot]

I was giving an example. It could've been something far more subtle than literally killing guards. Maybe he was able to meddle with patrol assignments -- who would be where, when, and in what numbers. I mean, the sky is the limit for how a second unseen agent could make things easier for the other agent. Snake was the muscle, the rubber that hits the road, but Skull Face worked in subtle ways to stack the odds in Snake's favor. Snake, and thus the player, is none the wiser because Skull Face did his job well.

Yes, the sky is the limit when we wildly invent plot points to make some desperate connection with a character.

 

[Ishida]

I was giving an example. It could've been something far more subtle than literally killing guards. Maybe he was able to meddle with patrol assignments -- who would be where, when, and in what numbers. I mean, the sky is the limit for how a second unseen agent could make things easier for the other agent. Snake was the muscle, the rubber that hits the road, but Skull Face worked in subtle ways to stack the odds in Snake's favor. Snake, and thus the player, is none the wiser because Skull Face did his job well.

What a terrible way to cheapen Snake's character, missions and story.

 

[Anung]

Yes, the sky is the limit when we wildly invent plot points to make some desperate connection with a character.

But THAT medic was our best man...>_>


<_<

 

[Neiteio]

What a terrible way to cheapen Snake's character, missions and story.

Maybe, but I never saw "Snake as god" to be some untouchable concept. I think the series has been demystifying the accomplishments of its heroes for a while, showing that they're team efforts with a pinch of luck and amplified by those who retell the legend to others. Like I said, Snake's hard work and determination is still the lynchpin that holds it together, Skull Face or no. It's just not the entire story.

 

[Reebot]

But THAT medic was our best man...>_>


<_<

"Boss, that guy can match your super human reflexes and best even you in CQC."

"Make him a medic."

Bravo Mr. Big Boss

 

[Griss]

'Listening to every conversation' has Assassin's Creed 'tailing missions' absolutely whooped in the 'shittest open world following person around objectives' category.

This shit is driving me crazy. 10 attempts now, on Linga Franca.

 

[Drencrom]

What a terrible way to cheapen Snake's character, missions and story.

At this point I'm kinda glad MGSV wasn't set in the creation of Outer Heaven/Zanzibarland with the real Big Boss. Kojima would've probably retconned some bullshit that would've made him and Solid Snake look even worse somehow, maybe that the patriots are actually the good guys and that Ocelot was in fact evil and wanted Snake to take down the patriots for him. Quadruple-crossing us.

Yes, the sky is the limit when we wildly invent plot points to make some desperate connection with a character.

But THAT medic was our best man...>_>


<_<

lmao

 

[Opto]

 

[bluethree]

skull face is the guy who put night vision goggles and a shotgun in the middle of a dark cave

also responsible for all the calorie mates and ramen packs on a soviet base

 

[sappyday]

But THAT medic was our best man...>_>


<_<

Sounds exactly like me too

 

[KOMANI]

Skull face with that 100% camo index

 

[A-V-B]

Guys, I just found some other secret photos from very reliable sources

Skullface was definitely involved in Operation Snake Eater

gimme tonight to scan the photos, they're a bit old

 

[KarmaCow]

That wasn't a part of Snake Eater at all. He wasn't even Big Boss at that point.

All of that was a result of the aftermath of the Boss' death. Zero & Big Boss both did everything after the fact in pursuit of their version of the Boss' will. It wasn't the intention all a long.

The point of snake Eater was to get the philosopher's legacy. It had nothing to do with creating a legend.

Well the Boss was in on the plan to have become the scapegoat in Operation Snake Eater. Snake had Ocelot (and EVA) working behind the scenes to covertly help him along from the inside. The whole ending is that Snake is fed up because he realises he was just a tool all along and the Boss was used as a pawn despite everything she did for her country. It's been driven into the ground by the subsequent games but that idea was always there. It's the explanation for Big Boss creating a world for soldiers in Outer Haven.

And that was fine! It made sense within the story itself, it didn't need to be extrapolated and stretched thin by everything that followed. But here we are under miles of unneeded additions to the backstory.

'Listening to every conversation' has Assassin's Creed 'tailing missions' absolutely whooped in the 'shittest open world following person around objectives' category.

This shit is driving me crazy. 10 attempts now, on Linga Franca.

If you're having trouble with the last part with the Viscount himself, back up. Prisoners will flop to the ground even if they can't see you. He'll get stuck in the doorway, before the dialogue triggers if you're watching him walk in from the window. It's dumb.

 

[Griss]

Maybe, but I never saw "Snake as god" to be some untouchable concept. I think the series has been demystifying the accomplishments of its heroes for a while, showing that they're team efforts with a pinch of luck and amplified by those who retell the legend to others. Like I said, Snake's hard work and determination is still the lynchpin that holds it together, Skull Face or no. It's just not the entire story.

That might be subtle, clever storytelling in another game or piece of media. But in a series where the heroes have single-handedly done huge amounts ridiculously heroic stuff, like Big Boss fighting off the supernatural Cobra squad on his own using on-site-procurement, all while healing ridiculous injuries, being tortured, losing his eye, defeating the Shagohod - a mission which ended up preventing nuclear war... In that case the point falls flat because we've SEEN what caused the legend, and it's appropriately batshit crazy. The second point is that the series isn't subtle enough to pull off a point like this. It's about heroes doing big crazy things, legendary things. To come back and say 'actually they're not really legends, it's mostly myth' is bullshit, because we KNOW it's not right, and it's totally out of character with the tone of the series.

 

[Ishida]

At this point I'm kinda glad MGSV wasn't set in the creation of Outer Heaven/Zanzibarland with the real Big Boss. Kojima would've probably retconned some bullshit that would've made him and Solid Snake look even worse somehow, maybe that the patriots are actually the good guys and that Ocelot was in fact evil and wanted Snake to take down the patriots for him. Quadruple-crossing us.

And this is exactly why I abandoned the group of people who want a game about The Boss in WW2, or a game about Ocelot, or a game about Liquid. I just want this series to die as intact as possible.

 

[Neiteio]

"Boss, that guy can match your super human reflexes and best even you in CQC."

"Make him a medic."

Bravo Mr. Big Boss

To be fair, soldiers can have specialties.

The idea is that the medic was Big Boss' best all-around soldier &#8212; adept at CQC, marksmanship, stealth, infiltration/exfiltration, scouting, tracking, etc. He probably had proved himself as a leader in some smaller capacity, testing his tactician chops, as well.

But he was called "The Medic" because he specialized in field surgery.

Hell of a résumé!

 

[RevolverRoden]

I feel violated.
I've been playing as a fraud all this time, Pythonselkan was right, and this action figure I have posing on my bookshelf isn't actually Big Boss. Wow

 

[SuperStiltzkin]

"Boss, that guy can match your super human reflexes and best even you in CQC."

"Make him a medic."

Bravo Mr. Big Boss

He was an S+ in everything but an S++ at medicine.

 

[BeautifulMemory]

Skull face is bb's reflecx mode

 

[Drencrom]

To be fair, soldiers can have specialties.

The idea is that the medic was Big Boss' best all-around soldier — adept at CQC, marksmanship, stealth, infiltration/exfiltration, scouting, tracking, etc. He probably had proved himself as a leader in some smaller capacity, testing his tactician chops, as well.

But he was called "The Medic" because he specialized in field surgery.

Hell of a résumé!

Why are you still desperately trying to make sense of this?

 

[KOMANI]

And this is exactly why I abandoned the group of people who want a game about The Boss in WW2, or a game about Ocelot, or a game about Liquid. I just want this series to die as intact as possible.

I agree with this man.
It's hitting me like a ton of bricks how stupid this story is.

 

[Griss]

And this is exactly why I abandoned the group of people who want a game about The Boss in WW2, or a game about Ocelot, or a game about Liquid. I just want this series to die as intact as possible.

It genuinely feels like it's too late for that. MGS4 stood as a good cap to the series, despite all of its flaws.

Peace Walker and MGSV did proper harm to the series, imo. They should have quit while they were ahead, but didn't.

If you're having trouble with the last part with the Viscount himself, back up. Prisoners will flop to the ground even if they can't see you. He'll get stuck in the doorway, before the dialogue triggers if you're watching him walk in from the window. It's dumb.

Holy SHIT thank you.

 

[Griss]

Double post, sorry.

 

[Reebot]

Lol, perfect.

To be fair, soldiers can have specialties.

The idea is that the medic was Big Boss' best all-around soldier — adept at CQC, marksmanship, stealth, infiltration/exfiltration, scouting, tracking, etc. He probably had proved himself as a leader in some smaller capacity, testing his tactician chops, as well.

But he was called "The Medic" because he specialized in field surgery.

Hell of a résumé!

Why stop there? Lets also assume

Spoiler

make up

that the Medic was number 3 in the organization. All the soldiers knew him and were like "man that medic is super awesome and has the exact same voice as the boss!" No one knew his name though, or ever mentioned him during the Peace Walker incident out of respect for Big Boss.

"Only you can stop Peace Walker Boss! Well you and that incredible medic, but you happen to be there so I guess only you!"

 

[Neiteio]

Why are you still desperately trying to make sense of this?

I'm not "making sense" of it. It already makes sense, and it's not a hard concept to grasp. Do you know how military specialties work? What's implausible about the one soldier who accompanies BB on Ground Zeroes being among his best? Why insist on thinking the man is just a doctor?

 

[SuperStiltzkin]

'Listening to every conversation' has Assassin's Creed 'tailing missions' absolutely whooped in the 'shittest open world following person around objectives' category.

This shit is driving me crazy. 10 attempts now, on Linga Franca.

Just skip those tasks till you get the rechargeable stealth camo. Don't bring DD. He fucks up conversations. I did War Economy trying to get all conversations. Hid in the truck. Dudes kept getting out of the truck cause DD wouldn't get out the way. Eventually they just went on caution mode cause of a dog and hid in the airport never talking again.

 

[Shadow_Lord]

Skullface was the one who hit Volgin with that thunderbolt.

 

[Reebot]

I'm not "making sense" of it. It already makes sense, and it's not a hard concept to grasp. Do you know how military specialties work? What's implausible about the one soldier who accompanies BB on Ground Zeroes being among his best? Why insist on thinking the man is just a doctor?

Morpho also happened to be second best at CQC.

It just never came up much in conversation.

 

[Drencrom]

I'm not "making sense" of it. It already makes sense, and it's not a hard concept to grasp. Do you know how military specialties work? What's implausible about the one soldier who accompanies BB on Ground Zeroes being among his best? Why insist on thinking the man is just a doctor?

The fact that he just called him "medic" in GZ suggested that.

What I'm trying to say is that it's blatantly obvious this whole "that medic was our best guy" thing is contrived and just made up to make the whole Big Boss phantom thing more "believable".

 

[Neiteio]

Why stop there? Lets also assume

Spoiler

make up

that the Medic was number 3 in the organization. All the soldiers knew him and were like "man that medic is super awesome and has the exact same voice as the boss!" No one knew his name though, or ever mentioned him during the Peace Walker incident out of respect for Big Boss.

"Only you can stop Peace Walker Boss! Well you and that incredible medic, but you happen to be there so I guess only you!"

I'm sure just like every MGS installment, if there was an MGS6 Kojima would retcon the medic into the backstory. This is nothing new. There were characters and concepts in MGS3 that weren't mentioned in MGS1, etc.

Although you also have the "meta" element here, in which case Kojima might be inclined to leave the medic a blank slate regardless, just because he's supposed to be a fourth-wall-breaking connection to the player.

So who knows!

 

[SuperStiltzkin]

I'm not "making sense" of it. It already makes sense, and it's not a hard concept to grasp. Do you know how military specialties work? What's implausible about the one soldier who accompanies BB on Ground Zeroes being among his best? Why insist on thinking the man is just a doctor?

No that does make sense, but it's an unnecessary addition and hiding his presence makes no sense. Why would Zero hide Skull Face's presence but openly tell him to make contact with Adam to help him through the mission? Solo infiltration is obviously not the lynch pin to the mission's success and withholding intel among your team only brings more harm than good.

 

[KyanMehwulfe]

well Venom's Combat and Medic ranks are the same so I guess MB just auto-sorted him to the latter ;p