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SPOILER: Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread | Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO

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... it's like using the chicken hat... so easy.

The sad part is that the first time I played through a certain mission
The Metallic Archea one where you have to kill the SKULLS at the airport
, I had so much trouble killing them that I tried the Chicken hat because I thought it made you invincible.

Much to my surprise when I got completely wrecked anyhow. Eventually was able to get through by just running away and getting on the roof and continually calling in refills to my Rockets and Grenade Launchers. Horrible mission. It finally forced me to give up on tranquilzing everything and just blow up some shit. Even ended up with an A rank after restarting to change my loadout (no chicken hat that time!).

The hat is hilarious looking though. I recommend everyone try it at least once just to see the hilarious modeling.
 
The sad part is that the first time I played through a certain mission
The Metallic Archea one where you have to kill the SKULLS at the airport
, I had so much trouble killing them that I tried the Chicken hat because I thought it made you invincible.

Much to my surprise when I got completely wrecked anyhow. Eventually was able to get through by just running away and getting on the roof and continually calling in refills to my Rockets and Grenade Launchers. Horrible mission. It finally forced me to give up on tranquilzing everything and just blow up some shit. Even ended up with an A rank after restarting to change my loadout (no chicken hat that time!).

The hat is hilarious looking though. I recommend everyone try it at least once just to see the hilarious modeling.

D-Walker owns them hard with its Gatling gun.

Quiet also does an excellent job at kicking their asses, there is a vid on youtube where a guy hides somewhere while she does all the work. Gets an S rank lol.
 
seriously, D-Walker gatling gun has so much ammo it;s ridiculous that they let you use it in the game. i was using it against the Metal Gear boss and it was great.
 
D-Walker owns them hard with its Gatling gun.

My D-Walker was poverty status (I had never used it at that stage). So I didn't want to drop in an use a new buddy. I should have done that though because the way I ended up winning was silly. I wouldn't have expected the base gatling gun to be good against them though. Good to know!
 
I've noticed a lot of complaints of MGSV and Kojima failing to paint Big Boss as the villian we find in metal gear 1 & 2. Correct me if I'm wrong but hhasn't hasn't Big Boss always been painted as a villain of a flawed ideology and not one of evil? Big Boss had an ideology and the goal of making a nation for soldiers and planned to make everlasting war to provide work for these soldiers who were cast away. You must remember that when metal gear released we weren't far removed from unpopular wars such as the Vietnam war where soldiers were treated with discontempt when they arrived home. It is all about context, and perspective. I don't recall many calling Rambo the villian in First Blood, a movie that heavily inspired Kojima when creating Metal Gear. What exactly is so different about the big boss in metal gear and the one we've gotten in peace walker and V?
 
Just watched Quiet's rain scene. I missed a bunch of Quiet scenes in the game.

What in the fuck. Quiet absorbs water through her skin, and then Big Boss comes and drops the water that was stuck in his boots.

Real smooth, Big Boss. Surely your feet water will win her over.

He was actually emptying her boots out for her, and handing them to her.

The Quiet hate is delicious.

I don't hate Quiet, but I hate how they treat her in the game. She has potential to be a seriously cool character, if it wasn't for every chance the game gets shoving her breasts and ass in your face.
 
I've noticed a lot of complaints of MGSV and Kojima failing to paint Big Boss as the villian we find in metal gear 1 & 2. Correct me if I'm wrong but hhasn't hasn't Big Boss always been painted as a villain of a flawed ideology and not one of evil? Big Boss had an ideology and the goal of making a nation for soldiers and planned to make everlasting war to provide work for these soldiers who were cast away. You must remember that when metal gear released we weren't far removed from unpopular wars such as the Vietnam war where soldiers were treated with discontempt when they arrived home. It is all about context, and perspective. I don't recall many calling Rambo the villian in First Blood, a movie that heavily inspired Kojima when creating Metal Gear. What exactly is so different about the big boss in metal gear and the one we've gotten in peace walker and V?

hqdefault.jpg
 

If you are trying to make a country of soldiers, you are gonna need children to take over the next generations. It's harsh, but a children soldier is going to become a seasoned warrior. Even Eli understood that in MGSV and that's where The Kingdom of Flies comes from.

BB still recovered and protected the soldier children from all the world and gave them shelter.
 
What exactly is so different about the big boss in metal gear and the one we've gotten in peace walker and V?

The one we got:
A) Saves childrens
B) Eradicates a possible plague
C) Rids the world of nukes
D) "Saves" animals from war zones
E) Does mercenary shit
F) "Hires" shady fucks so they can do mercenary shit too.
H) All of the above

The one we don't get:
A) Rides into the sunset
B) Cripples one of your buddies
C) Uses his "best guy" as bait.

There's probably a lot more in both sides of the coin I am missing.
 
If you are trying to make a country of soldiers, you are gonna need children to take over the next generations. It's harsh, but a children soldier is going to become a seasoned warrior. Even Eli understood that in MGSV and that's where The Kingdom of Flies comes from.

BB still recovered and protected the soldier children from all the world and gave them shelter.
Michael Jackson did the same thing. Gave those kids shelter.
 
If you are trying to make a country of soldiers, you are gonna need children to take over the next generations. It's harsh, but a children soldier is going to become a seasoned warrior. Even Eli understood that in MGSV and that's where The Kingdom of Flies comes from.

BB still recovered and protected the soldier children from all the world and gave them shelter.

Still pretty fucking evil to take war orphans and turn them into soldiers, regardless of how "necessary" it is.
 
The one we don't get:
A) Rides into the sunset
B) Cripples one of your buddies
C) Uses his "best guy" as jail bait.

There's probably a lot more in both sides of the coin I am missing.

What is B referring to?

Metal Gear Solid V Spoiler Thread: In Defense of Child Soldiers

Obviously the whole idea is pretty fuckin heinous, but I can see how BB could build a mentality that he feels justifies it without feeling like a morally bankrupt person.
 
If you are trying to make a country of soldiers, you are gonna need children to take over the next generations. It's harsh, but a children soldier is going to become a seasoned warrior. Even Eli understood that in MGSV and that's where The Kingdom of Flies comes from.

BB still recovered and protected the soldier children from all the world and gave them shelter.

Big Boss started and fueled the wars that made those kids orphans. He took them with the only intention to train them and send them to fight the next war that in turn would create more orphans.

Big Boss was always depicted as a dude that only knew war and the battlefield, and thus wanted a world sunken in chaos and constant conflict. A world where "soldiers would always have a place".

I don't know about you, but that seems like the delusions of a madman to me.
 
The best thing about MGSV is its weather. Gameplay is a close second.
The sandstorms are fantastically relaxing.

Kojima is a pro at weather and especially weather sound effects. MGS games probably have the best wind echo in all of gaming. It's a trademark at this point.
 
You just got served the Dick Justice, son.
I'm not sure how this refutes my post, exactly. Is the thinking big boss shows here wrong? But its not 'kill all kids, I'm evil!'. It was Kaz who refused to train the child soldiers in MGSV and while I'd grant you that big boss' phantom would be a hard sell on the the child soldier front this is the real big boss. We already see big boss using the medic as an asset without recourse for the effect it will have on him. We already see big boss falling down this rabbit hole. Furthermore, mgs4 already further showed big boss to not be evil in its ending. More like misguided and wrong.
 
I'm not sure how this refutes my post, exactly. Is the thinking big boss shows here wrong? But its not 'kill all kids, I'm evil!'. It was Kaz who refused to train the child soldiers in MGSV and while I'd grant you that big boss' phantom would be a hard sell on the the child soldier front this is the real big boss. We already see big boss using the medic as an asset without recourse for the effect it will have on him. We already see big boss falling down this rabbit hole. Furthermore, mgs4 already further showed big boss to not be evil in its ending. More like misguided and wrong.
I wasn't being serious.
 
Ok, finished this last night (at least I assume I have, there might be some crazy shit I haven't seen yet even though I'm 98% complete with a few side ops left).

I just gotta work through some thoughts here.

If there's something that I've missed the explanation to, either in cassettes or otherwise, let me know. But some of this stuff I feel just wasn't explained or cut due to time.

Also I realize I'm probably thinking waaaaay too hard and too critically about all of this, and most of it probably has no answers, because Kojima and Metal Gear and all that, yeah I know. But I still have the questions and if someone even has theories or conjecture or whatever I'd like to hear it.

1) What the fuck was Skullface's deal?

He said, in his own words, he basically had an urge for revenge against Zero and Big Boss that was like a volcano that had hardened into granite.

Why?

As far as I can tell neither did anything to him to warrant this sort of resentment. If his motive was like, power or control or something I'd get it. Big Boss and Zero are two major influential power players carrying out the Boss' legacy, so if that was his key motivation (and he gets into that a little when he's taunting Zero) that would make more sense.

But why did he want revenge? Near as I can tell, it's the Soviets who fucked up his life, took his language, his face, his lungs etc. Shouldn't it be them who he is fucking with? Shouldn't he be trying to destroy the USSR? Instead he's collaborating with them to get at Zero and Big Boss.

Again, why? All they ever did was give him a job, train him up, and make him ride bitch on Operation Snake Eater. And while he mightn't have liked that last one, was it really justification for wiping the English language from the planet. Shouldn't be have been trying to eliminate Russian?!

2) Seriously, what was up with Skullface's plan?

It wasn't in self defence from a linguistic point of view; Zero had already given up on the vocal parasites and had clearly chosen to head down the Foxdie path as shown by the last conversation he had with Skullface.

What was he trying to do? Why did he trust Psycho Mantis to control Sahelanthropus for him when in the very first mission the kid was clearly fucking his shit up with Volgin and Space Whales? Did he have no contingency that this ineffable, mysterious child who had attacked his forces in the past might not play ball with him forever? Or is it my lust for explanation here?

3) So I guess Huey is tied with Gaius Baltar for the biggest piece of shit who attempts to rationalise things to himself in the universe award.

I kind of don't understand why he did half the things he did. Did he kill Strangelove or just not hear her? Why did he fuck with the quarantine protocols that let the parasite mutate? What was going on there.

And what the hell was the point of Battle Walker? It was this thing that got waaay more prominence than it deserved (ie, fully animated and voice acted cut scenes) but then was only ever used as a Battle Deployment thing. Was this just something left on the cutting room floor?

4) What was up with the third English strain?

The end of the game seems to indicate that it was in Quiet. Ok. But I could have sworn I saw Psycho Mantis giving it to Eli.

Does that mean Quiet was one of the first two strains, and that Eli was the third and Code Talker and Ocelot got it wrong? But Snake said he tossed two vials into the fire in cassette tapes. Was he mistaken or am I misremembering the scene where I thought I saw Psycho Mantis giving Eli the vial? What the hell was going on here; is the third strain still in play?

5) Why oh why did Code Talker keep silent about Quiet's vocal parasites after he had his conversation with her in Navajo?

Wasn't he like, really fucking set on tracking down and eliminating that third strain to end Skull Face's legacy and prevent his creation being used for genocide? But when Quiet tells him that she's got em, he does nothing, not even under the radar?

I mean, why wouldn't he go to Venom or Ocelot or anybody? Why wouldn't he secretly try to give her Wolbachia or something? Instead he just does nothing and when shit inevitably hits the fan in terms of parasite mutation, he only then admits he had this super pertinent information that he should have shared ages ago.

What was up here? All his character motivation thus far suggested this was something he wouldn't do. He seemed earnestly dedicated to eliminating the parasites. Was that a ruse?

6) What happened to Sahelanthropus?

I guess uh, Eli took it to Africa or something...? Are they setting up for a side game here or something? And if Psycho Mantis can control things like that, why wasn't he piloting Metal Gear Rex in MGS1?

7) So this is it for Zero?

So during the events of this game, Zero goes into a vegetative coma from which he cannot awaken until Big Boss kills him in the epilogue for MGS4? Or am I missing something there?

Doesn't that make it seem like he was kind of a non-factor from this point on in the universe? He sort of set up the Patriots through Sigint in the 1980s and vegetated for another 30 years until Big Boss euthanased him?

What was going on here?

Again, I realize I'm probably taking all this too seriously, and I may have missed stuff, but I find writing this out kinda cathartic.
 
I'm not sure how this refutes my post, exactly. Is the thinking big boss shows here wrong? But its not 'kill all kids, I'm evil!'. It was Kaz who refused to train the child soldiers in MGSV and while I'd grant you that big boss' phantom would be a hard sell on the the child soldier front this is the real big boss. We already see big boss using the medic as an asset without recourse for the effect it will have on him. We already see big boss falling down this rabbit hole. Furthermore, mgs4 already further showed big boss to not be evil in its ending. More like misguided and wrong.

What? What part of MGS4 showed Big Boss as "not to be evil"? Not a single scene in MGS4 retcons Big Boss' vision for the world.
 
Still pretty fucking evil to take war orphans and turn them into soldiers, regardless of how "necessary" it is.

What else are they gonna do in a country run by soldiers and guns for hire? It's practically the only job available around. It's questionable, but not downright evil as other characters in the series (like Psycho Mantis whose objective in life is solely to kill and make people suffer).

Children are vital to any economy as they will take on the jobs in the future, and war economy is no different. Big Boss is exactly just like Zero as their ideals and wills got twisted to the extreme. One wanted to unite a world by controlling the citizens with a system and the other by the abolishment of such systems.
 
I'm not sure how this refutes my post, exactly. Is the thinking big boss shows here wrong? But its not 'kill all kids, I'm evil!'. It was Kaz who refused to train the child soldiers in MGSV and while I'd grant you that big boss' phantom would be a hard sell on the the child soldier front this is the real big boss. We already see big boss using the medic as an asset without recourse for the effect it will have on him. We already see big boss falling down this rabbit hole. Furthermore, mgs4 already further showed big boss to not be evil in its ending. More like misguided and wrong.

Big Boss was presented as an evil bad guy in MG2, end of story. There were little hints of ambiguity with stuff like Kyle Schneider talking about how BB saved him during MG1, but otherwise he's absolutely not some morally grey anti-villain.

Also MGS4 had Big Boss acknowledge that he pretty much did evil shit.
 
The one we got:
A) Saves childrens
B) Eradicates a possible plague
C) Rids the world of nukes
D) "Saves" animals from war zones
E) Does mercenary shit
F) "Hires" shady fucks so they can do mercenary shit too.
H) All of the above

The one we don't get:
A) Rides into the sunset
B) Cripples one of your buddies
C) Uses his "best guy" as bait.if

There's probably a lot more in both sides of the coin I am missing.
Those examples are venum, not big boss.
 
DAYAM! Platinumed?

also, where do i get the bandana?

I still need to make and dismantle a nuke for plat. But I've done all the tasks, s ranks, blueprints and collectables

You can develop the bandanna after you finish side op 143, and you can develop the infinity bandanna after you see the true ending
 
O
4) What was up with the third English strain?

The end of the game seems to indicate that it was in Quiet. Ok. But I could have sworn I saw Psycho Mantis giving it to Eli.

Does that mean Quiet was one of the first two strains, and that Eli was the third and Code Talker and Ocelot got it wrong? But Snake said he tossed two vials into the fire in cassette tapes. Was he mistaken or am I misremembering the scene where I thought I saw Psycho Mantis giving Eli the vial? What the hell was going on here; is the third strain still in play?

The third strain was in Quiet. Snake tosses 2 vials into the fire, but you never see or hear the 2nd one break. That's because Mantis took it before disappearing and later gave it to Eli.
 
1) What the fuck was Skullface's deal?

He said, in his own words, he basically had an urge for revenge against Zero and Big Boss that was like a volcano that had hardened into granite.

Why?

As far as I can tell neither did anything to him to warrant this sort of resentment. If his motive was like, power or control or something I'd get it. Big Boss and Zero are two major influential power players carrying out the Boss' legacy, so if that was his key motivation (and he gets into that a little when he's taunting Zero) that would make more sense.

But why did he want revenge? Near as I can tell, it's the Soviets who fucked up his life, took his language, his face, his lungs etc. Shouldn't it be them who he is fucking with? Shouldn't he be trying to destroy the USSR? Instead he's collaborating with them to get at Zero and Big Boss.

Again, why? All they ever did was give him a job, train him up, and make him ride bitch on Operation Snake Eater. And while he mightn't have liked that last one, was it really justification for wiping the English language from the planet. Shouldn't be have been trying to eliminate Russian?!
well it wasn't revenge per se... it was taking vengeance in general against tyrant languages and he chose zero as a target because he represented using language to control.... it wasn't about the personal crime against him, but how Zero's plan was to use language to control everyone going into the future.

so Skull Face wanted to stop that and sort of 'reset' language to 'free' people and make everyone equal under equal access to nuclear weapons...a world with no english and a world where everyone, not just zero or russia or usa, has WMDs

it was basically less about what was done to him, and more about what was planning to be done to everyone (in the same vein of what was done to him but on a far greater and more calculated scale).
 
I still need to make and dismantle a nuke for plat. But I've done all the tasks, s ranks, blueprints and collectables

You can develop the bandanna after you finish side op 143, and you can develop the infinity bandanna after you see the true ending

got true ending, guess i need to unlock that side op
 
Big Boss was presented as an evil bad guy in MG2, end of story. There were little hints of ambiguity with stuff like Kyle Schneider talking about how BB saved him during MG1, but otherwise he's absolutely not some morally grey anti-villain.

Also MGS4 had Big Boss acknowledge that he pretty much did evil shit.
I see solidis called a grey villian all the time despite his training of child soldiers. People do evil deeds without necessarily being evil. At the end of mhs4 big boss realizes his wrongdoing and seems to regret it. I've done evil things in my life, I just haven't had the ambition or theater that big boss did and I wouldn't call myself evil. I don't see it. Big boss was a bad guy but not the evil, unrelatable, blow up the world because I hate the world villian that it seems some people believe.
 
I would like to complain that every time this thread gets bumped, I end up with The Who stuck in my head for a few minutes afterwards.

re: Quiet, if Kojima had kept her design practical, and wasn't like a constant Maxim photoshoot with the camera angles, he might have gotten away with it. This has probably been posted, but man, I would have done 70% less eye-rolling in this outfit -

uYKhxVi.jpg


Credit.
 
Did anyone ever check if the base member appearing in the Quiet cutscene where she cuts a soldier's mouth is one of those affected by the disease?

I would like to complain that every time this thread gets bumped, I end up with The Who stuck in my head for a few minutes afterwards.

re: Quiet, if Kojima had kept her design practical, and wasn't like a constant Maxim photoshoot with the camera angles, he might have gotten away with it. This has probably been posted, but man, I would have done 70% less eye-rolling in this outfit -

uYKhxVi.jpg


Credit.
Less rape-y but still shit.

And as you said, the shit outfit is only part of the problem, the grossly directed camera work does the rest of the job. The Ocelot model swaps reveal so much about the different treatment of women and men and the male gaze camera direction in this game, it's a great example to study.


There's a well-designed military outfit for her in the game itself, which simply should have been the default.

z1TlL2i.jpg
 
I see solidis called a grey villian all the time despite his training of child soldiers. People do evil deeds without necessarily being evil. At the end of mhs4 big boss realizes his wrongdoing and seems to regret it. I've done evil things in my life, I just haven't had the ambition or theater that big boss did and I wouldn't call myself evil. I don't see it. Big boss was a bad guy but not the evil, unrelatable, blow up the world because I hate the world villian that it seems some people believe.
What evil things have you done in your life?
 
I see solidis called a grey villian all the time despite his training of child soldiers. People do evil deeds without necessarily being evil. At the end of mhs4 big boss realizes his wrongdoing and seems to regret it. I've done evil things in my life, I just haven't had the ambition or theater that big boss did and I wouldn't call myself evil. I don't see it. Big boss was a bad guy but not the evil, unrelatable, blow up the world because I hate the world villian that it seems some people believe.

Solidus' end game was to free the people from the Patriots' control. Big Boss' end game was to create a world of perpetual war.
 
The third strain was in Quiet. Snake tosses 2 vials into the fire, but you never see or hear the 2nd one break. That's because Mantis took it before disappearing and later gave it to Eli.

Ahhhh.

So there is still one vial in play.

well it wasn't revenge per se... it was taking vengeance in general against tyrant languages and he chose zero as a target because he represented using language to control.... it wasn't about the personal crime against him, but how Zero's plan was to use language to control everyone going into the future.

so Skull Face wanted to stop that and sort of 'reset' language to 'free' people and make everyone equal under equal access to nuclear weapons...a world with no english and a world where everyone, not just zero or russia or usa, has WMDs

it was basically less about what was done to him, and more about what was planning to be done to everyone (in the same vein of what was done to him but on a far greater and more calculated scale).

Ok, but I sort of find that very weird because Zero had clearly opted for a different path by that point as alluded to in that last conversation between the two of them where he talks about a system that surgically targets individuals (FOXDIE) instead of clumsily targets entire ethnic groups (the vocal parasites).

It was sort of like getting vengeance for that thing Zero decided not to do, you know?

Also doesn't explain why he'd target Big Boss who had nothing to do with the development of vocal parasites.
 
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