Multiple fatalities reported at Umpqua Community College shooting in Oregon

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aeolist said:
considering that the shooter announced his intent on 4chan by describing it as a "beta male uprising" i think that considering the impact of american gender norms is totally appropriate
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Considering is fair. Declaring that the patriarchal machismo Establishment wants the USA to be a gun state is fucking beyond idiotic.

It really comes down to normalizing stringent gun control across multiple states. Take examples from NY and from Cali and make the US have much more stringent gun control at the federal level. Shove it down the throats of the states. This is one area where I'd be cool with federal control of gun ownership.

commish said:
Stop quoting that dumb post.
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Please stop, yes.
 
CNN's banner now says:

"Officers engaged the shooter at Oregon's Umpqua Community College and he now "is deceased," said Douglas County Sheriff John Hanlin. Watch CNNgo."
 
Wreav said:
Ugh, can't believe he posted about it on 4chan last night...and some of the egging him on...I'm not sure why I'm surprised, but I hate that place.
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Hell, if that particular narrative starts to catch on I think it's more plausible that the current congress would move to enact anti-online-anonymity laws before they'd consider pushing through a workable, useful gun control law or two.

Also, regarding Geo's post - if you don't think toxic masculinity has some part to play in the sustained levels of gun violence in America, you're wrong. It absolutely does.
 
BobbyRoberts said:
Hell, if that particular narrative starts to catch on I think it's more plausible that the current congress would move to enact anti-online-anonymity laws before they'd consider pushing through a workable, useful gun control law or two.
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God damn this is depressing and sadly I think you're spot on.
 
If this is not about guns but mental illness, as some would have us believe, why are these massacres not happening in Europe?

Or is it only Americans who suffer with mental illness?
 
Geo said:
The reason why the United States is so enthralled with keeping gun ownership of course stems back to issues of masculinity. Yes, masculinity, the internal conflict of American men since mainly the late 19th century. Men in America have constantly perceived masculinity as in decline. Masculinity, the rugged individual man as they say, is a disappearing ideal. Masculinity is in crisis right now, as it has been for well over a hundred years.

Guns are a way for many American men to be "masculine" again. In a society that seems to be increasingly less and less "masculine", this is important to them. Interesting parallels can be drawn to other aspects of American culture, such as advocacy for maintaining violence in football, which also claims lives and results in life-altering damage to the body (on a much smaller scale of course).

Gun ownership is thus deeper than just a visible societal problem. Its roots are much deeper. Guns correlate directly to issues of identity in relation to masculinity. Identity, how you perceive oneself and how you believe others perceive you. Identity as a man in America. Until this identity crisis is solved, mass change (bans on firearms) will never occur.

It's going to be awhile.
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This isn't a good post, come on... If there's one place on earth where you could say masculinity was in crisis, it's Japan. There's no gun crime in Japan, because there are no fucking guns. Crime in general is much lower than US as well. American culture may have issues with the glorification of violence, but saying it's because of a perceived decline of masculinity (Whatever that means) only makes sense when you view everything through gender glasses.

So would this mean that masculinity in Canada is in much better shape, then? How would you go about improving masculinity through legislation? Has a change in the perception masculinity ever been shown to decrease violent crime like Australia's ban on guns decreased gun violence? Any studies on that? You're talking complete nonsense
 
Don Draper's Hat said:
If this is not about guns but mental illness, as some would have us believe, why are these massacres not happening in Europe?

Or is it only Americans who suffer with mental illness?
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It's probably worse in America because mental health isn't covered under a lot of insurance policies, so instead of paying out of pocket for it it just festers and gets worse.

I have a good job and relatively good insurance but it covers barely anything in terms of psychiatric care.
 
Has this been posted yet?

http://www.nrtoday.com/news/18445375-113/ucc-shooting-rampage-at-least-13-reported-dead

Kortney Moore, 18, from Rogue River, was in her Writing 115 class in Snyder Hall when one shot came through a window. She saw her teacher get shot in the head. The shooter was inside at that point, and he told people to get on the ground. The shooter was asking people to stand up and state their religion and then started firing away, Moore said. Moore was lying there with people who had been shot.
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Bronx-Man said:
So is anyone gonna argue against Geo's post or are we just gonna dismiss it without a second thought?
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Was there something to discuss? Okay, he says we have guns because men want to feel masculine. Okay. So what? Was there a proposed solution buried in there somewhere?
 
Everyone posting they need to ban guns, you gotta remember, this is a country that didn't ban anything when a bunch of little kids got massacred. Let that sink in and remember that terrible event. The second they allowed that to happen and not take action made me realize the US is a lost cause when it comes to guns, gun culture, gun anything and that's sad. These sort of events will continue to happen and the politicians and a huge section of the population won't give a shit other than "That government better not take my guns".
 
crazygambit said:
Do you know how many people died today in the world?

If you spent half a second mourning each one, you would literally be unable to do anything else.

That you don't doesn't make you selfish.
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It's not a matter of THINKING or CARING about others, its when those thoughts inspire actions that DO affect others. So not caring about others means you won't change yourl ifestyleto help others, which is the very definition of selfish.
 
pgtl_10 said:
Reading the Yahoo comments is crazy. One poster said no more gun free zones because they are dangerous and got a 115 thumbs up while 39(including me) thumbs down.

Seriously what's with gun nuts?
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They can organize, mobilize, and give a shit when it counts (calling conressional members, voting). There is will on the other side. In fact a majority of Americans likely support more gun control. But there is no organization.
 
Apathy said:
Everyone posting they need to ban guns, you gotta remember, this is a country that didn't ban anything when a bunch of little kids got massacred. Let that sink in and remember that terrible event. The second they allowed that to happen and not take action made me realize the US is a lost cause when it comes to guns, gun culture, gun anything and that's sad. These sort of events will continue to happen and the politicians and a huge section of the population won't give a shit other than "That government better not take my guns".
Click to expand...

Yep, I live in Alabama and i regularly hear that if "the guns are taken away" they WILL kill the president. Those people will not give up their guns
 
Some people here are getting really, really upset with the consideration that feelings of insecure masculinity may inform the purchase, advocacy, and carrying of weapons.

Geo apparently touched a nerve with his post. Maybe it's more trenchant than you thought.
 
If gun people are so pro life, then doesn't the one or two lives saved count with gun control versus not? I know if I ever lost my shit I wouldn't be able to get one "off the street," due to my social anxiety and lack of knowledge where to go. I can't even get weed and I'm always down to hit that when it presents itself.
 
minor effort said:
Some people here are getting really, really upset with the consideration that feelings of insecure masculinity may inform the purchase, advocacy, and carrying of weapons.

Geo apparently touched a nerve with his post. Maybe it's more trenchant than you thought.
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Is it the reason that some people want to murder 12 people in cold blood?
 
Shooter was a 20-year-old male. He was found dead by officers inside one of the campus buildings.

There was an exchange of gunfire, but it's not known if the officers killed him or if he killed himself.

He was never taken into custody.
 
Geo said:
The reason why the United States is so enthralled with keeping gun ownership of course stems back to issues of masculinity. Yes, masculinity, the internal conflict of American men since mainly the late 19th century. Men in America have constantly perceived masculinity as in decline. Masculinity, the rugged individual man as they say, is a disappearing ideal. Masculinity is in crisis right now, as it has been for well over a hundred years.

Guns are a way for many American men to be "masculine" again. In a society that seems to be increasingly less and less "masculine", this is important to them. Interesting parallels can be drawn to other aspects of American culture, such as advocacy for maintaining violence in football, which also claims lives and results in life-altering damage to the body (on a much smaller scale of course).

Gun ownership is thus deeper than just a visible societal problem. Its roots are much deeper. Guns correlate directly to issues of identity in relation to masculinity. Identity, how you perceive oneself and how you believe others perceive you. Identity as a man in America. Until this identity crisis is solved, mass change (bans on firearms) will never occur.

It's going to be awhile.
Click to expand...

This is such a big reach, how is this a good post? I don't know what to say.

Where are your studies to back this all up, because it all makes zero sense.
 
commish said:
Was there a proposed solution buried in there somewhere?
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Nothing more than the basic "take the time to self-reflect a little" that is implied in almost every discussion about not only gun control, but the societal roots of any cultural disease. Someone doesn't have to have presented a solution to a wrong before choosing to point out the wrong, and pointing it out doesn't suddenly become weightless simply because there's not a prescribed solution chained to it.

Now, if you thought the assertion was false in every way, then you need to point out how/why its false.

But it isn't. Maybe it's not as true as originally presented, but that's how nuance tends to work. There is truth in there. Simply saying "bullshit" and then declining to engage in a way that could actually expose the bullshit is less helpful than if Geo had never called attention to the problem in the first place.
 
AmyS said:
Can anyone confirm this is the sack of excrement that did the shooting and is now dead?
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tbh probably not. The guy in the video is Eggman who seems to be known figure on there and it's a meme to want him out of the board.

They should really wait before alluding to the 4chan stuff.
 
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