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[Ishida]

Hilarious to see everyone turn against Kojima now.

Not me, though.

 

[Srey Plaughtered]

I think that not only Venom represent the player, but it is also the symbol of Big Boss becoming a "demon" by using his soldiers for his own personal goal of creating Zanzibar Land, and thus becoming the very thing he hated when killing The Boss

Yep. If anything Kojima made us all feel that Big Boss is a dick which we all had doubts about since MGS 3. The fact that he screwed us-the player over instead of any other character in the game to become a demon makes it even better. And I love it, I don't think Big Boss going and killing children or the other ideas we had about him becoming a demon would've been better.

 

[SolVanderlyn]

I think Kojima needed restraint and guidance. He is an artist at heart and needs more practical minded people to keep him grounded.

See also: Tetsuya Nomura. Just look at that latest compilation title and where the KH story has gone.

 

[Johndoey]

Hilarious to see everyone turn against Kojima now.

Not me, though.

I was always against Kojima, I merely chose now to reveal myself.

.

Nah, Kojima just wanted some more T&A.

 

[BadWolf]

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/met...-ultimate-ending-discussion-spoilers-1781915/

Amazing read O_O

Yep. If anything Kojima made us all feel that Big Boss is a dick which we all had doubts about since MGS 3. The fact that he screwed us-the player over instead of any other character in the game to become a demon makes it even better. And I love it, I don't think Big Boss going and killing children or the other ideas we had about him becoming a demon would've been better.

Very much agreed, the game completely changed my image of BB.

Some quotes from the article above:

It further details Big Boss's fall and shows us everything we ever needed to know about him. While in a coma, Zero comissions a memetic clone of Big Boss. The parallels between Les Enfants Terribles and the creation of Venom Snake are obvious. When Zero did this the first time, Big Boss was disgusted and rejected it. But what did Big Boss do this time? He embraced it, he embraced the cult of personality, he embraced the legend. After MSF was obliterated in Ground Zeroes, Big Boss realized that in order to achieve his sweeping dreams, he had to work from the shadows, even if that meant tying the noose around someone else's neck.

Venom Snake builds Diamond Dogs and eliminates XOF as a threat. It is now that Big Boss lets him in on the whole ruse and opens up an avenue of partnership.

The Metal Gear series is also about what controls people, what is passed down. Venom Snake passes down nothing, not his genes, not his memes, nothing. All of it is taken by Big Boss. In going through with Zero's scheme, Big Boss does exactly what he has always stood against: he used a soldier for his own gains. He is a hypocrite and a coward who erases one his best men from the face of history just to save his own ass.

MGSV completely recontextualizes everything we knew of Big Boss's and his life. Before the Big Boss trilogy (MGS3, PW, GZ/TPP) all we knew of him came from second-hand sources who were given information fabricated by Zero, Big Boss, and everyone else who worked to help build Big Boss's legend. We thought the goal of the Big Boss trilogy was to be a Darth Vader story, to show the man's fall from hero to villain. But Metal Gear is never so black and white. With MGSV, we see what the real intention of the Big Boss trilogy was: to deflate the legend. Big Boss was never a hero, was never a legendary soldier. What he built was built on the shoulders of countless others. He was also a hypocrite and egomaniac who imposed his own ideology on others, and ultimately, was no different from Zero. Thematically, Metal Gear is about ideology gone astray, how good intentions change and warp over time, corrupted by legends and ego. The Phantom Pain fits right into this, recontextualizing Big Boss's fall entirely into a man who became consumed by his own legend and ideology. Big Boss and Zero had competing ideologies, but they both fell prey to the same sinful desires. They made the same mistakes in life, and if the Patriot AI are the inheritors of Zero's will, then the Snakes are the inheritors of Big Boss's.

In MGS4, during his last moments, Big Boss realizes the mistakes he has made in life. He ends Zero and ends himself, voluntarily destroys their competing and destructive ideologies and legends so that they may not grow again. He tells Snake the lesson the Boss tried to impart on him so many years earlier: lay down your gun and live. No more legends, no more ideologies. Leave the world as it is and respect the will of others. That is exactly what Solid Snake does, thus making him and Big Boss antithetical to one another. Solid Snake was the true protagonist of this series, and with MGSV, we finally see how.

 

[SomTervo]

I was always against Kojima, I merely chose now to reveal myself.

I was always against Kojima, then I found a cassette tape in my bathroom.

I listened to it, and it turned out that I was Kojima all along. Now I'm on Kojima's side.

I enjoyed that ending.

Yep. If anything Kojima made us all feel that Big Boss is a dick which we all had doubts about since MGS 3. The fact that he screwed us-the player over instead of any other character in the game to become a demon makes it even better. And I love it, I don't think Big Boss going and killing children or the other ideas we had about him becoming a demon would've been better.

Yessss

Vindication

Let the haters hate

Peace, breh's

 

[Johndoey]

I was always against Kojima, then I found a cassette tape in my bathroom.

I listened to it, and it turned out that I was Kojima all along. Now I'm on his side.

Are you the phantom or the Kojima Kojima? Or are we all merely aspects of the one great Kojima, truely it is unknowable.

 

[Blader]

BTW, didn't Code Talker say that the vocal cord parasites don't infect human hosts before they reach puberty?

I really hated the way Code Talker pronounces vocal cord. And he says it in about every other sentence.

 

[KOMANI]

I was always against Kojima, I merely chose now to reveal myself.


Nah, Kojima just wanted some more T&A.

I started turning on him when he acted all creepy towards my gf at the time

 

[Spring-Loaded]

It'd ruin her entire arc to give her an outfit like that or her XOF one from the beginning. She's not supposed to look like an ordinary soldier, but a shell of one whose body has been defiled in retribution for her monstrous, sadistic acts. For the majority of the game, she's defined by penance - lying prostrate before those she had wronged, completely at their mercy. The nakedness is a symbolic offering of her body for judgment, as she clearly regrets her former life as an assassin without conscience. Her body, once an instrument of indiscriminate violence; is given a new, benevolent purpose through its use by the man she once tried to destroy; and only after she repents her sins and is transformed into an empathetic soul willing to die for others is she worthy of being called a 'human' and not an instrument of violence, symbolised by the ability to give her clothes only coming very late in the game, immediately before her departure.

Have her wear the remains of her actual uniform, the one burned in the intro. That accomplishes everything you say her default costume does. It can still be revealing without looking so silly. Boss could give her a new uniform after she joins, which could even represent him giving her a greater purpose.

Where'd the elbow gloves and stockings come from?

 

[Johndoey]

I started turning on him when he acted all creepy towards my gf at the time

Did he call next week claiming it was his phantom?

 

[Feltrol]

So what happens to Diamond Dogs after the events of Phantom Pain?
Did it get disbanded?

 

[Toa TAK]

So what happens to Diamond Dogs after the events of Phantom Pain?
Did it get disbanded?

Nobody knows.

Maybe they just sat back as MGS4 happened.

 

[Inferno313]

So what happens to Diamond Dogs after the events of Phantom Pain?
Did it get disbanded?

I inferred from the ending that Diamond Dogs eventually gets wrapped into Outer Heaven in some way.

 

[Gorillaz]

Hilarious to see everyone turn against Kojima now.

Not me, though.

Its not that people are turned against him but its the fact people are realizing he needs to be restrained in terms of creative control.

 

[BadWolf]

Have her wear the remains of her actual uniform, the one burned in the intro. That accomplishes everything you say her default costume does. It can still be revealing without looking so silly. Boss could give her a new uniform after she joins, which could even represent him giving her a greater purpose.

Clothing like that would suffocate her since she breathes through her skin.

During that cutscene with Ocelot by her cell, when he tells Venom about her physical state, he mentions that they tried putting clothes on her but that person ended up breathing through a tube. So she beat the crap out of him/her basically.

Even during the cutscene after the boss fight with her, when Venom takes her to the helicopter and covers her with a jacket, she takes it off almost immediately.

I inferred from the ending that Diamond Dogs eventually gets wrapped into Outer Heaven in some way.

Most likely yeah, Venom does agree to work with BB after being told about the truth.

 

[akidnamededdy]

Have her wear the remains of her actual uniform, the one burned in the intro. That accomplishes everything you say her default costume does. It can still be revealing without looking so silly. Boss could give her a new uniform after she joins, which could even represent him giving her a greater purpose.

Yeeeaaahhhh uhhhhhh Miller would have had her shot on sight immediately if she showed up on their base in an XOF uniform.

 

[Neiteio]

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/met...-ultimate-ending-discussion-spoilers-1781915/

Wow, this is excellent.

 

[NotLiquid]

So what happens to Diamond Dogs after the events of Phantom Pain?
Did it get disbanded?

Diamond Dogs becomes the first instance of Outer Heaven.

 

[Symphonia]

I think they can still infect human hosts at any age, but they aren't a risk as they can't begin to copulate in prepubescent children. Which is also why tracking down Eli is such a priority for them - along with Sahelanthropus, his English vocal cord parasite would inevitably become active as he aged; and they choose to abandon him to die after seeing him show symptoms.

So did the vocal cord parasite evolve into FOXDIE as Liquid got older?

 

[akidnamededdy]

So did the vocal cord parasite evolve into FOXDIE as Liquid got older?

No, Mantis removed them from Liquid's body because Mantis is fucking magical. FoxDIE is a whole other thing.

 

[Golnei]

So did the vocal cord parasite evolve into FOXDIE as Liquid got older?

No, they were destroyed after Mantis magically removed them with no build-up. But it's heavily hinted at that they served as the conceptual basis for FOXDIE in-universe.

 

[Sn4ke_911]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

 

[Chariot]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

STOP TORTURING US. STOP STOP STOP!

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Yeeeaaahhhh uhhhhhh Miller would have had her shot on sight immediately if she showed up on their base in an XOF uniform.

So the ripped stockings and bikini were a tactical decision to lower Miller's guard? Ingenious.

 

[rtcn63]

Speaking of Mantis, I like to think that Child Mantis did a "this is not the Sahelanthropus you're looking for" to the Diamond Dogs, explaining why Chapter 51 wasn't a thing.

 

[Twookie]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

oh god why

 

[akidnamededdy]

So the ripped stockings and bikini were a tactical decision to lower Miller's guard? Ingenious.

I'm not defending Quiet's outfit, just pointing out why your idea is dumb.

 

[Astarte]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

Wow time for some Metal Gear Online exclusive lore

 

[GreenScar]

Abso-fucking-lutely. Big step back from outer ops and less variation from PW side ops. Side ops were fun mini games/ puzzles. A great break from the action. Also there was a cutscene tab in PW that's absent in TPP.

There's a cutscene tab under Logs...

However, like other tabs under Logs, there's nothing actually on it. Probably another example of how the game is incomplete.

 

[Xpliskin]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

That's a red herring.


I checked the executable:
-no bosses other than volgin, quiet, liquid and sahelantropus (mantis was never planned as a boss)
-afghanistan, cyprus and central-africa are the only "levels"
-Eva/Boss were skins


If there's new content, it's going to be a patch or DLC.

 

[Sub_Level]

(I know, I was just throwing it back at the guy I think both MGS2 and MGS3 have great, valid themes/messages.)

For sure. MGS3 also hits the player repeatedly with its messages. In the very first radio conversation the Boss plainly tells Snake FRIENDS TODAY MAY BE ENEMIES TOMORROW.

Very heavy handed. Kojima writes with a club dipped in ink instead of a pen. Its amazing the stories are as captivating as they are still tbh.

 

[BadWolf]

There's a cutscene tab under Logs...

However, like other tabs under Logs, there's nothing actually on it. Probably another example of how the game is incomplete.

Huh?

Those logs list the relevant content (like you can read the codec conversations you have had during a mission if you didn't hear something right). Also lists the cutscenes etc.

Unfortunately there is no actual cutscene viewer, MGS4 didn't have it either though.

 

[Chariot]

Plus, the guide would be pretty shitty, if there was a lot more in the game it doesn't even know about.

 

[Kazuhira]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

It can't be as cryptic as unlocking zadornov's missions in PW or finishing P.T

 

[Spring-Loaded]

I'm not defending Quiet's outfit, just pointing out why your idea is dumb.

You're not. And if her wearing clothes she wore at one point to n the game is dumb, her wearing a bikini, torn stockings and elbow gloves is dumber, guaranteed. As is your logic.

If you want to defend her outfit, at least own up to it.

Clothing like that would suffocate her since she breathes through her skin.

During that cutscene with Ocelot by her cell, when he tells Venom about her physical state, he mentions that they tried putting clothes on her but that person ended up breathing through a tube. So she beat the crap out of him/her basically.

Even during the cutscene after the boss fight with her, when Venom takes her to the helicopter and covers her with a jacket, she takes it off almost immediately.

Boss: "Get her something to wear. She's one of us for now, and she needs to look the part."

Ocelot: "B-but Boss-sempai...she breathes through her skin."

Boss: "Have R&D work on a breathable material that meets her needs."

Because video game stories and character designs are not limited by fictional science.

 

[BadWolf]

Plus, the guide would be pretty shitty, if there was a lot more in the game it doesn't even know about.

Yeah if there is anything more it has to be add-on content, not something in the current game.

 

[GreyOcelot]

That's a red herring.


I checked the executable:
-no bosses other than volgin, quiet, liquid and sahelantropus (mantis was never planned as a boss)
-afghanistan, cyprus and central-africa are the only "levels"
-Eva/Boss were skins


If there's new content, it's going to be a patch or DLC.

What about the theory that disabling a certain number of group of nukes will trigger the additional ending leading into simply a chapter 3 title card?

 

[Spring-Loaded]

There's a cutscene tab under Logs...

However, like other tabs under Logs, there's nothing actually on it. Probably another example of how the game is incomplete.

It just has dialogue from recent cutscenes. Like with the other tabs, it doesn't stay forever.

 

[GenG3000]

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/met...-ultimate-ending-discussion-spoilers-1781915/

Excellent read. It's gonna take a bit until the dust settles, but the plot will definitely be appreciated for what it does and for making the original Metal Gear games more relevant.

About the ending, I particularly like the fact that the tape for OPERATION INTRUDE N313 is on the other side of the tape where Big Boss confesses to the the Phantom. Nice way to portray how big of a dick is Big Boss.

 

[Symphonia]

No, Mantis removed them from Liquid's body because Mantis is fucking magical. FoxDIE is a whole other thing.

No, they were destroyed after Mantis magically removed them with no build-up. But it's heavily hinted at that they served as the conceptual basis for FOXDIE in-universe.

Is this ever explained in the audio logs?

 

[GenG3000]

Is this ever explained in the audio logs?

It's seen in the leftover cutscenes for chapter 51 in the bluray of the special edition.

 

[Xpliskin]

What about the theory that disabling a certain number of group of nukes will trigger the additional ending leading into simply a chapter 3 title card?

These type of things you can't determine out of disassembly.

Smart thing to do would be to try to get some meaning out of the lua script mission files.

But last time I checked they were packed/or in data form (not text).


The very last hope to determine the extent of the missing content would be if some reviewer or someone with a pre-release version would kindly share some files with us.

I don't require much, just a few files.

 

[usp84]

Excellent read. It's gonna take a bit until the dust settles, but the plot will definitely be appreciated for what it does and for making the original Metal Gear games more relevant.

About the ending, I particularly like the fact that the tape for OPERATION INTRUDE N313 is on the other side of the tape where Big Boss confesses to the the Phantom. Nice way to portray how big of a dick is Big Boss.

The more i read stuff like this the more i like the whole story. It just sucks that so much were cut from the game

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

Yep. If anything Kojima made us all feel that Big Boss is a dick which we all had doubts about since MGS 3. The fact that he screwed us-the player over instead of any other character in the game to become a demon makes it even better. And I love it, I don't think Big Boss going and killing children or the other ideas we had about him becoming a demon would've been better.

Yup, this was a pretty sinister/cowardly thing to do.

 

[matrix-cat]

http://gamingbolt.com/metal-gear-so...fficial-mgs-twitter-says-there-is-more-to-see

Keep playing what? Plenty of people have 100% at this point; ain't shit else in there.

 

[BadWolf]

Is this ever explained in the audio logs?

Episode 51: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3e0LoFh8ew

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Keep playing what? Plenty of people have 100% at this point; ain't shit else in there.

Or is there

 

[wilsonda]

So can anyone explain the Ntrude tape? why did Big Boss send it to Venom? My thought is that Big Boss sent it to Venom so that Venom (fake Big Boss) would then give the mission to Solid Snake. Thus, Solid Snake would then take the mission and kill Venom (aka fake big boss). Thus, the Big Boss that appears in MG1 is actually Venom and the Big Boss that appears in MG2 is actually the real big boss?

 

[Spring-Loaded]

So can anyone explain the Ntrude tape? why did Big Boss send it to Venom? My thought is that Big Boss sent it to Venom so that Venom (fake Big Boss) would then give the mission to Solid Snake. Thus, Solid Snake would then take the mission and kill Venom (aka fake big boss). Thus, the Big Boss that appears in MG1 is actually Venom and the Big Boss that appears in MG2 is actually the real big boss?

Sounds about right