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[DryEyeRelief]

Why is it people keep thinking that character poll as the holy grail of determining popularity.
There are so many factors to take into while determining a character's popularity.

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

I'm obsessed with the lore of street fighter and don't like the superficial characters from street fighter 2, so I need to come up with some sort of contrived reasoning for why they don't belong and attempt to vindicate my own personal views with arguments about popularity.

 

[Skilletor]

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

^

 

[Shadoken]

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

Pretty much.


I think the roster has pretty good variety in terms of Gameplay,Design and Nationality.

 

[qcf x2]

Funny how many people were 100% on the idea that Ken wouldn't be on the starting roster. And were okay with it. But now...

Spoiler

I do think Ken should always be in.

 

[ElFly]

Funny how many people were 100% on the idea that Ken wouldn't be on the starting roster. And were okay with it. But now...

Spoiler

I do think Ken should always be in.

It's because people were resting easy on the knowledge that Ken would be one of the first DLC characters anyway.

He is on the starting roster? even better.

 

[Horseress]

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

I'm obsessed with the lore of street fighter and don't like the superficial characters from street fighter 2, so I need to come up with some sort of contrived reasoning for why they don't belong and attempt to vindicate my own personal views with arguments about popularity.

You just tl;dr; 30 pages

 

[zedreamcast]

No, but that's the point. They're the one's they need to target unless they plan on having a bunch of 40 year olds be their main audience for SF6. They can't keep living on us super hardcore fans, and they definitely can't live on the ones who were around to play Super Turbo.

The problem is that kids today are pretty lame, they want call of duty, mortal kombat, GTA. Capcom obviously see that kids arent as interested in street fighter. The wanna go where the money is which is people who already play the game. Obviously people from when SF2 was popular would know the cast cause there were action figures and cartoons and board games. They were every where, now a days kids really only play what is in the main stream and not a niche genre of video games. I doubt an elementary schooler would have the patience to go into training mode and practice after getting blown up a couple times online.

 

[ThirtyPlus]

Alright, I come clean. Blanka is a terrible character and should never be included in another SF game, no matter how "popular" he is, regardless of the criteria for judging it.

Spoiler

Kappa

 

[Raitaro]

Why is it people keep thinking that character poll as the holy grail of determining popularity.
There are so many factors to take into while determining a character's popularity.

First off a character not appearing in games has a HUGE impact , Dhalsim has been in literally every SF and VS game. Karin is not the most popular Alpha character by any measure. If someone like Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento had never appeared in SSF4 and if we got Mika and Karin instead they would be topping the polls. Ditto for SF 3 and 'Q' being the most popular character.

*snip*

Thank you for mentioning this. I agree.

In Dutch we have a saying: "onbekend maakt onbemind" which roughly translates to "being unknown leads to being unloved."

The fact that polls are often filled with characters that have appeared in the biggest number of games (with some exceptions of course) is not surprising to me if you count the fact that people like to stick to what they know (or have mastered in these cases), but it is something I'd wish Capcom - as the official curators so to speak - would try to remedy by giving lesser known characters a chance to shine so people can grow attached to them too.

They are doing that now in a way with R.Mika and Karin, but I'd wish they'd also follow suit with some more SFIII folks.

 

[enzo_gt]

You just tl;dr; 30 pages

Let's not forget much of the last thread as well.

 

[The Lone Dragon]

Why is it people keep thinking that character poll as the holy grail of determining popularity.

As opposed to what? What other remotely scientific way do you propose for determining popularity?

"Well, the guys at my local arcade in the 90's didn't like the SF3 cast, so I guess that means no one on earth likes them. Now. 18 years later."

"SF2 was the best selling game, so everyone in that game must be popular,...right?"

"Well, when I go online, I never see XYZ characters, so they must not be popular...WORLDWIDE."

"Well, people online always say SF3 destroyed the entire Street Fighter franchise for 10 years, so I guess the roster must have been bad. I mean, I wasn't alive then, but it must be true."

Compared to THIS crap ^^^, yes a widely publicized, formal, company administered poll basically IS a holy grail.

 

[Neoxon]

Why is it people keep thinking that character poll as the holy grail of determining popularity.
There are so many factors to take into while determining a character's popularity.

First off a character not appearing in games has a HUGE impact , Dhalsim has been in literally every SF and VS game. Karin is not the most popular Alpha character by any measure. If someone like Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento had never appeared in SSF4 and if we got Mika and Karin instead they would be topping the polls. Ditto for SF 3 and 'Q' being the most popular character.

Secondly the poll only consisted of roughly 60-70k votes? SF4 sold around 3 million. Just so you know how insignificant that number is. It is mostly the hardcore fans who play every single SF ever.
If you took a "Best games of all time" poll on GAF you would get titles like Zelda,Dark Souls,MGS, or FF7 or something.
Now do the same poll on millions of random gamers and youd probably end up with COD,Angry Birds and Minecraft.


Being a Guy player , I fking Hate Gief. And I dont really like Sim's playtstyle. But I understand and respect the variety and unique gameplay they bring to the roster and their iconic status.


That popularity poll was meant as a reference for Capcom , they have tons of info anyway on the rise and decline of character's popularity. Notice how almost all the SF 2 veterans are among the 'Popular" bunch? Ditto for Alpha. The exception being Birdie , which is why he got a huge change and is now a very popular character. I am expecting something similar with Sim.

• Street Fighter III: New Generation
• Street Fighter III: Second Impact
• Street Fighter III: Third Strike
• Marvel vs. Capcom 1
• Marvel vs. Capcom 3: Fate of Two Worlds
• Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3
• Tatsunoko vs. Capcom

You were saying?

 

[cackhyena]

Can't wait until the game is out so we have something to talk about besides this character bullshit. Jeeeeeeeezis

 

[Geminosity]

First off a character not appearing in games has a HUGE impact , Dhalsim has been in literally every SF and VS game. Karin is not the most popular Alpha character by any measure. If someone like Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento had never appeared in SSF4 and if we got Mika and Karin instead they would be topping the polls. Ditto for SF 3 and 'Q' being the most popular character.

You can leave Sakura, Cody, Guy and Rolento out of as many games as you like and i'd still never vote for them. I get the whole 'absence makes the heart grow fonder' argument but lets be honest, if that were the be all and end all wouldn't Birdie have been super voted instead of lying dead at the bottom of the poll? Or does this 'rule' only magically work on certain characters so all the ones that inconveniently debunk it don't count?

 

[Mik317]

I think Ryu, Ken, Chun, Gief, and Cammy are all good candidates to always show up. Bison too (but this may or may not be his last rodeo if the whole end of shadowloo thing holds true...then again dude dies a lot). Guile kinda sort as well (I mean he actaully had more to do with the main plot than Ryu ever had if you think about it..plus DAT THEME).

Vega, Balrog, and Sagat are take it or leave it. Honda (who has constantly been forgotten recently lol), Fei Long, THawk, and DeeJay probably shouldn't always show up (Fei maybe not so much but his rekka styles can be replicated a bit). I will not speak on Blanka for salt reasons...(Blanka is pretty iconic tho..for good and bad reasons)

And considering Fighting Game Rosters are now expected to eventually hit around 40 characters..I don't see the harm in most of the WW showing up. 4 of them probably won't show up and if they do it will be late in the life of the game anyway (when all that is left is the diehards and the newly created diehards).

and honestly the argument here is that "people won't be attracted to the game if all they see is old characters...so they should put in this slightly less old character". I mean I love SF3 too but those characters won't bring any new blood either..and Dimps' new characters probably also won't bring in the new blood either. Fighting games are all about the cast and if you look at many of the speculation threads, most posts are people are waiting for their favorite character to return (smash is the exception kinda). And considering some of the WW fanbase, it is fair to say that there are actually a lot people who are happy to see them (hell there has been a smattering of people who REQUIRE all of the WW to be in in this very thread).

 

[delSai]

Can't wait until the game is out so we have something to talk about besides this character bullshit. Jeeeeeeeezis

The character bullshit wont stop. We will somehow find a way to have the same talks when it's about DLC.
I cant wait for the hate when El Fuerte gets announced!

Spoiler

He wont.

 

[SamVimes]

You can tell capcom really went all in on the cast of tvc because they put in the ever popular Alex, which they refuse to do in other games because they personally hate every 3s fan in the world.

 

[Shadoken]

• Street Fighter III: New Generation
• Street Fighter III: Second Impact
• Street Fighter III: Third Strike
• Marvel vs. Capcom 1
• Marvel vs. Capcom 3: Fate of Two Worlds
• Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3
• Tatsunoko vs. Capcom

You were saying?

Every SF2
Every Alpha outside of 1
Every SF4
Xmen vs SF
M vs SF
MvC2
CvS1
CvS2
SFxT

Maybe not Literally everything , but thats almost 90% of the SF games.

 

[Shadoken]

You can leave Sakura, Cody, Guy and Rolento out of as many games as you like and i'd still never vote for them. I get the whole 'absence makes the heart grow fonder' argument but lets be honest, if that were the be all and end all wouldn't Birdie have been super voted instead of lying dead at the bottom of the poll? Or does this 'rule' only magically work on certain characters so all the ones that inconveniently debunk it don't count?

Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento are still in the "Popular" category. Before they were added to SSF4 and SFxT they were topping polls.
Ditto with Elena,Poison,Hugo but now they have gone down a little.

All am saying is , there are popular characters and unpopular characters. Yea there are characters that not many people like at all like Birdie,Sodom,Twelve,SF 1 characters.


You get my point , but hey you can twist it and make exceptions if you want to prove people wrong.

 

[Scotia]

Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento are still in the "Popular" category. Before they were added to SSF4 and SFxT they were topping polls.
Ditto with Elena,Poison,Dudley but now they have gone down a little.

All am saying is , there are popular characters and unpopular characters. Yea there are characters that nobody likes at all like Birdie,Sodom,Twelve,SF 1 characters.

I like Sodom and Twelve.

 

[Shadoken]

I like Sodom and Twelve.

I like Sodom too , Twelve can go die. But I dont really see popularity changing all that much for them.

Oh and THawk and Dee Jay too , how did they get into SSF4? Lol.

 

[ThirtyPlus]

I like Sodom too , Twelve can go die. But I dont really see popularity changing all that much for them.

Sodom? Yikes.

 

[SephLuis]

This is going nowhere, since we have no leads that point to Dhalsim, except an event that's going to happen in India (if I am not mistaken).

Since they didn't showed Guile at NYCC, it could anyone's guess by now.
Maybe it will be Dhalsim, maybe it will be another SF2 veteran. Maybe they will throw a curveball and it's no one from SF2.

At this point, everyone is rooting for their favorites.

 

[delSai]

I like Sodom too , Twelve can go die. But I dont really see popularity changing all that much for them.

Oh and THawk and Dee Jay too , man who even asked these guys for SSF4? Lol.

T.Hawk is awesome

 

[Shadoken]

T.Hawk is awesome

Well not according to some people who take polls wayy too seriously.

 

[Neoxon]

This is going nowhere, since we have no leads that point to Dhalsim, except an event that's going to happen in India (if I am not mistaken).

Since they didn't showed Guile at NYCC, it could anyone's guess by now.
Maybe it will be Dhalsim, maybe it will be another SF2 veteran. Maybe they will throw a curveball and it's no one from SF2.

At this point, everyone is rooting for their favorites.

The Street Fighter V panel is tomorrow, so we don't know for sure.

 

[sixteen-bit]

Ono's a real jet setter. I hope he can finally drop a surprise on us tomorrow in NYC.

 

[Scotia]

This is going nowhere, since we have no leads that point to Dhalsim, except an event that's going to happen in India (if I am not mistaken).

Since they didn't showed Guile at NYCC, it could anyone's guess by now.
Maybe it will be Dhalsim, maybe it will be another SF2 veteran. Maybe they will throw a curveball and it's no one from SF2.

At this point, everyone is rooting for their favorites.

NYCC panel is tomorrow. Character reveal will happen there. Capcom aren't confirmed to turn up at the Indian game event but if they do then Zen (from India) seems likely to be revealed there.

You are correct on saying that there are no leads on Dhalsim. People pulled that straight out of their ass.

 

[Scotia]

I like Sodom too , Twelve can go die. But I dont really see popularity changing all that much for them.

Oh and THawk and Dee Jay too , how did they get into SSF4? Lol.

I find Twelve quirky. He's not an outright favourite by any means, but I still like him.

I fucking despise T-Hawk though. What a terrible fucking character.

 

[DryEyeRelief]

and honestly the argument here is that "people won't be attracted to the game if all they see is old characters...so they should put in this slightly less old character".

They make that argument because the slightly less old character is actually new to them. But it's a new character with a proof of concept. It's like a kickstarter fund goal.

The nonsense about having an even distribution of characters from sf2/sf3/alpha is just a veil for their actual concern, which is having characters that weren't in sf4. ie "i'm tired of playing this 20 year old character for 7 years already" 7 years huh? Wow what game was released seven years ago? Did you start playing back then?

that's the hilarious part. this obsession about even representation and tried characters when all you've played is street fighter 4 and maybe x tekken.

 

[Geminosity]

Sakura,Cody,Guy,Rolento are still in the "Popular" category. Before they were added to SSF4 and SFxT they were topping polls.
Ditto with Elena,Poison,Hugo but now they have gone down a little.

All am saying is , there are popular characters and unpopular characters. Yea there are characters that not many people like at all like Birdie,Sodom,Twelve,SF 1 characters.


You get my point , but hey you can twist it and make exceptions if you want to prove people wrong.

So now you claim characters are either popular or not? The point you were making was that it wasn't that clear cut and that absence was apparently an important factor. If you don't even stand by your own point then I don't have to disprove it, because you're doing that yourself already :3

 

[ExVicis]

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

Projecting?

Maybe for you that's the case but I've brought up the popularity poll on stuff on characters I DO like and would want in this game but are very very VERY low on that poll (rip Sodom).

 

[pizzacat]

this is like the same as smash threads at this point lol.

who cares

popularity, what seems "right" is thrown out the window.

imo if the character meshes well with the games mechanics its a good choice that they are there and no one has really crossed the line or seem out of place with how it plays

 

[Shadoken]

You just said that characters are either popular or not. The point you were making was that it wasn't that clear cut and that absence was apparently an important factor. If you don't even stand by your own point then I don't have to disprove it, because you're doing that yourself already :3

But I just proved how absence is a point. When Poison,Elena,Rolento and Hugo were top spots Pre-SFxT and then dropped after SFxT.
The same thing is going to happen to Karin and Mika with SF5.

I just agreed that there are some 'unpopular' characters who are never going to make it to the top of these polls like SF1,Birdie..etc.

But after Birdie redesign idk , he may also end up being very popular.
Same thing can happen even with Sodom and people might like him a lot after being re-introduced in SFV.

Btw I am agreeing that there are Popular and unpopular characters, What I meant is that the poll isn't a definitive thing that "This character is the most popular ever"
It keeps changing. Today Karin might be more popular than Sakura , but I can bet you after SF V Sakura will be back on top.

 

[SephLuis]

The Street Fighter V panel is tomorrow, so we don't know for sure.

NYCC panel is tomorrow. Character reveal will happen there. Capcom aren't confirmed to turn up at the Indian game event but if they do then Zen (from India) seems likely to be revealed there.

You are correct on saying that there are no leads on Dhalsim. People pulled that straight out of their ass.

I am lost in time >.>

I thought the announcement was just the stage.

Did they confirm a character for tomorrow ?

 

[ThirtyPlus]

this is like the same as smash threads at this point lol.

who cares

This game doesn't come out for 6 months.

We have nothing else.

 

[Scotia]

I am lost in time >.>

I thought the announcement was just the stage.

Did they confirm a character for tomorrow ?

No but Ono's there and they almost always announce a character at NYCC. Nothing's certain but there is a chance.

 

[Geminosity]

But I just proved how absence is a point. When Poison,Elena,Rolento and Hugo were top spots Pre-SFxT and then dropped after SFxT.
The same thing is going to happen to Karin and Mika with SF5.

I just agreed that there are some 'unpopular' characters who are never going to make it to the top of these polls like SF1,Birdie..etc.

But after Birdie redesign idk , he may also end up being very popular.

Same thing can happen even with Sodom and people might like him a lot after being re-introduced in SFV.

By the same argument you make that birdie and sodom being in SF5 might AID their popularity due to the redesign and whatnot it's entirely possible that the statement 'The same thing is going to happen to Karin and Mika' may not play out so you're kind of contradicting your own train of thought within a single post :/

Also whatever 'drop' happened to the characters you mention, they're still High on the charts. The minutiae of exactly where might've changed but they're still 'popular' which means that the bigger picture of the poll is still valid.

 

[Dremark]

You can leave Sakura, Cody, Guy and Rolento out of as many games as you like and i'd still never vote for them. I get the whole 'absence makes the heart grow fonder' argument but lets be honest, if that were the be all and end all wouldn't Birdie have been super voted instead of lying dead at the bottom of the poll? Or does this 'rule' only magically work on certain characters so all the ones that inconveniently debunk it don't count?

I don't really understand why people keep acting like Karin is some unpopular character that no one ever cared about. She always seemed popular when Alpha 3 was out and the Japanese polls linked in the previous thread had her rather high as well.

The fact she hasn't been around likely did increase her demand, she probably isn't more popular than Ryu and Sakura in Japan for example) but I really doubt it created it.

 

[Shadoken]

This is going nowhere, since we have no leads that point to Dhalsim, except an event that's going to happen in India (if I am not mistaken).

Since they didn't showed Guile at NYCC, it could anyone's guess by now.
Maybe it will be Dhalsim, maybe it will be another SF2 veteran. Maybe they will throw a curveball and it's no one from SF2.

At this point, everyone is rooting for their favorites.

Untrue , the reason many people are thinking Dhalsim is because.

There is a very good chance the character is from SF 2. The game desperately needs some Zoners now so that would lead to Sagat,Guile and Dhalsim.

Now its not like Sagat and Guile CANNOT be in , but just that the chances of Dhalsim is higher. Hes more unique and Guile although completely different from Charlie , does share many visual design similarities with him. Same case with Sagat and shotos. Dhalsim is easily the most unique out of the bunch.

 

[Shadoken]

Also whatever 'drop' happened to the characters you mention, they're still High on the charts. The minutiae of exactly where might've changed but they're still 'popular' which means that the bigger picture of the poll is still valid.

That is what I am agreeing with you on. The Poll is a good guideline in the bigger picture , but its not some kind of definitive list. Where the top 10 characters should be in every SF game or something.

Characters move up and down frequently , but they mostly remain in the same "TIer" if that makes sense.

Edit-
And Btw Mika and Karin didnt get as big of a redesign as Birdie. They were already popular so Capcom didnt want to screw them up, Birdie was open for Capcom to play around with. Which is why his poisition in the poll can change more drastically.

 

[Geminosity]

That is what I am agreeing with you on. The Poll is a good guideline in the bigger picture , but its not some kind of definitive list. Where the top 10 characters should be in every SF game or something.

Characters move up and down frequently , but they mostly remain in the same "TIer" if that makes sense.

Yeah, I'd agree with that but was anyone arguing against that point?

 

[BokehKing]

Untrue , the reason many people are thinking Dhalsim is because.

There is a very good chance the character is from SF 2. The game desperately needs some Zoners now so that would lead to Sagat,Guile and Dhalsim.

Now its not like Sagat and Guile CANNOT be in , but just that the chances of Dhalsim is higher. Hes more unique and Guile although completely different from Charlie , does share many visual design similarities with him. Same case with Sagat and shotos. Dhalsim is easily the most unique out of the bunch.

If anyone needs a refresh, it's guile, dude has two moves
Bless him with some moves, have the panel get interrupted by Guile's theme and drop that character introduction video

 

[Shadoken]

Yeah, I'd agree with that but was anyone arguing against that point?

Then all these SF2 characters are still "popular" right ? Why are people complaining about them. Dhalsim could be the exception just like Birdie for the Alpha cast.

 

[Mik317]

I think Balrog is the guy people are ignoring in terms of a SF2 returnee.

 

[Shadoken]

If anyone needs a refresh, it's guile, dude has two moves
Bless him with some moves, have the panel get interrupted by Guile's theme and drop that character introduction video

But thats what makes Guile though , dude with two moves gonna kick your ass. No gimmicks no BS. Straight up fundamentals.

 

[ExVicis]

I think Balrog is the guy people are ignoring in terms of a SF2 returnee.

I've noticed that too. Does Balrog not count? Why are people suddenly forgetting him when discussing returning people from SF2?

 

[Gunslinger]

But thats what makes Guile though , dude with two moves gonna kick your ass. No gimmicks no BS. Straight up fundamentals.

I agree. If anyone wants to learn SF use guile. Best way to learn about the basics of any fighting game.

 

[pizzacat]

If anyone needs a refresh, it's guile, dude has two moves
Bless him with some moves, have the panel get interrupted by Guile's theme and drop that character introduction video

he only needs those 2 honestly

 

[Momentary]

Oh lets cut the bs. this isn't about popularity. This is about character I like isn't in the game, character I don't like is.

I'm obsessed with the lore of street fighter and don't like the superficial characters from street fighter 2, so I need to come up with some sort of contrived reasoning for why they don't belong and attempt to vindicate my own personal views with arguments about popularity.

This is the best post out of both threads.