• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

Hey Bernie Sanders supporters, how do you think he will deal with these hurdles?

Status
Not open for further replies.
that link is already time-stamped but if it doesn't go there because you're on mobile scrub to 7m59s

also I don't think it's a negative thing that some of his views align with the Republican party because the views that do are good for America as a whole. I think it just speaks to the strength of his platform.

here's a video on the topic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwDY2rO9lWM

Yeah, thanks for that. I am on mobile but I'll check these out.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not against supporting a Republican policy when it's right. I just thought it was funny because it's an argument I've never heard in support of Bernie.
 
I think Bernie Sanders has a much better shot at the general than he does at the primary. While Hillary Clinton is certainly more electable, a huge amount of Americans agree with his policies, and in early match-up polls he stands better than Hillary Clinton against Trump, Bush, or Rubio.

That being said, the odds are still against him. If Hillary's shot at beating a Republican in the general is 70/30, Bernie Sanders' is probably 40/60.

Yeah, I'm in agreement here. He would have a hard time in the general.
 
Yeah, thanks for that. I am on mobile but I'll check these out.

And don't get me wrong, I'm not against supporting a Republican policy when it's right. I just thought it was funny because it's an argument I've never heard in support of Bernie.

it's not really Republican policies (I think I worded that wrong), it's just basic issues where the country seems to be largely unified.

stuff like free public college, an infrastructure jobs program, and expanding social security.
 
Also, this idea that we Dems are unbeatable in the General regardless of who we put up scares the shit out of me. 2008 was always low hanging fruit after the disaster that was Shrub the Lesser. 2012 was ours because it is hard to unseat an incumbent. Yes, states are trending towards us. Yes the GOP is it's own worst enemy. However, we can lose if we push too far too fast.
 
Hate to break it to you, but he's still not going to beat her. And it won't even be remotely close when the delegates are counted.

It's already getting rocky on the right, and it's doing absolutely nothing to help us fix our system of government. If the same happens on the left, it will be every bit as unproductive.

Oh I don't think he has much chance either, but he's interesting and I want to see him make an impact.

Do you mean unproductive like Congress failing to pass legislation or major systemic reforms? Rocky to me is like 1964 Civil Rights Act, they have to send the army places to quiet citizen revolt. I don't think the two party system is going to go away via peaceful reform, it will involve things actually getting bad.
 
Sanders has amazing message discipline, but yeah, his mainstream appeal is up in the air, at the very least. Also, there's a fine line between passionate, experienced voice of the people, and grumpy, red faced old man yelling at clouds. His refusal to discuss anything but intricately nuanced economic policy in interviews may play well with, like, 8% of the national electorate, and makes him a great candidate for labor secretary, but he's also auditioning to be the most recognizable figure of government in terms of diplomatic relations, social disaster response, and just about every other topic of import that isn't just a nerdy, substantive debate about inequality. The people demand competence and seriousness, sure, but there's other parts of the game he just isn't interested in that can't be brushed off without consequence (but Hillary has her own problems with this dynamic, too). The log cabin myth is something all candidates have to deal with sooner or later, but he's less equipped to negotiate that hurdle than others, I think.

But his lack of office holding surrogates that can play bad cop rhetorically and prep events for him cross country with donors in less than 48 hours is his biggest drag compared to his primary competitor. Big crowds are nice, but big money actually puts you in the oval office, if we're talking real politick, here.
 
Also, this idea that we Dems are unbeatable in the General regardless of who we put up scares the shit out of me. 2008 was always low hanging fruit after the disaster that was Shrub the Lesser. 2012 was ours because it is hard to unseat an incumbent. Yes, states are trending towards us. Yes the GOP is it's own worst enemy. However, we can lose if we push too far too fast.

Shrub the Lesser might not actually be, after that recent gaffe where Jeb! referred to his superPAC as "we" and quickly "corrected" himself. I mean, the entire premise that we have to pretend these candidates aren't involved with their superPAC's is a fucking farce and it's ridiculous it's gone on this long.
 
People are seriously underestimating Bernie's SWAG. That will be key in this race.
 
Moderate and/or disillusioned Republicans are not going to become Sandersites. Outside of some mildly pro-gun tendencies, there's virtually nothing that Bernie Sanders stands for that appeals to anyone on the right. At all.

The idea that Bernie Sanders holds some sort of massive crossover appeal is a complete fantasy.

Anecdotal here, but I have several friends who have been whining about Obama and the impending Hillary reign for years. Each of them are disgusted with the Republican party and very disappointed there isn't anyone competent leading the pack there. So who are they looking at?

Sanders.

Some exact quotes from just a few of them:

"Yeah he wants to take all my money but at least he's not a lying bastard and out of his mind with this abortion shit."

"I don't know how he thinks he's going to pay for all the things he's talking about but at least he's not out there embarrassing Christians."

"My registered party is a joke right now but at least Sanders isn't Hillary."

So yeah, I know its anecdotal because these are some of my personal friends, but this has been my experience when talking with them about Sanders. None of them come at me with the burning rage for Sanders like they seem to have over Hillary and/or Obama and none of them have anyone on the right that they don't think looks like a fool. The closest thing they have is Rubio and even then its like they grudgingly admit he's kind of a loser too. I'm telling you, there is an appeal that might not have existed had the right side had better candidates who weren't so obviously bought and paid for. There is a great distrust of our elected officials right now that reaches across party lines.

Also, for every woman out there who thinks "Oh I want Hillary to win so a woman can be president!" there are men out there who think "Oh, I would rather have Sanders win because he's a man."
 
Shrub the Lesser might not actually be, after that recent gaffe where Jeb! referred to his superPAC as "we" and quickly "corrected" himself. I mean, the entire premise that we have to pretend these candidates aren't involved with their superPAC's is a fucking farce and it's ridiculous it's gone on this long.

another reason why I think Bernie is attractive to the general public. he is vocal against superPACs and has raised about as much as any of the GOP candidates with an average donation of like $20-30. he's the people's champ!
 
i hope that Bernie shakes hilary enough for her to adopt some of his policies, but I admit I'd be legitimately shook at a Rubio or Jeb vs Bernie scenario in the general
 
Anecdotal here, but I have several friends who have been whining about Obama and the impending Hillary reign for years. Each of them are disgusted with the Republican party and very disappointed there isn't anyone competent leading the pack there. So who are they looking at?

Sanders.

Some exact quotes from just a few of them:

"Yeah he wants to take all my money but at least he's not a lying bastard and out of his mind with this abortion shit."

"I don't know how he thinks he's going to pay for all the things he's talking about but at least he's not out there embarrassing Christians."

"My registered party is a joke right now but at least Sanders isn't Hillary."

So yeah, I know its anecdotal because these are some of my personal friends, but this has been my experience when talking with them about Sanders. None of them come at me with the burning rage for Sanders like they seem to have over Hillary and/or Obama and none of them have anyone on the right that they don't think looks like a fool. The closest thing they have is Rubio and even then its like they grudgingly admit he's kind of a loser too. I'm telling you, there is an appeal that might not have existed had the right side had better candidates who weren't so obviously bought and paid for. There is a great distrust of our elected officials right now that reaches across party lines.

Also, for every woman out there who thinks "Oh I want Hillary to win so a woman can be president!" there are men out there who think "Oh, I would rather have Sanders win because he's a man."
The problem with that is Bernie hasn't actually been attacked very much in the media. If he becomes the candidate, the guns will come out on him.

I mean, do your friends actually know Bernie is pro-choice, and he can't embarrass Christians because he's Jewish? Moreover if these people are somewhat apathetic about Bernie, do you think they are actually going to be gung-ho supporting him in a third party, which is what L.B. Jeffries is trying to argue?

You can't build a lasting party with just anti-establishment resentment. There has to be actual policies that the people who would join the party support.
 
It's like Sanders most vocal defenders have never followed politics before this and don't understand the mechanisms in place that make him getting the democratic nomination next to impossible. Vote for him in the primary if that makes you feel better, but don't throw a hissy fit and vote 3rd party to spite Clinton in the general election. This election is too important to do so.
 
i hope that Bernie shakes hilary enough for her to adopt some of his policies, but I admit I'd be legitimately shook at a Rubio or Jeb vs Bernie scenario in the general

For morbid curiosity I kinda wish I could view the alternate universe outcome of a Sanders/??? vs Rubio/Kaisch general election.
 
It's like Sanders most vocal defenders have never followed politics before this and don't understand the mechanisms in place that make him getting the democratic nomination next to impossible. Vote for him in the primary if that makes you feel better, but don't throw a hissy fit and vote 3rd party to spite Clinton in the general election. This election is too important to do so.

Basically, I know Clinton isn't the most popular on the internet but she'll do good and defiantly better than a Republican. People have got to realize that it's more about the party than the people.
 
Man, a lot of the rhetoric I see around hardcore Bernie supporters sound a lot like Tea Partiers. No compromise, no backing down.

Kind of scares me because I think that kind of attitude doesn't belong in politics at all.
 
Man, a lot of the rhetoric I see around hardcore Bernie supporters sound a lot like Tea Partiers. No compromise, no backing down.

Kind of scares me because I think that kind of attitude doesn't belong in politics at all.

I've stopped telling people I support Sanders at all. I love the guy and I'm rooting for him in the primary, but I'm tired of the conversations that always follow - both positive and negative. It's always the same "you know he can't win right" and negative stuff about even supporting him in the primary (which is entirely unnecessary and the idea that supporting him right now is bad is ridiculous, because otherwise we'd just have Clinton running a center right safety campaign) which is followed with the cringe inducing white Reddit bro-liberal talking points "he marched with Martin Luther King he's the best hope for minority populations."

Can't win in that situation, man.
 
I'm voting for Sanders (in NJ, btw) because he's going to keep the focus on the issues and pull Hillary to the left. I'm tired of the DNC acting like they need to pull to the right to win. It's antithetical to the needs of the country, and it isn't what the people say they actually want when they're polled on the issues. Also, Bernie is getting people excited about the possibilities of a responsibly run government and has been registering voters - a net positive no matter what. I don't particularly care who we end up with as a nominee. Hillary will most likely take it, but I don't see any GOP nom beating any Dem nom.
 
I see far more "Sanders supporters say this" than I actually see Sanders supporters saying anything. At least around here.

The "Bernie or Bust" group is an extremely small one. Quit trying to manufacture excuses for a potential Clinton loss.
 
I'm still going to vote for him because I want an open socialist to get a lot of support because hopefully that moves the party left in the future knowing those values are shared by a lot of the democratic base, but I'm secretly hoping sanders doesn't win.

I think Sanders would be a great dictator but I'm worried about even if by a miracle he ends up with the presidency, that his own base will turn on him once he isn't able to do the majority of things he has such a strong conviction for. I don't think sanders has the ability to make moderate, incremental improvements look good like Obama or Hillary can. All the people galvanized by him I think will tune out because many don't seem willing to accept compromise or other ideals, as we've seen on social media by his support relentlessly attacking people for supporting lesser candidates who won't make real change happen like sanders will. If real change doesn't come as fast as they want, what will they do?

I feel like we'll get Jimmy Carter'ed going with him.. His outsider image will make it easy to pin anything that goes wrong as his doing, and the Repubs will sweep the White House in 2020

Maybe I'm crazy but that's what I envision happening. I don't like Hillary as a person as much as sanders but I think the future of the party long term is probably better off in her hands.. Maybe..
 
I see far more "Sanders supporters say this" than I actually see Sanders supporters saying anything. At least around here.

The "Bernie or Bust" group is an extremely small one. Quit trying to manufacture excuses for a potential Clinton loss.

Who are you talking to in this thread?
 
Who are you talking to in this thread?

It's like Sanders most vocal defenders have never followed politics before this and don't understand the mechanisms in place that make him getting the democratic nomination next to impossible. Vote for him in the primary if that makes you feel better, but don't throw a hissy fit and vote 3rd party to spite Clinton in the general election. This election is too important to do so.

Basically, I know Clinton isn't the most popular on the internet but she'll do good and defiantly better than a Republican. People have got to realize that it's more about the party than the people.

Man, a lot of the rhetoric I see around hardcore Bernie supporters sound a lot like Tea Partiers. No compromise, no backing down.

Kind of scares me because I think that kind of attitude doesn't belong in politics at all.

I dunno
 
Because capitalism has done a metric shit ton to reduce poverty and suffering around the world. It works better than the alternatives, it simply needs to be regulated because it has a lot of rough edges.

have you looked around America lately? because that's the country we're talking about and capitalism has done a metric shit ton to increase poverty and suffering in our own country.
 

Heh heh. Good show.

I'm a pretty vocal Bernie supporter, but I've never said I wouldn't vote for Hillary if it comes to that in the general. I have only seen that sentiment expressed like twice on this board and God help me, I can't stay out of the Bernie threads here.
 
Clinton was the 11th most liberal member of congress

People act like she is a republican in democratic clothing. She isn't as liberal as Bernie, which is why she is electable in a national election.

We're in a political landscape where the most disastrous example of American socialism in the modern era, Obamacare, the subject of 70+ votes and an actual government shutdown, was something the Republicans themselves invented in the 90's. Being to "the left" nowadays is basically being a moderate not so long ago. Also, it's not just about pulling Hillary to the left, but the DNC. When they decide on which congressional and gubernatorial candidates to support, they need to quit acting like independants are centrists, looking for wimps.

They need to take a lesson from a outspoken lefty like Al Franken whose reelection was a breeze, despite that being against 'conventional wisdom', and doing so where Obama suffers low approval ratings. Hmm, maybe his low ratings have something to do with him capitulating too much, rather than him being too far left. After all, Obama did see a sizable and long-lasting bump in his ratings once he started going after the GOP directly this past December.
 
I expect Bernie to...

Sweep-the-leg-e1444567060982.jpg


Hillary is going to need a Body Bag. And Jeb/Trump/Carson are just plain road kill.
 
Your question implies we should vote for who we think will win. Anything can happen. Just support the candidate you like and we'll see what happens after the primary.
 
Is anyone going to make the OT for the debate tonight? I'd do it but I'm at work and won't be able to make it good like the Republican ones were.
 

Daniel B·;181379104 said:
I think you might be underestimating the possibility of an unprecedented landslide, in Bernie's favor, when more and more people discover that Bernie Sanders is a very rare bird, a politician who is not part of the "political class" and who would actually fight for politicies that are in the best interests of everyday Americans, not Corporations and the super rich, that would make America a great nation again, for current and future generations.

The "socialist" label is inconsequential. People who fear such label, which Sanders hasn't even embraced calling himself a "democratic socialist" instead, are the same people who think Obama is a muslim. Demographics are set in democrats advantage.

Well, so was his competing with Hillary Clinton a few months ago. You want to argue for the status quo, go for it. I don't think the kind of systemic change you're proposing we wait for happens without things getting a bit rocky.

They may be in reference to these, all from the first page.
 
I supported bernie at first and I'm black. Yet after seeing how him and his movement handle certain things that aren't even BLM he's not taking on hilary. I'm not gonna say it's impossible but if he can't get his shit together it won't be like obama like some keep trying to compare him too.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom