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[The Lamp]

I just got done playing through U1 thanks to the PS4 collection. Pretty much every single scenario where Nathan had to shoot a gun could be argued as a self-defense situation. In fact, for most of the game, he just wants to escape that fucking island and pirates keep trying to murder him wherever he goes. If he didn't kill people, he would never have left that island. He even tried to save Eddy.

I'm about to play through U2 and U3 again after years (going through U3 first because I want to save the best for last). I realize that these games are a bit more gruesome because Nathan uses stealth to stalk and kill people and he's trying to get treasure and will kill whatever tries to stop him, but I wouldn't say it's cold-blooded. He just eliminates whatever is going to try to stop him or kill him. In Istanbul, he was worried about using real guns against innocent security guards.

I don't really get where people get the impression that he's a bloodthirsty serial killer. He's just doing what he's gotta do to get his treasure and/or save the world from a psycho villain ready to unleash unstoppable supernatural chaos. He uses violence when he needs to save his loved ones or get to where he needs to, and that often leads to goons dying. He's constantly in situations where he's outnumbered and would definitely be murdered or imprisoned if captured, so of course he's gonna shoot people up.

Idk I guess I just don't get why people are hung up about an action movie caricature killing bad guys anyway?

 

[hydrophilic attack]

He willingly got into situations where he'd need to kill hundreds to survive

 

[Symphonia]

 

[Dusk Golem]

There's a few scenes as the series goes on where it wasn't specifically what he needed to do.

I think Uncharted just got picked out because the hero is supposed to be this kind of charming adventurer, yet he's killed hundreds if not thousands of people. A lot of games do this, but he sort of got picked out due to the importance/popularity of his games and how it sort of contrasts the image painted of his characters. But, videogames.

 

[Savantcore]

I was shocked to find out that this is actually a serious debate that people have.

It's a video game. Dumb shit doesn't make sense.

 

[FantasticMrFoxdie]

I always thought it was just a joke people threw in there. Mostly famous because of that one comic where he pulls the guy off the ledge.

edit: yep that one above. lol at people taking it seriously.

 

[OléGunner]

Only when I joined Gaf did I find out people had issues with a treasure seeking action hero killing bad guys.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Yeah I don't get it either. Action game protagonist kills tons of mooks who violently attack him. Well... duh?

The dissonance is far worse in Tomb Raider (2013), because she acts all remorseful at killing a dear, and ten twenty minutes later she's doing gruesome shotgun executions and yelling "come at me, assholes" (paraphrased).

Edit: I feel the hypocrisy/dissonance between the game's narrative and the game's content is even worse in MGS. "War is such a terrible thing and eats away at our humanity blah blah blah... oh here, pick up this sweet, sweet customized gun full of cool badass parts". lol umm

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

I don't think many people take it as seriously as you feel they do. Just a joke that got overused

 

[jg4xchamp]

Because the concept of him being this vanilla Everyman type cat went completely out the window in the context of an action game. ND does a lot with a pretty generic character and poor man Hollywood scripts, but the sheer ridiculousness of how detached the game can be from the story became a bit much to swallow.

Drake wasn't the first, he is just like one of the first few where people actively pointed out how silly it all is.

 

[Eggbok]

 

[Beelzebufo]

I was shocked to find out that this is actually a serious debate that people have.

It's a video game. Dumb shit doesn't make sense.

It makes perfect sense though, he's just a violent murderer.

 

[Hektor]

He kills around 800 people per game (It shows your stats) and gets his loved ones into danger multiple times in the search of some treasure, he's actively getting himself into combat situations that could be easily avoided by just not going where people are that you know will start shooting at you.

Evidently some treasure is more important to him, than his, his friends and his enemys life.

I don't think many people take it as seriously as you feel they do. Just a joke that got overused

I wouldnt call it a joke, but i personally just enjoy the discussion and arguments about such things. You dont always have to discuss serious issues about sexism or companys next big fuckup.

 

[The Lamp]

I don't think many people take it as seriously as you feel they do. Just a joke that got overused

Perhaps. It's hard to tell what is serious and what's not over the Internet sometimes.

 

[SSReborn]

Lazarevic was my uncle

 

[brickarts295]

Okay...so what was he suppose to do in that situation, because any other way I see it, either that dude dies or Nate dies.

 

[OrlanisWorks]

His personality is... fucking weird. He's a charmer and sometimes comes off being a little sensitive, but will kill everyone in his way except the Bin Laden bad guy, whom he would try to save from quick sand or would not intentionally kill for... reasons?

Uncharted is pretty weird, guys.

e: I wouldn't call him an asshole because he kills a lot of people. He's an asshole because he generally treats the people around him like shit to fertilize his adventures.

e:

How many people would have died if he didn't stop the supernatural villains in all 3 games?

Technically, not many, since they only found the supernatural stuff by way of Nate's super smarts.

 

[Beelzebufo]

Okay...so what was he suppose to do in that situation, because any other way I see it, either that dude dies or Nate dies.

He climbs up the ledge and joins the guy?

 

[Head.spawn]

Okay...so what was he suppose to do in that situation, because any other way I see it, either that dude dies or Nate dies.

Go home and be a family man?

 

[The Lamp]

He kills around 800 people per game (It shows your stats) and gets his loved ones into danger multiple times in the search of some treasure, he's actively getting himself into combat situations that could be easily avoided by just not going where people are that you know will start shooting at you.

Evidently some treasure is more important to him, than his, his friends and his enemys life.

I feel like most of the time he's trapped in a linearly designed level where bad guys are patrolling the map lol. And every once in a while his partner gets kidnapped.

How many people would have died if he didn't stop the supernatural villains in all 3 games?

 

[Always-honest]

I was shocked to find out that this is actually a serious debate that people have.

Indeed...

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Do people say the same thing about the Shadow of Mordor dude? Talion or whatever his generic name was. The orc kills are really gruesome, you can slaughter tons and tons of uruk, and you can even basically mind-rape with some of them your wraith powers into giving you info.

I guess it's okay because they're Uruks, or something. xD

 

[Rutti]

To me it's not the part where he is shooting people. It's the part before that. Drake knows that to get some treasure he has to go through an army to get it and he decides it's worth to kill hundreds of people to get this treasure instead of dropping it going to find something else.

 

[Auto-Reply]

He sometimes has just too much fun when disposing of enemies, now and then his true self appears for a split second on screen when he starts laughing like a child after kicking an enemy down to his death. He catches himself quickly and hides the insanity inside again before anybody becomes truly aware of it.

If the guy was a real human being I would be very careful around him and very, very afraid!

 

[Ranma]

honestly i don't care. it's a videogame. Otherwise I also should feel sorry for all the aliens i killed in Doom.

 

[Beelzebufo]

Do people say the same thing about the Shadow of Mordor dude? Talion or whatever his generic name was. The orc kills are really gruesome, you can slaughter tons and tons of uruk, and you can even basically mind-rape with some of them your wraith powers into giving you info.

I guess it's okay because they're Uruks, or something. xD

I mean people say it's weird that Uruks are so terribly treated in tLotR too if that's what you mean.

So Nathan Drake is like Wario but more grusomely violent I guess? Or Indiana Jones if he killed like 100x the amount of people?

 

[Replicant]

Because they're crazies with no sense of originality whatsoever. It started when in UC2, the villain of the game compared Drake to himself, who's a mass murderer. All because Drake, God Forbid, defend himself from getting killed by shooting back at those who persistently shoot at him (even when things are collapsing around them).

Who'd think a villain would try to justify himself using the most irrational argument? Apparently there are those who bought this delusion.

 

[Coffee Dog]

If Indiana Jones was straight up annihilating wave after wave of dudes, people would be questioning his morality and lifestyle as well. The truth is, nathan is less believably a "treasure hunter" when most of the runtime is spent in gun combat.

I was shocked to find out that this is actually a serious debate that people have.

It's a video game. Dumb shit doesn't make sense.

Surprisingly, some people want to hold these sorts of things to a higher standard than "It's a video game."

It's something that prevents people from taking the story seriously, which is a big deal in a Naughty Dog game that is entirely a railroaded story.

 

[Hot Coldman]

It's more like he gives a disproportionate amounts of fucks for the trail of bodies he leaves for someone positioned so much as an likeable everyman.

That said, the series has never asked to be taken that seriously, so it's hard to take that factor seriously too. It's Uncharted, not Undertale.

 

[Dusk Golem]

I'm also going to throw out there since Uncharted 4 is the final game in the series and I do think the people at Naughty Dog are fairly self-aware, and with this being the closing game, I have some expectations we may be digging a bit into the mental state of Nathan and the effects all of this has had on him. Call it my suspicion.

Personally, I don't think it's an issue, just kind of a silly thing that does create some dissonance, but not in a bad way per say. But I just feel this may actually be explored in the fourth game, some sneaking suspicion again.

 

[Beelzebufo]

I hope Uncharted 4 has dragons because dragons are cool and it's a video game. The dragon could be all like brawghhhh 🔥🔥🔥🐉

 

[Skelter]

honestly i don't care. it's a videogame. Otherwise I also should feel sorry for all the aliens i killed in Doom.

But Doom doesn't suck its own dick by calling itself a cinematic experience. If the devs want to treat their game like s movie then people will call out the bullshit like in a movie.

 

[KevinCow]

I don't know about yearning to kill people, but a person who has killed that many people, even in self defense, would be seriously fucked up psychologically. That fact that he's never shown a lick of remorse over the fact that he's killed thousands of people tells me that he's kind of a sociopath.

 

[GRaider81]

honestly people read too much into stuff like this.

Almost every video game ever has a violent murdering protagonist if we are going down that road.

 

[Mivey]

I think this debates stems from the very obvious fact that modern games are trying to portray the characters in a more believable light, while not changing anything about the actual content that most of them are about: Killing a lot of people.

It's nice that more and more players ask themselves: "You know, why do we have to kill just so many people in games? Isn't' there, I dunno, more out there?"

At least that's what I like to believe is going on. Maybe it's just the usual Internet outrage culture, without any deeper thought behind it.

 

[Footos22]

The guy lands in the water and swims to shore if you look down, try harder next time.

 

[Hektor]

Do people say the same thing about the Shadow of Mordor dude? Talion or whatever his generic name was. The orc kills are really gruesome, you can slaughter tons and tons of uruk, and you can even basically mind-rape with some of them your wraith powers into giving you info.

I guess it's okay because they're Uruks, or something. xD

That dudes entire personality is summed up as "That guy who wants revenge", so yeah, i would call him that as well.

I feel like most of the time he's trapped in a linearly designed level where bad guys are patrolling the map lol.

But he could just go home, get a safe job and be a family man. Or you the player could just put the gamepad down. You dont have to play UC, you only do that because you want to. The only way to win the game is not to play it.

How many people would have died if he didn't stop the supernatural villains in all 3 games?

But the supernatural villains only really show themselfs as such very late into the games.

 

[ChaoticBlue]

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

 

[AniHawk]

I was shocked to find out that this is actually a serious debate that people have.

It's a video game. Dumb shit doesn't make sense.

i think people have a disconnect with 'bestwritinginagame!' and general naughty dog praise and then playing the game to see this guy who's kind of at odds with what his character is supposed to be (male adventurer fantasy man guy thing).

like you could have nathan drake be an awesome antagonist who's just kind of a sarcastic asshole while he kills people in search for treasure. and then like you could have an indiana jones type who's all it belongs in a museum and has to stop him except he's like charming and stuff.

 

[Dusk Golem]

The guy lands in the water and swims to shore if you look down, try harder next time.

Wasn't that patched in later after attention was brought to it, as a sort of funny edit if I recall?

(again, I don't think this is an issue at all, I just find it kind of humorous and interesting.)

 

[Coffee Dog]

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

Surprisingly, not all games have to be about shooting lots of mans.

I mean yeah, it wouldn't sell nearly as much, but then we're just agreeing that Naughty Dog compromises all sorts of things in the name of cash. :^)

 

[Hektor]

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

They dont have to. The Sims works fine without fighting people.

 

[SSReborn]

When Drake looks up at the mirror he realizes that all along he was really... Kratos.

 

[GeoGonzo]

I don't think anyone who calls him bloodthirsty is being serious, just poking fun at the ridiculous body count.

In a tangent, I think the last Tomb Raider did it better, if only due to a couple of lines where she mentions how, after the first few kills, killing people felt scarily easy. In a way she's lampshading the ludonarrative dissonance, which isn't as perfect as avoiding it (if that is even possible while keeping the game exciting?)... but to me it felt slightly better than what Uncharted does, which is not acknowledging it.

 

[neogaffer1]

Okay...so what was he suppose to do in that situation, because any other way I see it, either that dude dies or Nate dies.

nate could've climbed up the ledge and choked out the guy to make him go unconscious instead of throwing him off of a cliff for one

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

nonlethal attacks and takedowns tho. more games need sleep darts.

 

[Beelzebufo]

I think this debates stems from the very obvious fact that modern games are trying to portray the characters in a more believable light, while not changing anything about the actual content that most of them are about: Killing a lot of people.

It's nice that more and more players ask themselves: "You know, why do we have to kill just so many people in games? Isn't' there, I dunno, more out there?"

At least that's what I like to believe is going on. Maybe it's just the usual Internet outrage culture, without any deeper thought behind it.

I think that's it. It's why this is a little different than "Mario kills lots of turtles", Mario isn't a real guy and koopas aren't real turtles and the Mushroom Kingdom isn't earth. Like Nathan Drake kills more people than Arnold in Commando.

 

[AniHawk]

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

well yes and no. yes in a third-person shooter you do, but was third-person shooter really the best naughty dog could come up with for a swashbuckling adventure through different locales? i don't know why it couldn't have been more like a modern prince of persia.

then you have the last of us, which completely and totally makes sense in that world where it's kill or be killed. there's a matter of survival against the infected and normal people. the design and the story play together instead of against each other.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

Drake puts the thrill of treasure over the lives of his friends, so what are the lives of others to him?

 

[petghost]

it's a game. they have to place enemies in the levels for you to shoot at so the game can progress.

yeah i thought it had to do more with the disparity between the regular gameplay stuff and how they characterize drake... not something inherent to his character.

 

[Acquiescence]

If you've got a wife and kids, don't work as a mercenary. Simple as that.