Kindergarten Teacher Bans Legos For Boys Citing ‘Gender Equity’

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Magnetic_North said:
They are fucking Lego bricks!!

Sorry I tend not to swear but christ come on now

Ugh she's the type of person that gives feminism a bad name :(
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lmao why? if you think this gives feminism a bad name then you're probably looking for a reason for feminism to have a bad name in the first place.
 
Stumpokapow said:
My position is that if the story has some sort of broader ramifications or there's evidence it's part of some pattern or people are bringing up a broader issue, then it is the kind of news story people should consider posting. If it's just local ephemera, then I agree that regardless of politics it's not really worth spreading. I think we can determine which one of these it is by looking at the content of the story, the immediate reactions, and the path through which the story gained traction and spread.

I posted after the thread rapidly blew up with short, (mildly) angry responses. You can read the first page. Look for people who say something that's deeper than "This is a bad thing." Since that post, there has been more push-back, and we're closer to actually talking about something instead of just "+1 this is dumb". That's an improvement. I feel fine being judged as shamefully encouraging people to look at the context of this story more broadly rather than just instantly reacting to the story itself.
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I understand what you are trying to say. Its pointless to look at this story as anything but just an individual. It would be more alarming if this was a stance that a school overall would take.

My stance i guess is to sigh instead of get angry or upset at this. This seriously reads like an onion article...

A friend pointed out to me that the worst is that you can have any bs certificate to be a teacher. I don't want to take credit away from great teachers that are out there. But people that take extreme measures like this really harm education overall.
 
benicillin said:
lmao why? if you think this gives feminism a bad name then you're probably looking for a reason for feminism to have a bad name in the first place.
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Clarification: she's the type of person that people who are looking to wrongfully give feminism a bad name cite as their "evidence" for why feminism is bad.
 
brau said:
A friend pointed out to me that the worst is that you can have any bs certificate to be a teacher. I don't want to take credit away from great teachers that are out there. But people that take extreme measures like this really harm education overall.
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Such a strange conclusion. One of the follow up stories noted "Meanwhile, many in the community have stepped out to defend Keller, sharing stories of the positive impact she has made in her students' lives - girls and boys alike."

A well-appreciated teacher did a dumb thing for like twenty hours total. Do you sincerely believe that characterizing this case as "extreme" is taking a sober eye to the thing? For thirty minutes a day, for one month a week, she maybe gave the girls a little extra attention. What about the other three hours per day, for the rest of the nine months of the school year?

This case may or may not be emblematic of her overall teaching method, but we don't really have any evidence to indicate that it is. In fact, we do have testimony from actual parents with direct access to the situation that she's, on measure, a positive influence on their kids.
 
Brakke said:
Right but that's just the thing. You don't have a kid there. If the parents wanna care, sure totally. If the little island newsletter thinks it's relevant to the community, yeah fine, go for it.

This isn't some Great Looming Threat To Children Nationwide. This isn't some trend sweeping the nation. One teacher, wielding zero power, makes some kids play with their second-favorite toy for a little while and then the kids go home for lunch. The republic will stand tomorrow.

The symbolism on this one is so obvious. This is happening on an island. Those kids maybe don't play with LEGO when they're kids but by the time they get to high school that's #7 in the state. Or they're crossing the Sound to a school that probably offers computer science in a nation where few do. Hell, by the time they're in high school Bainbridge Island probably will offer CS, through TEALS or on their own.

"How should we educate our children?" -- especially with regard to gender roles -- is a worthy question. This case doesn't give us useful access to that question.
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Yeah, I don't have a kid there. My 'outrage' begins and ends in this thread stating my measured opinion on her methods. I'm not looking for her head. Why are you telling me not to care about something mildly?

People are talking about broader issues here in a reasonable way. They have accessed the question.
 
Reminds me of my French teacher from the ages of 12-15. Every day she'd start off by saying that we'd have to work extra hard because as a class of boys we were naturally less gifted than girls, and then she'd pull out some newspaper article to prove it. She'd have the statistic regarding how many more girls got 'A's than boys in the corner of the blackboard year round. She'd often rant about how the failure of girls' success in school to translate to running the country meant that each and every one of us was sexist, and what a good job we did of hiding that fact. And eventually she started calling us all by girls' names (Rory became Rosy, James became Jane etc) so we could see how 'humiliating' suffering gender discrimination was. (??? Don't ask, I never figured it out.)

Every day for three fucking years, god damn. I used to feel bad as a kid for hating her, because she was a grown up I knew she must have been at least a little right. It's only with the benefit of hindsight that I can see how sexist and hateful she was and that we shouldn't have had to put up with that. Not only that, I went from being talented at French as a child to failing my French class by 15 because I couldn't focus and she refused to teach us properly. Gah, makes me so mad.

Made me sceptical of feminism or things said under the guise of being 'feminist' or 'progressive' ever since.

Anyway, fuck this teacher.
 
Disappointing, even if she is now claiming that it was only a temporary rule in her class (still highly suspect.) I'm not sure I buy that girls need encouragement to play with LEGO. Do a little research and you'll see it is one of their biggest markets right now. LEGO has went hard after the girl market and the Friends and Disney Princess sets are among their biggest sellers. These LEGO toy sets are just as intricate in their building and creative experience, IMO (I think I know... I own a lot of them.)

If she wants to talk about equality though...

boys are two-thirds more likely than girls to have a learning disability.
boys are up to four times as likely than girls to have neurodevelopmental disorders such as autism.
boys are more than twice as likely than girls to have ADHD (up to 5x as likely according to some sources).
boys make up two-thirds of students in special-education and are 5x more likely to be classified as hyperactive.
Boys are more than twice as likely than girls to receive a prescription for antipsychotic medication regardless of age (to treat mental disorders, ADHD, etc.)
boys are 30% more likely to drop out of school than girls.
boys are outnumbered by girls in higher education later in life, making up 44% of bachelor degrees and 45% of graduate degrees holders respectively.

sources:
http://www.pbs.org/parents/raisingboys/school.html
http://www.nimh.nih.gov/news/scienc...psychotics-prescribed-regardless-of-age.shtml
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...e-likely-be-prescription-antipsychotics-girls
http://www.autism-help.org/points-gender-imbalance.htm

It doesn't stop there... you can find all kinds of worrying statistics about boys when it comes to their capabilities to learn and thrive in the classroom. Of course, our society is set up in a lot of ways to benefit males more, which is something we are continuing to address and improve on thankfully, but it doesn't change that the playing field is not level. While society may favor boys in a lot of ways, the deck is stacked against them academically. And teachers need to be sensitive to this.

Oh, and as a LEGO fan for ages I'd really be interested in LEGO's response to this if it starts to blow up anymore than it has. We do have lots of data that shows children who grow up with stimulating toys such as LEGO are more likely to go into STEM fields and other highly-skilled jobs, so I really don't think it's a trival thing to discourage any child from enjoying them.
 
My wife and I are about to have a little girl and we were casually walking through Toys R Us checking stuff out. The gender rolls are taught through toys at a very young age. There was maybe one small section of girl legos and the small section was still geared around building a house for a family. One of the barbie toys was hilariously awful. She was in a nice skirt with an apron on and high heels next to an oven / stovetop. Seeing all this was very overwhelming for us actually. We're not sure what we're going to do or how to combat this.

EDIT: I will echo the statement that the teacher should have just got rid of dolls if she found them to be useless.
 
Might have been mentioned before but why doesn't she just set the toys up as centers and rotate the groups in each center.

Then you integrate the kids and get them to play with different toys.
 
... but there is Lego for girls, like Rapunzel's Prison ... whoops, ehm, Creativity Tower

yFoHED0.jpg
 
I understand the mentality behind her actions, but the execution just feels really rotten. If you want to set aside time to encourage kids to broaden their horizons, go for it. But just bluntly saying 'you can't play with this' only breeds resentment. And the kids can pick up on that.
 
Lol, increasing gender equality by forcing only some children to play with specific toys or else. If I read this I'd personally buy every boy and girl in the class a Lego set and ask for the teachers firing.
 
Boys need the handicap.

Look at our patriarchy. What don't you understand? In order for the world to actually have gender equality, us men have to voluntarily take a hit in certain places. We'll live.

Mushroomer25 said:
I understand the mentality behind her actions, but the execution just feels really rotten. If you want to set aside time to encourage kids to broaden their horizons, go for it. But just bluntly saying 'you can't play with this' only breeds resentment. And the kids can pick up on that.
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I do, however, agree with this for the most part. Poor execution.
 
Zulithe said:
Disappointing, even if she is now claiming that it was only a temporary rule in her class (still highly suspect.) I'm not sure I buy that girls need encouragement to play with LEGO. Do a little research and you'll see it is one of their biggest markets right now. LEGO has went hard after the girl market and the Friends and Disney Princess sets are among their biggest sellers. These LEGO toy sets are just as intricate in their building and creative experience, IMO (I think I know... I own a lot of them.)

If she wants to talk about equality though...

boys are two-thirds more likely than girls to have a learning disability.
boys are up to four times as likely than girls to have neurodevelopmental disorders such as autism.
boys are more than twice as likely than girls to have ADHD (up to 5x as likely according to some sources).
boys make up two-thirds of students in special-education and are 5x more likely to be classified as hyperactive.
Boys are more than twice as likely than girls to receive a prescription for antipsychotic medication regardless of age (to treat mental disorders, ADHD, etc.)
boys are 30% more likely to drop out of school than girls.
boys are outnumbered by girls in higher education later in life, making up 44% of bachelor degrees and 45% of graduate degrees holders respectively.

sources:
http://www.pbs.org/parents/raisingboys/school.html
http://www.nimh.nih.gov/news/scienc...psychotics-prescribed-regardless-of-age.shtml
http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...e-likely-be-prescription-antipsychotics-girls
http://www.autism-help.org/points-gender-imbalance.htm

It doesn't stop there... you can find all kinds of worrying statistics about boys when it comes to their capabilities to learn and thrive in the classroom. Of course, our society is set up in a lot of ways to benefit males more, which is something we are continuing to address and improve on thankfully, but it doesn't change that the playing field is not level. While society may favor boys in a lot of ways, the deck is stacked against them academically. And teachers need to be sensitive to this.

Oh, and as a LEGO fan for ages I'd really be interested in LEGO's response to this if it starts to blow up anymore than it has. We do have lots of data that shows children who grow up with stimulating toys such as LEGO are more likely to go into STEM fields and other highly-skilled jobs, so I really don't think it's a trival thing to discourage any child from enjoying them.
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This is all very interesting. I didn't know we were so prone to not learning. I guess that would explain how i have no idea what i am doing most of the time.
 
Holy shit you people. She just wanted to give the girls some time with the Lego.

Lego is awesome, my daughter loves it, I ain't even mad about this. You people are pulling some 'all lives matter' with this backlash shit.
 
Fuck this teacher. You know as a child I was denied Legos? I always got to see other play with them and never me. I always felt unfairly singled out because they looked like the greatest thing to play with ever (and they are!) but I never got to touch them until finally my parents out of pity some years later bought me some.

So as someone who grew up denied to use of Legos for arbitrary reasons fuck this teacher. I hope she gets fired. This is unacceptable.
 
CrazyDude said:
It sounds more like she has a chip on her shoulder about men in general and is taking it out on the boys in her class. Sounds like she is using gender equality as an excuse to get away with it.
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Ding ding ding.

Only a hateful person would lie to a child and think what she thinks about hell freezing over before she makes good on a promise.

I hope she is made to walk on Legos for her crimes :)
 
ExVicis said:
Fuck this teacher. You know as a child I was denied Legos? I always got to see other play with them and never me. I always felt unfairly singled out because they looked like the greatest thing to play with ever (and they are!) but I never got to touch them until finally my parents out of pity some years later bought me some.

So as someone who grew up denied to use of Legos for arbitrary reasons fuck this teacher. I hope she gets fired. This is unacceptable.
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You should direct that rage at your Lego-denying parents instead of someone who is trying to make sure that the girls in her class also get a chance to play Lego.
 
Not said:
Boys need the handicap.

Look at our patriarchy. What don't you understand? In order for the world to actually have gender equality, us men have to voluntarily take a hit in certain places. We'll live.



I do, however, agree with this for the most part. Poor execution.
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Considering boys and men are falling behind women in terms of education, I don't think this is a good example of "men taking a hit".

The last thing we need is for poor teachers like this one to give young boys a reason to dislike school.
 
There's actually a defense force for this in this thread? Can someone explain to me how the teacher's solution is better/less mean-spirited than buying some extra Lego and forcing both boys and girls to play with them during that time period, instead of simply denying them to the boys?
 
ExVicis said:
Fuck this teacher. You know as a child I was denied Legos? I always got to see other play with them and never me. I always felt unfairly singled out because they looked like the greatest thing to play with ever (and they are!) but I never got to touch them until finally my parents out of pity some years later bought me some.

So as someone who grew up denied to use of Legos for arbitrary reasons fuck this teacher. I hope she gets fired. This is unacceptable.
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Why were legos denied to you?
 
gender equity doesn't mean forcing someone to do something they don't want to do. It means giving them the MEANS to do things that they might not have the opportunity to do otherwise.

If she wants to promote gender equity with regards to legos, divvy them up and say 50% of the legos are girls only legos. Or just get more. Or, i don't know, maybe just ask the girls if they actually want to play with legos.

This is the exact opposite of the right way to go about it,
 
Fusebox said:
You should direct that rage at your Lego-denying parents instead of someone who is trying to make sure that the girls in her class also get a chance to play Lego.
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My parents bought me legos. Don't bring my parents into this attempt to defend this thinly veiled favoritism by this teacher.

A teacher is supposed to give their students all the opportunities in the world they are capable of getting, anything less makes them a bad teacher. This teacher seems to thinks she needs to actively deny someone else's opportunities in order to gives others some. Is that right? Would it be better if teachers actively helped more women with college prep and scholarships and just didn't bother helping men at all to promote gender equity?

brau said:
Why were legos denied to you?
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Teacher for some reason hated me is my assumption but I can't say for certain. I have no idea because like these kids I was too young at the time to understand things like that and just knew I was singled out from all the kids.

I do know eventually my parents had me switched to a different teacher.
 
ExVicis said:
My parents bought me legos. Don't bring my parents into this attempt to defend this thinly veiled favoritism by this teacher.

A teacher is supposed to give their students all the opportunities in the world they are capable of getting, anything less makes them a bad teacher. This teacher seems to thinks she needs to actively deny someone else's opportunities in order to gives others some. Is that right? Would it be better if teachers actively helped more women with college prep and scholarships and just didn't bother helping men at all to promote gender equity?
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Ok, but your last post makes no sense now.
 
ExVicis said:
Fuck this teacher. You know as a child I was denied Legos? I always got to see other play with them and never me. I always felt unfairly singled out because they looked like the greatest thing to play with ever (and they are!) but I never got to touch them until finally my parents out of pity some years later bought me some.

So as someone who grew up denied to use of Legos for arbitrary reasons fuck this teacher. I hope she gets fired. This is unacceptable.
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It stopped a month ago.
 
Fusebox said:
Ok, but your last post makes no sense now.
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First Post: This is disgusting to me on a personal level as someone who had something almost the same happen.

Second Post: Teacher's shouldn't do this because it's clear favoritism.

I don't see why it matters if the posts are different the end result is still this is disgusting.
 
Fusebox said:
Holy shit you people. She just wanted to give the girls some time with the Lego.

Lego is awesome, my daughter loves it, I ain't even mad about this. You people are pulling some 'all lives matter' with this backlash shit.
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Girls deserve as much Lego as they want, but I dont see why the boys have to suffer for no reason except the teachers disdain for adult men...
 
DarkKyo said:
Girls deserve as much Lego as they want, but I dont see why the boys have to suffer for no reason except the teachers disdain for adult men...
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It's a safe bet most of those boys are packed up with Lego at home and the girls aren't, seems like a well-intentioned but ultimately misguided attempt to address that imbalance and the teacher has my support.
 
Oersted said:
It stopped a month ago.
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The OP article does not mention that but it makes it...somewhat better, maybe? It still doesn't quite excuse the favoritism of it or likely how the young children felt about it. At least a few of those boys probably noticed what she was doing at a while. How do you think that makes them feel? Are their feelings not important just because of gender inequality they don't know about or have no part of that now they're thrust into the forefront of? Or are they not important because the "experiment" ended after a month? Were it that my child was in this school I would immediately remove them from that school, boy or girl.
 
Fusebox said:
It's a safe bet most of those boys are packed up with Lego at home and the girls aren't, seems like a well-intentioned but ultimately misguided attempt to address that imbalance and the teacher has my support.
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Would you have problem with there being enough Lego for all the children to play with and learn from? Or are you actually in favor of promoting sexist education?
 
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