Sephiroth_VII
Member
People are deluded if they don't think potential backlash and bad PR could cause a company to not bring a game to the west.
Play-Asia says SJWs to blame for DOAX3 not coming west
- Thread starter Cheesemeister
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Finalantagonist
Banned
I personally find "trigger warnings" ridiculous, so I can see my opinion is probably not wanted here. I'll bow out gracefully.
Wait wat
The difference between fictional characters and coma patients, I would have thought, is that the coma patient is a real human being, with real and inalienable human rights, whether they're awake to enjoy them or not. A fictional character is none of those things.
A fictional character is just a phantom, an imaginary being, made up of descriptive text or ink on paper or pixels on a screen, or whatever else. No matter how fixated the observer becomes on them or how they are characterized, that doesn't change the fact that they don't have rights or agency because they're not real. I feel like I have to highlight that, because so many of you don't seem to understand the distinction between "real people", which have actual form and weight and legal rights no matter what their status, and "fictional characters", which obviously do not, cannot, and hopefully never will. That shit is how you get NEET saddos marrying their 2D waifus in actual real-life wedding chapels, which has happened in the past.
So worrying or complaining about fictional characters getting sexualized "against their best interests" has always seemed extremely wrong-headed to me, because it presumes that such sexualization "harms" the character, which, of course, doesn't exist in reality. This argument is demeaning to actually real human beings as well as mind-numbingly stupid, so would you kindly cut that shit out? It's embarrassing, not just to yourself, but to everyone involved in the discussion.
And yes, I do understand that you're objecting to the existence of characters as sex objects at all, but so what? You can't do anything about it, you certainly can't tell me or anyone else what to like or dislike, all you can do is gripe and complain on GAF about it. Oh, and make up slightly sick arguments equating fictional characters to real-life coma victims. Classy.
And yes, I was offended.
As for the OP topic? Eh, I don't care, let P-A use their Twitter account however they wish, even to pander to GooberGaters. I wasn't gonna buy the game anyway.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
We did, and it got closed until there's more info because it all relied on that Facebook comment. I guess this is more about Play-Asia being shits than Koei's decision, seeing as Play-Asia's tweet isn't official Koei info.
Some people really do relive trauma when reminded of bad rhings from their life: rape victims, soldiers with PTSD, war survivors.
A single sentence to make someone's day less shitty seems ok by me.
Being a decent person is haaaaard, man :/
Finalantagonist
Banned
Agreed that it's nice, but it shouldn't be expected that everyone with a voice should and must consult others before they say something. Otherwise, that's policing how people talk which is a bad road and just plain silly, in my opinion. A majority of people in this world have experienced trauma in some way, shape, or form. Unfortunately, that doesn't give anyone the right to tell people what words they can or can't use, even when speaking to you. Besides, you can't say anything if you're trying not to offend anyone.
But that's a different argument that probably isn't suited for here. Nor will it probably get anywhere.
I suppose KT's reluctance to bring the game westward makes a PC version very unlikely. :/
Looking at his new tweets and man, he really doesn't give a fuck. Welp.
Looking at his new tweets and man, he really doesn't give a fuck. Welp.
Valkerionseven
Member
Just cause I was thinking it does not mean they should have tweeted it, type things I guess.
Agree in general not just for DoAX3 which I would not be grabbing either way (tried the second game on a rental and hated it)
Agree in general not just for DoAX3 which I would not be grabbing either way (tried the second game on a rental and hated it)
LightofRohan
Member
Ya I think people are missing this point, it's not about the backlash now it's about the backlash if they bring it here. Just look around and see how sensitive people are nowadays. We're in a hyper sensitive time.
Also why is this thread still up when the other one was closed?
It is not about not saying something. Its saying you gonna spoiler before you spoiler
Finalantagonist
Banned
What?
But again, no one really cares. DOAX is a game that doesn't pretend to be something it's not and no one has really voiced anything against it and I doubt many even will if it's ever localized.
...you are not serious, right?
DICKS AHOY
Banned
I thought the point behind trigger warnings was pointing out to a victim of something particularly impacting like rape/murder/etc. that your article is going to discuss those topics in gross detail in a context where you may well have a ton of people who fall into that ballpark reading it. Like, in a psychology course or a support group or something. PTSD regardless of trigger memes or not has always been a thing after all.
I know it happens the other way around sometimes* unfortunately, but it's original point was meant to be a self-imposed warning rather than a warning for other people to start using warnings in everything they write about. Or something to that effect. It rarely comes up in the stuff I read either way.
* The overuse of it in increasingly pointless situations is partially where that 'triggered!' meme comes from. Doesn't help when trigger warnings are and aren't needed can apparently be a very subjective matter when it comes to whether you laugh at the meme or think it's taking a shit on disadvantaged people, or even a bit of both.
I know it happens the other way around sometimes* unfortunately, but it's original point was meant to be a self-imposed warning rather than a warning for other people to start using warnings in everything they write about. Or something to that effect. It rarely comes up in the stuff I read either way.
* The overuse of it in increasingly pointless situations is partially where that 'triggered!' meme comes from. Doesn't help when trigger warnings are and aren't needed can apparently be a very subjective matter when it comes to whether you laugh at the meme or think it's taking a shit on disadvantaged people, or even a bit of both.
Finalantagonist
Banned
Sorry for my opinion, but I think being able to joke/talk about even the most crass, insulting, or offensive things is vastly important and prefer the "tough skin" approach.
It's the same reason no one protests men's/lad magazines. Everyone can have their smut. No one is particular bothered by that it disagrees with it. It's not that complicated.
Edited it, but to put as simple as possible:
Trigger warnings are not about giving anyone the right to tell people what words they can or can't use, even when speaking to you. That is completely wrong. It is about warning people the content could hurt.
Sensitive towards what?
That was not his point.
That was not what you said. You implied any discussion of any topic will offend someone.
ShockingAlberto
Member
No one's stopping you from talking about whatever you want.
You've just never had the unlimited right to never offend people. They can be offended if they want, you can find some other people to be offensive with.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Well, they won't get my business anymore.
And yes, this is actually a lost sale, as it is entirely possible to both have a fondness for pointless objectifying smut and think the attitude and stance behind these tweets is bullshit.
And yes, this is actually a lost sale, as it is entirely possible to both have a fondness for pointless objectifying smut and think the attitude and stance behind these tweets is bullshit.
Finalantagonist
Banned
I think you're just expected to be prepared to have your feelings hurt/offended/"triggered" by just being an adult living in the real world. You shouldn't have to provide for some particular trauma victims anymore than trauma victims should have to wear a label saying "I'm a victim. Please don't say these words to me.".
Exactly.
The more hyper sensitive people seem to mostly be these "anti-SJW" people who have taken it as their mission to belittle and attack anyone & everyone who brings up topics like ethnical inequality, treatment of women and minorities etc. in regards to games & the game industry. Criticizing DOAX for objectifying women and not wanting to support a retailer who views a certain part of their customers with contempt is not hyper sensitivity, going batshit insane in attacking those criticizing it & joining a movement like GG because "those feminazis and fags are trying to destroy our games" is hypersensitivity.
Finalantagonist
Banned
Actually we do have the right to say offensive things to people who are offended. Being offended doesn't give you any rights, but you do have the right to be offensive.
You are LITERALLY victim blaming.
GhostTrick
Banned
The SJW thing was too much. Thats totally terrible PR. You have more catchy, decent and fair ways to grab attention. They could've just said "DoAX3 not coming to West ? Its still coming to You" and make it a better way to express how its a none issue thanks to their services.
But I feel like this tweet reflects less than PR and more of personal opinions.
But I feel like this tweet reflects less than PR and more of personal opinions.
Fatal Futanari
Member
Bingo. They see it and just dont wanna deal with it. Don't blame them either.
Everything is saying "but they brought _____ game over earlier this year that had sexual themes" but none of those game's core aspect was bouncing beach babes having fun in the sun. Did Deception IV or DoA LR let me have butt battles and play beach volleyball? Anyone who thinks that KT wouldn't get shit if they brought it over is only kidding themselves.
Yea, PA may lose some customers but probably not alot. I mean, they sell Moe Chronicles ^_^
I just chuckled at the tweets and went about my day.
oh and hello /v/
Palette Swap
Member
That backlash talk is just a passive aggressive way to justify a business decision while saying "don't criticize our games" and cajoling some people who love their persecution narrative.
The intersect between the group who would buy the game (which does nothing to hide its cheesecake and even thrives on it) and the group who would be turned off from buying it because someone said somewhere it was objectifying is minuscule at best.
If anything, the biggest backlash could come from the first group itself if K-T had to touch any character or costume for rating purposes.
Finalantagonist
Banned
I'd agree with that.
Empathy?
ShockingAlberto
Member
You misunderstood.
You have no right for them not to be offended. Be a jerkass all you want. Make it your life goal if you want. People are free to think you're a jerkass and not want to be around you. You haven't earned any right to be a jerkass to people if they don't want you around, though. They'll be offended, not want to be around you, and you can find people that better fit your sense of humor.
http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/dead-or-alive-xtreme-2
It's all those dang SJWs who are causing this, not the fact the only market that's likely to buy the game are sad trash goblins who can't get exhentai to work right.
It's gotta be those feminists who ruin everything, and not the fact this particular brand, this spin-off of this series, is, at this point, in the minds of most, an exercise in how little work you have to do in terms of game design to try and justify looking at digital women wearing skimpy swimwear.
But, maybe I'm wrong, maybe the SJWs did actually cause this, because they're actively trying to prevent games such as these to be released outside of Japan. In which case : good. Get all of those games in the trash, where they belong.
It's all those dang SJWs who are causing this, not the fact the only market that's likely to buy the game are sad trash goblins who can't get exhentai to work right.
It's gotta be those feminists who ruin everything, and not the fact this particular brand, this spin-off of this series, is, at this point, in the minds of most, an exercise in how little work you have to do in terms of game design to try and justify looking at digital women wearing skimpy swimwear.
But, maybe I'm wrong, maybe the SJWs did actually cause this, because they're actively trying to prevent games such as these to be released outside of Japan. In which case : good. Get all of those games in the trash, where they belong.
Finalantagonist
Banned
Blaming them of what? Being offended? Unfortunately, yes. For what other people say? No.
like, are we talking natural rights, or what
Dr. Buni
Member
I'd love more terrible embarrassing games like Dead or Alive to not ever be released outside of Japan; I guess I am a SJW then?
Wow, you are terrible. Try to be more empathetic towards fellow human beings, is it that hard?
Have you ever considered putting "sociopath" on your resume? Jesus fuck man, lmao.
Finalantagonist
Banned
Sure. You can try to be proactive but it's impossible to appease everyone proactively. And if you simply disagree with someone, you can do that too, even in an offensive way
DICKS AHOY
Banned
I think it depends on the context. If it's a game, movie, stand-up comic,
/v/
An articles on specialist sites geared towards victims of abuse is more likely to have PTSD-types who'd probably want some level of warning before they click into something that dredges up recent abuse. I think it's less the concept of triggers that annoy you and more the potential abuse of the concept in situations it isn't really needed.
Eh, celebrating an already niche game not getting a release is a bit tacky. Couldn't you just ignore it if you ever saw it on store shelves?
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
No, means you're egoistic and judgemental.
Finalantagonist
Banned
Adults living in the real world have social standards. Not purposefully hurting is one of them. Or atleast giving a warning you are about to get hurt.
You missed the point again.
Finalantagonist
Banned
I think you have a misunderstanding of what a sociopath is. Let's steer clear of insults if we can. I just have a different opinion than you is all
I think you have a misunderstanding of what a sociopath is. Let's steer clear of insults if we can. I just have a different opinion than you is all
I dunno mate, i feel like you should suck it up bro. I mean, you're an adult living in the real world, right?
ShockingAlberto
Member
I think you have a misunderstanding of what a sociopath is. Let's steer clear of insults if we can. I just have a different opinion than you is all
I don't think he's under any obligation not to offend you.
Right?
I wouldn't slap that title on you just because we have different opinions. That's just being stupid and keeps us all fighting.
Finalantagonist
Banned
See I don't think it's always "purposefully" (if it's purposeful, sure, you're being a jerk or a troll or whatever). You say how you feel and if that offends people, it's usually an after-effect. Hell, it's good to be offensive sometime. Great people have been offensive. It's good to offend the norm.
But just because it's offensive doesn't mean you shouldn't say it/be allowed to say it/have to put a "warning" before you say it. At least in my opinion.
Palculator
Unconfirmed Member
Nor is he free of criticism. Something Finalantagonist consistenly pointed out to be still within the rights of those being offended. I don't think Finalantagonist is offended, even. Just pointing out sociopathy is an overreactive accusation.
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