[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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OriginalThinking said:
I'm going to spoiler tag it
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Don't.

Not only because this is a spoiler thread, making spoiler tags completely pointless, but because speculation and spoilers aren't the same thing. Your uninformed guess doesn't actually become insider knowledge just because you guessed right. You still didn't actually know what was going to happen when you made your guess. So its not a spoiler. Don't tag it.
 
munchie64 said:
What does this mean?
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When you watch ANH do you get the feeling that 5 years before only there was still a bunch of Jedi/Force users jumping around, using the force, fighting with lightsabers, and just doing crazy shit all around?

In TESB Yoda, the greatest Jedi of all, has been hiding on a shit hole on Dagobah since forever to hide from Vader and the Emperor. Shit was real.

It took Luke THREE YEARS to be able to force pull a lightsaber out of a snow bank.

The narrative from Rebels doesn't make an once of sense when you put it in context of the events of the OT.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
Don't.

Not only because this is a spoiler thread, making spoiler tags completely pointless, but because speculation and spoilers aren't the same thing. Your uninformed guess doesn't actually become insider knowledge just because you guessed right. You still didn't actually know what was going to happen when you made your guess. So its not a spoiler. Don't tag it.
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Based on how many bonkers "spoilers" people are guessing in this thread I imagine there is a lot posting here who completely ignored the OP and do not realize the shot list for the film leaked.
 
chesspieceface said:
What are you talking about
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You being hell-bent on interpreting things solely the one way regardless their accuracy.

You SEE the interview that quote came from? The extended divorce riff he went on while laughing? The comedy bit he did w/ Vanity Fair the week before? The fact this is all 2 years history to him? The fact its all history because he initiated, and then executed the sale of his entire company?

He wasn't wronged, or slighted. He's not nursing or harboring a quiet pain. He's a multibillionaire CEO who knew what he was doing when he did it and is joking with CBS about being an old divorcee from a soap opera.

Its not that serious to him that he's gonna go on 60 minutes and cut a fuckin WWE promo w/ Charlie Rose about feeling snubbed. Because HE SOLD THE COMPANY. If he cared about having any say in the sequels, he wouldn't have walked in the first place.

And Han Solo dies.
 
chesspieceface said:
When you watch ANH do you get the feeling that 5 years before only there was still a bunch of Jedi/Force users jumping around, using the force, fighting with lightsabers, and just doing crazy shit all around?

In TESB Yoda, the greatest Jedi of all, has been hiding on a shit hole on Dagobah since forever to hide from Vader and the Emperor. Shit was real.

It took Luke THREE YEARS to be able to force pull a lightsaber out of a snow bank.

The narrative from Rebels doesn't make an once of sense when you put it in context of the events of the OT.
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En masse? No. Two young padawans who managed to survive giving their best to help the growing rebellion? Yeah, I can buy that.

Luke had no real training, and was 22 (According to a children's book) when he started. Kanan knew what he was teaching 14 year-old Ezra.

Obi.-Wan taught Luke...what, 5 days worth of Jedi knowledge? Luke was on his own.
 
chesspieceface said:
When you watch ANH do you get the feeling that 5 years before only there was still a bunch of Jedi/Force users jumping around, using the force, fighting with lightsabers, and just doing crazy shit all around?
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I mean no, because it doesn't really matter to the story but there's nothing that says that doesn't happen. I'd say it makes more sense a few Jedi survive order 66 than none.
In TESB Yoda, the greatest Jedi of all, has been hiding on a shit hole on Dagobah since forever to hide from Vader and the Emperor. Shit was real.
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OK? What exactly do you mean by this? Yoda should have been fighting if others were? Everyone should have done what he did?
It took Luke THREE YEARS to be able to force pull a lightsaber out of a snow bank.
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Luke didn't have a permanent Jedi teacher if that's your issue.
The narrative from Rebels doesn't make an once of sense when you put it in context of the events of the OT.
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Not seeing it.
Daft_Cat said:
What, he wasn't clear? A story chronicling the growing rebellion and a Jedi on the run from the Empire has no place during a slice of Star Wars canon in which the rebellion was growing and the Jedi were on the run from the Empire. It just *doesn't make sense*.
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lol
 
Bobby Roberts said:
And Han Solo dies.
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200_s.gif
 
chesspieceface said:
How do you think Han will die?

- Beheaded
- Pierced
- Slashed
- Force choked
- Force pushed in a crevice or something?

Can't be too graphic for sure.
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I think he'll either be sliced in half from head to groin, or have a lightsaber shoved into his open mouth and you'll see it come out the back of his head with a horrible final scream from Han.

Anyway Entertainment Weekly posted snippets of the Star Wars soundtrack, if nobody mentioned it yet.

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/12/11/john-williams-star-wars-force-awakens-score-clips
 
Bobby Roberts said:
You being hell-bent on interpreting things solely the one way regardless their accuracy.

You SEE the interview that quote came from? The extended divorce riff he went on while laughing? The comedy bit he did w/ Vanity Fair the week before? The fact this is all 2 years history to him? The fact its all history because he initiated, and then executed the sale of his entire company?
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He also hadn't seen the film at that point. For all we know, he may have been surprised by how much his original outlines managed to influence the final direction of the film. Another possibility is that he doesn't give a fuck, re: the turtles in this video.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
Don't.

Not only because this is a spoiler thread, making spoiler tags completely pointless, but because speculation and spoilers aren't the same thing. Your uninformed guess doesn't actually become insider knowledge just because you guessed right. You still didn't actually know what was going to happen when you made your guess. So its not a spoiler. Don't tag it.
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Cheebo said:
Based on how many bonkers "spoilers" people are guessing in this thread I imagine there is a lot posting here who completely ignored the OP and do not realize the shot list for the film leaked.
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I've untagged it. I did read the OP, I was simply erring on the side of caution. Lesson learned, no need to tread carefully!
 
chesspieceface said:
When you watch ANH do you get the feeling that 5 years before only there was still a bunch of Jedi/Force users jumping around, using the force, fighting with lightsabers, and just doing crazy shit all around?
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The idea that there were Jedi running around who survived the purge other than Obi-Wan and Yoda has been around for literally decades. The EU was even more egregious with this, since there were other pre-Order 66 Jedi who were still alive during and after the OT. But regardless, there's nothing in ANH that concretely states that there couldn't have been Jedi 5 years prior to ANH. The only thing we know is that by the time of RotJ, Luke is the last Jedi.

In TESB Yoda, the greatest Jedi of all, has been hiding on a shit hole on Dagobah since forever to hide from Vader and the Emperor. Shit was real.
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And Kanan's actions have caused Vader to start hunting him down in Rebels, so that fits fine.

It took Luke THREE YEARS to be able to force pull a lightsaber out of a snow bank.
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Nothing ever indicated that Luke's first use of telekinesis was on Hoth. And even so, he had to train himself basically.
 
Fj0823 said:
En masse? No. Two young padawans who managed to survive giving their best to help the growing rebellion? Yeah, I can buy that.

Luke had no real training, and was 22 (According to a children's book) when he started. Kanan knew what he was teaching 14 year-old Ezra.

Obi.-Wan taught Luke...what, 5 days worth of Jedi knowledge? Luke was on his own.
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Well it doesn't seem like he stayed on Dagobah for much more than that, and that's all he had before ROTJ.

My point is, if Ezra, Kanan and Ahsoka existed in that era, it made no sense to not try anything against the Empire while waiting for Luke to grow up. The only reason ANH happened like it happened is because Ezra, Kanan and Ahsoka *did not exist* in that era.

If you don't agree with that no need to continue arguing :)
 
Fj0823 said:
En masse? No. Two young padawans who managed to survive giving their best to help the growing rebellion? Yeah, I can buy that.

Luke had no real training, and was 22 (According to a children's book) when he started. Kanan knew what he was teaching 14 year-old Ezra.

Obi.-Wan taught Luke...what, 5 days worth of Jedi knowledge? Luke was on his own.
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I don't have an issue with Rebels for the most part. Not with what chesspieceface is complaining about at least. The one thing I don't like is the Inquisitors. First there was only one; he died cheaply, but then all of a sudden there are two more?

It would make sense that Vader could take on an apprentice in secret (a la The Force Unleashed), but all these extraneous dark side users running around under Palpatine's watch? Ehhhh.

It'll be interesting to see how they "dispose of" Kanaan, Ezra, and Ahsoka. For the latter I would imagine Vader will strike her down eventually.
 
prag16 said:
I don't have an issue with Rebels for the most part. Not with what chesspieceface is complaining about at least. The one thing I don't like is the Inquisitors. First there was only one; he died cheaply, but then all of a sudden there are two more?

It would make sense that Vader could take on an apprentice in secret (a la The Force Unleashed), but all these extraneous dark side users running around under Palpatine's watch? Ehhhh.
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The Inquisitorius is a dark side adept organization that are sub-Sith in terms of "power levels". Sidious was already setting up plans for them in TCW when he was kidnapping Force-sensitive babies to raise them on Mustafar. Rather than just hunt down and kill all Force-sensitive individuals, which is impossible because they're not an organization but a naturally occurring thing that will always continue to be born, Sheev and Annie decided to turn a bunch of them into attack dogs. They don't have the strength, the training, or the ambitions of the Sith. They're just lackeys sent out to hunt down Jedi stragglers.
 
I'm actually enjoying Rebels just for what it is: more adventures in the universe of Star Wars.

But still think it's out of place and doesn't fit the greater story.
 
sphagnum said:
The Inquisitorius is a dark side adept organization that are sub-Sith in terms of "power levels". Sidious was already setting up plans for them in TCW when he was kidnapping Force-sensitive babies to raise them on Mustafar. Rather than just hunt down and kill all Force-sensitive individuals, which is impossible because they're not an organization but a naturally occurring thing that will always continue to be born, Sheev and Annie decided to turn a bunch of them into attack dogs. They don't have the strength, the training, or the ambitions of the Sith. They're just lackeys sent out to hunt down Jedi stragglers.
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I don't really remember that from the Clone Wars, but it's been a while.

Nevertheless, this whole thing is obviously kind of a retcon (that happens not to blatantly step on existing material) that I doubt anybody ever had in mind in the early prequel timeframe, let alone the OT timeframe.

Which is why I can slightly sympathize with chesspieceface's stance.
 
If we understand it correctly. The emperor keeps inquisitors weak on purpose, they just hunt weakened Jedi/ Padawans,he'd go all Maul on them if they get too strong.

When they fought a top form Jedi in Ahsoka they were hilariously overpowered.
 
prag16 said:
I don't have an issue with Rebels for the most part. Not with what chesspieceface is complaining about at least. The one thing I don't like is the Inquisitors. First there was only one; he died cheaply, but then all of a sudden there are two more?

It would make sense that Vader could take on an apprentice in secret (a la The Force Unleashed), but all these extraneous dark side users running around under Palpatine's watch? Ehhhh.

It'll be interesting to see how they "dispose of" Kanaan, Ezra, and Ahsoka. For the latter I would imagine Vader will strike her down eventually.
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Notice how much the Inquisitors suck at using the force and lightsaber battles? They aren't Sith, just disposable pawns that are barely trained to use the dark side of the force so they won't be a threat to the emperor. There aren't many fully trained Jedi, inquisitors can take down untrained and padawans, Vader is needed to kill Ahsoka.
 
The fact that the Seventh Sister uses droids to do stuff any Jedi can do with the Force should tell you enough about their level.
 
prag16 said:
this whole thing is obviously kind of a retcon
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It's not even kind of a retcon. It's a straight out retcon.

Star Wars been retconning itself since 1979, though. It's not like the story itself is a series strength. It's the way the story is told that matters. Sometimes they do it well. Sometimes, not so much.

For what its worth, Clone Wars ended up being a pretty decently told tale. So far Rebels is kinda so-so. Force Awakens? Hopefully we find ourselves somewhere in Good-to-Great territory.
 
chesspieceface said:
I'm calling anything non-lucas fan fiction at this point. It's not negative, it's just ... not original Star Wars.

I mean, Rebels is canon and great and everything, *but it doesn't make any fucking sense*. It shouldn't exist, it breaks the OT, render everything irrelevant. It exist only because there's a public with an infinite thirst for Star Wars stories.

It's no better than fan fiction.
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What? You're willing to call the prequels canon over this film? Just because Lucas was the creator of those films? Are the Marvel movies not in canon any more? They all aren't directed by the same people.

Who cares about inconsistency? It is a Star Wars film, not The Godfather.
 
Speaking of retcons, characters are also allowed to mislead, be wrong, omit information, tell half truths, and straight up lie. Hell, Obi-Wan was all about misleading Luke and leaving out information, and that was all within the Original Trilogy! Is it lazy? Occasionally, but it all depends on how it plays.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
It's not even kind of a retcon. It's a straight out retcon.

Star Wars been retconning itself since 1979, though. It's not like the story itself is a series strength. It's the way the story is told that matters. Sometimes they do it well. Sometimes, not so much.

For what its worth, Clone Wars ended up being a pretty decently told tale. So far Rebels is kinda so-so. Force Awakens? Hopefully we find ourselves somewhere in Good-to-Great territory.
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The "kind of" qualifier was because they didn't exactly have to completely override something that was already explicitly established. The inquisitor thing was more like "oh by the way during that time they happened to be doing this and that, even though it wasn't shown onscreen", etc.

I'm liking Rebels so far. Feels more focused than Clone Wars in some ways, possibly because we're mostly following a small group, and not a wide scale war. But I think it's been solid so far. Definitely looking forward to more Vader appearances.
 
Im just going to say i didnt knew about the third Death Star until recently, that would have been a good surprise :(

But it was my fault for reading that magazine.
 
weshes195 said:
What? You're willing to call the prequels canon over this film? Just because Lucas was the creator of those films? Are the Marvel movies not in canon any more? They all aren't directed by the same people.

Who cares about inconsistency? It is a Star Wars film, not The Godfather.
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Of course! :) And the Marvel movies are not in canon because the canon is the comics! :P
 
Sub Boss said:
Im just going to say i didnt knew about the third Death Star until recently, that would have been a good surprise :(

But it was my fault for reading that magazine.
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Good news is, it's not REALLY a "Death Star." It kinda/sorta serves a similar purpose, but it's definitely a little more interesting a permutation of the concept.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
Huh. She actually says Luke's name to him.
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I know it's easy to read too much into things (look at the last few pages), and you have to be mindful of the intended audience, but referring to her father as "Luke Skywalker" seems so...impersonal. We can infer from the trailer that Rey understands BB-8, so is it too much to assume that he atleast tells her he needs to find Luke? Much like R2 giving Luke reason to seek Old Ben.

I'd imagine it's just a name to her at that point.
 
Kuros said:
edit: BTW should this be in here or the spoiler production thread? That thread died the moment this one started up.
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This thread basically succeeded that one. Here's good.

munchie64 said:
Maybe BB-8 tells her? Kind like in ANH with Leia.
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I'm sure it makes logical sense, I'm remarking more on the fact that, like Nodnol says, it seems like it's just a name. No personal attachment. Which might speak to just how outside the loop she really is when it comes to Skywalkers and Solos.
 
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