Dragon Ball Super |OT| 28 Episodes Later

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Didn't Vegeta get SS2 when he willingly turned Majin? I thought he basically cheated to unlock it.
 
Watched the full episode. The magazine previews made it sound more interesting than what it actually was... well, it doesn't help that this week's animation was a complete mess - lot of weird zoom ins on character faces and just plain bad art all around. At least the backgrounds looked nice I guess?

Again, a bunch of changes from RoF here with Vegeta refusing to hold Goku's hand for the teleport, the teleport itself signaled to Goku by Gohan's power up instead of the Z fighter group effort from the movie, Piccolo's death/Piccolo carried off to get raised back by the Namek dragon balls, etc. Along with Vegeta finishing Ginyu and Gohan realizing he fucked up bad by neglecting training, I think the changes are actually pretty good... though the execution could have been a lot better. Lot of lost potential on Toei's part.

But on the subject of potential (lol) this episode really drove home Gohan's failures/lack of training and now lack of ability to protect everyone. If this doesn't mean anything going forward, then goddamn. I'm sure some people will probably complain - and yes it could have been handled better - but it's still better development than we saw in the movie version and hopefully shows that Earth/his family can't always rely on Goku or something.
 
Vegeta could have achieved SSJ2 on his own, but it's also possible he didn't. He let himself be possessed because he knew there was still a large gap between him and Goku, and Babidi's magic boosts someone's strength by a huge amount. That amount could have been enough to let him become a SSJ2.

I have to check to see if he became a SSJ2 post Babidi though.

He does against Kid Buu, and he's dead at that time, so yeah he has it naturally.
 
Welfare said:
Vegeta could have achieved SSJ2 on his own, but it's also possible he didn't. He let himself be possessed because he knew there was still a large gap between him and Goku, and Babidi's magic boosts someone's strength by a huge amount. That amount could have been enough to let him become a SSJ2.

I have to check to see if he became a SSJ2 post Babidi though.
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It was implied that he could already transform to SSJ2.
 
Kagari said:
But on the subject of potential (lol) this episode really drove home Gohan's failures/lack of training and now lack of ability to protect everyone. If this doesn't mean anything going forward, then goddamn. I'm sure some people will probably complain - and yes it could have been handled better - but it's still better development than we saw in the movie version and hopefully shows that Earth/his family can't always rely on Goku or something.
Click to expand...

Hopefully Gohan will hear about the Universal tournament and want to prove to himself and everyone else that he can, in fact, be useful, and will want to replace Buu.

I mean how do you have people complain about Gohan, and even Gohan himself, that he doesn't train, and do absolutely nothing with it? That doesn't make sense.
 
Welfare said:
Vegeta could have achieved SSJ2 on his own, but it's also possible he didn't. He let himself be possessed because he knew there was still a large gap between him and Goku, and Babidi's magic boosts someone's strength by a huge amount. That amount could have been enough to let him become a SSJ2.

I have to check to see if he became a SSJ2 post Babidi though.

He does against Kid Buu, and he's dead at that time, so yeah he has it naturally.
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The Daizenshuu confirmed years ago that Vegeta obtained the form prior to becoming a Majin.
 
Welfare said:
Hopefully Gohan will hear about the Universal tournament and want to prove to himself and everyone else that he can, in fact, be useful, and will want to replace Buu.

I mean how do you have people complain about Gohan, and even Gohan himself, that he doesn't train, and do absolutely nothing with it? That doesn't make sense.
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In this week's episode he says something like "If only I had trained like dad and the rest Piccolo wouldn't have died..." Krillin tries to be Mr. Nice Guy and tells him it's only natural to prioritize family over fighting to which Frieza tries to exploit, threatening Gohan's family and that's when he decides he has to protect his family and to use his last bit of energy to alert Goku to his location. Goku even praises him for this, I laughed.
 
Welfare said:
Hopefully Gohan will hear about the Universal tournament and want to prove to himself and everyone else that he can, in fact, be useful, and will want to replace Buu.

I mean how do you have people complain about Gohan, and even Gohan himself, that he doesn't train, and do absolutely nothing with it? That doesn't make sense.
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I don't expect anything out of Gohan.

16 dies telling Gohan to fight and Goku decides to bow out, move on, Gohan is now counted on to be the new protector of earth. He ends up nearly a grown ass man that's weaker than his 11 year old self. Buu comes and wrecks shit cause Gohan couldn't be assed to train(if he kept up Dabura would've been destroyed quickly and Buu doesn't revive)

Then he gets a freebie power up and becomes stronger than his dad and yet again he sits on his ass after its all over when daddy saves the day, probably telling himself it's fine now that daddy is back. Now Beerus comes along and Gohan is useless, Vegeta does better than him.(imagine if he kept up training and they made him SSJ God, would've done a lot better than Goku at least).

Still Gohan sits around and now Frieza comes back and daddy aint here to bail him out at as fast. His body is in worse shape now than he was as a 5 years old and he gets his real dad killed, again.

This guy never learns.
 
It's amazing how low Gohan has fallen this past year alone from RoF and DB Super. Used to be the most powerful fighter in the world and now he's what? Dropped to 7th, 8th place in two movies?

Ginyu was wasted too. Really weird fanserivce. Should've just kept Tagoma but made him weaker.
 
I feel like what they are doing with Gohan in the Super version here is foreshadowing him returning to training.
The episode's art was weird, but the shots with varying line thickness were amazing looking.
 
Nintendoga said:
It's amazing how low Gohan has fallen this past year alone from RoF and DB Super. Used to be the most powerful fighter in the world and now he's what? Dropped to 7th, 8th place in two movies?

Ginyu was wasted too. Really weird fanserivce. Should've just kept Tagoma but made him weaker.
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He's the third strongest Z Fighter behind Goku and Vegeta?
 
Kagari said:
He's the third strongest Z Fighter behind Goku and Vegeta?
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Whoops I meant universe. Considering Beerus and Whis and Frieza. I dunno if you'd count Buu as a Z-fighter but with the way things seem to be looking Piccolo might get a power-up later on and be behind Goku and Vegeta in rank.
 
Kagari said:
Watched the full episode. The magazine previews made it sound more interesting than what it actually was... well, it doesn't help that this week's animation was a complete mess - lot of weird zoom ins on character faces and just plain bad art all around. At least the backgrounds looked nice I guess?

Again, a bunch of changes from RoF here with Vegeta refusing to hold Goku's hand for the teleport, the teleport itself signaled to Goku by Gohan's power up instead of the Z fighter group effort from the movie, Piccolo's death/Piccolo carried off to get raised back by the Namek dragon balls, etc. Along with Vegeta finishing Ginyu and Gohan realizing he fucked up bad by neglecting training, I think the changes are actually pretty good... though the execution could have been a lot better. Lot of lost potential on Toei's part.

But on the subject of potential (lol) this episode really drove home Gohan's failures/lack of training and now lack of ability to protect everyone. If this doesn't mean anything going forward, then goddamn. I'm sure some people will probably complain - and yes it could have been handled better - but it's still better development than we saw in the movie version and hopefully shows that Earth/his family can't always rely on Goku or something.
Click to expand...

Does Gohan actually say anything in regards to needing more training? Or is it just assumed since he got the snack down.


And in terms of fighters, it's probably (manga spoilers)

Whis>Mystery Fighter>Beerus>Goku>Vegeta>Golden Frieza>Gohan>Buu>Gotenks>Piccolo>18>Tien>Krillen


>ChiChi>Yajirobe>Pan>Yamcha

Goku and Vegeta are pretty back and forth, but Goku usually has the upper hand.

Buu isn't as strong as he once was, but still pretty strong.

Gotenks seemed a lot stronger in Z, but they're kind of just a joke character right now. He could be anywhere from before Piccolo to after 18.

Piccolo and 18 is a toss-up, but if Piccolo is stronger now than he was in the Android saga, then I'd say he's definitely stronger than her.

Tien and Krillen are pretty close too, but Krillen hasn't been training like Tien has. Tien also beat the shit out of semi perfect Cell.
 
EightBitNate said:
Does Gohan actually say anything in regards to needing more training? Or is it just assumed since he got the snack down.
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According to the Kanzenshuu summary says he no longer has the power to protect everyone and if he had kept up his training like Goku then Piccolo wouldn't have died.

Anyways, changed my avatar back to an older one since Ginyu's return amounted to pretty much nothing. Oh well, :(
 
ArchedThunder said:
According to the Kanzenshuu summary says he no longer has the power to protect everyone and if he had kept up his training like Goku then Piccolo wouldn't have died.
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Which makes me wonder (manga spoilers)
if he'll be ready in time for the tournament. Goku brushes off the suggestion that Gohan should fight.
 
EightBitNate said:
Which makes me wonder (manga spoilers)
if he'll be ready in time for the tournament. Goku brushes off the suggestion that Gohan should fight.
Click to expand...

I shrugged off the possibility before, but I think it's very possible now that
Buu will fail the entry test and then Gohan will take his spot, revealing that he's been training rigorously since Freeza. Alternatively I would love it if we got a movie that takes place during the tournament where Gohan has to protect the Earth from a new villain and he gets to show off the results of him returning to training and then maybe after the movie he could make it to Super Saiyan Blue for whatever arc may follow Universe 6.
 
He basically admits to himself that due to lack of training/fighting he no longer is able to protect everyone. He then says 'if only I'd kept training like my dad and others have been then Piccolo wouldn't have died.'
 
ArchedThunder said:
I shrugged off the possibility before, but I think it's very possible now that
Buu will fail the entry test and then Gohan will take his spot, revealing that he's been training rigorously since Freeza. Alternatively I would love it if we got a movie that takes place during the tournament where Gohan has to protect the Earth from a new villain and he gets to show of the results of him returning to training and then maybe after the movie he could make it to Super Saiyan Blue for whatever arc may follow Universe 6.
Click to expand...

Very exciting time to be a Gohan fan.
 
Kagari said:
He basically admits to himself that due to lack of training/fighting he no longer is able to protect everyone. He then says 'if only I'd kept training like my dad and others have been then Piccolo wouldn't have died.'
Click to expand...
The added focus on Gohan's loss of power in this version of the story feels like it was definitely put in for foreshadowing purposes. I'm a Gohan fan and I've been okay with Gohan being a family man, but now Gohan has come to the conclusion that not training was a bad idea which gets me excited at the very real possibility of him becoming an actual fighter again.
And hey, it makes sense to do it to. Super's livelihood will rely heavily on merchandise and video game revenue (home games as well as arcade games like Heroes) and taking a fan favorite character who has massive potential and making him a fighter again would definitely be a good idea for merchandise reasons.
 
ArchedThunder said:
I shrugged off the possibility before, but I think it's very possible now that
Buu will fail the entry test and then Gohan will take his spot, revealing that he's been training rigorously since Freeza. Alternatively I would love it if we got a movie that takes place during the tournament where Gohan has to protect the Earth from a new villain and he gets to show off the results of him returning to training and then maybe after the movie he could make it to Super Saiyan Blue for whatever arc may follow Universe 6.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure how much time has passed between RF and the tournament arc, but if Gohan decides to train on his own while Goku and Vegeta are gone, maybe he will try and convince them to pick him over Piccolo/Buu. That's only if he gets really serious about his training though and wants to prove that he still got it.

Personally I don't like the idea of SSB Gohan. I think they should keep it exclusive to full-blooded Saiyans. However, even if Gohan can get his hidden potential back, he'll still be stronger than Piccolo and Buu.
 
Welfare said:
Really, how can they NOT make merch on SSJB Gohan? It's happening somehow, someday.
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And I get the feeling now that it will be happening in Super and not just be a Heroes what if. I kinda hope he just uses the same Gi he did when he fought Super Buu, would be nice to keep that outfit around since Goku got a new one, though again it would make sense to give him a new outfit for merch reasons.
Speaking of, I actually hope Piccolo finally gets a new outfit.

Zalman said:
I'm not sure how much time has passed between RF and the tournament arc, but if Gohan decides to train on his own while Goku and Vegeta are gone, maybe he will try and convince them to pick him over Piccolo/Buu. That's only if he gets really serious about his training though and wants to prove that he still got it.

Personally I don't like the idea of SSB Gohan. I think they should keep it exclusive to full-blooded Saiyans. However, even if Gohan can get his hidden potential back, he'll still be stronger than Piccolo and Buu.
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The amount of time passed is not clear, so who knows. I'm going to assume maybe a few months or so.

As for Gohan getting Super Saiyan Blue I don't really see why they would need to keep it to the full blooded Saiyans, I mean half and even quarter Saiyans qualify as Saiyans for the God Ritual, so I don't see why they couldn't also achieve Blue. That being said I hope they keep Blue away from Goten and Trunks until they are full grown, it already was kinda dumb that they were Super Saiyans at such a young age.
 
ArchedThunder said:
And I get the feeling now that it will be happening in Super and not just be a Heroes what if. I kinda hope he just uses the same Gi he did when he fought Super Buu, would be nice to keep that outfit around since Goku got a new one, though again it would make sense to give him a new outfit for merch reasons.
Speaking of, I actually hope Piccolo finally gets a new outfit.
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Piccolo's outfit is perfect though. Wouldn't change a thing about it.

Kinda hoping Gohan gets a new Piccolo outfit.
 
EightBitNate said:
Piccolo's outfit is perfect though. Wouldn't change a thing about it.

Kinda hoping Gohan gets a new Piccolo outfit.
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I love his outfit too, but I would still love to see him get a new one, Heroes has made me wonder what they could do. I'd still want him to have a cape and turban (that he throws off when shit get real) but they could still give him something new that achieves the same cool look.
 
ArchedThunder said:
I love his outfit too, but I would still love to see him get a new one, Heroes has made me wonder what they could do. I'd still want him to have a cape and turban (that he throws off when shit get real) but they could still give him something new that achieves the same cool look.
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A palette swap like what Vegeta got could be cool
 
If they do put gohan in I hope he suddenly isn't some super serious fighting guy. We've got enough of that with piccolo and vegeta. And he can't really be cocky like he was with his potential unlocked.

I can't really think of a unique personality for a fighting focused gohan.
 
ArchedThunder said:
The added focus on Gohan's loss of power in this version of the story feels like it was definitely put in for foreshadowing purposes. I'm a Gohan fan and I've been okay with Gohan being a family man, but now Gohan has come to the conclusion that not training was a bad idea which gets me excited at the very real possibility of him becoming an actual fighter again.
And hey, it makes sense to do it to. Super's livelihood will rely heavily on merchandise and video game revenue (home games as well as arcade games like Heroes) and taking a fan favorite character who has massive potential and making him a fighter again would definitely be a good idea for merchandise reasons.
Click to expand...
Yeah I agree the changes seem very deliberate for that sort of direction, especially with the dialogue that we're seeing here. Character growth is one thing this show really needs.
 
1J1LcHi.jpg
 
I've always liked the fact that Gohan became what he is now because it was always his passion from the beginning of Z. It just seems right for the character. However, with the way they've set up Super, I now feel he absolutely needs to train. If seeing Piccolo die right before his eyes doesn't trigger something in him, there's something wrong. Now THAT would be out of character.
 
Zalman said:
I've always liked the fact that Gohan became what he is now because it was always his passion from the beginning of Z. It just seems right for the character. However, with the way they've set up Super, I now feel he absolutely needs to train. If seeing Piccolo die right before his eyes doesn't trigger something in him, there's something wrong. Now THAT would be out of character.
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Not only that but Frieza directly threatens his family this episode so that could be motivation as well.
 
Zalman said:
I've always liked the fact that Gohan became what he is now because it was always his passion from the beginning of Z. It just seems right for the character. However, with the way they've set up Super, I now feel he absolutely needs to train. If seeing Piccolo die right before his eyes doesn't trigger something in him, there's something wrong. Now THAT would be out of character.
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I see nothing but Truth in this post. Bless your soul. Gohan coiming back 2016
, until they change they're mind about him being a hero again.
 
Kagari said:
Yeah I agree the changes seem very deliberate for that sort of direction, especially with the dialogue that we're seeing here. Character growth is one thing this show really needs.
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Well, bringing Ginyu back seemed like it was deliberate too, and we know how that turned out...
 
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