[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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Just came back - only one gripe:

- Kylo Ren aka Arkham Knight aka Anakin 2.0....yeeeesus, what happened here? Spends 3/4 of his screen time maskless and whines how everything's not going his way.

When Rey said "You're afraid you're never going to be as strong as Darth Vader", she should've said "You're afraid you're going to turn out just as whiny as Anakin...
 
ColonialRaptor said:
I think it consumed a whole sun for the first firing we just didn't see it.
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oh, i missed that. I just really digged that shot of Kylo Ren watching the beam go by his window.

that pretty much means the Starkiller base kills 2 star systems with each shot, one target system, plus the one they froze by consuming its sun.
 
Not Spaceghost said:
It was a lot of fun but it needed to be more focused, there was a ton of not really filler, but what i'd call fat to this movie. I was expecting a slightly more slimmed down product.
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I don't think there was any fat really, but I think I understand what you mean that it could have been more focused and slimmed down. Introducing Finn, Rey, Poe, BB-8, Kylo Ren and then re-introducing Han & Chewie, then introducing Maz, then seeing Leia and 3PO again, meanwhile trying to flesh out the First Order.. it's A LOT to take in. I think this is why they went with a simple plot and a structure similar to ANH and an enemy weapon that was simple to grasp and didn't need much explaining beyond "it's a Death Star, but bigger". It would have been too messy if the plot/politics/threat needed a bunch of explaining. Overall I thought it was a very good decision, they focused on character moments instead of coming up with some intricate plot.
 
Rymuth said:
Just came back - only one gripe:

- Kylo Ren aka Arkham Knight aka Anakin 2.0....yeeeesus, what happened here? Spends 3/4 of his screen time maskless and whines how everything's not going his way.

When Rey said "You're afraid you're never going to be as strong as Darth Vader", she should've said "You're afraid you're going to turn out just as whiny as Anakin...
Click to expand...

He did? Didn't appear whiny to me, especially not Anakin 2.0
 
Fliesen said:
oh, i missed that. I just really digged that shot of Kylo Ren watching the beam go by his window.

that pretty much means the Starkiller base kills 2 star systems with each shot, one target system, plus the one they froze by consuming its sun.
Click to expand...

Unless the system has more than one star, which is quite common.
 
I don't really get the complaints about kylo. Yeah he's young, brash and unsure. Basically a late teen being manipulated by a charismatic leader/ideal. He wasn't even "whiny", but he did have a temperament, which I liked. It wasn't subtle but did a nice job at exposing his main flaw.
Or did we want more video game character like darth maul
 
Violet_0 said:
I'd assume you need a shitload of resources to construct something like that, there should be an extensive spy network that monitors suspicious activities in all sectors. And they must have had someone to keep an eye on the remaining Empire splinter forces and what they're up to, even if it happened in a part of the galaxy that is still fully under their control

Fliesen got a good point there though, I suppose. Still, at this technology level, you'd expect some highly advanced surveillance and espionage tools


something I've forgotten to say about Kylo is that I love the fact that he's a dark force user that is tempted by the light side, for a change. Something inherently funny about it
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I thought about this then realised that the Empire managed to build two massive Death Stars fine and with little fuss until they got blown up.
 
pringles said:
I don't think there was any fat really, but I think I understand what you mean that it could have been more focused and slimmed down. Introducing Finn, Rey, Poe, BB-8, Kylo Ren and then re-introducing Han & Chewie, then introducing Maz, then seeing Leia and 3PO again, meanwhile trying to flesh out the First Order.. it's A LOT to take in. I think this is why they went with a simple plot and a structure similar to ANH and an enemy weapon that was simple to grasp and didn't need much explaining beyond "it's a Death Star, but bigger". It would have been too messy if the plot/politics/threat needed a bunch of explaining. Overall I thought it was a very good decision, they focused on character moments instead of coming up with some intricate plot.
Click to expand...
characters were most definitely more important than world / politics.

Again, i think they could have removed that part with the ... tentacle monsters on Han Solo's freighter entirely.

lastplayed said:
Unless the system has more than one star, which is quite common.
Click to expand...

well, if the ecosystems of surrounding planets are balanced around a twin star system, i'm not sure reducing the number of stars to one would be something those planets would survive for long.

but that's being really nitpicky, let's not bring astrophysics into star wars ;)
 
Rymuth said:
Just came back - only one gripe:

- Kylo Ren aka Arkham Knight aka Anakin 2.0....yeeeesus, what happened here? Spends 3/4 of his screen time maskless and whines how everything's not going his way.

When Rey said "You're afraid you're never going to be as strong as Darth Vader", she should've said "You're afraid you're going to turn out just as whiny as Anakin...
Click to expand...
think of him as Anakin, but on a possible redemption path (after fucking up by killing Han, mistakenly believing that it would somehow calm his conflicted mind). The scene where offered to train Rey really felt like heavy foreshadowing. My god, it's so much like Avatar: TLA

played by a far better actor. Oh, and he's more badass too.
 
Fliesen said:
well, if the ecosystems of surrounding planets are balanced around a twin star system, i'm not sure reducing the number of stars to one would be something those planets would survive for long.

but that's being really nitpicky, let's not bring astrophysics into star wars ;)
Click to expand...

Not nitpicking at all, just saying it's possible it could charge a few times without moving much. So in a binary system it would only kill three systems, instead of four. That's good value. :D
 
Rymuth said:
Just came back - only one gripe:

- Kylo Ren aka Arkham Knight aka Anakin 2.0....yeeeesus, what happened here? Spends 3/4 of his screen time maskless and whines how everything's not going his way.

When Rey said "You're afraid you're never going to be as strong as Darth Vader", she should've said "You're afraid you're going to turn out just as whiny as Anakin...
Click to expand...

Because he's not a Sith Lord. Kylo Ren is Solo's son who was given to Luke's academy and was (for reasons we're not yet told) seduced by the dark side. It is heavily implied that he's not a fully trained Jedi at all. He was maybe not the most powerful in Luke's academy. It is also heavily implied that he has anger/rage issues which lead to the dark side.

I think people who don't like Ren are unwilling to accept that a Star Wars villain doens't need to be the all-powerful dominating Sith Lord. This guy is much more nuanced and has plenty of room for growth. And even in his "whiny" state, the guy still murders a lot of people, kills his own father, almost kills Finn which is much more than Vader achieved in episode 4.

Kylo Ren is awesome and that's saying a lot, considering how all the new characters are great. (although I don't get the Poe Dameron love, the guy has almost no character development and is pretty much a one-note badass)
 
The more I think about it.

The least this movie stands on its own legs.

The plot of all the Star Wars movies is very simple and engaging.

This one is a cluster fuck.

If I had to convince somebody who doesn't know about star wars, I wouldn't know where to start.

It relies far too much on past movies and it's not having a decent story of its own.
 
Violet_0 said:
think of him as Anakin, but on a possible redemption path (after fucking up by killing Han, mistakenly believing that it would somehow calm his conflicted mind). The scene where offered to train Rey really felt like heavy foreshadowing. My god, it's so much like Avatar: TLA

played by a far better actor. Oh, and he's more badass too.
Click to expand...

What I love about him is that he ACTS like he's badass but you can see all his insecurities.
Even his entire costume and his posture while in it (a slight slouch, the voice changer, the mask). It seems like he's trying to emulate so hard his big idol Vaderino. I dunno if every touch was intentional in his demeanor but I really liked it

Slaythe said:
The more I think about it.

The least this movie stands on its own legs.

The plot of all the Star Wars movies is very simple and engaging.

This one is a cluster fuck.

If I had to convince somebody who doesn't know about star wars, I wouldn't know where to start.

It relies far too much on past movies and it's not having a decent story of its own.
Click to expand...

I disagree. How is it a clusterfuck ? Like really ? It's muddy in some points at "best" but a clusterfuck ?
I mean, it's pretty much episode 4 again with some slight variations and episode 4 is clear as day. And of course there's obvious tie because yeah, it's a continuation.
As for convincing, it's basically fantasy with a coat of space paint on it. Space wizards, laser sword fights, giant evil intergalactic empires vs resistance, unlikely heroes. Like I dunno. You could critique it's too far similar a plot to 4 but that would make it the opposite of a clusterfuck.
 
Fliesen said:
characters were most definitely more important than world / politics.

Again, i think they could have removed that part with the ... tentacle monsters on Han Solo's freighter entirely.
Click to expand...
Yeah, possibly. That sequence does get them all to escape together on the Falcon though.
 
Violet_0 said:
I'd assume you need a shitload of resources to construct something like that, there should be an extensive spy network that monitors suspicious activities in all sectors. And they must have had someone to keep an eye on the remaining Empire splinter forces and what they're up to, even if it happened in a part of the galaxy that is still fully under their control

Fliesen got a good point there though, I suppose. Still, at this technology level, you'd expect some highly advanced surveillance and espionage tools


something I've forgotten to say about Kylo is that I love the fact that he's a dark force user that is tempted by the light side, for a change. Something inherently funny about it
Click to expand...

yeah something I thought about too. The resistence had no clue about the base. But here is a weapon, that you can see from space with your own eyes. How in the hell did they keep it secret? No spies, no recon, no educated guesses, with the amount of demolition and construction that would have needed to take place. No one mentioning or noticing whole stars disappearing?
 
Concerning why the map piece couldn't be used by itself, I'm guessing it's the same reason KOTOR had you go around piecing together 5 parts of a map to find the Star Forge. The galaxy is a big place, and you can end up with a piece where there are no recognizable landmarks.

Speaking of KOTOR, the planet on which Rey finds Luke could be Rakata Prime. That planet features on a map in The Force Awakens Visual Dictionary.

I had some part of this movie spoiled for me, but I'm so glad the Rey/Kylo duel at the end was still a surprise. That was incredible. She is such a wonderful new character.
 
koddas said:
Loved this movie so much but man the idea of Chewie galaxy trotting without Han makes me so sad :(
Click to expand...

that really got me as well, i was never a chewie fan, but I felt for him when han died, his rampage should have been longer, though, he should have ripped of kylo's arm right there. or any arm at least.

and damn C3PO was so annoying, how he ruined han and leias scene. i understand he did similar things in episode 5, but damn.
again, I was never a big droids fan, but BB-8 was absolutely funny and adorable, easily the most likable droid, I had really no interest in seeing that annoying prick C3PO ever again after BB8.
 
MrHoot said:
I don't really get the complaints about kylo. Yeah he's young, brash and unsure. Basically a late teen being manipulated by a charismatic leader/ideal. He wasn't even "whiny", but he did have a temperament, which I liked. It wasn't subtle but did a nice job at exposing his main flaw.
Or did we want more video game character like darth maul
Click to expand...
Kylo was awesome. A more developed, younger version of 'good' ROTJ Vader. I loved the tantrums, it's a more realistic 'tortured' character. And fresh, we don't see that in fantasy style movies much.

So many great performances in this film. Ridley, Boyega, Driver, Ford were all spectacular IMO.
 
Just saw it, very random thoughts:
- I liked it a lot. It's where I expected it (somewhere between RotJ and ANH, with ESB being on top). I thought the moment to moment action was fantastic, but overall the movie didn't flow perfectly. There's just too much stuff in there.
- While the overall story was only good, I loved all the new characters and their chemistry.
- Kylo Renn was definitely not what I expected. I liked that they got his lineage out of the way pretty quickly, and I also liked that he's not another super powerful Sith, but rather a teenage shitlord gone horribly wrong. There's a lot to be said about how both he and Rey have bits of Anakin in them, while being negatives of one another.
- Finn was a bit disappointing. He's a good character and his interactions with Rey are great, I like the idea of a stormtrooper reclaiming his uniqueness, but there wasn't much development in there for him.
- Rey is really fucking cool. She might be too cool, in the sense that she's the best bits of Luke, Han and even Anakin all rolled into one character, but her dark streak is intriguing. I'm dumb because I couldn't figure who she is and why she was waiting there. It was a dick move to have half her flashes in the trailer to completely subvert expectations.
- Poe was cool. I don't know if he's the next Han or just Wedge with a larger role, but I liked him.
- BB-8 looked great, he's just adorable.
- The nazi thing was way too on the nose. I really hope their lead guy is an actual giant. I liked how they went back to a power structure like ANH with Tarkin and Vader, where the dark side guy isn't above the military commander.
- That ending was great. I disagree with people calling it a remake of ANH. There's a ton of echoes and obvious references, but the links are pretty superficial IMO.
 
I thought Ren (Renn?) Was pretty lame. There was little reason to fear him, and he never showed himself as particularly powerful. Maybe the supreme leader guy will give him a boost but eh

Enjoyed the film overall, but it just kinda feels like a setup. Hope the next film pushes the envelope further.

Also the two guys from the Raid were underused. And I didn't see any choreography cool enough to have come from them. Where's my TOR CGI level lightsaber battle dammit?
 
BronsonLee said:
Now Chewie just sits at home, watches Netflix, and looks up sadly at a photo of him and Han being buddies
Click to expand...

e547394a6b2cb387c265b280a8a62819.png
 
The death of Han made me sad, kind of spoiled the rest of the movie for me. Very disappointing that Han and Luke never met again.
Why'd they have to go with yet another Death Star for this story? Twice in the original trilogy wasn't enough? And the new empire learned nothing from the past and forgot to properly protect it, again. Overall, a bit bleak for a Star Wars movie.
Some parts made no sense at all, unfortunately. What was the speed of the shots fired by the new Death Star (had to be FTL to reach planets in different systems, but why was it visible then)? Why were explosions of distant planets visible from the base of the rebels?
 
Really there was so much to love in this film.

The Millenium Falcon being in a badass dogfight.
Han and Chewie's banter.
Wookiee rage!!!
Great lightsaber fights.
Brilliant humour.
Satisfying climax.
Very good use of 3D.

I'm seeing this again ASAP and I will buy the 3D Blu-Ray immediately. Steelbook if possible.
 
One thought that just occurred to me - the First Order won, right? They destroyed the Republic. So... what were the consequences of that exactly?
 
Fliesen said:
quite obviously. I suppose you can more easily and effectively rule an entire galaxy as a totalitarian regime.
I don't find it hard to believe that the current government of the republic is utterly overwhelmed by the splinter groups of the former empire.

it's similar to the diadochi after the fall of Alexander the great's empire.
Click to expand...

But the resistance still somehow knew exactly when the base started powering up and where it was firing at? I like JJ for the character stuff but the story was nonsensical.
 
D.Lo said:
So many great performances in this film. Ridley, Boyega, Driver, Ford were all spectacular IMO.
Click to expand...
Definitely agree with this, Driver especially.

Just got home from watching the film and I really enjoyed it. That ending got me hyped! Lightsaber fights were awesome too,
 
Fix The Scientist said:
But the resistance still somehow knew exactly when the base started powering up and where it was firing at? I like JJ for the character stuff but the story was nonsensical.
Click to expand...

Well, I assume they just looked at how quickly the star was shrinking and extrapolated from that. They also mentioned a surveillance flight, no? Maybe they have some smaller ships in the area that gather data.
I mean, it's a bit like asking how they can even communicate in real-time over such distances.
 
EpicBox said:
One thought that just occurred to me - the First Order won, right? They destroyed the Republic. So... what were the consequences of that exactly?
Click to expand...
The way I took I it, they basically reset the political situation to pre-ANH, except there's not even the semblance of a senate, just space nazis, local federations I assume, and the Resistance.

Edit: Star Wars Episode VIII - The Star Wars.
(While this could have been An Old Hope)
 
Reading this thread I'm surprised how well y'all seem to take Han's death. I had no idea it would happen as I avoided all spoilers since episode VII was announced, and it felt like a massive (and unnecessary) downer.
 
majik13 said:
yeah something I thought about too. The resistence had no clue about the base. But here is a weapon, that you can see from space with your own eyes. How in the hell did they keep it secret? No spies, no recon, no educated guesses, with the amount of demolition and construction that would have needed to take place. No one mentioning or noticing whole stars disappearing?
Click to expand...

It reminds me of the whole "Romulus's star suddenly goes supernova" shit in Star Trek 2009.

Thanks Abrams.
 
it seems like the pandering to the OT was something that just kind of had to be done after the prequels

It makes sense when you think about it, go for that nostalgia and win back the old masses. I guess what i'm getting at is that this was probably a strategic move to get as many people as possible back onboard, and the other two movies can still be their own thing.
 
Palette Swap said:
The way I took I it, they basically reset the political situation to pre-ANH, except there's not even the semblance of a senate, just space nazis, local federations I assume, and the Resistance.
Click to expand...

I'd argue it's even more wild west than Pre-ANH. NO ONE is the establishment now. It's gunna be a mad grab for systems and power as the Resistance and the New Order both try to gobble up the galaxy the fastest. This is probably going to be absolutely brutal for the little guy in this galaxy.
 
Relied too much on Episode 4.

Loved the robot, loved the sword battles, no silly jumping around.

Hated the constant fan-service, again, it relied too much on Episode 4.

Loved the scene with the café where all the different alien races were chilling.
 
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