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[Kin5290]

I said this a couple of nights ago, after seeing it, but does it bother anyone else that Raye is a Mary Sue character? New can-do-everything character who bonds and forms instant relationships with everyone she meets.

This is why the Mary Sue is such a sexist trope. It's disproportionately applied to female characters over male characters, even if they may technically qualify. Female characters require a higher level justification for why they can be badasses, it seems, even when at a base level their backstory boils down to "survived 15-20 years" on a hostile death planet.

Also, "forms instant relationships with everyone she meets", what does that even mean?

 

[The Flash]

Can't read through the whole thread right now, but... is there a consensus on why this shot, which appeared in the final trailer, did not make it into the movie?

Yeah it was there.

 

[SuperBanana]

The movie felt a bit too packed though. Felt more like two movies cut into one. Never really got a chance to breathe.

I think the Starkiller base felt like too much. The movie would have been fine without a super weapon and if that planet had been normal or just a First Order base but they wanted that c-wing action scene at the end.

Also, where are the other fighters?! No Y-wings, B-wings, A-wings, Tie-interceptors, Tie-Bombers, nothing.

 

[Discotheque]

Can't read through the whole thread right now, but... is there a consensus on why this shot, which appeared in the final trailer, did not make it into the movie?

this was in the movie. but they cut out that amazing scene in the teaser where kylo busted out his lightsaber.

 

[Dash_Riprock]

I said this a couple of nights ago, after seeing it, but does it bother anyone else that Raye is a Mary Sue character? New can-do-everything character who bonds and forms instant relationships with everyone she meets.

She's no more of a Mary Sue than Luke was/is.

 

[FeD.nL]

It was talked about before; thing is with time zones, you'll notice threads repeat themselves.

I paid special attention in my second viewing after someone mentioned it; definitely Obi-Wan saying "Rey" as she snaps out of the vision.

I do wonder if they've left it open deliberatel; she could be a Skywalker or a Kenobi. In fact, they left a lot open, probably to allow 8 to go where it needs to go, and doesn't have too much already locked down.

Rey and Luie could have spent years together on the island, or they returned to the Resistance straight away.

Finn could have woken up straight away, and has risen within the ranks of the resistance. Alternatively, he may still be recovering in 8.

The Republic could have either been wiped out, OR Starkiller just took out the closest system and was then targeting more, as well as the Resistance base.

They weren't kidding when they said Johnson had a lot of freedom.

My bad. I searched for 'Alec Guinness' and the only results I got were my posts of yesterday. Should have searched for Obi-Wan I guess.

 

[SuperBanana]

because the editors suck. they also cut out that amazing scene in the teaser where kylo busted out his lightsaber.

No they didn't. It was when he cut up the console after hearing the droid escaped.

 

[Gamezone]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

 

[johancruijff]

really wish the soundtrack throughout the movie was as good as it was during the final scene. that was the best of williams' original music in this film (and the only piece i remember)

been going back to that track quite a bit already.

loved this tho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTmP0iBQUkA

 

[Cybit]

Just got back.

I liked it a lot. Felt like watching a star wars movie in the theater. Got legit chills when Finn grabs the lightsaber, ready to fight Kylo. Had to stop myself from yelling out in the theater to "KICK THAT ()&*#@)$*)@#*_)$ ASS", Rey is immensely likable, Daisy Ridley is freaking killing it. Boyega was OK until the end where he picked up. The final scene of him vs Kylo was so well done in terms of emotional play.

The assumption is that Rey is Han and Leia's child; but I'm guessing she is either Luke's kid or the Emperor's kid. I also think Snoke is a red herring for someone else - wouldn't be surprised if they go the clone route with Emperor or something similarly out of nowhere. I was sad that Chewie didn't rip Kylo's arm off.

9/10 to 9.5/10.

 

[Dash_Riprock]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

Sigh, for the third time, blaster shot to the gut. That he could still even fight demonstrated his force power. As for the bolded: Um, that was the point. He is.

 

[Discotheque]

No they didn't. It was when he cut up the console after hearing the droid escaped.

no not that scene. the teaser trailer, where he's in the forest and busts out the saber.

 

[Shuggananas]

Can't read through the whole thread right now, but... is there a consensus on why this shot, which appeared in the final trailer, did not make it into the movie?

Because editing
And I think this one might have been in I'm not sure

 

[Messypandas]

Alot of stuff from the first teaser was cut. Kylo pacing then igniting, Rey looking panicked on the speeder magnum, bb-8 high-tailing across the sand, the shot of the xwings kicking up water (it was different in the movie) and Finn standing into shot was a shorter cut.

 

[El Topo]

no not that scene. the teaser trailer, where he's in the forest and busts out the saber.

He's wearing a helmet in that scene. Maybe it was just done for the trailer?

 

[Rehynn]

Yeah it was there.

This exact shot? I was looking forward to it the whole time, but never saw it. I think they showed Finn attacking Kylo (with a lot more determination) instead.

I'm seeing it again on the 22nd, so I'll make sure not to blink, lol.

 

[riverboatgambler]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

It isn't great writing but they are setting the two characters up as fairly equal. There's also the possibility she really does have training and her memories have been altered, the way those scenes are presented doesn't really seem to support this though.

 

[Blue Ninja]

I think that Kylo shot was done purely for the teaser. Was a cool reveal for Ren's lightsaber, but since we already had that earlier in the movie that particular scene/shot wasn't really neccesary in the finished product.

Speaking of the lightsaber, I really liked how Kylo's was so distorted and chaotic when compared to Luke's. Thing was buzzing with energy.

fuck me I'm two years older, thanks dude

To think that could've been us swinging lightsabers on set.

 

[Moff]

Seeing a bad guy being tempted by the light was amazing..

I think that's a very interesting idea.
the trope is that jedi are tempted by the dark side, but seeing it the other way round adds something new. people call him whiny but I think it's far more interesting to see a villain who is not a badass but someone who doubts himself.

 

[Occam]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

Yeah, she got a little too good, too soon.

 

[The Flash]

This exact shot? I was looking forward to it the whole time, but never saw it. I think they showed Finn attacking Kylo (with a lot more determination) instead.

I'm seeing it again on the 22nd, so I'll make sure not to blink, lol.

At the very least there is a scene almost identical to it.

 

[Skux]

Can't read through the whole thread right now, but... is there a consensus on why this shot, which appeared in the final trailer, did not make it into the movie?

Trailers are often made without the final cut of a film being completed - it happens all the time, it's no big deal.

 

[Fliesen]

She basically felt like Lady Luke though, and I don't know if that really gives her much identity.

They have similar origins, but are quite different in character. For example, she's (been so far) clearly a loner, Luke clearly is more outgoing. (friends at the Toshe station. Biggs. etc)

eh i dunno about that. just this year alone we had furiosa and the lady from mission impossible.

liked her quite a bit though but i don't think she can step up to those two. maybe by the end of the trilogy.

i totally forgot about Furiosa. i'm an idiot.
And tbh, i watched MI 5, but i can't really remember the name of the female protagonist, which does speak a bit against her character, imho.

I recall her being a great addition to the movie, but she didn't leave that much of an impression.

 

[nOoblet16]

When two sabres collide it's one's strength versus the other's
There has to be weight in light sabre battles

They don't collide for the majority of the battle though, the blows and swings should appear weightless until made contact with other lightsabres. It's not a proper sword they are swinging after all.

 

[Mr Cola]

Having time to sleep on it I view the movie more favourably, would love to see it a second time now

Anyone had a changed opinion on second viewing? Either good or bad?

 

[Cybit]

She's no more of a Mary Sue than Luke was/is.

Eh, she seems several tiers higher on the Mary Sue chart than Luke - at least Luke was a whiny pain in the ass who nearly got his ass kicked in a bar fight. But - her character is super likable, Ridley plays her fantastically, and I'm willing to let the story breathe and see where it goes.

 

[Shuggananas]

They don't collide for the majority of the battle though, the blows and swings should appear weightless until made contact with other lightsabres. It's not a proper sword they are swinging after all.

I
what

 

[Simo]

Can't read through the whole thread right now, but... is there a consensus on why this shot, which appeared in the final trailer, did not make it into the movie?

Shot was definitely in there. Its after the first parry of sabers and I think when Kylo hits his wound again.

Yeah they cut Kylo's teaser reveal but obviously that was just for the trailer. They also cut the scene from the second teaser where you see Maz's hand handing Leia Luke's lightsaber.

 

[El Topo]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

He's pretty wounded, he just killed his father so unquestionably there is a lot on his mind, he then fights Finn and first dominates Rey, who only manages to gain the upper hand after the whole "Close my eyes and let the Force in" scene. If we then add that his training is supposedly unfinished, it's not too farfetched. I could see why some have issues with that though. Maybe they could've had Chewie intervene, but I think they wanted to drive home that Kylo loses? We'll see how things work out in the other movies.

 

[john tv]

So not having read anything or been spoiled by anything (thank God), and just having seen the movie for the first time, I of course felt like Rey was Luke's daughter - has any evidence come out to disprove this yet? It seemed like all hints were pointing toward that to me, but what's the current word/consensus?

 

[Blue Ninja]

Yeah, she got a little too good, too soon.

Eh, don't forget Chewbacca dealt a pretty heavy blow to Kylo when he shot him. He was losing blood and in pain, and it was pretty clear he still had a long way to go before becoming a master himself. He had more experience, but when Rey focused her mind and channeled the Force it didn't feel like that much of a stretch for him to get his ass kicked. He was vulnerable.

 

[Mr Cola]

So not having read anything or been spoiled by anything (thank God), and just having seen the movie for the first time, I of course felt like Rey was Luke's daughter - has any evidence come out to disprove this yet? It seemed like all hints were pointing toward that to me, but what's the current word/consensus?

Strongly implied, not certain

The biggest indication we have is from interviews with Kennedy where she says (Paraphrasing) "The episodes saga deals specifically with the Skywalker family"

 

[Cybit]

i totally forgot about Furiosa. i'm an idiot.

I would have Rey magnitudes above Furiosa, fwiw. Rey is way more likable and fleshed out in not nearly as much time IMO.

PS: Disney, please release male shirts that have Rey on them, for she is a badass.

 

[nOoblet16]

Upon further reflection I agree with this. The first act was well-paced, but once Han showed up it never stopped.

The pirate and alien encounter should have been removed and the time should have been used for some exposition that leads to Maz's place, which is then followed by the battle where Rey is captured.

 

[Shuggananas]

So not having read anything or been spoiled by anything (thank God), and just having seen the movie for the first time, I of course felt like Rey was Luke's daughter - has any evidence come out to disprove this yet? It seemed like all hints were pointing toward that to me, but what's the current word/consensus?

Too many hints for her not to be a skywalker or at least a kenobi

Then you have the tinfoil hat clowns who suggest she's an engineered clone of palpatine or some garbage like that

 

[Fliesen]

loved this tho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTmP0iBQUkA

Yeah. It's my favourite from the OST.

It has a great progression, from unsuspecting and curious to confident and adventurous.

Too many hints for her not to be a skywalker or at least a kenobi

Then you have the tinfoil hat clowns who suggest she's an engineered clone of palpatine or some garbage like that

i'm fine with her being a blood relative of a Jedi we know (even though i still think she doesn't have to be for her to 'matter'), but what exactly were those hints? After my second viewing, I'm totally on board with the "she's been a youngling at Luke's Jedi school and she was taken to safety when Kylo Ren started wrecking that place, slaughtering the kids there.
The flashbacks are clearly chronological and clearly memories. Not just "visions".

 

[Stiflers Mom]

I really disliked what they tried with "Phasma"...

She has that "Glam-Armour", does the "sexy Stormtrooper walk", and was basically nothing in terms of story..

Why was she even in there?

 

[d1rtn4p]

Was also really disappointed they cut out that longer shot of the xwings flying across the water from the first teaser. Was easily my favorite thing from all the trailers.

 

[Mr Cola]

I really disliked what they tried with "Phasma"...

She has that "Glam-Armour", does the "sexy Stormtrooper walk", and was basically nothing in terms of story..

Why was she even in there?

To be set up for episode 8

 

[kaizoku]

Rey seems too good at everything to just stay as a good guy, similar to how anakin went bad. Luke ended up being the best ever but he started off as a bumbling babe and always faced struggles.

Anakin and Rey boss everything they try. Maybe she was abandoned on Jakku by Luke as he knew she would turn to the dark side and become the most dangerous Sith Lord ever. She could be related to Snoke or maybe luke saw darkness in himself and it was magnified in his offspring.

But now that she awakened Luke has no choice but to try and keep her to the light path.

Kylo will find redemption with his mother and Rey will find belonging and family with the dark side and Finn will have to try to win her back.

 

[JB1981]

I thought the settings and alien designs were uninspired. Honestly needed some of Georges touch there. Jabba's Palace shit on the alien creature designs in this

 

[john tv]

Strongly implied, not certain

The biggest indication we have is from interviews with Kennedy where she says (Paraphrasing) "The episodes saga deals specifically with the Skywalker family"

Nod, also Maz CG-whatever saying the saber belonged to her (am I misquoting? that's how I remember it anyway). And saying the one she was waiting to return wasn't coming (presumably her mother?), but that there was another (presumably Luke?). All felt like signs she's Luke's daughter to me. Tho you would think she would remember this if she was as old as she was in the flashbacks when she got taken away...

 

[Dash_Riprock]

I really disliked what they tried with "Phasma"...

She has that "Glam-Armour", does the "sexy Stormtrooper walk", and was basically nothing in terms of story..

Why was she even in there?

Boba Fett 2.0

 

[Shuggananas]

Yeah. It's my favourite from the OST.

It has a great progression, from unsuspecting and curious to confident and adventurous.



i'm fine with her being a blood relative of a Jedi we know (even though i still think she doesn't have to be for her to 'matter'), but what exactly were those hints? After my second viewing, I'm totally on board with the "she's been a youngling at Luke's Jedi school and she was taken to safety when Kylo Ren started wrecking that place, slaughtering the kids there.
The flashbacks are clearly chronological and clearly memories. Not just "visions".

Kylo doesn't know her
She doesn't know Luke. The flashbacks aren't memories, she saw the knights of Ren

She was left on Jakku as a kid too.

 

[Galava]

I think they made a big deal about Rey just overpowering Kylo everytime they clashed their force powers, as well as they made a point about how emotional Kylo is (Crying before killing Han, destroying stuff when Rey escaped, stuff like that). I am not exactly sure what his motivations for seeking power are (Maybe Han just sucked as a dad? Luke was too good as a teacher? I guess they will go deeper in that later on) but its clear he needs more, and having him lose twice to a novice has to hurt his pride.

So his character arc could be motivated a lot about defeating Rey in a personal way.

Killing Han seems unforgivable to us viewers since we know Han as per the original trilogy, but we really know very little about his real motivations other than to prove himself he could and that Han may not be a great dad.

My guess: Ben Solo found the lightsaber and touched it, saw Anakin murdering oyunglings and jedi in the temple. He said: Ok, if i want to be that strong, i need to do the same. So he proceeded to murder all Luke's apprentices.

 

[Messypandas]

I really disliked what they tried with "Phasma"...

She has that "Glam-Armour", does the "sexy Stormtrooper walk", and was basically nothing in terms of story..

Why was she even in there?

To completely fuck the home team over with the shields lol. Terrible character.

Seriously why not make her the fight with Finn and the electric stick dude. They could have prefaced it with her shocking him earlier on when he took his helmet off

 

[TangoAlphaLima]

Isn`t it a bit stupid that Rey was able to beat the shit out of Kylo, only an hour after she discovers the force? It doesn`t help that Kylo`s actor kinda looks like a scared kid.

Yeah, she got a little too good, too soon.

I suspect that they're gonna have to explain Rey's massively quick turn into a Jedi in the next film. Right now it seems completely against existing canon. Maybe it has something to do with Palpatine no longer exerting a dark shroud over everything? I don't know, but I think there has to be some explanation.

 

[Blader]

Wait what scene are you referring to

You can hear bits of Obi-Wan's voice at the tail end of Rey's vision.

 

[Cybit]

To completely fuck the home team over with the shields lol. Terrible character.

Seriously why not make her the fight with Finn and the electric stick dude. They could have prefaced it with her shocking him earlier on when he took his helmet off

It seems that she was one of the characters who was hit really, really hard by the editing. The un-cut version of this movie is going to be even better, it looks like.

 

[Galava]

You can hear bits of Obi-Wan's voice at the tail end of Rey's vision.

Didn't notice that, what does he say? I will pay more attention the next time I see it though.