[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #2) - One Thumb Up

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Raven117 said:
Yup....folks expecting VIII that dives deep into the lore for explanations will be deeply disappointed, IMO.
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I think they have a great opportunity to go deep into the Jedi/ Darkside mythos. You have Luke looking for the first Jedi temple, Snoke training up Kylo and the Knights of Ren backstory as well.
 
Fury Road > The Force Awakens > Creed, though they're all at least really good
Which is fun cause my 70s franchise love goes Star Wars > Rocky > Mad Max
 
MBison said:
I don't think he is. I don't think there was any evidence for it.
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I felt like the discussion about the "awakening" between Kylo and his boss happening right after Finn starts acting out kind of led me to think there might be a connection.

Brandon F said:
The hissyfits made for some great comedic moments, but as a tortured and conflicted villain carrying any real depth? I was not convinced. I saw more of Anakin whining to Obi-Wan in Ep. 3 than I did the cold ruthlessness of Vader in him.
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I think they're building to it. The way they didn't with Anakin.
 
BronsonLee said:
WHAT
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cJLYltg.gif


:P
The Chef said:
Can we just talk about SW and not start ranking movies this year please?
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I'm just saying.
 
BronsonLee said:
Don't worry, that's why I'm here!

This is the safest movie ever in the history of safe.
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This is how I feel too. Compared to what JJ with Star Trek 2009, TFA's script is no where near as provocative. I bet Arndt's original script was more like the first 30 min. Arndt didn't even want to revisit the old cast.
 
Brandon F said:
The hissyfits made for some great comedic moments, but as a tortured and conflicted villain carrying any real depth? I was not convinced. I saw more of Anakin whining to Obi-Wan in Ep. 3 than I did the cold ruthlessness of Vader in him.
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Yeah until he put his lightsaber through Han.
That whole scene was so amazing
 
Brandon F said:
The hissyfits made for some great comedic moments, but as a tortured and conflicted villain carrying any real depth? I was not convinced. I saw more of Anakin whining to Obi-Wan in Ep. 3 than I did the cold ruthlessness of Vader in him.
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That wast kinda the point. Kylo was a Vader poser. His mask was scarred and his voice modulated, but he was a normal underneath. He understood Vader's power but not the pain that Anakin had to go through to be Vader.
 
I'm honestly bummed Serkis is playing Snoke. It kind of means we're stuck with some cgi weird looking alien. The Emperor was way more intimidating. And I hope 'Snoke' is actually the equivalent of 'Sidius' and he has a much better real name, because what the hell were they thinking.
 
LegendofLex said:
I'm not actually convinced this is actually true or that it has ever been truly important to good triumphing over evil in the Star Wars universe.

- Anakin's Jedi training was insufficient to keep him from falling to the dark side. He certainly was never concerned with listening to the Force's guidance; he wanted to wield the Force as a weapon to achieve his goals.
- Almost every formally trained Jedi failed to survive the Jedi purge, and we're told the Jedi's ability to tap into the Force was diminished, presumably through Palpatine's influence.
- Luke was formally trained, but in the end ignores the instructions of his masters to defeat Vader and wins in the end precisely by refusing to participate in the struggle.
- Vader doesn't even actually use the Force to defeat the Emperor; he just opens his heart to compassion for his son, an act that requires no training whatsoever and in fact goes directly against his own Sith training.
- Yet again, every one of Luke's students-in-training either is slaughtered or is Kylo Ren and turns to the dark side.
- Rey, the only Force-sensitive person we've encountered in the films who as far as we know has had no formal training, defeats Kylo Ren simply by tapping into the guidance of the Force.

There's nothing saying that anything the Jedi or Sith have ever told us about the Force is actually pristine advice, and in fact the "formal" ways of both the Jedi and the Sith have been pretty consistently fallible.
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This is a really good point, actually.

I think it has more to do with the fact that the Jedi and the Sith represent two extremes. The Jedi way of teaching is about pacifism and inaction, whereas the Sith are more about pure, raw emotion and letting that fuel someone's strength (which usually always ends badly since that spirals out of control).

Theoretically, you could still have a so-called "Gray Jedi" teach someone the ways of the Force without adhering to either of those extremes. A pupil can still be taught about the ways of the Force without being exposed to the doctrine of the Jedi or the Sith, because both extremes lead to death and destruction. Which is something that I'm personally hoping will be touched upon in Episode VIII, specifically in Luke's teaching of Rey and how it (hopefully) differs from both Yoda's and the Sith ways.
 
well I aint posting detailed impressions since it's silly now but I watched this on the 16th at midnight and came back to a ban, lol

I really liked it. Im due a second viewing still which is stupid but just havent been able to make it happen. I'll even take the opportunity of not being able to share thoughts on it by better forming them in subsequent viewings.

it's pretty damn great, tho
 
SalsaShark said:
well I aint posting detailed impressions since it's silly now but I watched this on the 16th at midnight and came back to a ban, lol

I really liked it. Im due a second viewing still which is stupid but just havent been able to make it happen. I'll even take the opportunity of not being able to share thoughts on it by better forming them in subsequent viewings.

it's pretty damn great, tho
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welcome back. second viewing for us is on the 27th :D
 
Dubbedinenglish said:
That wast kinda the point. Kylo was a Vader poser. His mask was scarred and his voice modulated, but he was a normal underneath. He understood Vader's power but not the pain that Anakin had to go through to be Vader.
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This.

Though we don't know what particularly pulled Ben to the dark side, basing our current understanding merely from seeing that he isn't physically scarred shows us that he hasn't experienced what should have been life-ending pain like Anakin.
 
Ok, here's the bit from the novelization:

“It is you,” Ren murmured.

His words unsettled her: Not for the first time, he seemed to know more about her than she did about herself. But she had no time to ponder his comment, nor was she inclined to do so anyway; she was too consumed with rage. Holding the haft of the lightsaber in both hands, she ignited the beam— and charged.

[..]

Though Ren was bigger and stronger than Rey, their struggle had nothing to do with physical size. What she lacked in mass, she made up for in ferocity.

For a while she actually drove him backward, until he regained his self-assurance and in turn pressed her. The fight continued to shift back and forth; first he gained the advantage, then an enraged Rey took it back.

There was a vast rumbling, as of a continent sighing, and a gigantic chunk of forest behind Rey simply collapsed downward, leaving her fighting on the edge of a cliff so high that the newly formed surface below could not be seen through the rising cloud of dust.

Ren held his lightsaber, poised to strike. “I could kill you right now. But there is another way.”

Breathing hard, Rey looked up in disgust at the man looming above her. “You’re a monster.”

“No. You need a teacher.” He was beseeching and insistent all at once. “I can show you the ways of the Force!”

Slowly she shook her head. “The Force?” That was what this was about? Instead of moving to defend herself, Rey closed her eyes. Ren hesitated, confused by her actions.

A long moment passed, in which Ren sensed a change in the air, a change in her. Then she opened her eyes and attacked, viciously, in a way she didn’t know she was capable of, striking again and again as Ren was slowly driven back. The flaring energy from the interacting lightsabers was more pronounced than ever in the flurry of her attack. And—Ren went down.

He was up again in an instant, but not in time to fully deflect a following blow from Rey’s weapon.

He succeeded in blocking it, but he still took the full force of the strike against the haft of his own lightsaber. The weapon went flying into the snow. Unarmed, he raised a hand and utilized the Force to fend off one slashing blow after another, until finally her fury penetrated his remaining defenses.

Taking a glancing blow to the head and chest, he went down, a prominent burn slashed across his face. Weakened, he reached out toward his lightsaber, trying to draw it to him.

One downward cut, she saw. One quick, final strike, and she could kill him. The landing lights of a shuttle appeared in the distance, coming over the trees in her direction. She had to make a decision, now.

Kill him, a voice inside her head said. It was amorphous, unidentifiable, raw. Pure vengeful emotion. So easy, she told herself. So quick.

She recoiled from it. From the dark side.
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Fatalah said:
Could Rey be Luke's last surviving student, who's memory has been erased to protect her?
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I honestly keep thinking this might be it.

It still doesn't explain her visions of herself being a child but I could see those being false memories or real memories before she was taken in by Luke.

Or maybe she was left by her parents at some point so that longing for them to return is very much real but muddled by what she thinks she knows and what she actually knows.
 
I'll say that the first thing I immediatly thought of when coming out was this:

I can't believe how the lack of comradery and just real character interactions in the prequels had me with a fucking ridiculous hunger for more every time Poe and Finn interacted

like I wanted to follow them, forever, and more of them, all the time, from the minute they were on the Tie fighter

that's like the absolute main thing Star Wars had lost and I was smiling like a dipshit

a lot of it has to do with the performances really since it aint like the script was super strong regarding their banter but it really really worked. I fuckin care about new star wars characters mayneee
 
They've already delved into using the force to extract memories or information with Kylo. It doesn't seem that unlikely that you could replace existing memories with a fabricated one.

I'm not sure they'll go that route but it doesn't seem that far fetched.
 
btw I watched it at 1am on the 16th on a small theatre with only 3 other people there

which was fucking insane but the showing was kinda hidden on the website

ZPxSRvP.jpg
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I know a lot of people could say the lack of a crowd maybe hurts the thing but god no. I was stretching feet

also I couldnt help but wonder how many people were able to watch it like that on the fucking day. felt super weird
 
DoctorWho said:
You're right, but it would conveniently explain away her display of skill in a multitude of areas as more than just her being guided by the Force.
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It would, but given the overarching themes and dichotomies the movie is playing with I think there's no reason to accept anything but that, the most likely of explanations.
 
Did anyone else find the solar powered Death Star (that charges in less than an hour), to be completely absurd. Did J.J. get a ten year old to come up with that very clever idea for him?

Kylo Ren isn't strong with the force. The dark side is meant to be more powerful. Yet he got his ass beat by two amateurs with no jedi training. He's clearly no Darth Vader. Yes he got shot earlier but they don't how the injury affected his movement during the actual fight scene. He appears to be really going at it full speed, swinging with both both arms hard, no sign of him being slowed down by injury.
 
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