Uhh if learning how to levitate shit and bend weak minds to your will is on the table, you make the time lol.
[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #2) - One Thumb Up
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
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Uhh if learning how to levitate shit and bend weak minds to your will is on the table, you make the time lol.
Theodoricos
Member
I really like the idea of Rey being adopted by Luke the more I think about it.
On the one hand, I wish that she's had prior Jedi training to help explain her becoming more powerful in the movie once it begins to "(re)awaken". On the other, I do admit that an amnesiac protagonist is a little bit too much of a cliché. So at the end I'm not sure which of the two I'd prefer.
On the one hand, I wish that she's had prior Jedi training to help explain her becoming more powerful in the movie once it begins to "(re)awaken". On the other, I do admit that an amnesiac protagonist is a little bit too much of a cliché. So at the end I'm not sure which of the two I'd prefer.
GiantEnemyGoomba
Member
Yeah there's clearly potential for it to be great, but after they've established all this mystery, it'd be kinda lame for them to go with the only obvious outcome.
TheOctodad
Member
Just checked my local theater which is all reserved seating. There's still few seats at each one, but not many. And they have at least 6 theaters showing it.
Skellig Gra
Member
Why adopt her for like 6 months then dump her on a desert wasteland?
Smash cut to it falling on her head while she was cruising around Cloud City
VistraNorrez
Member
This exchanges makes me believe it is Luke. My theory is Kylo and the Knights of Ren kidnapped her with the intent to kill her, by Kylo couldn't kill her so he abandoned here on a backwoods planet.
Maz linking Rey's wait and search on Jakku with her search for Luke is almost too on the nose.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
It's already about a Skywalker. Kylo Ren.
The Librarian
Banned
I can also imagine, if Luke is dying at some point, her looking over him, crying, and saying, "You're my father."
A lovely contrast with the OT.
Either Han or Leia said they went back to what they were good at.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
It was good rey - Finn bonding and showing solo still had debt issues.
shortsFortallPeople
Banned
eh, she wasn't alone. we've been through this in the thread. Lor San Tekka is on Jakku and the basic assumptions being made are that he was watching over her the way that Ben was on Tatooine basically keeping an eye on Luke while he was shooting womp rats and working on the moisture farms. Jakku is a lot less obvious a place to look for a skywalker than tatooine so it makes sense to put her in that shitty place, to keep her hidden
some things in star wars are obvious. It's super obvious that Lando was going to betray Han, it was super obvious that Han was going to help in the end of ANH, it was super obvious that Han getting frozen and sold to Jabba was not going to be the end of the character. It's never been about how obvious something is, it's been about how well the execution is done.
And OT was about Luke and Vader. There's always two, remember
Well he does care about Luke to a certain degree, just not as much. Or at the very least he doesn't want to kill him. I think if the Temples would play a part in Snoke's downfall he would absolutely go out of his way to prevent Luke from finding the first one. In this film he doesn't do that.
Skellig Gra
Member
He did all of this when he was like 13 years old?
I can't speak for all the people entertaining alternate theories, but it's not that I don't think she's a Skywalker. She almost certainly is. It's more than I don't understand why they would cloak it in secrecy when it's such a painfully easy conclusion to jump to that any small child could do it. Why even bother? Virtually no one would be surprised by that reveal and it seems like the point of hiding such a thing from the audience would be to give us a shock when it's discovered.
It could still be a surprise for the character, but if that is their intent, I would've preferred it if the audience was somehow informed in this film. Hiding it when the answer is the obvious one can only do one thing in this environment: induce endless speculation that will end up leading to a portion of the audience being unsatisfied when it's just the obvious thing anyway.
Theodoricos
Member
After the Knights of Ren slaughter of everyone in Luke's academy, I assume, in order to protect her from being discovered through the Force.
We have another thing to consider though. Rey refers to whoever left her as "her family". I doubt that she'd consider her kidnappers her family unless her memories just got really screwed up once she was abandoned.
Would also make for a good end credits moment for 8 or 9
Cargoship Crew member: "Hey what's your name?"
Rey: "(ponders)...Skywalker. Rey Skywalker."
Future PhaZe
Member
did he survive? even after seeing it twice i forget about his fate
SmackAttack
Member
Since some are posting it, I'd figure I'd jump in and say that the majority of the showings are sold out at the theater I usually go to from here until Sunday/Monday. I'm trying to go see it again with a friend of mine but we might do Imax. Wonder if those are sold out too.
I'd imagine if Luke did adopt/is Rey's dad, he's not going to be the one who left her on Jakku.
It'll be something like he left her in the care of the Church of the Jedi guy (Exorcist dude) who left her there.
Something like, Luke has a good lead on where the temple is, finds it but ends up being bombarded with Force Ghosts, losing his marbles/blind/whatever and can't get back as a result -- he's stuck on the island.
So, whoever he left her with is the one who did so. They're not going to saddle Luke with the deadbeat dad thing.
It'll be something like he left her in the care of the Church of the Jedi guy (Exorcist dude) who left her there.
Something like, Luke has a good lead on where the temple is, finds it but ends up being bombarded with Force Ghosts, losing his marbles/blind/whatever and can't get back as a result -- he's stuck on the island.
So, whoever he left her with is the one who did so. They're not going to saddle Luke with the deadbeat dad thing.
TheOctodad
Member
I've always felt Luke was Rey's father, especially with lines by Maz about the light saber going from Anakin, to Luke, and now to Rey. I still feel that's most likely the case but after seeing the movie again today, I kind of haven't completely written off Rey being Han and Leia's.
I'm not going to write down my long in depth theory of what happened, but I definitely think Rey could have been placed on Jakku in secret by someone, not necessarily by Luke, after Kylo Ren kills all of Luke's students, and that Leia and Han assume their daughter is dead. It would explain the looks of familiarity that Han gives her, but also why the don't bring up a daughter when talking about bringing Kylo back home, or why Jakku means nothing to Han.
Again, I have a more in depth theory of this, but then again, I also think the easiest answer is probably the right one, and that is that her father is Luke.
What's wrong with Luke using a light saber again? Or should he also "be above" using one of the most efficient weapons/tools in the galaxy because reasons?
I don't think Leia wants to become a Jedi, why would she after seeing what happened to her father and then her son?
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Nice!
Iriscomeback
Member
Ok I just saw it a second time and loved it even more.
There was also something new I noticed.
When Han and Kylo are on the bridge, Kylo has red light on him. Han also has some red light in his face, but also blue light coming from the back. The light then goes red when Kylo stabs him with his lightsaber.
Finally, Han falls down in the blue light.
So fucking good. Can't believe I missed that the first time.
There was also something new I noticed.
When Han and Kylo are on the bridge, Kylo has red light on him. Han also has some red light in his face, but also blue light coming from the back. The light then goes red when Kylo stabs him with his lightsaber.
Finally, Han falls down in the blue light.
So fucking good. Can't believe I missed that the first time.
It's not really been a picnic for her brother either for that matter...
WadiumArcadium
Member
Well deserved. She was great.
Skellig Gra
Member
I guess that highly depends on who or what the Knights of Ren are. If they are the guys from Rey's vision it appears only Kylo is a force user and the rest are just thugs. If so that would imply he founded them. So he would have to have been like 13 years old when this all went down. Granted this is all speculation but her being SO young when left on Jakku really throws a wrench in the timeline of these events.
Rey age information from Pablo Hidalgo from Lucasfilm!
Rey is 19 in TFA (same age as Luke in ANH), was left on Jakku when she was 7.
Also a bit more clarification on Kylo Ren. He is 30 in TFA and TFA is 30 years post ROTJ, he was born shortly after ROTJ per Hidalgo. Conceived in the immediate aftermath of ROTJ it looks like. Kylo Ren was 18 when Rey was hidden on Jakku.
Rey is 19 in TFA (same age as Luke in ANH), was left on Jakku when she was 7.
Also a bit more clarification on Kylo Ren. He is 30 in TFA and TFA is 30 years post ROTJ, he was born shortly after ROTJ per Hidalgo. Conceived in the immediate aftermath of ROTJ it looks like. Kylo Ren was 18 when Rey was hidden on Jakku.
The Elite
BOSS
Anyone else trying to piece together a timeline for when shit would have happened.
We know the First Order didn't emerge until after Luke vanished. We just don't know how long ago that happened. Maybe ten years? It doesn't feel like Kylo's been doing the Kylo thing that long though.
When you place things on a time line it makes it clearer. If Rey was abandoned as a kid that would have been about 12-13 years ago based on how old she looked in the vision/flashback.
It's hard to say. The only concrete thing we know is that the First Order came after Luke disappearing. That is made explicitly clear in the crawl.
It's such a great paragraph. So much information.
Jesus Cheebs, it's like you were reading my fucking mind.
We know the First Order didn't emerge until after Luke vanished. We just don't know how long ago that happened. Maybe ten years? It doesn't feel like Kylo's been doing the Kylo thing that long though.
When you place things on a time line it makes it clearer. If Rey was abandoned as a kid that would have been about 12-13 years ago based on how old she looked in the vision/flashback.
It's hard to say. The only concrete thing we know is that the First Order came after Luke disappearing. That is made explicitly clear in the crawl.
It's such a great paragraph. So much information.
Jesus Cheebs, it's like you were reading my fucking mind.
I don't want her to be a Skywalker because a) the galaxy is bigger than that and b) I don't want these movies trying to chase or recreate "No, I am your father." That was a big moment for the OT, but it's not the only thing Star Wars is. I want characters built through more than just the reveal of who their parent is. It'll be a letdown, for me, if she's Luke's daughter.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
I only hope she doesn't get type casted
NYCmetsfan
Banned
Yub nub is good getting freaky music
Right. Learning to use the Force has ruined most her family's lives.
I'm sure she is content to just have the bare minimum and be able to sense great disturbances, nothing more.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
Well that would have been before her son's training.
But I get the father explanation as well as the explanations others have posted (she was too busy with politics, she has a temper, etc.).
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Just got back from seeing it again, emerged quite a bit more positive the first time I saw it A lot of thoughts I'm going to dump:
-JJ Abrams is a legitimately incredible visual director. He's been coming into his own the last few movies but this is the one that really shows off that goddamn, this guy has an incredible eye. He shoots action well, he shoots conversations well, he shoots complex sequences with changing perspectives incredibly well. Mad Max is still the best visually directed film of the year, but I think this movie gives it a run for its money. Take any scene out of context in this film and its going to look somewhere between great and astounding
-JJ Abrams is also a painfully mediocre structural director. And this is a problem that has also shown up in basically every movie he's worked on and it doesn't seem to be getting better. His films, especially the big sprawling ones, always feel cobbled together between scenes, and there's an awkward feeling to how everything connects together that represents, really, the movie's biggest problems
-The Starkiller assault was much more enjoyable now that I wasn't expecting it to be the centerpiece of the finale. As background for everything else going on it works really well
-The visual design in the cantina is also astounding, and has some of my favorite stuff in the whole movie. I know they played up the whole "using real props" thing a lot, and I think that was mostly nostalgia pandering, but in that scene in particular it reminds me of my rich eccentric grandmother's weird house filled with weird things.
-Domnhall's speech before the first firing of the Starkiller is fucking awesome. The whole thing absolutely sells the "psychotic nazi" vibe
-Rey being so skilled with the force so quickly never bothered me that much, and it really doesn't bother me now. Look, maybe the critics would have a point if all we had were the first three movies where it took Luke a week of training to learn how to move a rock, but in the decades since the expanded universe including TV shows and especially video games have scaled up the level of "force magic" considerably. Plus the force prodigy angle is one that I'm okay with, I like the idea of an "awakening", that the force, as a quasi sentient oversoul, has selected its champion of the Light Side to put forth.
-On the other hand, Rey's character overall is still the thinnest of the main three, and having really paid attention the second time through this is almost entirely because she got Mystery Boxed in her own damn movie. The first time I saw it I didn't keep total track of just how much they were neglecting her backstory versus hinting at it, but having paid attention now yeah they're really leaning into "Rey's past" as one of the big dramatic hooks going into the next movie. Which is incredibly dumb, IMO, especially when she's juxtaposed right next to Finn and Kylo
-On the whole "she's good at everything" thing: she is, and whatever, that's not really a bad thing inherently. But they don't contextualize it well. People point to the "we used to hit womp rats, they're not much bigger then that" line as an example of how you can use a single line to establish skill without needing much more context, but the thing about the womp rat line is that does establish context, it gives us a mental image of a dumbass kid and his friends in the outback gunning down rats. Rey, on the other hand, basically gets two lines "I'm a pilot!" and "I've never flown off planet" to justify her piloting skills, neither of which tell us anything about why this scavenger character who just drives a speeder to wreckage and back would have ever seriously flown a ship before. All they had to do was throw in something like "I helped Dargo Bylan run stuff cross planet a few times but nothing like this!" Is this more mystery boxing? I don't know, I don't know if her mysterious past is "she has repressed skills" or just "why she was left alone
-Finn and Poe fucking kill it at just seeming like super good buddies right out of the gate. Not much to say here, I just love those opening moments
-But...the best part of the movie is easily everything up until Finn and Rey find the Falcon. After that it starts to slide down pretty noticeably.
-In fact, while I liked him the first time around, now I really sort of wish Han Solo wasn't in this movie. The final scene between him and Ben is good, but everything with him feels like the movie playing into its legacy too cloyingly, and the movie is so much better when its about all new characters against the backdrop of the original trilogy we all love. He's only a decent actor in most of his scenes, his exchanges with Leia are particularly difficult since they're both...well, not great actors and now they have to act together. I wish I could see a version of this movie without either of them
-C3PO was a mistake. The initial gag, where he interrupts the reunion, is good. After that he's just playing awkward "what's that boy? you say old sally is in the well and we have to go rescue her?" translator to the droids when the much more effective method of having people just react to the droids and let us fill in what they said with context has already been working for the whole movie. I didn't like a single scene he was in
Hmmm what else...
-Kylo Ren remains incredible
-JJ Abrams is a legitimately incredible visual director. He's been coming into his own the last few movies but this is the one that really shows off that goddamn, this guy has an incredible eye. He shoots action well, he shoots conversations well, he shoots complex sequences with changing perspectives incredibly well. Mad Max is still the best visually directed film of the year, but I think this movie gives it a run for its money. Take any scene out of context in this film and its going to look somewhere between great and astounding
-JJ Abrams is also a painfully mediocre structural director. And this is a problem that has also shown up in basically every movie he's worked on and it doesn't seem to be getting better. His films, especially the big sprawling ones, always feel cobbled together between scenes, and there's an awkward feeling to how everything connects together that represents, really, the movie's biggest problems
-The Starkiller assault was much more enjoyable now that I wasn't expecting it to be the centerpiece of the finale. As background for everything else going on it works really well
-The visual design in the cantina is also astounding, and has some of my favorite stuff in the whole movie. I know they played up the whole "using real props" thing a lot, and I think that was mostly nostalgia pandering, but in that scene in particular it reminds me of my rich eccentric grandmother's weird house filled with weird things.
-Domnhall's speech before the first firing of the Starkiller is fucking awesome. The whole thing absolutely sells the "psychotic nazi" vibe
-Rey being so skilled with the force so quickly never bothered me that much, and it really doesn't bother me now. Look, maybe the critics would have a point if all we had were the first three movies where it took Luke a week of training to learn how to move a rock, but in the decades since the expanded universe including TV shows and especially video games have scaled up the level of "force magic" considerably. Plus the force prodigy angle is one that I'm okay with, I like the idea of an "awakening", that the force, as a quasi sentient oversoul, has selected its champion of the Light Side to put forth.
-On the other hand, Rey's character overall is still the thinnest of the main three, and having really paid attention the second time through this is almost entirely because she got Mystery Boxed in her own damn movie. The first time I saw it I didn't keep total track of just how much they were neglecting her backstory versus hinting at it, but having paid attention now yeah they're really leaning into "Rey's past" as one of the big dramatic hooks going into the next movie. Which is incredibly dumb, IMO, especially when she's juxtaposed right next to Finn and Kylo
-On the whole "she's good at everything" thing: she is, and whatever, that's not really a bad thing inherently. But they don't contextualize it well. People point to the "we used to hit womp rats, they're not much bigger then that" line as an example of how you can use a single line to establish skill without needing much more context, but the thing about the womp rat line is that does establish context, it gives us a mental image of a dumbass kid and his friends in the outback gunning down rats. Rey, on the other hand, basically gets two lines "I'm a pilot!" and "I've never flown off planet" to justify her piloting skills, neither of which tell us anything about why this scavenger character who just drives a speeder to wreckage and back would have ever seriously flown a ship before. All they had to do was throw in something like "I helped Dargo Bylan run stuff cross planet a few times but nothing like this!" Is this more mystery boxing? I don't know, I don't know if her mysterious past is "she has repressed skills" or just "why she was left alone
-Finn and Poe fucking kill it at just seeming like super good buddies right out of the gate. Not much to say here, I just love those opening moments
-But...the best part of the movie is easily everything up until Finn and Rey find the Falcon. After that it starts to slide down pretty noticeably.
-In fact, while I liked him the first time around, now I really sort of wish Han Solo wasn't in this movie. The final scene between him and Ben is good, but everything with him feels like the movie playing into its legacy too cloyingly, and the movie is so much better when its about all new characters against the backdrop of the original trilogy we all love. He's only a decent actor in most of his scenes, his exchanges with Leia are particularly difficult since they're both...well, not great actors and now they have to act together. I wish I could see a version of this movie without either of them
-C3PO was a mistake. The initial gag, where he interrupts the reunion, is good. After that he's just playing awkward "what's that boy? you say old sally is in the well and we have to go rescue her?" translator to the droids when the much more effective method of having people just react to the droids and let us fill in what they said with context has already been working for the whole movie. I didn't like a single scene he was in
Hmmm what else...
-Kylo Ren remains incredible
Thanks for sharing! Rey's actually younger than I would have thought they'd have her at, I would have guessed higher at 21. Do we know how old Finn or Poe are too?
Something I'm not understanding is the map - I mean, what does the orange line represent?
It's space...you can travel omnidirectionally. And yet there is this clearly delineated orange line that ends at Luke's location...which seems kind of pointless unless I'm missing something.
Why not just have a marker or something near his planet indicating his location?
It's space...you can travel omnidirectionally. And yet there is this clearly delineated orange line that ends at Luke's location...which seems kind of pointless unless I'm missing something.
Why not just have a marker or something near his planet indicating his location?
Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew
Banned
That's probably the path Luke took before he ended up in the remote planet.
The force ghost of Anakin flowing back and forth between the light and dark side is so fucking awesome. I really hope they use that in episode VIII.
TheOctodad
Member
Luke discovers Rey (I use this term open endedly).
Jedi Academy Slaughter happens.
Luke gives Rey to the Church of the Force to keep her safe while he goes in search of Jedi Temple secrets. He tells them that this child may be part of the key, but he doesn't understand enough yet.
Church hides her on Jakku after being hunted and threatened. Her "family" is simply the people from the Church that had been looking over her as she was training for a few years in the academy.
Lor San Tekka stays on Jakku to watch over her, hoping for Luke to return and figure out Rey's significance.
Jedi Academy Slaughter happens.
Luke gives Rey to the Church of the Force to keep her safe while he goes in search of Jedi Temple secrets. He tells them that this child may be part of the key, but he doesn't understand enough yet.
Church hides her on Jakku after being hunted and threatened. Her "family" is simply the people from the Church that had been looking over her as she was training for a few years in the academy.
Lor San Tekka stays on Jakku to watch over her, hoping for Luke to return and figure out Rey's significance.
The Elite
BOSS
Ewoks doing the nasty in the dark. Eating stormtroopers.
John Harker
Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
He thinks she is as strong if not more strong in the Force than he is, she just manifests it differently... Luke believes it is through her strength of will that she expresses her connection to the force.
Basically, she isn't as susceptible to the dark side as he is, and doesn't need 'jedi training' to combat the temptation of the dark side. Her strength and will make her more suited for leadership; and given the requirements of running an army, the pacifist nature of jedi probably don't suit her needs. So she doesn't have an interest in formal training and learning the martial combat which is more suited to single combat than leading from a command center.
Pieced that together from lines in the movie plus what it says about her in the Visual Dictionary of TFA and plus this interview:
http://screenrant.com/star-wars-force-awakens-leia-jedi-jj-abrams/
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
shortsFortallPeople
Banned
then the whole lightsaber flashback moment means zilch. And the whole "it was anakin's then luke's, it's been in the family" thing is a red herring, too.
I don't buy it.
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