Well at least it makes it harder for cheaters but it doesn't make any sense for SP game like Quantum Break. I hope they offer tools to devs to allow overlays. And please allow me to add games to Steam and have the Steam controller working. This would (for me) be ok.
Greenberg: Quantum Break is not coming to Steam
- Thread starter chadskin
- Start date
Well at least it makes it harder for cheaters but it doesn't make any sense for SP game like Quantum Break. I hope they offer tools to devs to allow overlays. And please allow me to add games to Steam and have the Steam controller working. This would (for me) be ok.
OnionPowder
Member
So you'd have rather that Dark Souls stayed the way it was just because Microsoft told you that we shouldn't have full control over the things we purchase?
tiredheadcrab
Member
Thats what I thought. It just looks like Devs will have to adjust something in the code. IDK why MS would have taken out multi gpu support. That seems absurd.
cm osi
Member
i fell this is kind of the piracy discussion.
all this uproar but there is no "quantum break pulled from steam to make it w10 exclusive"
it's either on w10 or nothing, i guess you would like it on steam but it's not an option. you're not losing anything here.
the fullscreen, gsyn and everything else is all an "if"
Its amazing/disappointing how some cant see past the end of their nose - hopefully the event next week will at least give an opportunity to discuss this further.
Right now this thread seems to amount to if you arent for Windows Store you must be an entitled Steam user which isnt really anywhere close to the point regards the concerns/questions raised.
MS are doing what seems the best business strategy for them regards a coherent ecosystem, but that should never imply that current users within that ecosystem dont have a right to reply regards how the multitude of their needs are considered/delivered by what MS are doing.
ps3ud0 8)
The only thing that's being lost are sales and that's on Microsoft and Remedy's side.
Also what the fuck are you on about piracy? How on earth is this even comparable?
Okay so honestly i get the ire around this platform choice. In my mind the positives outweight the negatives. This doesn't relate to Quantum Break specifically, but the main positive is less cheating in multiplayer games. I have a powerful gaming pc but i rarely use it for games available on my console of choice. Why? Because consoles rarely have the cheating/modification issues that pc has. Anything that fixes/makes that situation better, i am 100% behind. And unfortunately the same avenues people use for cheating are the same ones that durante and others use to improve/mod games.
EDIT: and for single player games it improves the situation on connected games. People can look at leaderboards and so forth and actually know that these are real scores people had...not something they went into an editor and changed.
EDIT: and for single player games it improves the situation on connected games. People can look at leaderboards and so forth and actually know that these are real scores people had...not something they went into an editor and changed.
So the only positive is that it may prevent cheating?
You'd give the keys to Microsoft to prevent cheating? For real? Why don't you support developers that give user's dedicated server tools so they can administrate their own servers for one.
This is such a stupidly complex and unnecessary restricted way to prevent cheating.
What amazing benefits! I'll glady give up modding and tweaking if it means accurate leaderboards.
OnionPowder
Member
Leaderboards on single player games > Customer control over their own products
Well its not the only reason. Its my biggest reason. There is also piracy, theft of assets, system stability, ease of install and uninstall, etc. And getting MIcrosoft's first party catalog on pc.
OnionPowder
Member
Those walled gardens on the 360 and PS3 sure did stop cheating on Call of Duty
Considering a lot of newer games use P2P instead of actual dedicated servers, that should really be the focus if we're talking about cheat prevention.
How exactly does UWA ensure system stability? What kind of esoteric crap is that?
Microsoft catalogue on PC is nice, but not on Windows Store for the reasons stated in this thread already.
Ease of install and uninstall? Wow amazing. If this is a hurdle for some people on PC, then they should stick to consoles.
Piracy and theft of assets don't benefit the consumer in any way. Those are specifically benefits for developers.
LordRaptor
Member
Steam offers both an anti-cheat service (VAC) and online leaderboards with friend / global filtering, FYI.
OnionPowder
Member
Too complicated on Steam
I'm guessing what he's getting at is the registry. He wants the registry to go away.
As much as I'd agree, this is the fucking worst way to go about it.
I've also yet to see any actual problems that arise from the registry when uninstalling and installing applications, other than left over crap that makes it think the app is still installed (which is a literal 10 second fix).
During my 5 years as a PC gamer I've only had to mess in the registry one time to fix some dumb error. But it has never actually broken anything for me after uninstalls and such.
It's very rare that you have to mess around in one even as a core gamer.
It can be annoying as an IT tech though.
I answered why uwa. For gamers it might not come up a lot...but for regular applications it does. I guess being an it tech colors my opinion therein.
I'm an IT tech as well, but this isn't a good move for gamers at all.
Different needs. It needs to be separated and stay that way.
Fortunately, we're still all on Windows 7 here. God help us if we move to UWA for anything.
I get the issues. I think the controversy is overblown. This store is only ever going to be 1st party and 3rd party agreement games (like rise). It isn't some landmark change in gaming. The platform will continue to evolve and some of these lost capabilities will come back. win32 isn't going anywhere; universal apps will never be able to replace many applications. Can someone seriously see visual studio written as a uwa? For Microsoft it solves crossplatform concerns for simpler applications on the app side. On the game side it protects xbox live and gives them a secure platform to blur the line between xbox one and the PC. Lets look at it for what it is. Gamers don't have a human right to modify game files. If you are not interested in this product...don't buy it. But multiple times in this thread people have said "you aren't a pc gamer" if you view pc's as more powerful consoles or are not concerned about the modding or game modification cause. This platform will allow microsoft to write a game as a uwa and have it run on xbox and pc. That is an incredible and very useful achievement and as a gamer something i am excited about.
(I'm reacting to this post assuming it was sarcasm. If that was a misread, then mea culpa)
As important as Steam has been in building the audience and expectations for digital distribution in PC gaming, this attitude that "Steam = PC Gaming" is pretty embarrassing. I say this as someone fully expecting the Windows 10 store to languish.
Who would have guessed!
Steam is fine. GoG, Origin, Uplay, Battle.net and even the Rockstar whatever thing are also fine.
They all sell computer programs. The Windows store sells "apps".
Wowfunhappy
Member
Have you ever reinstalled Windows, though?
Even if you haven't, surely you're familiar with the fact that a lot of Windows users reinstall Windows from scratch every few years, right? If you don't, you're computer slows down and you're a bit more likely to run into strange errors. This is mostly due to the registry; reinstalling Windows is the easiest way to clean it out.
Like I said before. MS should have done their own client, even if the outrage would have been as big (but of course from another perspective).
Luckily there's absolutely no-one writing UWP apps. The restrictions are simply too high, and as you said, software on windows is known to be available from whatever website/vendor you want.
They tried to lure developers over to UWP and their store with smooth talk about customers being able to easier install apps and sandboxing for apps, but in practice this meant a huge wall of restrictions and basically maintaining two code bases (as it's not viable to sell your software only in the Windows Store).
The fear I have though is that they'll restrict software installation rights further within future versions of windows so software can only be installed if signed with a windows store key. Or at least, they'll try. (as in: market win32 as the 'dinosaur' platform and everyone should go UWP).
This is a silly attempt to make people go to the Windows Store, but it doesnt' work like that: people go to whatever source they think will sell product P, and if that source doesn't sell P, then P doesn't exist for them. Exactly the reason why no-one is doing UWP apps today and didn't do any WinRT apps before that: no-one will go to the windows store to see whether it has a product they want.
Wowfunhappy
Member
Is this actually true? It's hard to believe that Nixxes spent that much extra time making a Windows Store version of RotTR.
Hmmm, maybe they could integrate it into the Xbox App, or remake it as a client that supports that.
Someone go post these ideas on the feedback website and link here so we can vote on it and tweet it to Phil.
Possible that it was required as part of some deal with MS.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I've been wanting to reply to this thread but hesitated because I'd get avatar quoted and laughed at but then realized who gives a shit? I can damn well share my opinion freely so here it is... BEST GAMING NEWS IN MONTHS!!! I had lost hope with how crappy the past couple years have been with remasters and remakes and my PS4 collecting multiple layers of dust and my PC....holy crap I don't eve wanna open the case to see what it's in there. Getting to the point...I've always been a fan of GFWL. I preferred it over Steam, Origin, Uplay. I liked the overlay, the integration with xbox live in case I ever bought the new xbox, the light client, how it's not really open when you play, the better achievements, the fact that it's not associated with fanboys of the worst order, the 360 controller being integrated, not having to navigate through a bloated client, the whole shebang. Never had an issue with it either (many many others can say the same) so when it was discontinued with no further game support i was bummed. When the Win10 store was announced I was excited but no stinkin games were being released on it. Fast forward to today and the best exclusives on consoles are now going to Win10. I can't get into 95% of japanese games so my PS4 is a dust collector...well not really, I use it for netflix a few times a week but in terms of games ughhh so I've always been envious of MS western exclusives and now here we are, they're hitting PC and NOT ON STEAM. I couldn't be more happier. I don't give a shit about mods or editing exe files. Mods cheapen the experience for me...like Fallout mods for example. Fixing Dark Souls and those other games wasn't modding, it was fixing broke ass games. Hopefully we won't see too many of them on the Win10 store. I SERIOUSLY doubt we will...Remedy and MS are working on QB themselves. It's not some new PC japanese developer like Dark Souls. I believe the Forza games, Fable, Sea of Thieves, Scalebound, Gears, Halo MCC and all other big Win10 exclusives will have the same top quality ports. That's my prediction. We won't have need for any ridiculous resolution fixes and whatnot. All of this will be on a nice closed cheat-free experience with full Win10+XBL integration. I couldn't be happier. I'm legit upgrading my PC b/c of this. It could run min specs on these games but a few hundred bucks and I'm golden. Best gaming news in a long ass time.
e: I sincerely hope MS doesn't listen to this thread and puts them on Steam instead. Keep em on Win10...grow your store, gain good faith from customers and your efforts will be rewarded.
e: I sincerely hope MS doesn't listen to this thread and puts them on Steam instead. Keep em on Win10...grow your store, gain good faith from customers and your efforts will be rewarded.
It's disappointing to see so many willing to give up all their consumer rights for the foolish idea that giving Microsoft all the control will fix everything.
It must be so rewarding for closed-platform console users to know their games arrive in fantastic condition that don't require fixing, provide a cheat-free experience, that Microsoft is able to anticipate their desire for how they want to play their games, offer a value-competitive online experience, and always put the needs of the consumer ahead... Oh wait...
For a game, the main code will be the same, but the shell around how it interacts with the OS etc., yes that's extra code you have to add for the Windows Store alone, it's useless outside it. Not to mention disabling things that are not available. It's another platform basically you have to support, like PS4, XBO and PC native, you have to add additional code paths and #ifdef the crap out of them so everything builds. That's all extra work.
For a game, maintaining things isn't the biggest burden, as more than a few bugfixes aren't released for the average game. For software in general that's a different story.
So because the things we complain about don't matter to you, everyone else that does care should get shafted?
You're right, you shouldn't have posted.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
These are MS best exclusives all AAA and heavily funded. Do you really think they'll release shit ports? Especially considering the sales for the win10 versions will probably be a decent chunk of the total sales. They're not gonna put out trash ports for these top exclusives. Remedy themselves are working on Win10 QB. So you can't edit your exes or run FRAPS... *shrug* Don't care. Hundreds of millions don't care with Apple either.
So, completely broken for months, and make people not trust 343i even more?
GHG
Member
Barack Lesnar
Banned
I forgot about that whole ordeal so scratch MCC off the list. That's a complicated as hell game to make...to synchronize all those multiplayer modes from 4 different games into one package. But you're right.
This is a forum of core gamers, not casual gamers. Of course there are going to be people that care here. You're ignoring an entire group of people that post here. Kind of a dick move.
The rest of your post is just wishful thinking.
You sell it for $60, you bet your ass it should work out of the box. Don't even try and make it seem like a lesser deal than it was.
From the tests i have done it looks like it doesn't actually blocks those things, so i don't understand why you are agreeing with that post.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=195417314&highlight=#post195417314
As far as I can tell, you can modify the contents of a windows store app. The only downside is that you can't use the original dev's signature.
A win32 app also has absolutely no trouble interacting with the minecraft store app. I used cheat engine and was able to modify in game values easily - just like with any other win32 app. (windbg worked as well)
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Sharing my opinion on it not discounting yours. I've been pretty consistent with it for years now.
Wow. Barack.
I don't know how to respond to your entire post. There are quite few gems in there, including:
Steam fanboys?
What?
I'm not sure that you ...
Ok, let me just respond to this, then:
Some would consider that having the games you purchased on GFWL vanishing to be "an issue".
I don't know how to respond to your entire post. There are quite few gems in there, including:
Steam fanboys?
What?
I'm not sure that you ...
Ok, let me just respond to this, then:
Some would consider that having the games you purchased on GFWL vanishing to be "an issue".
What version of Windows 10 are you running? I don't think you can do any sideloads on Home. Also, I'm pretty sure altering the code will break the achievements, since it's no longer the same app.
(Not that most power users would install 10 home, but this could be an issue for anyone who makes something like an edit to an app.)
I have Win10 pro on my pc and win10 home on my laptop. Just checked, and the home edition has the sideloading and developer modes as well.
Obviously any existing DRM the app implements by itself isn't being removed by windows.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Yes!
Weren't most of the poor Japanese ports due to the devs not being too familiar with PC?
Not following you here
Do you really think this will happen again? The Win10 game store is inside windows itself... it's built in, it's not a separate store front. Give it a chance mate.
What has Microsoft done that's positive for PC gaming in recent years?
I like you.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Nothing!
But you didn't address my point. The likelihood of that happening again is tiny...it is BUILT into Windows 10, not a separate client. The whole of Windows would have to collapse to have us lose our games again.