Arizona Primary 2016, its a mess
A hellish caucus where you stand in line for several hours and in the end, end up defeated by the dark side
did he really get 60%?
Super Tuesday 4. I'm really feeling (The After Bern) March 22, 26 contests
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Arizona Primary 2016, its a mess
A hellish caucus where you stand in line for several hours and in the end, end up defeated by the dark side
20k to Hillary's 13k.
Roughly ten percent of those that wanted to vote had their vote counted, basically.
Going to be interesting when this is dissected, I expect its mostly Republicans readying for the GE but if this leads to blowback on them that causes Arizona to go blue it would be pretty good.
I think that was the point, the whole organization in Arizona is geared towards suppressing voters who would not vote Republican especially with the current crop they have propped up during their circus act.
The republicans didn't fare much better, with only 49k votes counted. I doubt AZ will go blue anytime soon regardless.
John McCain is praying you're right.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
Saw someone post this on Facebook. Holy shit. Fucking incredible.
perfectchaos007
Member
I've been out of the loop but have the Bernie bro's been crying foul in Arizona?even as a neutral observer there did seem to be potential of tampering that May have happened with the write in ballots and the chaos at some of the polling sites
There were certainly issues with long lines due to lack of polling places (especially in Maricopa County, which had its number of polling places reduced by over 2/3). Some Bernie supporters are using these lines as examples of DNC-enabled disenfranchisement of people voting for Bernie, as if those lines contained 100% Bernie voters. There were also complaints about the news networks calling the state for Hillary early (when she was obviously winning by an insurmountably large margin). They claimed that the news networks were in collusion with the oligarchy to depress Bernie's vote totals by calling the race before it should have been. Most of the other ballot issues seem to be relatively minor compared to the average small-scale primary clusterfucks.
Arizona needs to do better to ensure everyone who wants to vote can actually vote in a reasonable amount of time. However, there's no conspiracy here other than the theories conjured up in the minds of Reddit's most vocal Bernie supporters.
John McCain is one of the few Republicans that call out the Tea Party as batshit crazy. He's willing to work across the aisle. He's so far from the first Republican that I'd want flipped that I almost don't want Arizona to turn blue just so he can remain a not-batshit-crazy voice in the Republican party to keep them in line.
Math really isn't a strength of some Bernie supporters is it?
boiled goose
good with gravy
It's like you didn't read my post at all.
Huh? His post was basically implying some Bernie mentum. Still under his targets and underperforming, but now underperforming less.
If he keeps closing this gap and doesn't get mawled in NY, we might have a race that comes down to CA. Of course this means winning big when he wins and not getting mawled in places like Maryland and Kentucky. (And ny as i said).
My expectations still have him losing by ~200 tho.
On Arizona.
As others have pointed out, it is hard to tell how it affected the primary.
My only issue is that the election was called based on early voting while people were still in line. That was fucked up. We do know early voting favoured Hillary.
balladofwindfishes
Member
What were you even saying? Hillary's been in support of Campaign Finance reform her entire political career and has the record to show that. You can't downplay this part of her platform.
TwoDurans
"Never said I wasn't a hypocrite."
There's only so many people in the state that can vote. When a candidate holds more than 50% of the possible voters they can call it with as little as 1% of the precincts reporting in.
In 24 short hours a very vocal part of them are practically convinced Arizona was a great big conspiracy the corrupt DNC planned and that Hillary was set to win sonce day one. It's reaching the mentality of the far far right and absolutely insane.
balladofwindfishes
Member
I'm extremely disappointed by the lack of critical thinking, research and just general awareness from Bernie supports, especially in the last few months when they've started to get desperate.
Liberals aren't supposed to be like this. We're supposed to be based on reason and fact. We make fun of Conservatives for being paranoid, reactionary and poor thinkers. It can't be like this, it's embarrassing.
lastflowers
Banned
The Democrat Party is full of idiots just like the Republican Party. I feel sorry for you if you're just coming around to this.
That being said, we're typically more empathetic idiots.
So you think they have the responsibility to not only decide what liberals stand for but also graciously illuminate the people who disagree with you.
When a group of people act condescending towards another group of people for the best part of the year - you should be expecting some blow-back.
balladofwindfishes
Member
There's a difference between blow back and paranoia/stupidity. Thinking everyone is out to get Bernie and he's the only light in a miserable world full of cheats and scams isn't really healthy or the right way to react to issues of voter fraud.
In their irrational hate of Hillary, they've put the blame on the totally wrong people, the wrong party, and let the GOP get away with it.
His vocal supporters are his worst asset.
lastflowers
Banned
Cool, go tell them that on twitter/reddit/facebook instead of side-swiping some of the less conspiratorial posters on neogaf.
balladofwindfishes
Member
But we were talking about the conspiracy theories and the people who believe them...
Does talking about less than savory Bernie supporters make you uncomfortable?
You call a bunch of people paranoid and stupid - while a critically thinking individual might realize that vocal minority of people are in no shape or form indicative of the large majority of people voting for Sanders.
Much like I choose not to believe that the majority of people supporting Clinton are like the people on this forum.
The irrational hate you speak of is a symptom of a primary process, much like how Clinton and Obama supporters had an irrational hate towards the candidates last primary despite them being far closer than Clinton and Sanders with their respective platforms.
Clinton's vocal supporters aren't in any shape or form better.
boiled goose
good with gravy
It wasn't reporting in. People were still in line. Generally calls are done after polls close. If you call it before polls close you can affect the results.
It's unclear how this would affect things but it definitely can. Clinton supoorters could go home thinking it's done. Sanders supoorters could go home thinking it's pointless.
That's why calls (and reports) are made after polls close.
boiled goose
good with gravy
Wow. Talk about having to go step by step here.
You understand that it is not just about wanting to repeal citizens United one day.
There is damage being done by money in politics NOW. Hillary is basically part of this damage.
And it's not just citizens United that is a problem. That only made things worse. There have been 3 or 4 Supreme court decisions since the 70s that have resulted in the mess now. Hillary has been tied with money in politics since her days in Arkansas and Walmart.
Watch the washington democratic caucaus here
http://www.king5.com/news/politics/washington-democratic-caucus-coverage/99029475
http://www.king5.com/news/politics/washington-democratic-caucus-coverage/99029475
Leona Lewis
Banned
You go, old lady
"I don't care if she takes their money, as long as she uses it on us!"
Caucus was a mistake, it's nothing but trash
Aaron Strife
Banned
I know! If Bernie doesn't get the nomination, let's burn the whole thing down by voting in Trump so we can get a real liberal in the White House in 2020 who will restore the VRA, McCain-Feingold, and a whole bunch of other crap!
(as if Hillary wouldn't support any of those things seeing as how she did as a Senator)
Election reform should be the first priority for any Democrat who gets the opportunity to push legislation.
I am actually pretty bummed that the entire focus has been on Citizens United, which a) is impossible for the legislation to do anything about and b) as discussed in this thread, is probably not nearly as big a deal as people seem to argue, at least for Presidential elections.
A short list of much more important election reform topics, from my view:
* Mandatory early voting in every state. Should be minimum two weeks, including weekends.
* Banning voter ID laws at the federal level.
* Vote by mail expansion.
* Voting Rights Act restoration.
* Restoring the franchise to felons.
I am actually pretty bummed that the entire focus has been on Citizens United, which a) is impossible for the legislation to do anything about and b) as discussed in this thread, is probably not nearly as big a deal as people seem to argue, at least for Presidential elections.
A short list of much more important election reform topics, from my view:
* Mandatory early voting in every state. Should be minimum two weeks, including weekends.
* Banning voter ID laws at the federal level.
* Vote by mail expansion.
* Voting Rights Act restoration.
* Restoring the franchise to felons.
Wafflecakes
Member
Almost all those things must be done at the state level...
is that because of a state's rights issue?
pigeon forgot automatic voter registration.
Wafflecakes
Member
No. Because the constitution gives management of elections to the states.
so what on his list can be done and not conflict with the constitution?
Congress explicitly has the power to regulate "the times, places and manner of holding elections". States make the decisions. Congress makes the regulations.
Wafflecakes
Member
Probably the voting rights act restoration, assuming the SCOTUS is a dem majority.
Wafflecakes
Member
DP:/
Nice blatant misquoting of the constitution.
No where in the constitution does it give congress power over the Presidential elections, or any other elections for that matter. If congress decided to go that route and try to force it on the states through the provision quoted, the states could simply have two ballots, each with different requirements. One for congress, one for everything else.
The only real power that congress has over the general election is choosing the day.
Nice blatant misquoting of the constitution.
No where in the constitution does it give congress power over the Presidential elections, or any other elections for that matter. If congress decided to go that route and try to force it on the states through the provision quoted, the states could simply have two ballots, each with different requirements. One for congress, one for everything else.
The only real power that congress has over the general election is choosing the day.
can congress take the power of redistricting congressional seats from the states? I assume they can't take away their power over their state redistricting.
Wafflecakes
Member
The SCOTUS has said they cannot. Though they have been able to impose some restrictions if the states are using their redistricting power to disenfranchise voters.
Black Republican
Member
so the next big super tuesday aint till april 26th? damn
Just got back from caucusing (Washington state). I got there an hour early and barely managed to get one of the last parking spots in the lot. By the time I left, cars were lined up along the road for several blocks.
Apparently, attendance was much higher than expected. Someone who was there in '08 said there were only seven votes from my sub-precinct back then. This time, there were 34. 28-6 in favor of Bernie. Due to the way delegate math works, that means my neighborhood is sending 4 delegates for Bernie and one for Hillary to the next caucus level.
Don't know how the precinct as a whole voted yet, because not everyone had their votes finished, but pretty much everything I heard from the other tables was pro-Bernie. Even the Hillary-supporters at my table were pro-Bernie - they mostly just thought Hillary had a better chance.
But that's to be expected. I am in western Washington, the more progressive half of one the most progressive states.
Apparently, attendance was much higher than expected. Someone who was there in '08 said there were only seven votes from my sub-precinct back then. This time, there were 34. 28-6 in favor of Bernie. Due to the way delegate math works, that means my neighborhood is sending 4 delegates for Bernie and one for Hillary to the next caucus level.
Don't know how the precinct as a whole voted yet, because not everyone had their votes finished, but pretty much everything I heard from the other tables was pro-Bernie. Even the Hillary-supporters at my table were pro-Bernie - they mostly just thought Hillary had a better chance.
But that's to be expected. I am in western Washington, the more progressive half of one the most progressive states.
gutter_trash
Banned
Caucuses should be abolished.
It should only be Primaries with lots of early voting days available
It should only be Primaries with lots of early voting days available
Wafflecakes
Member
True, but won't happen any time soon.
Black Republican
Member
sounds like its gonna be a sweep for bernie, maybe most the counties?
As long as there is no coin tosses caucuses are ok, certainly looks more fun than the Arizona primary
/bias
gutter_trash
Banned
Caucuses are not okay because it forces voters to be present a certain time of day which is bullshit
Electronic voting and automatic voter registration is the future, also a Holiday on election day would be good.
Black Republican
Member
Donna Brazile on cnn said there was a 31-31 split and bernie won by a coin toss
a good sign? :O
So far 8 precincts going to Hillary and 16 to Bernie, but no idea what the percentages are. I expect anywhere from 60 Bernie-40 Hillary to 70 Bernie-30 Hillary, with it likely being somewhere in the middle of the two.
If Sanders gets more than 70% it's a good night for him, whereas if Clinton gets more than 40% it's a good night for her. Anywhere else would be about where the parties would be expecting if to be and would be ok with it.
I'm really glad my state doesn't have a caucus, seems like a mess. I don't like to talk about politics except with my close friends and on the Internet. To have to go into a room with a bunch of strangers and do that shit seems horrible.
Edit: looking at people's posts it looks like it will be closer to 70% Bernie maybe a bit higher, which if true is good for him. Anecdotal evidence and all that though. Gonna have to wait till the numbers come in to make a judgment on how Sanders did today.
If Sanders gets more than 70% it's a good night for him, whereas if Clinton gets more than 40% it's a good night for her. Anywhere else would be about where the parties would be expecting if to be and would be ok with it.
I'm really glad my state doesn't have a caucus, seems like a mess. I don't like to talk about politics except with my close friends and on the Internet. To have to go into a room with a bunch of strangers and do that shit seems horrible.
Edit: looking at people's posts it looks like it will be closer to 70% Bernie maybe a bit higher, which if true is good for him. Anecdotal evidence and all that though. Gonna have to wait till the numbers come in to make a judgment on how Sanders did today.
Black Republican
Member
a yellow Hillary Yaas shirt spotted on CNN
Adam???
Adam???
Macho Madness
Member
He's in Ohio.
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