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[cerulily]

I can't tell who is trolling and who isn't anymore.

I can't believe THIS is the change they made based on expected feedback... Like NOBODY would have said anything about the size of her panties.

Square-enix is taking the wrong thing out of all of this, and i hope this inability to understand just what is often critiqued doesn't affect Yoko Taro :x

 

[Abstrusity]

I think the change is worse since they're far more not able now and make it look like she's one of those deviant art weirdos with a diaper fetish.

Let's be honest here, those people were going to edit a diaper on her anyway.

There will also be a Sonic rendition.

It is known.

 

[Muzicfreq]

Underwear? Really?
W/E
If it was nintendo this game would have been axed.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

I'd say their anger is kinda justified. They have to deal with changes in their game because of the extreme prudness of some people in a different country where the game is going to flop regardless of whether a character wears plain white underwear or what looks suspiciously like a diaper at the given angle.

"remove it for everyone" uh, why not just give optional costumes? i would be okay with that, everyone is happy

Lol that'll be the day

 

[Nottle]

Better not support Trump then, because /pol/ has been spamming his twitter with half naked cartoon girls (read: women in anime with MAGA hats shopped on), and he's gotten tired of it! :^)

That's hilarious. See, we need to have the freedom of anime waifus to harmlessly embarrass a political candidate.

 

[otakukidd]

I'd probably help people to understand how all the Japanese fans feel if they imagine our big block buster movies getting censored Western versions based on Chinese or Indian values. Another culture dictating our entertainment for us thanks to a rising fear of backlash.

Didn't this happen to homefront? Wasn't it suppose to be China invading but were made to change it.

 

[Majukun]

personally i don't care either way..after the last star ocean made my stop playing it out of sheer stupidity of its main character i wasn't going to purchase the game anyway,and i'm not that interested in virtuad underskirt,but i totally understand why the japanese are pissed..it would be like the next call of duty get's violence censored in the west too because japanese media would not like that

if japanese otakus want their fanservice just let them get their fanservice

 

[Mr. Pointy]

Didn't this happen to homefront? Wasn't it suppose to be China invading but were made to change it.

That was the Red Dawn remake.

 

[Wonko_C]

We get less sexy underwear.... which doesn't solve anything really.

Band aid solution

Exactly, this is not the solution. They should remove it altoget- wait...

She's under 18 right? So why are they even trying to sexualize her in the first place? Why are these guys so obsessed with being able to see a teen girls panties?

Even if she weren't 18, in Japan 16 it is considered "fully developed" for women and 18 for men.

Well my point is that an embarrassingly stupid change like this one comes from Japanese developers thinking Westerners have a problem with sex when really they have a problem with sexism.

Japan: "sexism? what's that?". Their culture is so different, they just don't understand. Some things that are seem as misogynistic (like women are the ones by default designated to serve coffee to their co-workers, never the other way around) is something that is not even thought about there.

 

[Pellegri Testament]

"remove it for everyone" uh, why not just give optional costumes? i would be okay with that, everyone is happy

There are people who make their hatred of a game known for just having the existence of optional costumes or artstyles. Look at any Stranger of Sword City thread after they announced the anime artstyle and that it would be optional along with the original. Even making something optional doesn't stop the backlash. It's impossible to make something where everyone is happy.

 

[dity]

I'd say their anger is kinda justified. They have to deal with changes in their game because of the extreme prudness of some people in a different country where the game is going to flop regardless of whether a character wears plain white underwear or what looks suspiciously like a diaper at the given angle.


Lol that's a good one.

I'd say their anger is at "desperately needs to go outside" levels. I mean, people sayin it's xenophobic to be critical of JRPG content but has y'all seen that bonus image?

If the dev had said nothing and released the character in the revised-undies form I bet no one would have bat an eyelid and there'd be just as much porn made.

 

[Kinyou]

Quiet absolutely deserved to be criticised, she was one of the most embarrassing video game characters of all time. Bayonetta is certainly highly sexualised but she is a strong, admirable character whereas Quiet is there purely to be lusted over. You can take issue with Bayonetta's sexualisation but I don't think you could call her a weak, misogynistic character.

I imagine that japanese devs/pubs likely don't get into the nuance of those criticisms but rather just see the amount of headlines etc. that were generated which results in stuff like the Mika buttslap being removed despite no one taking offense to that particular part.

 

[ZerOmegaG]

Any fighting technique in SO5 that contain panty shots , you like have to go out of your way to move the camera to see it ( for this character )

Some people in this topic seem to think camera control is problematic.

 

[Alucrid]

Exactly, this is not the solution. They should remove it altoget- wait...



Even if she weren't 18, in Japan 16 it is considered "fully developed" for women and 18 for men.



Japan: "sexism? what's that?". Their culture is so different, they just don't understand. Some things that are seem as misogynistic (like women are the ones by default designated to serve coffee to their co-workers, never the other way around) is something that is not even thought about there.

lol come the fuck on. they're not hermaphroditic aliens from another galaxy

 

[meltingparappa]

People who will never play this game in a country they'll never visit are dictating the terms for the actual audience of the game that doesn't even address what they would find objectionable.

What a compromise.

First R. Mika, then Xenoblade, Fire Emblem, Bravely Default, Bravely Second, Overwatch...

Thank christ I'm safe from the perils of fictional female bodies these days.

 

[elyetis]

"remove it for everyone" uh, why not just give optional costumes? i would be okay with that, everyone is happy

Optional costumes can get lost when games cross the Pacific anyway.

 

[Majukun]

She's under 18 right? So why are they even trying to sexualize her in the first place? Why are these guys so obsessed with being able to see a teen girls panties?

because it's japan,not USA

not every nation in the world has the same strict age of consent laws USA have

 

[BajiBoxer]

Japan: "sexism? what's that?". Their culture is so different, they just don't understand. Some things that are seem as misogynistic (like women are the ones by default designated to serve coffee to their co-workers, never the other way around) is something that is not even thought about there.

That's not the least bit true.

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Clearly we haven't been complaining enough about her dumb face.

 

[univbee]

Ouch at those comments, are Japanese usually so hateful with gaijins ?
Or are we talking of a small minority on forums ?

I wouldn't necessarily say "usually" but it definitely happens, especially in situations where it's not "to your face". Remember that Japan is over 99% ethnically Japanese with the remaining 1% mostly consisting of Chinese/Korean, it's pretty much inevitable that things get weird in terms of relations with non-Japanese. On the one hand they can often be impossibly friendly and as a tourist you can expect some stellar treatment, but you'll also never be "accepted" there no matter how hard you try if you full-on live in Japan instead of just visiting. Hell, even if you look Asian (or actually are, but Chinese or Korean) and become a fluent native-level Japanese speaker it's not happening, there are even very successful detective agencies in Japan who research the background of, say, that guy your daughter is marrying, because what if his great-great-great-grandfather was Korean? (and no, the fact that your daughter's fiancee only speaks Japanese and has no living relatives who have ever left Japanese soil either isn't important).

 

[dan2026]

I don't understand why they censored it in the first place.

Who exactly complained? Nobody I can find.

This is getting absurd. Why can you have fully nude sex scenes in a game like the Witcher, yet panties in this game are apparantly too far?

I feel like I am loosing my grasp of this whole thing.

 

[Ushojax]

I imagine that japanese devs/pubs likely don't get into the nuance of those criticisms but rather just see the amount of headlines etc. that were generated which results in stuff like the Mika buttslap being removed despite no one taking offense to that particular part.

Of course, the increasing number of these "censorship" incidents is inevitable when you look at how prominent the issue of sexism has become in the West and the relative apathy (or wilful ignorance) regarding the issue in Japan.

 

[GoodCoffeeJoey]

Filthy gaijin go home.

 

[BlitzBlake]

Exactly, this is not the solution. They should remove it altoget- wait...



Even if she weren't 18, in Japan 16 it is considered "fully developed" for women and 18 for men.



Japan: "sexism? what's that?". Their culture is so different, they just don't understand. Some things that are seem as misogynistic (like women are the ones by default designated to serve coffee to their co-workers, never the other way around) is something that is not even thought about there.

Japan is one of the most misogynistic, sexist developed countries in the world. If I were a woman, certainly wouldn't want to live there. Hopefully Japanese men will start caring more about woman as a actual human beings rather than seeing 16 year olds skimpy underwear.

 

[dity]

People who will never play this game in a country they'll never visit are dictating the terms for the actual audience of the game that doesn't even address what they would find objectionable.

What a compromise.

First R. Mika, then Xenoblade, Fire Emblem, Bravely Default, Bravely Second, Overwatch...

Thank christ I'm safe from the perils of fictional female bodies these days.

What? No one complained. No one would have even noticed something as minor as this. That's why this decision to announce this change is hilarious

 

[EvilKatarn]

This is getting absurd. Why can you have fully nude sex scenes in a game like the Witcher, yet panties in this game are apparantly too far?

I feel like I am loosing my grasp of this whole thing.

CD Projekt and Rockstar don't give a fuck. ESRB and PEGI don't really give a fuck either.

It just comes down to being afraid that some controversy will decrease sales.

 

[Majukun]

Of course, the increasing number of these "censorship" incidents is inevitable when you look at how prominent the issue of sexism has become in the West and the relative apathy (or wilful ignorance) regarding the issue in Japan.

for how i see it it's just fanservice
not every character is a statement,otherwise i should be offended by how the male sex is porttrayed in the twilight series,but i don't becasuse it's just fanservice for the female audience

same here really,if some japanese otaku wants some fan service in JRPG let them have it,it's not that that it's gonna change women's position in japanese society

 

[Wonko_C]

That's not the least bit true.

I saw japanese women being interviewed about this on Youtube.

 

[Mediking]

Yikes... the outrage...

 

[Mr. Pointy]

If they said nothing, no one would have noticed. If they didn't change anything, no one would have cared.

That Square Enix shot themselves in the foot meme has been posted 4 times already, but it's apt.

 

[cm osi]

What? No one complained. No one would have even noticed something as minor as this. That's why this decision to announce this change is hilarious

yes, we reached a point where devs actually alter the content before people can even complain.

 

[dan2026]

Why not give people the choice of costume (underwear)?

Let people who want sexy, have sexy. And let those who don't turn it off.

yes, we reached a point where devs actually alter the content before people can even complain.

This is the worrying thing.
The Internet whiners are proactively having an effect on games before they have even been released.

 

[mcbites]

How distressing, indeed.

 

[Dice//]

Clearly we haven't been complaining enough about her dumb face.

 

[CrispyBoar]

People who will never play this game in a country they'll never visit are dictating the terms for the actual audience of the game that doesn't even address what they would find objectionable.

What a compromise.

First R. Mika, then Xenoblade, Fire Emblem, Bravely Default, Bravely Second, Overwatch...

Thank christ I'm safe from the perils of fictional female bodies these days.

I don't understand why they censored it in the first place.

Who exactly complained? Nobody I can find.

This is getting absurd. Why can you have fully nude sex scenes in a game like the Witcher, yet panties in this game are apparantly too far?

I feel like I am loosing my grasp of this whole thing.

Yeah, I know. It's just ridiculous & so dumb.

 

[Wildarmsjecht]

Japan is one of the most misogynistic, sexist developed countries in the world. If I were a woman, certainly wouldn't want to live there. Hopefully Japanese men will start caring more about woman as a actual human beings rather than seeing 16 year olds skimpy underwear.

....

I'm not...what?

 

[Acquiescence]

If they said nothing, no one would have noticed. If they didn't change anything, no one would have cared.

That Square Enix shot themselves in the foot meme has been posted 4 times already, but it's apt.

This. A whole lot of controversy that could so easily have been avoided either way, but instead they chose the worst means of tackling the 'issue'.

 

[notaskwid]

I for one always enjoy this threads and the sweeping "japanese culture specialists" janitors that inevitably come with them

 

[injurai]

Clearly we haven't been complaining enough about her dumb face.

 

[NakedJedi]

howaito piggu go home

 

[dity]

yes, we reached a point where devs actually alter the content before people can even complain.

I guarantee you no one would have paid enough attention to make a complaint. That's not even a stand-out feature of the character.

 

[Ushojax]

for how i see it it's just fanservice
not every character is a statement,otherwise i should be offended by how the male sex is porttrayed in the twilight series,but i don't becasuse it's just fanservice for the female audience

same here really,if some japanese otaku wants some fan service in JRPG let them have it,it's not that that it's gonna change women's position in japanese society

It all plays into the perpetuation of the current situation though, doesn't it? Japan is one of the lowest ranked countries on the planet in terms of gender equality and "fanservice" like this all feeds into Japanese society's views on women.

Nintendo thought they were giving us "fanservice" with Metroid Other M but they ended up stamping on one of the most revered female characters in gaming. Maybe they should put the fanservice lower down on the list of priorities and go from there. That a developer even had to mention this change tells you the importance they have attached to it. The minor change to this character's undergarments will do absolutely nothing to dampen the inevitable criticism of the game's female characters but they don't understand that.

 

[HGH]

for how i see it it's just fanservice
not every character is a statement,otherwise i should be offended by how the male sex is porttrayed in the twilight series,but i don't becasuse it's just fanservice for the female audience

same here really,if some japanese otaku wants some fan service in JRPG let them have it,it's not that that it's gonna change women's position in japanese society

Thing is there are people that disagree with your line of thinking, especially the last part, and some of them write for outlets with hundreds of thousands of subscribers.

 

[encephalon]

for how i see it it's just fanservice
not every character is a statement,otherwise i should be offended by how the male sex is porttrayed in the twilight series,but i don't becasuse it's just fanservice for the female audience

same here really,if some japanese otaku wants some fan service in JRPG let them have it,it's not that that it's gonna change women's position in japanese society

Well that's the real question there, isn't it? Does the pervasive objectification of women in Japanese games affect how men view women in Japanese society?

 

[Bullet Bill]

Incidentally, to those reading the "Japanese reactions" as any broad representation of actual Japanese reaction, those are Hachima Kikou readers, if I'm not mistaken.

Basically, they're mostly 2chan crowd.

It's like using 4chan as a representation of western reactions.

"the Japanese" =/= a selection of the 2chan crowd that reads Hachima Kikou.

Again, it's like using 4chan to represent "the westerners."

Eh, if I'm not mistaken, Hachima Kikou (and more broadly, matome blog) readers aren't for the most part of the 2ch userbase. That's actually why they're on Hachima Kikou. They just wanna read digests of 2ch threads.

I've only been checking 2ch's geha board and there's only like one thread about Star Ocean 5: it's about preorders and it's not even that active. The posters on the SO5 thread on the console RPG board aren't too bothered by this either.

And on Futaba (2chan.net) people don't really seem to care about it either.


Now, you are absolutely right when you say Hachima Kikou readers aren't representative of the Japanese.

 

[Nokagi]

CD Projekt and Rockstar don't give a fuck. ESRB and PEGI don't really give a fuck either.

It just comes down to being afraid that some controversy will decrease sales.

Which is strange. Are there any examples of a controversy actually decreasing game sales? Not the mention this wasn't even a controversy yet and probably would not have ever been one.

 

[NoLootBoxDev]

They're not wrong.

I agree.

 

[BajiBoxer]

I saw japanese women being interviewed about this on Youtube.

lol

 

[ZerOmegaG]

If they said nothing, no one would have noticed. If they didn't change anything, no one would have cared.

That Square Enix shot themselves in the foot meme has been posted 4 times already, but it's apt.

Didn't they make this comment because someone noticed during a stream? You can't fool eagle eyed otaku.

 

[NakedJedi]

I don't understand why they censored it in the first place.

Who exactly complained? Nobody I can find.

This is getting absurd. Why can you have fully nude sex scenes in a game like the Witcher, yet panties in this game are apparantly too far?

I feel like I am loosing my grasp of this whole thing.

Some liberal or swj probably saw the screenshot and got all their swj and liberal friends to email square. Swjs are a cancer to society