Likewise with Crystal being an alternative reality to Silver.
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Pokémon Sun and Moon Starters Revealed. Releases November 18th 2016.
- Thread starter BY2K
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Likewise with Crystal being an alternative reality to Silver.
I am annoyed that cross gen evolution have been culled in favour of Mega and all because Game Freak didn't want to remove one item, which is laughable as they remove items all the time.
Mega are not new Pokémon nor do they count as new evolution, as they are simply burst mode and I am worried that with every even number gen I am not going to enjoy it as the roster will be small with the rest being filled with mega.
I am also worried that I won't be able to use some Pokémon as they won't get an evolution that they needed, for example I always wanted to use Gligar and when he got a much needed evolution Gliscor I just fell in love with him and used him on my Platinum team before moving him to Heart Gold and then finally in X.
Mega don't give me that feeling as they are burst mode and I felt really disappointed that repeat this experience with Mawile, a Pokémon that I wanted to use for so long but held off as I was waiting for her to get an evolution.
They didn't do it because of mega, they did it because Game Freak have a running time line for each generation with gen 1 and gen 3 running in parallel same with Gen 4 and gen 2.
But since X and Y is stated to take place after gen 5, which took place years after gen 4 so they couldn't make it that Gen 1, gen 3 and gen 6 all ran parallel hence why they did the alternate universe.
They also did it to explain the old Pokémon being reconned to fairy, though I made up my own story to get around that, and how Mega suddenly came to be and move them out of Kalos.
Mega are not new Pokémon nor do they count as new evolution, as they are simply burst mode and I am worried that with every even number gen I am not going to enjoy it as the roster will be small with the rest being filled with mega.
I am also worried that I won't be able to use some Pokémon as they won't get an evolution that they needed, for example I always wanted to use Gligar and when he got a much needed evolution Gliscor I just fell in love with him and used him on my Platinum team before moving him to Heart Gold and then finally in X.
Mega don't give me that feeling as they are burst mode and I felt really disappointed that repeat this experience with Mawile, a Pokémon that I wanted to use for so long but held off as I was waiting for her to get an evolution.
They didn't do it because of mega, they did it because Game Freak have a running time line for each generation with gen 1 and gen 3 running in parallel same with Gen 4 and gen 2.
But since X and Y is stated to take place after gen 5, which took place years after gen 4 so they couldn't make it that Gen 1, gen 3 and gen 6 all ran parallel hence why they did the alternate universe.
They also did it to explain the old Pokémon being reconned to fairy, though I made up my own story to get around that, and how Mega suddenly came to be and move them out of Kalos.
Already Torn
Banned
I believe it's just an alternate timeline.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
That doesn't seem to be the case. Otherwise, how do you explain the huge emphasis on Mega-Evolution lore during the time in which Zinnia mentions the multiverse? It used to be the case that the remakes were parallel to the originals, but ORAS threw that out the window.
Also, that wasn't my point. I'm just saying that they didn't need to explain changes. For instance, the whole Fairy retcons to older Pokemon is no different from introducing Steel and Dark, and retconning Magnemite line to be Steel. We didn't get a long-winded explanation about why Magnemite is Steel. The whole multiverse thing seems to make things a lot more complicated than it needs to be.
Putting aside the fact that Knock Off exists and got a massive boost recently, i'm having a hard time seeing why Game Freak couldn't give Pokémon who really need a full-on evolution from previous generations in Sun/Moon instead of what seems to be "just give them Mega evolutions", especially considering how broken some Megas are in the main campaign. I could be wrong since there's over 700 of them so I might be forgetting one but i'm having a hard time remembering any possible Pokémon with a single evolution that would become an impenetrable wall when holding Eviolite. There's no mechanical justification for them not to give, say, Dunsparce a full-on evolution.
I don't and have never bought the "it's to be consistent" jargon considering they've been adding in new evolutions to older Pokémon since Generation II, regardless of whether the methods are through new mechanics i.e. friendship or not i.e. just adding in stones or trade items that are functionally identical.
I don't and have never bought the "it's to be consistent" jargon considering they've been adding in new evolutions to older Pokémon since Generation II, regardless of whether the methods are through new mechanics i.e. friendship or not i.e. just adding in stones or trade items that are functionally identical.
Already Torn
Banned
Again, it's a consistency issue rather than a balance issue.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
Pretty explicitly mentioned in ORAS.
Unlikely.
Alternate universe is the thing that makes the most sense for something like pokemon really.
It explains the whole 2 versions per gen to begin with!
It even explains the difference in mons availability between games.
It also even explains how trading and everything related to that works which would make no sense in universe wise.
I don't think that means that the events that happened in the old games never happened before either.
That would make the timeline reasoning they gave before utterly pointless.
There's less inconsistencies with multiverse than without.
they should have handled changing type better though.
Something like the actual pokemons don't actually change types when you import or something...
then it becomes a mess to make it work but still...
It explains the whole 2 versions per gen to begin with!
It even explains the difference in mons availability between games.
It also even explains how trading and everything related to that works which would make no sense in universe wise.
I don't think that means that the events that happened in the old games never happened before either.
That would make the timeline reasoning they gave before utterly pointless.
There's less inconsistencies with multiverse than without.
they should have handled changing type better though.
Something like the actual pokemons don't actually change types when you import or something...
then it becomes a mess to make it work but still...
Neoleo2143
Member
I've never really cared for the continuity for the Pokemon games, it's not like Adventures where the continuity actually does matter.
So I'm totally cool with a multiverse for the games where things go differently.
That being said, I still want some effort put into the storytelling like BW and give some time for character focus. You got islands to work with GF, use them to tell stories.
So I'm totally cool with a multiverse for the games where things go differently.
That being said, I still want some effort put into the storytelling like BW and give some time for character focus. You got islands to work with GF, use them to tell stories.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I'm not sure about it being something that makes the most sense. It just comes off as a move that tries to explain so much about something that at the end of the day, is ultimately irrelevant. I mean, do we really need an in-game reason why we have two different versions? They're all the same game and journey just with different content. The same can be said of things like trading, etc. It just becomes a huge mess if you start thinking of reasons for everything to exist.
Lil'DigiOp
Member
Y'all pissin me off with this Pokemon universe bull.
smh lol
smh lol
Didn't play it. Never owned a GBA and had no interest in ORAS. Gotta read up on my Pokémon lore I guess.
That's the thing though, now we have in universe explanation to something that made no sense before WITHOUT breaking what worked before.
White2 is still the direct sequel of White with the event of White already having happened.
You can absolutely ignore it (well not in the delta episode I guess) if you so want it.
You can ignore the Zelda timeline if you want, it's still there.
Idk if the alternate universes really tie into multiple versions like that, it was pretty explicitly stating that earlier gens happened in an alternate universe without mega stones and stuff lol
I really don't know. I might change my mind on this if they keep bring it up in future games, although I do hope they don't, but as it stands I'm just going to consider the Delta Episode stuff a neat reference to the original Hoenn games, it really didn't feel like much more to me.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
Either Maxie or Archie mention that it could have been them that went rouge in another universe during ORAS, don't they?
It also works.
Granted a bit differently.
If I understand it correctly,
there's as many universe as there is copies of the games.
All the games are in their own pocket universe BUT :
- Events that happened in Red/Blue/Yellow happened in copies of Gold/Silver/Crystal
and so on to have a continuity in the games.
You just NEVER played the events per se but alternate version of the events.
Now XY/ORAS is different in that the events of the old games no longer happened.
That split between gen VI and the rest however I can understand not sitting well with everyone though.
They really didn't need to do that for the Megas, I mean it was discovered in XY they could have left it at that.
After all what's to say that Mega didn't exist before because simply the conditions weren't met before.
It seems unnecessary to split the games like that.
No, that's already been established as Pikachu hitting the gym after being followed for so long by Team Rocket
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I'm not sure you can compare a sequel of a main series game to an explanation of the whole multiverse theory. White2 was meant to be a continuation to White's story, even with its new PCs and changes to Unova and its people. Whereas with the multiverse theory, you start splitting all of the Pokemon games into two groups, the group where MEvo is central to its lore, and the group where MEvo never existed. From there it starts to become a nightmare to explain differences: Are old remakes still parallel to their original games (just like the original timeline before Gen VI), or are they part of a new and self-contained universe? Is every game its own self-contained universe? Why the retcon so many new species of Pokemon each gen? Where does it start and end? Just by introducing this, you start to call so many of the inconsistencies and issues into question when no one really cared before.
The Zelda timeline has its own issues too, and has a lot in common with Pokemon. They're both trying to push a system that tries to explain every game that at the core is a self-contained story, into one continuity (especially when it was never planned aside from RBY matching up with GSC). In doing so, it ends up being a very lacklustre and inconsistent way of doing so.
ColtraineGF
Member
It's not like an established proven lore thing, it's a theory based off a quote from a certain character in the post game episode.
The quote itself can be read as a callback to the original games, and why the remake is different.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I dunno about Gen VI starter complaints. For some odd reason people have this allergy to bipedal-ness even though they're monsters.
It was done in a tongue-in-cheek, not-really-canon sort of way though.
Fuck Zinnia and fuck Episode Delta. Easily why I consider ORAS worst of the worst.
It was done in a tongue-in-cheek, not-really-canon sort of way though.
Fuck Zinnia and fuck Episode Delta. Easily why I consider ORAS worst of the worst.
It's pretty much the same thing, the games are all their own self contained universe that you can only move pokemons between them.
You won't see me arguing that the split GenV/GenVI is something great, interesting, needed or whatever though.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
Ah now I understand. I guess the concept outlined in Delta Episode is just something I can't stand behind.
There's nothing wrong with bipedal Pokemon but after 5 generations of bipedal fire starters in a row it just gets tiring. Braixen and Delphox are pretty awful even if you don't take that into account though.
I just want a fully evolved quadrupedal fire starter for once. I also thought having them all turn out bipedal in gen 6 was a bit much, I sort of felt that way in gen 3 too, I think Swampert looks much better on all fours. I've got nothing against bipedal pokemon though.
Plus we've never had the opposite happen. Where's my starter trio where they all turn out quadrupedal in their final form? No way that should happen with Rowlet though, yikes.
I'll never get the hate for Delphox, one of the best mon I've seen!
Fennekin line is majestic and the best thing to come in a long time.
There I said it!
I still hate that I started with Chespin to be rewarded with that horrible final evo just because Charmander wasn't going to be denied (come on 3 Fire starters for X is a bit much even for me).
I still like my Chestnaught because I managed to make something out of him but design isn't helping.
And on top of that it's not Fire/Fighter too!
I mean the Megas was something they clearly said they didn't know existed before so it's not a good reason and Fairy is like Steel, it's just there.
Fennekin line is majestic and the best thing to come in a long time.
There I said it!
I still hate that I started with Chespin to be rewarded with that horrible final evo just because Charmander wasn't going to be denied (come on 3 Fire starters for X is a bit much even for me).
I still like my Chestnaught because I managed to make something out of him but design isn't helping.
And on top of that it's not Fire/Fighter too!
I don't get why they even needed to explain that the games didn't happen.
I mean the Megas was something they clearly said they didn't know existed before so it's not a good reason and Fairy is like Steel, it's just there.
Gaiaknight
Member
Since im always the grass starter guy i hope the final evolutoin isnt another chesnaught situation though if it leads us to another one of these videos i wont complain as it was funny.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQp4xPmwqPg
though i did end up liking chesnaughts move set as drain punch on him is fun lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQp4xPmwqPg
though i did end up liking chesnaughts move set as drain punch on him is fun lol
But that's bullshit. Lickitung evolves into Lickilicky by leveling up with the move Rollout, and it could learn Rollout in Gen 2 via TM. Piloswine evolves into Mamoswine by leveling up with Ancient Power, and it could be bred with Ancient Power in Gen 3. Clearly those Pokemon could meet the conditions in those games without evolving.
Stop pretending this shit is consistent.
Actually there's some Bs about Mt.coronent causing those evos. Which is why they never happen past 4th gen.
We live in a sad world when this is a controversial opinion. Delphox is top tier and is sad people really seem to hate humanoid Pokemon for some reason. I think Delphox rubs people the wrong way because they saw Fennekin and they didn't think GF was going to turn a fox bipedal. I'm glad we got the foxy witch.
Braixen is the best Kalos starter too.
Already Torn
Banned
Thank you!
This makes even less sense. What changed with Mt Coronet after the events of Gen 2 to cause that? Why did Mt Coronet affect far away Unova?
You're all really reaching for this shit.
Neoleo2143
Member
Actually, I'm pretty sure the location based Evolutions have been kept pretty consistent with a magnetic field theme. Magnetzone always evolves in a sensibly magnetized (Or electrified) location.
I already accepted the fact that some things are going to be inconsistent, it's a long running videogame franchise that introduces new mechanics and explaining the absence of said mechanics in previous games is simply going to be a part of suspension of disbelief.
The starters have grown on me, I'm team Popplio now.
Sorry Firecat, if your name in French wasn't utter shite AND I didn't have friend already picking that one up I would have chosen you :/
I feel like there's a lot to be said about always getting the same thing.
I can totally understand not liking the whole Fire/Fighting combo for starters.
I'm not a big fan of Fennekin's middle evo(because most starter middle evos are the shit you have to trudge through to get the good stuffs like for Charmander) but the 1rst and last are really great.
fire pokemons are not the most common to begin with and I don't think I've seen many psy/fire combo either
That alone makes it interesting to play.
the design is fantastic, it's not overdesigned (and with the Megas you know they had the skills to do that) and it really feels like something distinctly pokemon that mesh well with the old ones too.
Sorry Firecat, if your name in French wasn't utter shite AND I didn't have friend already picking that one up I would have chosen you :/
I feel like there's a lot to be said about always getting the same thing.
I can totally understand not liking the whole Fire/Fighting combo for starters.
I'm not a big fan of Fennekin's middle evo(because most starter middle evos are the shit you have to trudge through to get the good stuffs like for Charmander) but the 1rst and last are really great.
fire pokemons are not the most common to begin with and I don't think I've seen many psy/fire combo either
That alone makes it interesting to play.
the design is fantastic, it's not overdesigned (and with the Megas you know they had the skills to do that) and it really feels like something distinctly pokemon that mesh well with the old ones too.
I'm pretty sure that's what it was too.
Doesn't explain why Piloswine suddenly turns into a mammoth when it levels up with Ancient Power.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I thought so too.
Thank you.
The Mt. Coronet thing was never a consistent element. Otherwise, Magnezone and Probopass should never evolve outside of Gen IV. People are seriously reaching for consistency where there is none.
I can't see it happening. The 3DS install base is too small.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
but that's just fire starters being bipedal - besides most of the time they are supported by their concept
and only Delphox feels awful - Braixen is fine, unless the concept of "cute witch" is bad when it's as old as time itself
I just want a fully evolved quadrupedal fire starter for once. I also thought having them all turn out bipedal in gen 6 was a bit much, I sort of felt that way in gen 3 too, I think Swampert looks much better on all fours. I've got nothing against bipedal pokemon though.
Plus we've never had the opposite happen. Where's my starter trio where they all turn out quadrupedal in their final form? No way that should happen with Rowlet though, yikes.
Samurott?
Also it fits with the Gen VI guys because RPG concepts.
It was meant to be tongue in cheek but fans took it as some sort of canon shit
NipplesAndToes23
Member
First time that they've skipped a third game for the same gen. Guess they thought it wasn't worth the time and money anymore.
Samurott?
Also it fits with the Gen VI guys because RPG concepts.
Uh, I think you misread something there. Samurott isn't a fire type is it?
The Gen VI thing does sort of fit with the RPG concept yeah, I won't deny that.
I'm not finished with OR so I'll see what you mean by that.
considering VG fanbases I wouldn't be surprised that it's just fans taking it too far
RBY = RSE -> GSC = DPPt -> B&W -> B2&W2 = X&Y
Archived by Bulbapedia of Toshinobu Matsumiya's tweet from 2014 about the official timeline http://archive.is/D9iPz
But hey, there could be retcons now with the remakes.
EDIT: Although, HG&SS had an event with Cynthia so that lines up.
Archived by Bulbapedia of Toshinobu Matsumiya's tweet from 2014 about the official timeline http://archive.is/D9iPz
But hey, there could be retcons now with the remakes.
EDIT: Although, HG&SS had an event with Cynthia so that lines up.