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[Melchiah]

Xbox ons games on Windows 10 will hugely increase their userbase. Think it would
Help developers also when they have to only make ons build for PC and xbox.

On W10, possibly, but the same benefits don't seem likely on the XBO side.

I don't quite follow what you mean with developers having only to make one build. I'd think the same code wouldn't work that well on both, considering the architectural differences.

 

[thuway]

I don't have all the answers. There are many xbox people that are currently with PS4 that may have read about Scorpio and thought, right fuck Neo, I'll go back to Xbox. I read a few on Gaf last night. But there's going to be a metric ton that stay where they are now. That's what happens when you shit the bed with a reveal like Xbone.

With iterative consoles- you are garunteed more powerful hardware and future compatibility. It's only a matter of time before the next machine hits with the level of performance you so desire. The biggest differentiating point now will be the the exclusives, and where your friends are playing - both of which play into Sony's hand.

The best answer to Neo will be competitive pricing in a way that makes it look like a poor value for money. Power will be important, but making Neo appear as an expensive glorified "premium" device that doesn't offer performance per dollar is the narrative they should be weaving.


But I'll freely admit: even with all of that said above- the Playstation ecosystem, exclusives, and the sheer amount of users in the Playstation family are something Microsoft will hit a stone wall against.

 

[Jack The Nipper]

The issue is even at 6tf games are still going to be in a rough ball park of looking the same, even as Xbox one.

The gap in different between what you see on ps4 and one is easier to tell on bigger tvs or if they are next to each other.

It's much.easier to tell from 1080 and 720.

Mgs was one stark difference but other games at the same resolution have been hard to tell apart.

But I would go with the best version either way.

I do feel doom has one of the bigger edges on pc I have seen imo

 

[J 0 E]

The question is: If Xbox Scorpio is more powerful than PS4 Neo will the 3rd party developers take advantage of it and make superior games? knowing how PS4 is outselling it overall 2:1


games on PS4 Neo / XBO Scorpio will have better parity than the current state and that's all IMO.

 

[MilkyJoe]

The question is: If Xbox Scorpio is more powerful than PS4 Neo will the 3rd party developers take advantage of it and make superior games? knowing how PS4 is outselling it overall 2:1


games on PS4 Neo / XBO Scorpio will have better parity than the current state and that's all IMO.

I think with current expectations 4.25 vs 6 tflops is going to make precious little difference in the 3rd party sector, maybe a bit more AA...

 

[SwolBro]

I think with current expectations 4.25 vs 6 tflops is going to make precious little difference in the 3rd party sector, maybe a bit more AA...

isn't that a wider gap than what the two consoles are at now? and we see how people get utterly crazy over the difference.

 

[suddenlyissoon]

I think with current expectations 4.25 vs 6 tflops is going to make precious little difference in the 3rd party sector, maybe a bit more AA...

It has got to mean more than that. It's more than double the tflops difference of the ps4 has over the Xbox one now and look at differences in some third party games in resolution and effects.

 

[MilkyJoe]

I think with current expectations 4.25 vs 6 tflops is going to make precious little difference in the 3rd party sector, maybe a bit more AA...

isn't that a wider gap than what the two consoles are at now? and we see how people get utterly crazy over the difference.

It has got to mean more than that. It's more than double the tflops difference of the ps4 has over the Xbox one now and look at differences in some third party games in resolution and effects.

See above

 

[gofreak]

The issue is even at 6tf games are still going to be in a rough ball park of looking the same, even as Xbox one.

The gap in different between what you see on ps4 and one is easier to tell on bigger tvs or if they are next to each other.

It's much.easier to tell from 1080 and 720.

Mgs was one stark difference but other games at the same resolution have been hard to tell apart.

But I would go with the best version either way.

I do feel doom has one of the bigger edges on pc I have seen imo

It's a shame there isn't some more moderate TV standard resolution in between 1080p and 4K where these new machines could stretch their legs a bit. I know there's 1440p on a lot of desktop monitors, and I guess many games could use that res on the new machines and downsample to 1080p on 1080p TVs.

But otherwise it'll probably be about differentiation at 1080p, on a framerate level or bells and whistles level. Which is good, but the next big resolution jump is probably not quite within reach of these systems, at least not without compromises.

 

[pixelbox]

I can't help be feel this model is bad of game development. How are games to advance technologically if it's held down with weak hardware?

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

 

[Maximilian E.]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

Obviously Sony has not locked this. I mean, going from PS1 and then PS2 to fall with PS3.. these stuff happen.

 

[martino]

The question is: If Xbox Scorpio is more powerful than PS4 Neo will the 3rd party developers take advantage of it and make superior games? knowing how PS4 is outselling it overall 2:1


games on PS4 Neo / XBO Scorpio will have better parity than the current state and that's all IMO.

it would probably translate in more stable framerate and/or better IQ at worst.(like now in favor of ps4)

 

[gofreak]

I can't help be feel this model is bad of game development. How are games to advance technologically if it's held down with weak hardware?

I imagine eventually the least recent hardware will get deprecated, and the baseline will bump up to the next least recent iteration.

When this happens will probably depend a lot on developer feedback about the scalability of their designs/tech etc.

So in terms of supported boxes within the 'XB1' software platform:

XB1 -> XB1-2 -> XB1-3

might become

XB1-2 -> XB1-3 -> XB1-4

upon the release of the XB1-4

Big question is whether they'll be upfront from the beginning of this new model about this rolling window of supported boxes, or if they'll wait until the first deprecation.

The other option is to reset the software platform entirely at a certain point. For example, in the above illustration, the XB1-4 would actually be a XB2, and would represent the new baseline. But with that kind of hard reset, you could potentially piss off your XB1-3 buyers, at least, if not also XB1-2 owners.

 

[EGM1966]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

To be fair - fanboy bias aside - it's a fair assumption.

Of the last 4 generations (including this as in flight) Sony has convincingly led/won 3 out of 4. MS has been trounced once, came in solid second place/tie once and miserably misread the market once. Sony has misread market once and still essentially landed in solid second place/tie.

Objectively in terms of market performance you would expect Sony to probably lead and you would expect MS to probably not given their observable, empirical performance in videogame market.

 

[Jumeira]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

Agree with this. The market is up for anyone with the right product, brand loyalty isn't as important as price and value.

 

[dragonelite]

On W10, possibly, but the same benefits don't seem likely on the XBO side.

I don't quite follow what you mean with developers having only to make one build. I'd think the same code wouldn't work that well on both, considering the architectural differences.

Assuming scorpio has a more generic architecture like PC and ps4. Maybe the Xbox one needs some gpu memory management or Microsoft can develop some tools to help devs.

I can't help be feel this model is bad of game development. How are games to advance technologically if it's held down with weak hardware?

Drop resolution or framerate i guess, use different levels of quality like with PC gaming.

 

[mrklaw]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

Of course. But Sony has a big lead now, and if both of them move away from 'Big Bang' generational resets to a more iterative approach, that favours the incumbent. So what if Xbox has a more powerful box coming in a year - PlayStation will have a more more powerful box a little while after that. People aren't waiting 6-7 years for a new machine so any leapfrogging is only temporary.

It is a good time architecturally to move to this approach,mouth is is bad timing for MS to come from behind because I don't think there are any quick wins anymore. You'd have to eat away slowly at the competition which could mean bleeding a ton of money

 

[gofreak]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

I think many are assuming the backward and forward compatibility of this new setup might imply that it's less likely for someone to hop between ecosystems once they're in one, in the same way that they might have in the past between hard generational resets. I think there's some truth to the idea that this should make ecosystems stickier for longer, but I think a lot of the discussion has included the qualifier about the platform holder of a given ecosystem 'not screwing up'. Of course if a platform holder stopped serving their users well, stopped providing good upgrade paths, or did something else totally dumb or anti-consumer, there's larger scope for platform hopping.

But we are potentially entering a new model of, effectively, non-expiring software generations.That could make a given ecosystem a lot more sticky than in the past.

 

[Backfoggen]

I can't help be feel this model is bad of game development. How are games to advance technologically if it's held down with weak hardware?

As far as I've seen there are no rumors about the MS not allowing exclusive games for Scorpio. It may be marketed as a completely new console as opposed to an upgraded one.

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

It's fandom. Some people heavily invested in one console will always want to reinforce their decisions. See that 2012 thread where everyone was saying Sony is going to completely fail with their next console while Nintendo and Ms will win. The complete opposite was the case.
People saying Sony will win no matter the product MS puts out are doing the same thing again.
Companies react to products and trends, things are bound to change always. Maybe NX will be another huge success for Nintendo. You can only speculate.

 

[martino]

Agree with this. The market is up for anyone with the right product, brand loyalty isn't as important as price and value.

This.
And forward compability on closed ecosystem won't lock gamers who played games once/twice without collecting/ keeping them
I have a feeling this is not a small part of the overall audience.

 

[jeff_rigby]

Way more detail in the Polygon article. Floodgates have opened I guess.

microsoft should have bought oculus

To recap:

1) The PS4 and XB1 launch Consoles are UHD Capable (Fact -confirmed-) Will be updated October 2016 (Strong Speculation, Mentioned is a Update Jan 2016 which did not happen)
2) BDXL drives from 2010 BD-R specs can read UHD Disks (not play) as can BD-ROM drives after a firmware update. The BD+ and AACS 2.0 routines have to run in a TEE that has a trusted boot. The difference between Mount Fuji book 8 & 9 give the changes to the drive firmware to support UHD Blu-ray. (Fact) (everything has to be in place to play UHD blu-ray movies).
3) UHD Media is served as HTML5 and a 4K TV screen is a webpage. Coming with UHD is a new browser and new DRM hardware. HEVC profile 10 multi-view plus depthmap (or subset) will be used for all streaming media in the future on UHD Capable platforms. (Fact)
4) HDCP 2.2 takes place in the media TEE which also supports Miracast, DTCP-IP (Playready, WMDRM and ND), HDMI 2 over LAN and Vidipath (Fact)
5) Microsoft and Sony have always planned to support 14 nm FinFET with Polaris and Vega in 2017 and plan to support the next console in 2019 be it an iteration or next generation. (Fact in letters to the EU power board and some speculation) Given a Livingroom TDP; Polaris for PS4 using GDDR5 will be 4 TF and Vega using HBM 2 for XB1 will be 6 TF. (Fact) XB1 has to use HBM 2 while the PS4 can use GDDR5 because they moved the ARM IP out of the APU.

PS4 Neo will be released before the XB1 Scorpio by about 6 months to a year. (Speculation but based on the PS4 ability to use GDDR5 and thus Polaris which AMD is releasing first). PS4 NEO will be cheaper to manufacture than XB1 Scorpio. (Strong speculation). There may be two XB1 versions but the PS4 will probably only have one going forward (Speculation based on price to manufacture). This is contrary logic if based on hardware design. Since the PS4 Southbridge contains all Media/ARM IP, it can be updated without needing to update the APU for any new features coming with UHD Media while the XB1 has all ARM IP in the APU and needs a complete new chip to update UHD media features.

6) Sony and Microsoft plan to support next generation TV and Vidipath. (Fact)
7) They plan to have DVRs for Antenna TV. Microsoft has already announced this and support for 1080P which is available from the EU as DVB T2 using Mpeg 4 and in the US only with ATSC 3 (Fact for Microsoft, speculation for Sony)
8) They plan to support UHD Blu-ray with digital bridge as a Vidipath server using Playready ND (Fact in Sony and Panasonic PDFs but speculation for the consoles)
9) Sony has a UHD Blu-ray Licence for a Embedded or Game Console Player (fact)
10) Sony has a UHD blu-ray Licence for a PC Player Application (Fact)
11) Sony wanted the UHD Blu-ray Digital bridge as a mandate . ANY UHD blu-ray player with digital bridge can support being a Media HUB (Transcode from 1080P to or from 4K) (Fact)
12) DVB T2 with HEVC starts in 2017 (Germany), in Korea 2017 as ATSC 3 and the FCC (US) has been petitioned to allow voluntary ATSC 3 implementation in 2017. (Fact)
13) 2017 was the date set for Cable TV to start to move to All IPTV and DOCSIS 3.1 (Fact)
14) ATSC 3 has features that could support a massive cable cutting movement to Antenna TV. It's envisioned that ATSC 3.0 will be the primary supplier of free content supplemented by the Internet (Cable TV cable modem supplying all IPTV media). (Fact) Playstation Vue and other streaming services will be the supplemental
15) LG already has a ATSC 1 & 3 Antenna TV Tuner/Vidipath server with more to come in 2017. (Fact)
16) Any UHD capable Dongle, STB, Game console or TV that supports HTML5 with W3C extensions and HEVC can be a next generation TV and Vidipath player if they have Playready DRM (fact)
17) Microsoft is rumored to announce Xbox dongles, Xbox STBs and a Xbox Slim this year and Scorpio late 2017. This is a complete spread of STBs to be supported by the XB1 as a Media and Game Hub. Always planned and now near enough to HEVC broadband and Antenna TV support for an announcement. This plus NEO is I think why Sony believes they will sell 20 million PS4 consoles from Christmas season 2016 to March 2017. UHD blu-ray with digital bridge and Vidipath along with it being a media hub and DVR for other platforms and a Next generation TV platform.

Best guess XB1 Slim will sell for $299 and PS4 (NEO) will sell for $399 as the only PS4 going forward. Scorpio in 2017 will probably be $499 with XB1 slim still selling for $299.

Every UHD TV to this point and the near future will also need a Vidipath Tuner (Fact).

18) Every Vidipath platform will have Playready DRM (Fact) Sony PS4 has Playready porting kit 3 and WMDRM (Fact in PS4 notice, there is no requirement for the notice, they are sneaking in an announcement for Vidipath support.)
19) VR uses a subset of the UHD software stack and hardware in the UHD blu-ray with digital bridge platforms. The same hardware that does the transcoding from 1080P to/from 4K can distort the output for VR goggles.

All the above are proven or speculated in my posts and threads with Cites supporting speculation.

 

[TBiddy]

It's fandom. Some people heavily invested in one console will always want to reinforce their decisions. See that 2012 thread where everyone was saying Sony is going to completely fail with their next console while Nintendo and Ms will win. The complete opposite was the case.
People saying Sony will win no matter the product MS puts out are doing the same thing again.
Companies react to products and trends, things are bound to change always. Maybe NX will be another huge success for Nintendo. You can only speculate.

I agree. Microsoft "only" needs to put a fantastic product to win people back. Of course there will always be die-hards that stay on either side of the fence, no matter how green the grass gets on the other side, but the average consumer will jump to the competition if the offers are good enough.

It wouldn't be the first time in history that people have abandoned an ecosystem in order to move to a new one.

 

[Waldini]

I agree. Microsoft "only" needs to put a fantastic product to win people back. Of course there will always be die-hards that stay on either side of the fence, no matter how green the grass gets on the other side, but the average consumer will jump to the competition if the offers are good enough.

It wouldn't be the first time in history that people have abandoned an ecosystem in order to move to a new one.

Microsoft "lost" because of the way the XBOX One was promoted. It was supposed to be a media-device. That, and the always-on, Kinect required nonsense made sure alot of people jumped to the PS4.

Can't blame 'em. Although I'm pretty sure that some PS4 owners would jump back (or make the switch) to Microsoft once that uber-console is released.

 

[bidguy]

The question is: If Xbox Scorpio is more powerful than PS4 Neo will the 3rd party developers take advantage of it and make superior games? knowing how PS4 is outselling it overall 2:1


games on PS4 Neo / XBO Scorpio will have better parity than the current state and that's all IMO.

its like i time traveled to 2013

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

Microsoft "lost" because of the way the XBOX One was promoted. It was supposed to be a media-device. That, and the always-on, Kinect required nonsense made sure alot of people jumped to the PS4.

Can't blame 'em. Although I'm pretty sure that some PS4 owners would jump back (or make the switch) to Microsoft once that uber-console is released.

Yeah i waited until they dropped the Price and Kinect and jumped back to Xbox (i still own a PS4, but Xbox just feels like Home for me). Now i will gladly upgrade to get a more powerful xbox again.

 

[Waldini]

Yeah i waited until they dropped the Price and Kinect and jumped back to Xbox (i still own a PS4, but Xbox just feels like Home for me). Now i will gladly upgrade to get a more powerful xbox again.

I owned a Playstation 1, 2 and 3 ... Couldn't get used to the DualShock controller. Feels weird and makes my fingers hurt after a while. XBOX controller feels alot better.

 

[EASTC0AST_GH05T]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

Are we talking US market or globally?

 

[Footos22]

The question is: If Xbox Scorpio is more powerful than PS4 Neo will the 3rd party developers take advantage of it and make superior games? knowing how PS4 is outselling it overall 2:1


games on PS4 Neo / XBO Scorpio will have better parity than the current state and that's all IMO.

Prob not. These games have to run on current consoles.

It may be more powerful. But games are just gonna hit a plateau in how good looking they can get. Its cross gen shot all over again but gen long.

 

[JumPeRJumPzZ]

I owned a Playstation 1, 2 and 3 ... Couldn't get used to the DualShock controller. Feels weird and makes my fingers hurt after a while. XBOX controller feels alot better.

After playing for months with the Elite Controller, the PS4 Controller just feels awful to me.

I would hope that Sony finally would do some kind of new controller that is more in line with the Xbox Controller.

 

[Beefy]

Are we talking US market or globally?

I think some people seem to forget what the market is like outside the US and UK. MS will need to do far more then just have more power to compete with Sony globally.

 

[get2sammyb]

Why is there always this notion that Sony now have the market on lock down for the rest of eternity?

MS screwed up badly with the XB1 and damaged the brand for sure, but to suggest that it's impossible for them to regain marketshare is laughable.

There's like a gazillion ideas and strategies yet to be used in the core gaming market, fueled by an ever changing landscape of technology and infrastructure. No company owns the future.

This works both ways I think. There are also a handful of people in this thread who've fallen straight back into 2013 fantasy land, where Microsoft uses its gigantic warchest to create a super system which it sells at a significant loss and secures several big brand third-party exclusives for.

The reality is, with the products unannounced, any speculation is likely to be poor speculation, because we just don't know what's going to happen in over a year's time.

 

[pixelbox]

I imagine eventually the least recent hardware will get deprecated, and the baseline will bump up to the next least recent iteration.

When this happens will probably depend a lot on developer feedback about the scalability of their designs/tech etc.

So in terms of supported boxes within the 'XB1' software platform:

XB1 -> XB1-2 -> XB1-3

might become

XB1-2 -> XB1-3 -> XB1-4

upon the release of the XB1-4

Big question is whether they'll be upfront from the beginning of this new model about this rolling window of supported boxes, or if they'll wait until the first deprecation.

The other option is to reset the software platform entirely at a certain point. For example, in the above illustration, the XB1-4 would actually be a XB2, and would represent the new baseline. But with that kind of hard reset, you could potentially piss off your XB1-3 buyers, at least, if not also XB1-2 owners.

Assuming scorpio has a more generic architecture like PC and ps4. Maybe the Xbox one needs some gpu memory management or Microsoft can develop some tools to help devs.



Drop resolution or framerate i guess, use different levels of quality like with PC gaming.

As far as I've seen there are no rumors about the MS not allowing exclusive games for Scorpio. It may be marketed as a completely new console as opposed to an upgraded one.

It's fandom. Some people heavily invested in one console will always want to reinforce their decisions. See that 2012 thread where everyone was saying Sony is going to completely fail with their next console while Nintendo and Ms will win. The complete opposite was the case.
People saying Sony will win no matter the product MS puts out are doing the same thing again.
Companies react to products and trends, things are bound to change always. Maybe NX will be another huge success for Nintendo. You can only speculate.

Thanks for answering. Let me propose this: let's say ray tracing is the next movement in technology. With this setup we'll receive very small increments of advancements. Higher resolutions and framerate do not make a better game. Could you imagine if this model was implemented in ps1 day? 1080p ps1 games...That's what bothers me about this. Find a solution and I'll be ok with this.

 

[anothertech]

I still see this as a PS3/360 scenario, more than anything else. Where Neo is the 360 and Scorpio is the PS3. History repeats itself.

All I can say though is MS better be sure to hit or surpass that 6tf target if they want to have any chance at winning market share again. And Sony better have Somthing else up its sleeve if it doesn't want to lose that market share.

Exciting times lol

 

[darkinstinct]

isn't that a wider gap than what the two consoles are at now? and we see how people get utterly crazy over the difference.

Gap now is .6 Teraflops. 1.8 would be a huge difference, of course devs would use the extra power, just like they do now. It's not about who sells most, otherwise last gen would've been Wii level graphics.

 

[Leyasu]

If the xbone had been equal in power to the ps4, and every bad decision not taken, does everyone think that this gen would have played out in exactly the same??

Im not saying that microsoft could have dethroned sony, but I think that they could have gone toe to toe so to speak.

A 100 more expensive, weaker console coupled with all the shit was suicide... And the results speak for themselves. But a new console that rights all the wrongs will definitely give them a fighting chance .

 

[Beefy]

If the xbone had been equal in power to the ps4, and every bad decision not taken, does everyone think that this gen would have played out in exactly the same??

Im not saying that microsoft could have dethroned sony, but I think that they could have gone toe to toe so to speak.

A 100 more expensive, weaker console coupled with all the shit was suicide... And the results speak for themselves. But a new console that rights all the wrongs will definitely give them a fighting chance .

It would have been close just because of the size of the US. Xbox would probably be leading sells in UK as well. Sony leading everywhere else. It would probably be the same as PS3/360.

 

[EventHorizon]

I agree. Microsoft "only" needs to put a fantastic product to win people back. Of course there will always be die-hards that stay on either side of the fence, no matter how green the grass gets on the other side, but the average consumer will jump to the competition if the offers are good enough.

It wouldn't be the first time in history that people have abandoned an ecosystem in order to move to a new one.

The problem for Microsoft is that Sony is moving first. Enthusiast early adopters are...well enthusiast early adopters. The people most likely to first buy the new half gen consoles are also the ones least likely to wait around for up to a year in order to make that purchase.

I also think the release of the PSVR will make the Playstation brand more sticky. I am a PS4 owner who was thinking that my best move would be to get the XB1.5 instead of the Neo, but the timetable of releases makes that unlikely as each step locks me more into the Playstation side. First, PSVR is releasing this fall. That brings a whole new type of gaming along with a host of console exclusive content for the Playstation. At that point my best bang for the buck would be to buy the PSVR. The amount of exclusive new content alone makes this the no brainer choice.

Now at this point my most logical upgrade path is to get the Neo. It will be out sooner so it has an opportunity advantage since I simply wont be able to get a Scorpion until later. In addition, buying the Scorpion does not allow me to use its extra power where I'd need and see it most, VR. I only have a 1080p TV so I wouldn't need need the extra horsepower over the Neo to crank out a higher resolution for my traditional games. The Scorpio and Neo graphics should be near identical at that resolution. Remember that most developers will still be targeting the much more numerous PS4 and XB1, and not pushing the graphics on these new consoles.

Finally, getting a Neo gives me an option I wouldn't have if I bought the Scorpion. I could sell my PS4 and use the money towards buying the Neo with the knowledge that I'd still be able to play all my PlayStation games on the Neo. This is a big difference with this half gen bump over a traditional full generation. The previous gen console will still be in high demand and full backward compatibility at launch makes it redundant.

 

[Snake29]

OK - but this thread is about MS next gen machine. What does that have to do with PS4 vs. XBO?

Polygon: Xbox Scorpio will be a ~6 TFLOP system (v PS4K's 4.14), unveil soon, Fall 17

 

[Darkstorne]

I agree. Microsoft "only" needs to put a fantastic product to win people back. Of course there will always be die-hards that stay on either side of the fence, no matter how green the grass gets on the other side, but the average consumer will jump to the competition if the offers are good enough.

It wouldn't be the first time in history that people have abandoned an ecosystem in order to move to a new one.

It's definitely a different scenario though. They'd be asking people to switch console mid generation. I have no doubt that happens sometimes, presumably during slim redesigns, but not to the extent that one console clearly in the lead suddenly gets overtaken by a competitor. That kind of sudden market share swap only happens at the start of a new generation.

I guess it will depend on how this is presented? Maybe if Microsoft can get people to believe this is a new generation, it could happen. But that would mean exclusive games on Scorpio that can't run on the Xbox One and PS4, and that means risking sinking millions into the development of graphically mind blowing games for a console that might not sell more than 10 million, with most gamers thinking "I'll just stick with my current console that still plays 99% of games the Neo and Scorpio can play."

 

[Markoman]

It would have been close just because of the size of the US. Xbox would probably be leading sells in UK as well. Sony leading everywhere else. It would probably be the same as PS3/360.

Absolutely, it would've been a continuation of Xbox360/PS3 with a trend towards PS4'S pole-position. Keep in mind that PS3 won a lot of ground back and finally overtook 360.

 

[timlot]

I see folks are working overtime...

17 Days till E3.

 

[anothertech]

Your wants are not the only wants someone may have, and not every product has to be targeted directly to you. It's okay to not want and not buy some piece of video game hardware if you don't find it appealing.

I guess my point here is not so much they have to cater to me, per say, but that playing all these games on my PC means I no longer need to buy their hardware, ever again, I don't have to pay for xblive ever again, and all the third party games will be played on a system that has nothing to do with Xbox.

I know the hardware profits are usually minimal, but when we're taklking user base in the millions each Gen, that adds up. The hardware and xbl sub seems to be where they make their money with Xbox, along with the software. Removing that from the equation seems like a good way to remove the whole ecosystem from many gamers homes. I don't see how this is a positive.

If they start charging xbl fees to PC gamers to play their games online, we will have a hearty chuckle and leave all those games behind, and find the nearest competitor to sink our time and money into.

Honestly, where is the positive in this? It seems more like something a failing company would do as a last ditch effort to stay relevant. And Xbox/MS are not in that kind of situation.

At this point, if Scorpio and all following iterations of Xbox have no exclusive content, and all their software will play better on my PC hardware, I find no reason to be a part of the Xbox ecosystem at all. It would be very easy to leave all that behind. And I can't possibly be the only one that will feel this way.

How is this a good thing?

 

[mitchman]

I keep thinking this might be a planted rumor by Microsoft to take some of the limelight from the PS4k announcement coming and the rumors so far. They make sure it says "target 6 TF" which means they can release it at far less and just blame rumors that were not correct.
Heck, if I wanted to make sure Xbox is mentioned in every article taking about the PS4 Neo, I'd also make sure a "rumor" was out about the next Xbox One being even more powerful.

 

[Guymelef]

I still see this as a PS3/360 scenario, more than anything else. Where Neo is the 360 and Scorpio is the PS3. History repeats itself.

All I can say though is MS better be sure to hit or surpass that 6tf target if they want to have any chance at winning market share again. And Sony better have Somthing else up its sleeve if it doesn't want to lose that market share.

Exciting times lol

So do you really think Scorpio is going to eat all the current PS4 advantage? ...

 

[Snake29]

I keep thinking this might be a planted rumor by Microsoft to take some of the limelight from the PS4k announcement coming and the rumors so far. They make sure it says "target 6 TF" which means they can release it at far less and just blame rumors that were not correct.
Heck, if I wanted to make sure Xbox is mentioned in every article taking about the PS4 Neo, I'd also make sure a "rumor" was out about the next Xbox One being even more powerful.

Good thought! I personally don't believe the new Xbox will have 6TB real life performance. Also Sony not stupid, and Cerny and his team are not sitting stil.

 

[bidguy]

Good thought! I personally don't believe the new Xbox will have 6TB real life performance. Also Sony not stupid, and Cerny and his team are not sitting stil.

yea cerny probably read about this rumor on the interwebz and is now en route to the sony hq before its too late

 

[anothertech]

I keep thinking this might be a planted rumor by Microsoft to take some of the limelight from the PS4k announcement coming and the rumors so far. They make sure it says "target 6 TF" which means they can release it at far less and just blame rumors that were not correct.
Heck, if I wanted to make sure Xbox is mentioned in every article taking about the PS4 Neo, I'd also make sure a "rumor" was out about the next Xbox One being even more powerful.

This would be marketing suicide imo. The specs would be revealed and huge backlash/trust issues would ensue. I suppose it could take some temporary limelite from Sony right now, but good Lord people would be pissed when things settled and they said nothing.

 

[iJudged]

Alright, I don't know what the fuck is happening right now, but all this is happening way too soon! Fml

 

[tzare]

Alright, I don't know what the fuck is happening right now, but all this is happening way too soon! Fml

is it?

At least Scorpio seems to be a long time away. A 18 month wait seems a lot to me. So many things can happen during that time. One of them is that PS4 neo could have enough time to be 'reengineered to meet specs with that Xbox. Sony sure isn't in a hurry right now.