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[jm89]

The working class will get shafted regardless of whether we stay in or leave. The Tories will bring in more cuts regardless of whether we stay or leave. The only difference is that they will use Brexit as the excuse to do the cutting.

The middle class has used every opportunity to fuck the working class. So is it any surprise that the working class are seizing the one opportunity they have to fuck the middle classes.

So the working class want to hurt the middle class by screwing them selves over even harder. Great plan.

 

[ClosingADoor]

That is not what I meant really, there are 32 counties in England, if for example 28 voted leave but 4 voted remain, but the individual votes meant the result is remain as a overall result it does not base the true feelings of the individual counties

what it does do is mean those with a higher amount of people have usurped the counties...which by actual numbers would be London....

so If the vote was by Counties the result will be leave (I think that is a given?) if the vote is by per person, the vote is likely remain.....

that is all I am saying, I am not arguing for either, I am saying the vote wont be representative of the country as a whole

And what exactly is the issue here? People vote, the biggest number wins. That is how it should be. No matter where they live.

Unless you want to cut up the country in little city states and have everyone rule themselves, the majority in a country decides what is going to happen.

 

[gerg]

that is all I am saying, I am not arguing for either, I am saying the vote wont be representative of the country as a whole

On the contrary, I would argue that this type of referendum produces the most representative result possible. Under your system it might be that a county of 500,000 people has the same weighting as that of 1,000,000 people, which would essentially make votes in the latter worth half as much as those in the former.

I think the only way such a system could be run is if London's borough each get an individual vote (as do separate areas of larger towns), but I'd wonder if that would only swing things even further towards Remain! (London alone has 32 boroughs.)

I dont get that either, I have never met a nanny, or nursery assistant who is not on min wage. and that seems to be the rhetoric rolled out...."the rich like their cheap nannies" it has always been a low wage job and always will be

The implication isn't that low-paid jobs might pay significantly better with a Remain vote, but that under a Leave vote prices on goods will rise, and it is those on low incomes who will find it much harder to manage that increase.

 

[Tak3n]

And what exactly is the issue here? People vote, the biggest number wins. That is how it should be. No matter where they live.

Unless you want to cut up the country in little city states and have everyone rule themselves, the majority in a country decides what is going to happen.

Not saying there is a issue, I was merely a response to a map that showed just how weird it looks with the counties...that is all

 

[Madchad]

This is going to be an amazing shit storm either way it goes Thursday night. Cant wait.

Still feel like Labour has been no where to be seen for the entire campaign. Useless Corbyn

 

[Billy Big Bollocks]

From the Guardian:

We are experienced retailers from Tesco, Sainsbury’s, Marks & Spencer, Asda, Waitrose, Morrisons and B&Q and with USDAW, who represent hundreds of thousands of trade union members, believe that if we leave the European Union prices will rise.

There are two key reasons for this.

Firstly, supply chains. We’ve spent the last few decades building very strong supply chains with the EU, which are fully integrated in order to deliver better quality, choice and value for the UK consumer. The single market and free trade are critically important to the strength of the consumer economy. Food is always one of the battle grounds for trade negotiations and the idea that we can reshape supply chains which have taken 45 years to build, in two to three years, is delusional.

Secondly, the value of the pound. In the past two weeks alone, as worries over leaving Europe have increased, the pound has fallen dramatically. This will push up prices. A ‘Leave’ vote will very likely make this worse and lead to a further rise in prices - such as the cost of filling a petrol tank, and the price of a weekly shop. We strongly believe that a Brexit will see less money in people’s pockets and be catastrophic for millions of ordinary families. That is why we believe that Britain should remain in the EU on 23rd June.

It has been signed by:

Marc Bolland, former CEO of Marks & Spencer and Morrisons

Sir Ian Cheshire, chairman of Debenhams and former chief executive of Kingfisher

Justin King, former CEO of Sainsbury

Sir Terry Leahy, former CEO of Tesco

Andy Clarke, the outgoing Asda chief executive

Dalton Philips, the former Morrisons CEO

Lord Price, the former Waitrose managing director, and now a trade minister

John Hannett, the Usdaw general secetary

Its a bit sad that the BBC have chosen to use the story that David Beckham wants us to remain in the EU as their headline story instead of something like this.

 

[liquidtmd]

Its a bit sad that the BBC have chosen to use the story that David Beckham wants us to remain in the EU as their headline story instead of something like this.

Indeed

Suppose they don't look as good in Calvin Kleins

 

[Psychotext]

From the Guardian:

We are experienced retailers from Tesco, Sainsbury’s, Marks & Spencer, Asda, Waitrose, Morrisons and B&Q and with USDAW, who represent hundreds of thousands of trade union members, believe that if we leave the European Union prices will rise....

Experts / Clearly trying to line their own pockets.

You pick your choice of head in the sand denial on that one.

 

[Tak3n]

Indeed

Suppose they don't look as good in Calvin Kleins

and the fact he spends half his life in the US...total nonsense, I have no time for anyone who votes based on what a celebrity does

 

[Madchad]

Why are they only "former" and "outgoing" why are none of the current people in those positions talking ? Ok the business may have signed a letter sometime ago but not put the actual heads of the business forward like that.

Just seems to be fodder for the sake of story.

 

[SuperEpicMan]

So what time will I likely need to stay up till to see the live result on the TV?

 

[Madchad]

So what time will I likely need to stay up till to see the live result on the TV?

Probably 4am or so. Depends on recounts.

 

[operon]

Its a bit sad that the BBC have chosen to use the story that David Beckham wants us to remain in the EU as their headline story instead of something like this.

No the sad thing is that becks makes more sense then anything that tak3n has posted in this thread

 

[Nilaul]

They keep saying £8 billion will go toward the health service, but intervention to keep currency collapsing and protect stocks could cost many times that and therefore the money for nhs they promised will be gone many times over, i cannot wait to see how they explain all this away.

They would blame it on someone.

 

[liquidtmd]

So what time will I likely need to stay up till to see the live result on the TV?

Honestly, the results will come in throughout the night but with the close nature expected I imagine you'll be looking at 4am at the very earliest before a verdict is clear

Probably 4am or so. Depends on recounts.

No regional level recounts are allowed

 

[Psychotext]

Why are they only "former" and "outgoing" why are none of the current people in those positions talking ?

Because most current managing directors and CEOs have the common sense to keep their business the hell away from politics. Especially politics as divisive as this.

TESCO SUPPORTS BREXIT.

TESCO SEES PROFITS FALL 30% AS REMAIN SUPPORTERS FLOCK TO SAINSBURYS.

 

[SuperEpicMan]

Probably 4am or so. Depends on recounts.

Honestly, the results will come in throughout the night but with the close nature expected I imagine you'll be looking at 4am at the very earliest before a verdict is clear

Hmmm, I might just wait till the morning in that case.

 

[Tak3n]

Can't help but feel this thread wont be half as entertaining on Friday if we vote to remain...vote leave and I can see bans flowing everywhere...

 

[Madchad]

No regional level recounts are allowed

Really ? That seems pretty mad if it turns out to be super tight i would of thought they would at least go over what they have again to be extra sure of the result.

 

[Wrestlemania]

Can't help but feel this thread wont be half as entertaining on Friday if we vote to remain...vote leave and I can see bans flowing everywhere...

What a lovely way of saying "I think that all remain supporters will drop any pretence of politeness in the result of a leave vote and will end up banned by being abusive towards any leave supporters".

 

[CCS]

Really ? That seems pretty mad if it turns out to be super tight i would of thought they would at least go over what they have again to be extra sure of the result.

I think what that means is if it's that close they have to recount everything.

 

[RedSparrows]

Just my personal experience online and in real life, but the average 'Leaver' is likely to be far more of a rude prick than the average 'Remainer'.

Like I said, just in my little corner of the world.

 

[killer_clank]

The overall result may well be tight but I doubt that many of the individual counts will be all that tight.

 

[Hasney]

Really ? That seems pretty mad if it turns out to be super tight i would of thought they would at least go over what they have again to be extra sure of the result.

But it doesn't matter if regions are close if the overall result is decided. Sure, if there was 1 vote in it for the national vote, then maybe they'd recount, but regional recounts will likely be pointless.

 

[Maledict]

Not saying there is a issue, I was merely a response to a map that showed just how weird it looks with the counties...that is all

Have you never looked at a map of our general election? The vast majority of the country goes blue, with small red spots.

That's true of any election in any country outside of tiny city states. Large, rural low population areas show up as massive compared to the cities.

Happens every election, every year.

 

[milanbaros]

Brexit has gone out all the way to 4.5 right now. That gives it a roughly 22% probability of happening.

 

[Tak3n]

Brexit has gone out all the way to 4.5 right now. That gives it a roughly 22% probability of happening.

and that is the value bet

 

[JonathanEx]

I think what that means is if it's that close they have to recount everything.

No national ones are allowed.

I guess the reason is - okay so say the East Midlands is close. ...so, what? That's not necessarily that it needs a recount for being wrong, it might just be close there. It's the raw numbers that matter for the full count. A national recount is also insanely big a challenge.

If the individual constituencies can recount before they're confirmed, if there's any reason to suggest the local counting went wrong for whatever reason, that makes more sense. But once they're validated or whatever the term is, it can't be challenged.

 

[milanbaros]

and that is the value bet

What do you mean?

 

[anonymous_abc]

some one on twitter said something that I thought was interesting, we could end up in a situation where vast swathes of the counties vote to leave, but we end up remaining because those that choose to remain will have a higher vote in physical numbers...

Shows what a divided country we are

Well Size and number does not equal population density, so I am not sure what else you would expect.

 

[hodgy100]

What a lovely way of saying "I think that all remain supporters will drop any pretence of politeness in the result of a leave vote and will end up banned by being abusive towards any leave supporters".

tak3n is such a nice person! he would never suggest such a thing...

if we leave I'll be in here drinking my sorrows with the rest of you, there won't be any bile, it achieves nothing at that point.

 

[Tak3n]

What do you mean?

Betting is all about value, if you ever want to win long term, you have to bet where the value is...

Betting to remain is a stupid bet, but more likely to win, but offers zero value

 

[Jackpot]

So Vote Leave posted footage of a brawl in Turkish parliament as a reason to leave the EU, and then doctored the footage with sound effects.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...n-turkey-video-doctored-screams-a7092191.html

The official Vote Leave campaign group appears to have added fake sound effects of blood-curdling screams and smashing glass to footage of a brawl in the Turkish parliament that it used to warn of the prospect of Turkey joining the EU.

A comparison of the Vote Leave broadcast with the original footage by The Independent indicates that the audio track was doctored.

The scream appears to be a stock sound effect used by filmmakers, which is available on YouTube under the title: ‘Scream 6: woman medium perspective panicked shrieks of fear’.

Later in the video, the sound of smashing glass appears to have been added to footage of an individual throwing an object during the fight, which took place in a committee of the Turkish parliament.

Another scream of pain – again, not audible in the original footage – appears to have been added to suggest someone being struck and injured by the object.

At the time, the Liberal Democrats called the video, which appears calculated to highlight the violence and aggression of the scene in the Turkish parliament, “xenophobic” and “from the propaganda playbooks of 100 years ago”.

The official Remain campaign criticised what they said now appeared to be a deliberate attempt to dramatise the footage and accused Vote Leave on indulging in "post-truth politics".

James McGrory, chief campaign spokesman for Britain Stronger in Europe, told The Independent: “Not content with telling porkies about Turkey joining the EU – when even Boris Johnson says it’s “not on the cards” – it seems Vote Leave have been reduced to making fake videos too.

 

[CharmingCharlie]

So the working class want to hurt the middle class by screwing them selves over even harder. Great plan.

The working class are already hurting badly whilst we are in Europe. Now if we leave it may or may not hurt them more than it is hurting them right now but obviously the hurt is not enough to discourage them from voting to leave just to screw the middle class that have shown they have absolutely no problem with chucking the poor and working class under a bus.

 

[FlammableD]

Metro's front page

Spoiler

advertisement

today.

 

[milanbaros]

Betting is all about value, if you ever want to win long term, you have to bet where the value is...

Betting to remain is a stupid bet, but more likely to win, but offers zero value

The whole point of the Betfair betting market is that equal money is going on both. That is why the market clears at these odds. When more people think Brexit offers better value the odds will shorten.

It is your opinion it is a stupid bet but the market thinks it is just as reasonable to bet on remain at 1.28.

 

[Tak3n]

So Vote Leave posted footage of a brawl in Turkish parliament as a reason to leave the EU, and then doctored the footage with sound effects.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...n-turkey-video-doctored-screams-a7092191.html

if it was good enough for the 60's Batman show it is good enough for the leave campaign

 

[Tak3n]

The whole point of the Betfair betting market is that equal money is going on both. That is why the market clears at these odds. When more people think Brexit offers better value the odds will shorten.

It is your opinion it is a stupid bet but the market thinks it is just as reasonable to bet on remain at 1.28.

you mis understand


you bet £100 on remain, you get £28 profit

you bet £100 on leave, you get £350 profit

where is the value?

 

[anonymous_abc]

you mis understand


you bet £100 on remain, you get £28 profit

you bet £100 on leave, you get £350 profit

where is the value?

Where is the value in loosing £100?

 

[hodgy100]

So Vote Leave posted footage of a brawl in Turkish parliament as a reason to leave the EU, and then doctored the footage with sound effects.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...n-turkey-video-doctored-screams-a7092191.html

The original video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8su2vCq950

what... the... fuck...

 

[liquidtmd]

They should have just said fuck it and added the Wilhelm Scream

 

[Tak3n]

Where is the value in loosing £100?

if you make the same bet 10 times in a row, you will make more money betting on leave, as the true odds are nowhere near 78%

that is what is meant by the value bet

 

[RedSparrows]

The working class are already hurting badly whilst we are in Europe. Now if we leave it may or may not hurt them more than it is hurting them right now but obviously the hurt is not enough to discourage them from voting to leave just to screw the middle class that have shown they have absolutely no problem with chucking the poor and working class under a bus.

This seems just a teensy bit reductive to me. Just a tad.

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

Metro's front page

Spoiler

advertisement

today.

I don't think I like the idea of this daily mail/metro stealth support of leave by taking advertising money instead of declaring it themselves. Seems really shady.

 

[Kabouter]

It seems to me most leave voters aren't in it to 'screw the middle class' or anything like that. I think most are genuinely voting for what they think will be best for themselves, of course I think they're wrong and are basing their decisions in part on lies they've been told by the leave campaign, but yeah, I don't think the main intent here is to just stick it to the middle classes.

 

[King_Moc]

if you make the same bet 10 times in a row, you will make more money betting on leave, as the true odds are nowhere near 78%

that is what is meant by the value bet

But...you stand to win more because you have a much higher chance of losing.

What the hell?

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

Leave being Leave, eh? Is anyone shocked or surprised any more?
I've gradually lowered my "disappointment with the UK" bar to levels that not even James Cameron could raise

Very little surprises me about this shitty referendum. I just accept that nursery school kids are more mature than most people involved in this process.

 

[Maledict]

The working class are already hurting badly whilst we are in Europe. Now if we leave it may or may not hurt them more than it is hurting them right now but obviously the hurt is not enough to discourage them from voting to leave just to screw the middle class that have shown they have absolutely no problem with chucking the poor and working class under a bus.

You are ignoring the very large, white working class vote that votes Tory. Has done since the 80s and Thatcher, and does now - my parents are a perfect example. You cannot boil these things down to simple, crude class warfare examples like you could 50 years ago.

Heck, the republicans in the USA have perfected the art of getting the poor to vote against their economic own interests - same goes here.

 

[Hasney]

I don't think I like the idea of this daily mail/metro stealth support of leave by taking advertising money instead of declaring it themselves. Seems really shady.

Metro will take anybodies money. I wouldn't be shocked if there is a remain ad coming.

 

[Tak3n]

But...you stand to win more because you have a much higher chance of losing.

What the hell?

Yes, let me give you a lesson

walk into any bookies and you will likely see the same people losing money betting on favourites in horse racingyou see the fav in a horse racing over time wins 33% of the time, and people think it is easy money, when in reality it is not, you will ALWAYS lose betting on fav's..

The value lies betting elsewhere, you see the fav often gives you better odds on the other runners, so a 50/1 may look like a joke...but in reality if me and you walk into a bookies with a £100 ok...

I say I will bet on every favourite at £1 a go to win for 100 races

you, I want you to close your eyes and pick any horse in each of those 100 races except the fav

after 100 races you will have lots more money than me, about 8 times out of 10...you see the odds dont truly reflect the horses chance, because they are animals, jockies etc etc, a whole host of things, so in the long term that is why the value bet is always the one that has better returns.