FunkyMunkey
Banned
yes his objective was to take the spotlight off of the dnc's performance last night, but not all press is good press, even for trump. there's a huge chunk of people undecided and won't swallow his shit like his devoted fans will
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Trump 'hopes' Russia will hack US government for Hillary emails.
- Thread starter Tal Shiar Agent
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yes his objective was to take the spotlight off of the dnc's performance last night, but not all press is good press, even for trump. there's a huge chunk of people undecided and won't swallow his shit like his devoted fans will
ShockingAlberto
Member
It'll take over the news until Obama's speech, which is all anyone was going to talk about, anyway.
Considering the other story was going to be how Clinton's speech about Hillary was anti-feminist (which I don't agree with Maddow about at all), I don't know that it was necessarily planned or particularly smart.
Lord Frieza
Member
Equal time. Key word, isn't it?
Yeah, sure, no one is going to listen to Obama's speech because of this. Whatever man, you're crazy. I could see it overshadowing Biden, okay, but I guarantee you that when Obama speaks, it will be the spotlight on every network broadcasting it, with immense discussion and dissecting of what he said afterward.
Sure it's moronic and absurd, but what he said isn't treason. The man has given us enough reasons to despise him, inventing things that aren't there only plays into his little game of exaggeration and escalation.
That remains to be seen.
Regardless of whether Hillary's approval drops, or his approval rises, the end result is still the same.
And name recognition matters. Shit, people in Florida thought they were voting for Bush Senior in 2000... You're giving far too much credit to the American electorate.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
It's not a ha ha airline peanuts joke, it's a flippant aside. Like Palin, Trump often incoherently claws at saying zingers. That's what this is. His people have told him to repeatedly talk about Hillary's emails, because that's how he gained 4-5 points in the last month, so you could ask him who he was cheering for in the olympics and he'd say "I'm cheering... For making America great again by finding Hillary's 30,000 deleted emails".
Trump's positions on foreign politics are troubling to the point of disqualification, and allegations of foreign funding or ties should probably be investigated.
There is absolutely zero scenario on earth that ends with a major political party's candidate being indicted on treason charges--themselves extremely rarely used even in clear-cut collaboration of high-level employees with foreign governments. People calling for Trump to be strung up on treason charges are hyperventilating chicken little babies, probably upset because Bernie didn't time travel back in time to drop out earlier and politer or whatever other sky is falling refrain we're supposed to be freaking about today.
One can sharply oppose Trump--even as reckless or evil--and be upset with both how he says and how the public responds--without mythologizing him as Hitler's Cousin Voldemort. The same was true of nutcases trying to impeach Bush over Florida 2000 or Iraq or Diebold Ohio 2004 or whatever it was on any given day
I feel like this is a gotcha question but you left out the context in which it is a gotcha.
The precise accuracy of polling is a complex question with many factors (for example, poll accuracy is lowest right around now, and was higher earlier in the year).
However I don't think this is actually relevant to the discussion. I'm responding to somebody saying "nothing Trump does hurts him in the polls," which isn't accurate. Commenting on the falsity of that statement does not necessarily mean I'm saying the polls are accurate.
This is beyond his regular dumb shit he says. This is as close to Treason without it being treason that there is. And imo is worth looking into by the relevant agencies. So yes, when he makes a statement like this it certainly deserves a response.
BFIB
Member
I am literally having a convo. on Facebook w/ Trump supporter right now. "Well, maybe she shouldn't have deleted those emails in the first place."
You seriously cannot argue w/ these people.
Except those were the primaries and this is the GE season and more specifically the DNC convention. People focused so much on Trump back then because, even without being an American, I can assume that the majority just didn't care too much about what Cruz or Jeb were doing at the time.
The idea that everything that worked for Trump late last year will work now is silly, the GE is an entirely different ballgame.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Yes, they did. He was losing by six or seven points which is roughly twice what Obama beat Romney by. Then Clinton had a really bad news cycle and the RNC convention happened. The reason people call it a convention bounce is that it goes up and then back down.
If the polls are in the same spot two weeks from now feel free to freak out, but if you look at the average campaign this will be Trump's highest point. You can't pick this one point and time and say 'see, Trump's bullet proof!' Its also why Nate Silver still gives Clinton a 60% chance of winning in the polls+ forecast.
I mean, I respect your opinion, but your position on this is wildly at odds with all major news networks and also the former CIA director. I think you might be apologizing too much.
There's kind of a lot of daylight between "Trump should be indicted for treason" and "this was a harmless irrelevant joke that nobody should talk about."
Jacksinthe
Banned
But it won't, no. Especially if his "hope" comes to fruition.
The GOP is dead, IMO. Trump, win or lose, changed the face of the party by campaigning against it and winning for it.
Hopefully this will cause a bit of change in the party when he is gone but I'm not holding my breath.
Trump isn't invincible but you have to be crazy to think that he doesn't have some IRL plot armor that other candidates don't have.
I mean the only things that really hurt him were the judge comments and the Orlando response.
Also people were swearing up and down that he wouldn't get a convention bump after the RNC shitshow. Lo and behold check out that vertical line on rcp.
I mean the only things that really hurt him were the judge comments and the Orlando response.
Also people were swearing up and down that he wouldn't get a convention bump after the RNC shitshow. Lo and behold check out that vertical line on rcp.
TestOfTide
Banned
At this point you should just respond by asking your FB friend how he would feel if he was doxxed by the Russians.
Lord Frieza
Member
I think everything from last night has already had its impact, but sure, I guess you can say he shifted it away from talks the morning, which could be important. But I mean, Obama is speaking tonight, so I don't see how anyone can really seriously think Trump is going to overshadow him with this. All eyes are going to be on Obama no matter what Trump says, well unless it's just something totally out there like...kill someone or something.
You do realize that Hillarys drop is from Dem leaning partisans feeling wishy washy and gross after the email thing. Not from some magical undecideds making up their mind.
They'll be back after the convention. This will play towards driving them back.
Same with Obama's rating. They wernt low because of moderates hating him. They were low because of the GOP absolutely hating him for being too liberal and the Left being disgusted he didn't go left enough.
Now the left is coalescing around him, and his numbers are great.
You dont seem to have a grasp on how any of this polling works.
teruterubozu
Member
Nah I just have a headache. Trying not to burn out on the day-to-day frothing of politics.
If drawing attention to his own dishonesty and treasonous appeals to a hostile foreign power will help him win the presidency, I really don't know what to do. Maybe become a doomsday prepper? Work on a new Underground Railroad to get people to Canada? Trump winning in this manner would cause me to completely lose faith in American democracy.
Nah. Call it... gateway treason.
Tal Shiar Agent
Banned
It's seditious for sure.
I think Silver is basing the polls+ forecast on demographic composition in key states.
My fear is this- He's bringing out the uneducated white vote in, so far as we can tell, unprecedented fashion. Clearly, being visible in the media and active on Twitter has served him really well with this group of voters.
I still ultimately think that Clinton is going to win, but people are just hand-waving the last few weeks as some kind of aberration or post-convention swing, but there's more to it than that.
Spot on.
If you guys want to accuse him of something, it's actually very close to sedition.
Glass Shark
Banned
Donald Trump is a social experiment
univariate
Banned
How is he not finished after these statements? He's a petty loon and he has no business running for president. He's toxic, ignorant, and an all-around disaster.
SolidSnakeUS
Member
If he really was brought up on sedition charges, would that basically eliminate him from the race?
And the nutcases spreading nonsense about Obama even to this day, and one of those idiots being the nominee for their party.
Part of Trump's appeal to his ardent supporters is the very fact he's unhinged.
eBay Huckster
Member
I'm not even gonna begin to believe this is just a "flippant aside" when he has already said, vowed, or blocked the five other things Frum mentioned:
Lord Frieza
Member
I know this sounds weird to say, but I think the RNC bump was a good thing, because that means the election and polls surrounding it are relatively normal. For all the talk of how Trump has 'changed the game,' the polls in the primaries were always in his favor. The fact that he got a normal bump, but still seems to be overall behind in the electorate shows that for all that talk, Trump is still in this election on a normal pace.
Reading that, I'm not sure I 100% explained that well, but maybe you know what I mean.
GiantEnemyGoomba
Member
How can people be so dense? Even if the emails detailed every spy our country has, you don't fucking hope that a dangerous country hacked the state department and found them so you can win an election. Is this election even real???
That's not what he's saying though, is he? It's an idiotic comment by Trump that also shows how unfit for president he is, but trying to string it up to treason seems kind of hyperbolic.
How exactly would you distinguish between a convention bounce and an actual important shift, in the week after the convention?
It could definitely be considered sedition which is also extremely serious.
He's too low energy to have his eyes light up.
gutter_trash
Banned
that's the trap
if any agency steps in to investigate him during the campaign, he will claim that the system is rigged, folks
if any agency steps in to investigate him after the inauguration; he will claim that the system is rigged, folks
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
What's really messed up is that it also depends on which aggregate you follow. RCP makes it look like a big swing, huffpost pollster makes it look like both are middling in the low 40s.
Primarily because huffpost uses every poll you can find EXCEPT one that RCP uses which is very experimental in terms of methodology.
Please clap.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Sure, only a crazy person would think this is a lock after the last two weeks but there are reasons this stuff is happening. If the Clinton campaign can get back on message now that the email stuff has been closed out they should still be able to win comfortably. Trump acting like a nutcase makes that much easier.
Again, the false dichotomy between "joke" and "treason" shouldn't be the choices. Even as a joke, from a possible future leader of international relations where policies will be implemented globally from just his rhetoric, these are dangerous, dangerous statements.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Yes I agree that Trump is an idiot and a lunatic but I think it's possible to talk about how some other group of people being dumb without needing to disclaimer that Trump is Real Bad and even in the post you quote I do that but I guess it's important to do it again just to test my loyalties or something?
I feel like his post IS actually saying "this is a flippant aside," which I disagree with entirely.
Trump and Putin were in different locations for the 60 Minutes interview so they couldn't have met. But Trump did claim he met Putin in Moscow at a different time. There's also an agreement to build a Trump Tower in the heart of Moscow. It's not clear whether that agreement has fallen through or on hold.
Because he has been trending in the positive direction for the last month?
univariate
Banned
Yeah, and that's what scares me. He's a diplomatic nightmare.
ferrasvansen
Member
Yeah he knows what he is doing, basically he must be in the pocket of Russia, too clear cut now. His masters are helping shape his pro Russian stance and he isn't shy about it or even trying to hide it.
Lord Frieza
Member
Trump may be bringing those people out, but I think, too, he's going to be bringing out the minorities in full force against him. Someone posted a story about how a former KKK headmaster ran for office in a state (Alabama, maybe? I forget), and there was real fear he would win because polls showed he had extreme favor to white voters, but in a twist, the black population came out in full force and sounded defeated him in the election. I know it's not exactly the same thing since we're talking about the whole country as opposed to a single state, and Trump (as racist as he is) isn't an actual former headmaster or what have you, but I think as much as he'll rally the one group, another group will rise against it as a reaction.
It's a false dichotomy that I haven't seen presented. Who said the statement should be ignored?
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