A polite discourse amongst friends on the importance of MP-elements in No Man's Sky

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MutFox said:
These are from Sean Murray's Twitter on the 8th. (2 days ago)

https://twitter.com/nomanssky/status/762688708764135425
To be super clear - No Man's Sky is not a multiplayer game. Please don't go in looking for that experience.

https://twitter.com/NoMansSky/status/762689755792412672
We do have some online features and easter eggs so people can know they are playing in the same universe. It's about cool "moments"
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Yeah but why did you remove the middle tweet from that?

https://twitter.com/NoMansSky/status/762689080245252096
The chances of two players ever crossing paths in a universe this large is pretty much zero.

Implying that if two players do manage to cross paths, they would be able to see each other like he said numerous times previously.

The way paths crossed a couple times already on day one.

The fact that all these tweets remained ambiguous instead of being a strong statement like "it's not coded into the game" is the reason anyone/everyone is confused/upset/disappointed.

People keep trying to put that same tweet in a vacuum as if it's something definitive. It's not at all, due to its context.
 
chillybright said:
I have a feeling that there won't be any response before the pc launch because they think a clear "no" (which seems like to be the case) will lead to some pre-orders to be canceled.



At this point I think it has more to do with the developer's dodgy and shady attitude than the multiplayer feature itself.
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DataGhost said:
The issue is this.

Sean has stated multiple times that other players can see you and you can see them.

Sure you might not be able to "interact" with them other than viewing them.

However, this is the only known way to see your own avatar in the game.

This has been tested extensively by two twitch streamers. They have tried a lot of things today and yesterday.

They even made sure to connect online and get rid of whatever the NAT setting was and nothing happened.

Right now, all we want is clarification and that is what we're not getting
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Najaf said:
The issue is that Sean (the lead developer) has made routine statements for years in various interviews and QA sessions that now appear to be completely false (like the ability to see other players). When looking back at all of those statements, the consistent theme was that it is possible to see others but 'The game is so large, that the chances of that happening are basically zero'.

Then hours before launch, a single tweet goes out saying that NMS is not a multiplayer game and players should not go in expecting that. However, this was followed with more tweets that bring it back into a vague area.

Now we sit just 48 hours after launch, people are discovering that (apparently) nothing happens when two players are in the same place at the same time. There has been a flood of questions about if simply a feature is broken, servers are struggling, conditions are not being met etc.. Sean's twitter has been dead for almost 24 hours and there has been no concrete response to this.
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Ah I see. Kind of makes you wonder why you would promote this feature as a thing if it wasn't really in the game? Seems so minimal given all the other stuff I have read about the title to really matter. I wonder if the lack of response is more a general embarrassment that they seemingly let this small issue spiral out of control. This isn't realistically a selling point for people is it? I haven't followed it, just saw a 5000+ post thread and wanted to see what the issue was.

This is about the worst pres you could ever have for your game over something so minuscule.
 
DataGhost said:
There's a problem with this

Heavy game spoiler
All players could be in a different galaxy. The ones who tried it were definitely in the same system and planet as any renaming done by other reflected to the other player
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I should rephrase and say everyone that is ABLE to meet up in the same location should try.
 
aerts1js said:
I see that there still isn't an official answer. It's sick that some people are defending this.. I mean, taking a look at the size of this thread and other sources this was a huge deal to a lot of people... including myself.

Oh well, it's saved me 60 bucks.
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Well if you were into the game for multiplayer you shouldn't have been buying it in the first place.
 
arbok26 said:
I should rephrase and say everyone that is ABLE to meet up in the same location should try.
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Then there's a matter of coordination

like
how do you know if people are in the same universe? We don't exactly know which universe person is in until they see people renaming systems.
 
Gotdatmoney said:
Ah I see. Kind of makes you wonder why you would promote this feature as a thing if it wasn't really in the game? Seems so minimal given all the other stuff I have read about the title to really matter. I wonder if the lack of response is more a general embarrassment that they seemingly let this small issue spiral out of control. This isn't realistically a selling point for people is it? I haven't followed it, just saw a 5000+ post thread and wanted to see what the issue was.

This is about the worst pres you could ever have for your game over something so minuscule.
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It has impacted my view of the game as I posted earlier:

I understand that when Sean was stating that the chances of running into another player were close to zero, he was referring to accidental or unplanned encounters. In that case, yes, the odds would be unbelievably small.

But to not account for people planning to meet up, especially with how connected communities are between Reddit/Twitch/Twitter/GAF etc., I'm kind of stunned that they did not think people would intentionally seek each other out immediately.

Honestly, the idea of being in a RNG set of worlds with only a limited number of varying factors with wildlife, terrain and general look and feel, the thought of running into a player or ship under such small odds is one of the more intriguing aspects (or was).

The appeal of the game where 'You are forever alone and can never interact with other players or see how they have impacted the worlds you are exploring other than naming creatures and planets' loses a lot of its luster. Yes, it is not meant to be a multiplayer focused experience, but the idea that you will NEVER see ANYONE... EVER, all of sudden takes a lot of the wind out of the sails for me.
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MaDKaT said:
Ah, sort of confusing with folks speaking as if the feature was confirmed removed and the exceptional vitriol towards the devs. Was thinking we had something more concrete buried in these pages.
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Nothing concrete enough as they could be explained due to the circumstances.


What we do know thus far is there has been one case where two streamers tried to meet up with each other and it didn't happen. They've tried many things as well as making sure they were connected online.
This can be explained away as day 1 server issues.

There was a person who used wireshark to check to see if the player is sending location data. Nothing was found of this sort.
This can be somewhat (I don't buy it, but sure) explained with the fact he is by himself and not near anyone so no need to send player movement / location data.
 
MaDKaT said:
Ah, sort of confusing with folks speaking as if the feature was confirmed removed and the exceptional vitriol towards the devs. Was thinking we had something more concrete buried in these pages.
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Well we did have the fact that the game sends absolutely no information back to the server other than when you name something. You can also pause whenever you like.

But that doesn't mean multiplayer isn't in! It just means it is really, really unlikely to happen, but who knows?
 
DataGhost said:
Nothing concrete enough as they could be explained due to the circumstances.


What we do know thus far is there has been one case where two streamers tried to meet up with each other and it didn't happen. They've tried many things as well as making sure they were connected online.
This can be explained away as day 1 server issues.

There was a person who used wireshark to check to see if the player is sending location data. Nothing was found of this sort.
This can be somewhat (I don't buy it, but sure) explained with the fact he is by himself and not near anyone so no need to send player movement / location data.
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Gotcha. Thanks for the summary.
 
UncleSporky said:
Yeah but why did you remove the middle tweet from that?

https://twitter.com/NoMansSky/status/762689080245252096
The chances of two players ever crossing paths in a universe this large is pretty much zero.

Implying that if two players do manage to cross paths, they would be able to see each other like he said numerous times previously.

The way paths crossed a couple times already on day one.

The fact that all these tweets remained ambiguous instead of being a strong statement like "it's not coded into the game" is the reason anyone/everyone is confused/upset/disappointed.

People keep trying to put that same tweet in a vacuum as if it's something definitive. It's not at all, due to its context.
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Didn't remove it, just didn't post it,
as I didn't post a bunch of his tweets.

Still, I'm probably not gonna buy the game until it's on sale at this point.

Hopefully they clear it up in the next little while.
Or at least after a person reaches the centre.

I still think reaching the centre will unlock features.
 
Kssio_Aug said:
It's relevant to your post. He clearly says you can play with your friends and that you could meet others.
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It said that in the trailer in 2014? I commented on the trailer, no where does it say coop.

Stop jumping down my god damn throat just because I'm trying to be reasonable and wait on an official word instead of calling people liars. This thread has been the same shit posted for pages now. We get it, we're all waiting for an answer.
 
Where we are going...
tumblr_l7dyqdu6yE1qztqsao1_500.jpg
 
A 60 Dollar mess imo. Why tell people it's capable of meeting your friends, just don't lie.... I wonder if the PC version will be easier to meet up?
 
MutFox said:
Didn't remove it, just didn't post it,
as I didn't post a bunch of his tweets.

Still, I'm probably not gonna buy the game until it's on sale at this point.

Hopefully they clear it up in the next little while.
Or at least after a person reaches the centre.

I still think reaching the centre will unlock features.
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The No Man's Sky spoiler thread has some bad news for you
 
butman said:
Sean says in the videos. The chances of encounter are tiny.
I don't understand why everyone complains. The game was released in less than a week and there are 18 quintillion planets for god sake!

The moment when a player meets other for the first time will be a milestone in the history of video games. Mark my words.
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That last part slayed me.
 
pitster03 said:
I wonder if the PC version will be easier to meet up?
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There is no "meeting up". There is no multiplayer. There isn't any position data being sent in the packets while playing the game, so it is functionally impossible for the game to support players meeting or seeing each other in game. No matter what Sean or anyone else has said in the past or today, this is the fact of the matter and it physically prevents players from seeing each other in game. It's just not coded into the game itself.

Now, could such a feature be added later on? Sure, possibly. Might the PC version have multiplayer while the PS4 version does not? Lord can you imagine the uproar if that were the case!!!

The sad reality is that Sean has repeatedly stated that players can see each other in game but it's hugely unlikely, when the fact is that players can not see each other in game. And personally I think that's poor marketing and very bad behavior on the part of Hello Games.

And hence, this huge thread in one day's time....
 
Man, even after release this game's messaging and marketing has been a complete blunder. I bought in despite it all and am enjoying the game a lot more than I expected thus far, and this revelation doesn't concern me (although a possibility would have been cool), but this is something they didn't even have to be gray about. Looking back, the coy responses to these questions were kind of masterful in their intent, and you wonder how anyone didn't pick up on it then.
 
Mengy said:
There is no "meeting up". There is no multiplayer. There isn't any position data being sent in the packets while playing the game, so it is functionally impossible for the game to support players meeting or seeing each other in game. No matter what Sean or anyone else has said in the past or today, this is the fact of the matter and it physically prevents players from seeing each other in game. It's just not coded into the game itself.

Now, could such a feature be added later on? Sure, possibly. Might the PC version have multiplayer while the PS4 version does not? Lord can you imagine the uproar if that were the case!!!

The sad reality is that Sean has repeatedly stated that players can see each other in game but it's hugely unlikely, when the fact is that players can not see each other in game. And personally I think that's poor marketing and very bad behavior on the part of Hello Games.

And hence, this huge thread in one day's time....
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Where is the source for this? Its been mentioned a lot but I haven't actually seen the source yet. Two people streaming their attempts to meet is one thing, but I'm not sure I trust a random person to use Wireshark correctly lol.
 
Mengy said:
There is no "meeting up". There is no multiplayer. There isn't any position data being sent in the packets while playing the game, so it is functionally impossible for the game to support players meeting or seeing each other in game. No matter what Sean or anyone else has said in the past or today, this is the fact of the matter and it physically prevents players from seeing each other in game. It's just not coded into the game itself.

Now, could such a feature be added later on? Sure, possibly. Might the PC version have multiplayer while the PS4 version does not? Lord can you imagine the uproar if that were the case!!!

The sad reality is that Sean has repeatedly stated that players can see each other in game but it's hugely unlikely, when the fact is that players can not see each other in game. And personally I think that's poor marketing and very bad behavior on the part of Hello Games.

And hence, this huge thread in one day's time....
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The only thing that is possible is that if you name something, and someone later visits that place, they might see a npc echo standing there waving or doing a little dance or something.
 
Pop said:
It said that in the trailer in 2014? I commented on the trailer, no where does it say coop.

Stop jumping down my god damn throat just because I'm trying to be reasonable and wait on an official word instead of calling people liars. This thread has been the same shit posted for pages now. We get it, we're all waiting for an answer.
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Your the second top poster in this thread and a significant amount of your posts have basically been drive by insults...if anybody is shit posting its you buddy.
 
I think it is fairly clear that sean made false promises in this respect. Why all this idolatry over Sean? This is the first big project he is involved in.
 
Trying to do some space combat and it's so bad. My ship is upgraded but still goes down so fast, and it's such a slog to try to swing around and find the various guys shooting at you.


Plus I'm crashing after every death now.
 
Mengy said:
There is no "meeting up". There is no multiplayer. There isn't any position data being sent in the packets while playing the game, so it is functionally impossible for the game to support players meeting or seeing each other in game. No matter what Sean or anyone else has said in the past or today, this is the fact of the matter and it physically prevents players from seeing each other in game. It's just not coded into the game itself.
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Would be an incredible feat of software programming and network coding if they could coordinate 10 million players' universes with rotating planets and such. Chances are pretty close to zero.

The game would have to live off a central server and players would have to access the one game world. That would be the way to do it, rather than have millions of copies of the game do their own thing and then co-ordinate every game world.
 
Exploding8 said:
Where is the source for this? Its been mentioned a lot but I haven't actually seen the source yet. Two people streaming their attempts to meet is one thing, but I'm not sure I trust a random person to use Wireshark correctly lol.
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gossi said:
I packet captured my PS4. When the servers are online, no player movement data is sent to servers, either in space or planet side. It simply doesn't transmit where you are, or any world sharing information.

It does transmit your Discovers, and a diary of planets you have visited. I imagine that is for the Easter eggs.

Also, if you press 'OPTIONS' it pauses the entire game world, including AI (watch creatures and ships stop) and *time*. Planets stop moving and time stops passing when in OPTIONS. This is *not* a multiplayer game.
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gossi said:
When the servers are up (and you can tell even in game as it tells you in the options menu) absolutely 0 packets are sent when you fly or walk around. It's going to be easier for more people to do packet capture of PC so expect more people to notice, but if you have a PS4 plug it into a box running Wireshark and start dumping the data. There's no netcode for 'pal around with friends'.
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.

Edit:
bobbytkc said:
I think it is fairly clear that sean made false promises in this respect. Why all this idolatry over Sean? This is the first big project he is involved in.
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It's an underdog thing: fans want the indie dev with big ambitions to succeed. Some can reconcile this with the understanding that the light MP element alluded to many times prior to release seemingly not being present in the final game whatsoever is an issue for a number of people who were looking forward to the game, and, for these folks, Hello's uncharacteristic silence is a cause for frustration; other's can't and exhibit the "Us versus them" mentality you see all too often with popular new releases.
 
mstevens said:
Trying to do some space combat and it's so bad. My ship is upgraded but still goes down so fast, and it's such a slog to try to swing around and find the various guys shooting at you.


Plus I'm crashing after every death now.
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Weird. I love the space battles and haven't had any of those issues. Do mobility and defense vary by ship? Or is it solely based on your sheilds and stuff?
 
The more I play, the more I realize it would be kind of a pointless feature.

It's a pretty alright game regardless, though I'm not sure multiplayer would make it any better.
 
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