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[Nesotenso]

So for all the people telling how oppressive that is to woman that they can't wear want they want, is this ok?

yes there is a dress code for places of worship. What has that gotta do with a fucking beach?

 

[Kayhan]

Who remembers the Cairo '48 swimsuit competition?

Sad to see how things have regressed since then.

There are images like this showing a backwards slide into female repression from the 1970s Afghanistan and Iran as well. They have been posted on GAF before.

 

[spekkeh]

I like how people are arrogant enough to claim that they know women are forced to wear it. Like how do you know that all of them want to wear a bikini instead. It's amazing how if a girl wants to sit nude she impowering yet if she decides she wants to cover herself up she's oppressed. A little anecdotall evidence my sister decided to wear the hjab at 13 nobody told her she had on the contrary we told her shr should wait a bit longer and think it through but when we came to US she wanted to take it off because she was scared that people would judge her at school and assume she's a terrorist my dad didn't object I was against it because she was doing it out of fear of other people but I bet you looking at her you would assume she's making her own choice and impowered when it's the opposite and it's that society is forcing on her there ideals

It's empowering to shun oppressive sexual morals, it's not empowering to conform to them. That's really not that difficult to understand. You can't turn it on its head and do a gotcha!

Maybe some people want to be a slave.

Well, too bad!

 

[RazMaTaz]

Sections of these countries, especially those with a lot of tourism and people like yourself working abroad can be okay. Let's not get ahead of ourselves though. In some places if you are a devout Muslim strictly following code fine, but try being a liberal, Jew, Christian, homosexual or something else, good luck.

Even Dubai a tourist and work hotspot

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/united-arab-emirates/local-laws-and-customs

Not as liberal as France in the slightest lol. If you read the above and think so then you are absolutely insane.

both Pakistan and Dubai (as examples) are multi faithed so they do consist of many churches. One of the nicest churches I have seen is in fact in Lahore, and even if you go deep into the villages, such as Pir Mahal, they to also have churches. Sure the ratio between mosques and churches differ massively, but so does the number of pakistani born christians/atheists to muslims too, even pakistani Hindus are the norm in Pakistan. Dubai and Qatar are no different too. Sure the laws you bought up is a guideline anyone should stick to, but the popularity of relationships, prostitution and even brothels in Hotels such as the Hayatt are so common that the police at most stages dont give a shit.

Ofcourse if its Saudi and Iran, then sure its a different story.

There countries are not as liberal as France, but, im strictly talking about this piece of clothing, where by its beyond stupid to ban.

 

[Don'tBeWeird]

Serious question:
why is your sister okay with covering her head?
Does she realize that this means that she is not the equal of man?

Why is it always the women?
Why wouldn't men cover themselves for a change?

If a man wants to wrap a keffiyeh around his head, does it mean that he is not equal of woman? What are you even asking here? It was her personal choice. People like to cover their heads for various reasons.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

USA has never underwent a true seperation of Church and State

Many European Western countries have lived a long difficult history of abuse of power from the Church, the Clergy, the monarchy

Secularisarion during the 19th to the 20th Century was fundamental into transitionning into modern democracies

History is ugly, secularists don't want religion to ever return into politics because of the corruption and manipulation of the Church with power

Explain to me what regulating beach wear has to do with separation of church and state. This should be good...

posts like this are allowed on this forum? Lol

France and Québec bashing are still politically correct, it seems.

So for all the people telling how oppressive that is to woman that they can't wear want they want, is this ok?

Private mosque != public beach

I do like how the blue-shirted woman in the diagram counts as "not allowed" though. WTF? She's dressed super modestly. I guess there's a hint of a curve showing, the horror!

 

[Jon Carter]

Fucking France is such a shithole.

France is a shithole? What?

 

[Condom]

Sad to see how things have regressed since then.

There are images like this showing a backwards slide from the 1970s Afghanistan and Iran as well. They have been posted on GAF before.

Again disgusting to see people supporting western puppet regimes and their forced culture. At least I don't have to wonder anymore what kind of reasoning people use to support colonialism.

 

[derder]

So for all the people telling how oppressive that is to woman that they can't wear want they want, is this ok?

I agree, but that's a mosque. Same goes for baseball caps and shorts in a catholic church. Not a valid comparison.

The root cause of the concern is the punishment for not meeting the cultural standard and the religious symbolism of the outfit. The punishment is a civil fine - likely the same which applies to bare nudity.

Take this same argument an apply it to a KKK outfit on the beach. That law has fuck all to do with modesty and everything to do with the symbolism that the outfit represents.

 

[RazMaTaz]

So for all the people telling how oppressive that is to woman that they can't wear want they want, is this ok?

Wow how stupid are you? It clearly says "MOSQUE". Its a place of worship. Name me one buddist temple or church that allows to wear a mini skirt or a bikini.

 

[Kurtofan]

France is a shithole? What?

One French city decided to ban a piece of swimwear=all of France is evil...

you'd think this is the Nuremberg laws.

 

[Kayhan]

Again disgusting to see people supporting western puppet regimes and their forced culture. At least I don't have to wonder anymore what kind of reasoning people use to support colonialism.

Islam colonized the middle east once upon a time too you know.

Or maybe you didn't know that the middle east wasn't always islamic.

 

[Audioboxer]

both Pakistan and Dubai (as examples) are multi faithed so they do consist of many churches. One of the nicest churches I have seen is in fact in Lahore, and even if you go deep into the villages, such as Pir Mahal, they to also have churches. Sure the ratio between mosques and churches differ massively, but so does the number of pakistani born christians/atheists to muslims too, even pakistani Hindus are the norm in Pakistan. Dubai and Qatar are no different too. Sure the laws you bought up is a guideline anyone should stick to, but the popularity of relationships, prostitution and even brothels in Hotels such as the Hayatt are so common that the police at most stages dont give a shit.

Ofcourse if its Saudi and Iran, then sure its a different story.

There countries are not as liberal as France, but, im strictly talking about this piece of clothing, where by its beyond stupid to ban.

That's just the hypocrisy usually seen in male dominated religions (as in males are the powerful ones) to be honest. Usually the most repressive religions have tons of their male followers trading money into the sex trade. Also you have to worry about how many of the sex workers in such countries come about.

Try being openly gay in Dubai as well, the police will probably care then

Relationships outside marriage

All sex outside marriage is illegal, irrespective of any relationship you may have with your partner in the UK. Same-sex marriages are not recognised and all homosexual sex is illegal. If the UAE authorities become aware that you’re conducting a sexual relationship outside marriage (as recognised by them), you run the risk of prosecution, imprisonment and/or a fine and deportation. It’s against the law to live together, or to share the same hotel room, with someone of the opposite sex to whom you aren’t married or closely related.

The UAE is in many respects a tolerant society and private life is respected, although there have been some reports of individuals being punished for sexual activity outside marriage, including homosexual activity, particularly where there is any public element, or the behaviour has caused offence. This applies both to expatriate residents and to tourists.

Due to the laws on sex outside marriage, if you become pregnant outside marriage, both you and your partner could face imprisonment and/or deportation. Doctors may ask for proof of marriage during ante-natal checks. An unmarried woman who gives birth in the UAE may also encounter problems when registering the birth of the child in the UAE, and could be arrested, imprisoned or deported. To get a birth certificate from the UAE authorities, you must provide a marriage certificate and the authorities may compare the date of the marriage against the estimated date of conception.

Offensive behaviour

Swearing and making rude gestures (including online) are considered obscene acts and offenders can be jailed or deported. Take particular care when dealing with the police and other officials.

Public displays of affection are frowned upon, and there have been several arrests for kissing in public.

Cross-dressing is illegal.

So yeah let's just not compare France to places like this, bans on clothing however wrong pale in comparison to some of the shit above.

 

[Jeels]

Wow how stupid are you? It clearly says "MOSQUE". Its a place of worship. Name me one buddist temple or church that allows to wear a mini skirt or a bikini.

Ya, I used to love when religions courses would ask you to go to a Temple, Synagogue, etc so you could learn about the norm there (the people at the temple would even loan you clothes so you could come inside). It was such a great cultural experience and I felt so lucky I didn't have to even leave my city to get to take a step into different faiths for a while.

 

[Flo_Evans]

I'm wondering what do our own homegrown religious fundamentalists (pentecostals) wear to the beach.

 

[Condom]

Islam colonized the middle east once upon a time too you know.

Or maybe you didn't know that the middle east wasn't always islamic.

Oh I guess that makes things right then, go on with exchanging patriarchy based on modesty for patriarchy based on the sexualization of women.

The west is far from perfect when it comes to women's rights (culturally), some of you need to get off your high horse.

 

[spekkeh]

Again disgusting to see people supporting western puppet regimes and their forced culture. At least I don't have to wonder anymore what kind of reasoning people use to support colonialism.

Wait are you seriously equating salafism with the revolution? That's, oh boy.

 

[freeofgreed]

See here's the thing about reactionary laws like this. If you truly believe women are forced to wear clothing like this by the men in their family realize these laws do nothing but punish the women. The men continue to go unpunished and the woman who was "forced" to wear it gets punished. How can you support something like this?

Also people bringing up secularism are talking out of their ass. A true secular society wouldn't discriminatly target a single religion. This is just reactionary bullshit because of France's recent terrorists attacks and nothing more.

 

[Bloody_Five]

Again disgusting to see people supporting western puppet regimes and their forced culture. At least I don't have to wonder anymore what kind of reasoning people use to support colonialism.

Serious question:
What were Islamic countries great cultural, scientific, technical achievements over the course of the past three centuries?

Most of the technology and science we enjoy in our modern world comes from the fact that Europe, led by French thinkers, broke away from the dogmas imposed by religions.

Is it so shocking to admit that some cultures our countries can be more advanced than others in some respect?

Medieval Europe was a shithole compared to the glory of the Badgad califate in the 9th century but things have changed a lot since then.

 

[Kayhan]

Oh I guess that makes things right then, go on with exchanging patriarchy based on modesty for patriarchy based on the sexualization of women.

The west is far from perfect when it comes to women's rights (culturally), some of you need to get off your high horse.

I agree that the west is far from perfect when it comes to women's rights.

But the west is light years ahead of the muslim countries.

 

[Lord of Ostia]

Sounds like trying to differentiate between a burkini and a wetsuit is going to encourage French police to racially profile. Not a good look, Cannes.

 

[victreeb3l]

Serious question:
why is your sister okay with covering her head?
Does she realize that this means that she is not the equal of man?

Why is it always the women?
Why wouldn't men cover themselves for a change?

How many hijabis have you spoken to? Different women have different reasons for donning a hijab.

And men do cover themselves. Turbans, kaffiyehs, taqiyahs are very common.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

It doesn't matter how much you hate the reason for why these women choose to wear what they wear, it's discriminatory to make it law that they can't, which will only ostracize them from using these public beaches.

It's total shit.

 

[Boney]

God I hope that mayor gets slammed hard for this. What fucking bs is that

Now people that feel they need to wear it won't be able to go to the beach. Great job Cannes. Next stop ceasing they're goods and money.

 

[freeofgreed]

Serious question:
What were Islamic countries great cultural, scientific, technical achievements over the course of the past three centuries?

Most of the technology and science we enjoy in our modern world comes from the fact that Europe, led by French thinkers, broke away from the dogmas imposed by religions.

Is it so shocking to admit that some cultures our countries can be more advanced than others in some respect?

Medieval Europe was a shithole compared to the glory of the Badgad califate in the 9th century but things have changed a lot since then.

Lol going with the Richard Dawkins route huh? The whole cultural superiority mentality. You do realize that is the exact same mentality that led to colonization? Europeans believing their culture/society is inherently better than others and forcing it on them.

 

[Condom]

I agree that the west is far from perfect when it comes to women's rights.

But the west is light years ahead of the muslim countries.

Not a justification for colonizing countries and applauding sexualization of women.

Besides, the west only fucks things up. Longlasting change comes from within and will be tailored to the specific situation.

 

[Quotient]

I would assume that the sale of fullbody wet suits to muslim women is going to skyrocket.

 

[spekkeh]

It doesn't matter how much you hate the reason for why these women choose to wear what they wear, it's discriminatory to make it law that they can't, which will only ostracize them from using these public beaches.

It's total shit.

Yes as a kid I didn't want to wear those ball huggers, so I felt ostracized from French pools too. You get over it though. Maybe if you're so offended by nudity, French beaches aren't really for you anyway.

 

[Bloody_Five]

Lol going with the Richard Dawkins route huh? The whole cultural superiority mentality. You do realize that is the exact same mentality that led to colonization? Europeans believing their culture/society is inherently better than others and forcing it on them.

An appropriate reply to your post:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExWfh6sGyso

 

[Audioboxer]

I would assume that the sale of fullbody wet suits to muslim women is going to skyrocket.

I know you're trying to be funny, but this wouldn't happen at all. Most of them would probably be forbidden from or never dream of wearing anything other than what they are expected to.

All this will do is cause inner hatred, the women being kept away from the beach and potentially a small percentage becoming radicalized or having radical thoughts. If not them maybe their male counterparts who will probably be angry at this ban.

 

[Mael]

And people wonder why I'm not fond of the South East of France.
Shitty far right breeding ground.
Ok with selling your beach to the highest bidder from Qatar or Saudi Arabia but please shit on regular ass muslims for no reasons.
Hypocrites.

 

[spekkeh]

Lol going with the Richard Dawkins route huh? The whole cultural superiority mentality. You do realize that is the exact same mentality that led to colonization? Europeans believing their culture/society is inherently better than others and forcing it on them.

Human rights are absolutely superior, no two ways about it.

 

[Lkr]

This is straight from the Trump policy book but there are people on gaf defending a city banning what women are allowed to wear to the beach.
Have you guys ever met or spoken with actual Muslims? There's a lot of islamaphobia in this thread

 

[Boney]

Human rights are absolutely superior, no two ways about it.

Sure.

But we got there thanks to slavery and genocide

You can't export culture like if it was a fucking MacDonald's

 

[Bloody_Five]

This is straight from the Trump policy book but there are people on gaf defending a city banning what women are allowed to wear to the beach.
Have you guys ever met or spoken with actual Muslims? There's a lot of islamaphobia in this thread

When you strongly disagree about everything Islam stands as a religion or as a philosophy, is it Islamophobia?

 

[Mael]

Oh and if we're talking about the Revolution and Slavery, the French revolution abolished slavery in all its territories.
It was reinstated by Napoleon because he had a shithead 1rst wife.

 

[DontBeThatGuy]

Yes as a kid I didn't want to wear those ball huggers, so I felt ostracized from French pools too. You get over it though. Maybe if you're so offended by nudity, French beaches aren't really for you anyway.

This specifically targets a religion, more specifically the women. You equating it to your "ball-huggers" scenario is disingenuous at best.

 

[Whitephantomzx]

Serious question:
why is your sister okay with covering her head?
Does she realize that this means that she is not the equal of man?

Why is it always the women?
Why wouldn't men cover themselves for a change?

Something that's not said much but men should also cover themselves like we shouldn't wear shorts that sit above are knees and that we we shouldn't sit shirtless. Also men and women are considered equal in Islam don't mix up Arab culture and Islam actually Islam was actually progressive it stayed that women must also learn and study and be knowledgeable it staed that she inherents an equal amount of money if her husband dies and that she should be treated as an equal to hetrhusband and this was all a thousand years ago when such things were unheard of I can go on but I'm at work

 

[Condom]

Human rights are absolutely superior, no two ways about it.

Not if we keep up with the new wave of Eurocentrism that people like you want to force upon people. You think you are a progressive while politically you are as reactionary as you can get. The sane Europeans have to fight both this bullshit as the spread of political salafism.

 

[Jeels]

When you strongly disagree about everything Islam stands as a religion or as a philosophy, is it Islamophobia?

If you start being a shithead to other people over it, yes.

 

[Audioboxer]

When you strongly disagree about everything Islam stands as a religion or as a philosophy, is it Islamophobia?

For some any criticism at all of Islam is Islamophobic. That is stupid.

As someone who detests all religions, and especially abuse of women, unfortunately for France though this is a situation where I'd say Islamophobic isn't wrong to be used. There is no reason for this ban other than to discriminate. I think the Koran and the majority of the Islamic doctrine is despicable but as a liberal country you do not fight illiberal practices by becoming what you frown upon yourself. This ban is wrong and it is discriminatory.

 

[Bloody_Five]

If you start being a shithead to other people over it, yes.

Where do you draw the line?

 

[freeofgreed]

Human rights are absolutely superior, no two ways about it.

Dictating what other people can wear is human rights? New to me.

 

[freeofgreed]

An appropriate reply to your post:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExWfh6sGyso

How about a response to this?

See here's the thing about reactionary laws like this. If you truly believe women are forced to wear clothing like this by the men in their family realize these laws do nothing but punish the women. The men continue to go unpunished and the woman who was "forced" to wear it gets punished. How can you support something like this?

Also people bringing up secularism are talking out of their ass. A true secular society wouldn't discriminatly target a single religion. This is just reactionary bullshit because of France's recent terrorists attacks and nothing more.

 

[spekkeh]

Sure.

But we got there thanks to slavery and genocide

You can't export culture like if it was a fucking MacDonald's

???

No.

This specifically targets a religion, more specifically the women. You equating it to your "ball-huggers" scenario is disingenuous at best.

Only if you think religion deserves some kind of special privilege over secular ideas.

Not if we keep up with the new wave of Eurocentrism that people like you want to force upon people. You think you are a progressive while politically you are as reactionary as you can get. The sane Europeans have to fight both this bullshit as the spread of political salafism.

Yeah no, all the cultural relativistic handwaving makes you not recognize an actual progressive anymore.

I'm not even particularly in favor of a burkini ban, but I do think it is justifiable.

 

[Lkr]

When you strongly disagree about everything Islam stands as a religion or as a philosophy, is it Islamophobia?

This is about people wearing shit to the beach, nothing to seriously do with the religion. I'm not a Muslim and have no reason to become one, but unlike you I understand what secularism and separation of church and state actually means. People are free to believe whatever religion they want

 

[Bloody_Five]

Charlie Hebdo's latest cover.
They received death threats for it.

Translation:
Reforming Islam: Muslims, let it all hang loose!

 

[Audioboxer]

???

No.
Only if you think religion deserves some kind of special privilege over secular ideas.




Yeah no, all the cultural relativistic handwaving makes you not recognize an actual progressive anymore.

I'm not even particularly in favor of a burkini ban, but I do think it is justifiable.

Uhhh I think you need to retrain your brain to decipher what fighting for secular ideas is.

Fighting to be secular here would be saying implementing bans to control what people wear is ridiculous. It's the exact same logic many Islamic countries use to ban shorts/bikinis/tshirts. Ban what we don't like, and be left with what we do...

I don't know how you can't see the irony there? It's not a secular countries place to tell these women what they can and can't wear but to show them the values of the country and that people are truly free here and maybe just maybe some of them will step out from the oppression they may well be under.

You cannot force them out. That will backfire, lead to further divides and as I said before possible radicalization. The one thing France could do with less of right now.

 

[mr jones]

Other people decided for women what to wear.

It's some crazy bullshit how oppresion against women gets defended here becuase of a misunderstood idea of freedom of religion.

Reminds me on the stupid Erdogan "for the democracy!" defenders here.

But... they choose to do that.

Yeah, the Amish are pretty brutal to women, too. /s

Look. Societal acceptance to stuff is fluid, and will change. There's no way any moral christian woman would wear what women wear now, 60 years ago. We still make women cover their chest while men can swim in nothing but a speedo. But that's normal to you, so you won't be outraged by that.

If a woman by choice wants to wear a burqa at the beach, who cares why. Let her wear it.

 

[Boney]

???

No.

Gee I sure loved the human rights in the second industrialization period of England with some cool worker rights and gentrification going on.