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[Zamorro]

People will make all sorts of rationalisations for this event, but the reality is that this is just the natural ebb and flow of a two-party democracy.

When your side elects a leader, everybody is electrified and enthusiastic for four years. If the leader doesn't make any bad mistakes and the economy is improving, the enthusiasm will wane a bit, but you will still elect that leader again, but with decreased margins.

By the time the next four years have passed, the enthusiasm will have all but died down on your side, even if the economy has improved greatly. Complacency will have set in. Now the other side will be electrified by whatever leader they choose at that time. And the process will repeat again. And again.

We have seen this exact same thing with Gore in 2000 and now with Clinton.

Both sides dream about a permanent control of government, yet it never happens. And maybe in the long run, that is a good thing. Because the death of a political era, like that of the Clintons, also brings renewal.

I know that this line of thought isn't much comfort if you are going to suffer the consequences of a Trump presidency. I just think it's better to think about it in this way, if the alternative is blaming your own side and all the infighting that go along with it. That will not help the Democrats in four years time.

 

[Head of Vengarl]

Welp. As a Mexican currently working in the US, I'll show myself out.

At least California showed that they love you. Come here, we even have legal weed!

 

[RPGCrazied]

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/third-party-voters-played-key-role-election-results

So we need to blame Gary Johnson and Bernie or Busters. I think that is fair.

 

[EatinOlives]

There was certainly complacency.

Resources were diverted into states she had no hope of winning, because they believed that the states that were actual battleground states were deemed completely "safe". And resources were also being diverted to down-ticket races because "it was such a sure thing!"

Voters were complacent in not going out to vote, but the Clinton campaign was raising money like mad and holding rallies daily using the party's most influential people. It wasn't a problem of effort, it's that it was directed in the wrong direction.

 

[ZeuzMX]

Fuuuck that. Us minorities gotta unite and fight for our rights every chance we get. God damn if I don't feel down as hell though today, like the freaking life has been completely sucked out of me.

I know brother. Tough times we living in. :S

 

[Digital-Hero]

At least California showed that they love you. Come here, we have legal weed!

Washington and Colorado had it first. pfft.

 

[kswiston]

If you support Donald Trump, you are supporting racism and sexism. It really is that simple.

True. However, all of us are used to ignoring "doing X supports terrible outcome Y" logic statements. If someone doesnt really care about social justice and isnt directly/immediately affected, that just gets thrown on the pile along with "USA levels of energy consumption is killing the planet" and "most of your cleap clothing and electronics supports terrible working conditions overseas".

Shaming people doesnt work. I dont know what strategy would work better.

 

[Akhe]

Trump right now

 

[paperboywriter]

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/third-party-voters-played-key-role-election-results

well, yeah of course. so should we eliminate a third choise now? Hillary and Trump did not convince those people to vote for them so they went third party. I dont see anything wrong with that.

It seems to me its an easy excuse, esp. after so many media outlets explaining to voters it might have an impact.


Also 46% didn't vote at all, start there.

 

[Kathian]

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/third-party-voters-played-key-role-election-results

I can't help when seeing these things think - if only all those Republicans had voted Democrat!

 

[Audioboxer]

Resources were diverted into states she had no hope of winning, because they believed that the states that were actual battleground states were deemed completely "safe".

Voters were complacent in not going out to vote, but the Clinton campaign was raising money like mad and holding rallies daily using the party's most influential people. It wasn't a problem of effort, it's that it was directed in the wrong direction.

Raising money to the sum they did did jack shit to sway the votes. It isn't all about money and peddling celebrities/influential people. Not when one of the things you are largely being attacked on is your wealth/establishment ties.

Treating Trump as a valid opponent and admitting he had a chance would have been a start to putting the media in it's place for constantly shoving the Trump has a 1% chance narrative.

 

[DocSeuss]

I honestly don't know. I mean, I think there's something to the notion of not giving a shit about the alt-right and just saying "fuck 'em." You're not going to win over the basket of deplorables. But what about the basket of not-quite-but-maybe-kinda-deplorables? Maybe there's hope there? Just might need to recalibrate how we think about engaging them.

Or not. I mean who knows? Maybe next go around you win by adequately engaging your base. Maybe demographics continue to shift such that this was the last grand stand of the evangelical/white vote.

How was this the last grand stand of the evangelical/white vote? This is a low turnout election, not a high turnout one. If this was a super racist election, you'd think we'd see an increase in support for Trump over Romney or McCain, but instead we see a decrease. We see even fewer people voting for Clinton than did for Obama. If there was some race-fueled backlash, you'd think we'd see an increase in support for one or both parties over Obama, but instead, more people voted for Obama than either candidate in this election. Both parties got fewer votes than their predecessors.

This election feels like the Rio Olympics, with its record low turnout numbers. People just aren't that invested.

I personally feel like chalking it up to "this is a racist election and my opposition are racists" isn't going to fix things. In fact, I think everyone's gonna learn the wrong lessons from this election and make things worse. I don't want the next election to be worse, and I'm terrified at the prospect that it will be, because people just want to see their opposition as completely and utterly evil.

I can't help when seeing these things think - if only all those Republicans had voted Democrat!

Everyone I personally know who voted third party would have voted Republican otherwise. Mostly deeply religious folks who believe Trump is some kind of anti-christ. The anti-abortion types who felt he was too immoral for them. Not people who would have voted Democrat.

 

[The Kree]

I have no idea what color or sex you are. I'm a white guy, and I tried to listen. I've got coworkers and acquaintances that supported him and I don't hate their guts or think they're racist by default.

Does Trump's victory send that message? Sure. But it could have been avoided by learning from disagreements instead of dismissing them off-hand. "Know Thy Enemy" - for lack of a better phrase. That's my point.

Dems thought this was won because Trump's an asshole, disregarding the insidiousness of demagoguery.

Tired of being asked to extend courtesies to people that never seem to want to reciprocate. Happy for you that you have it in your heart to not hate the idiots in your life.

 

[Quote]

I guess I will put this out there and see what happens but I voted for Donald Trump.

I will tell you exactly why I did it and why I didn't vote for Hillary Clinton and my reasons have nothing to do with racism or any of that bull crap that people seem to keep trying to make Trump voters turns out to be.

I'm a 26 year old white male. And I make around $20,000 a year. I consider myself to be a hard-working 20 something year old guy with a lot of my future but there were a few things in the end of Obama's administration that absolutely destroyed me, mainly Obamacare.

I fall into this small Gap that Obamacare absolutely did nothing for but destroy my wallet while giving me subpar health care that I not only didn't want but offered almost virtually no benefit to me.

Because I made too much to not be considered to be in poverty in my state I was not offered any subsidies on any kind of health care plan. My options are pretty much to buy a healthcare plan with extremely high deductibles that are almost like car insurance for a couple hundred bucks a month. He offered absolutely no real benefit to me medical wise.

But the thing that really set me off was that he basically bullied me into healthcare. It was pretty much either buy health care or be fine so suddenly I'm in the situation when ObamaCare got passed that my monthly budget was cut by a couple hundred dollars for something I only didn't want but I didn't need.

When you only make $20,000 a year and suddenly twelve to fourteen hundred dollars out of it is just proof gone for something you don't want it's extremely frustrating.

But this small Gap that Obamacare doesn't cover of this group people that make too much to be considered not in poverty but too little to actually afford any kind of Obamacare plans. It represents many people my age just trying to get out into the workforce and trying to figure out something that they want to do with their lives.

When you combine that with more and more companies cutting any kind of health care plans for their employees that are not full time, which I am one of, suddenly in the whole Obamacare health care problem became a huge headache for me and I literally had nothing I can do except either pay the fine or buy health insurance I didn't want.

Obamacare was a huge problem for me because it fundamentally changed my life for no real reason. It didn't benefit me in any single way.

That was one major reason why I voted for Trump because Obamacare needs to be repealed it's just that simple, but that's my opinion.

When you combine that with Obama's foreign policy which I just don't agree with, and also his endless fight against gun control which I think was always in pointless battle that didn't actually solve any problems, you have a president I just didn't agree with.

I don't dislike Obama I think he was doing what he thought was right but at the end of the day I just didn't agree with any of his policies and then his health care plan was something that affected me personally in a negative.

Enter Hillary Clinton,

She literally was an Obama 2. And I just don't see any way that could have benefited and not only me but many people that I associate with and even friends and family that were caught in the same exact predicament with Obamacare.

I voted for Donald Trump because I do want change I want to different foreign policy I want alternative to Obamacare and frankly I just want change I don't want another Obama.

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

Donald Trump comments that he made during that Infamous video definitely shook me up a little bit in terms of his character, but when you look at the other side and all you see is Hillary Clinton who has a lifelong history of making extremely selfish choices to line her pocketbook and give her and her husband power over anything else and I really didn't see that as an issue anymore it basically became a wash.

I'll tell you right now if Bernie Sanders would have been on that ballot there is absolutely no way I could have taken Donald Trump has my vote. Bernie Sanders represented somebody who I actually thought was truthful and not only did he not give off that sense of just sleeping is that both Trump and Clinton had, I actually felt like he was fighting for people even if it meant that I didn't agree with what he was fighting for.

Hillary understood the issues with Obamacare and wanted to repair it?

 

[Username1198]

No. It's not that simple. But just keep pretending you're morally superior.

It is that simple. Tell me how you can be ok with him saying and doing the nasty stuff he's done.

 

[Rayis]

come the fuck on

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...age-ukip-brexit-post-referendum-a7407951.html

come the fuck on

It disgusts me to read this, we let hate win.

 

[Suburban Thug]

This kind of incendiary reasoning is only going to further incite and solidify the opposing party, and will not be good going forward. A person can make a rational, self-egoist decision about their own economic decisions and still care about the plight of other people. There is a difference between not caring at all and making a decision to care more about their own problems.

You sound like you're on the defensive because nothing I said was incendiary. I do not believe everyone who voted for Trump is a bigot. In fact I would like to think that most conservatives at their core are decent people. But to vote for a man who sexually assaults women, bullies anyone brown with a funny name, generalizes Mexicans as rapists, doesn't support gay marriage, etc means that you are complicit. It means that things like equality and displaying common decency are low priorities on your moral compass.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

No the question is important because people want to divorce race from this discussion and act like the demonization of Trump supporters is what pushed them to him.

It's not. He found his footing through racism and that is what opened the door for anything else he wanted to talk about. He never failed to bring his talking points back to race.

So I'm saying people insinuating it was liberals that pushed people to Trump are misguided. This guy only got to where he was through that rhetoric. His supporters dont give a shit about what Liberals had to say. If a guy can only get on the map through racism than how is it the left that pushed them to it?

The mistake you're making is thinking that every person who voted Trump did so because they support him. Which obviously isn't true. Just like every vote for Clinton wasn't by people who think she would be a good leader. This was a battle between two of the most unlikable candidates in American Presidential history.

The left pushed them to do it because there were a bunch of aggressive assholes pointing fingers and generally acting like dickheads to people who were undecided/were considering Trump. It's not surprising in an election where both sides of supporters were being assholes that moderates and people on the fence were going to go support the guy that, at the very least, wasn't insulting them.

 

[ZeuzMX]

At least California showed that they love you. Come here, we even have legal weed!

I know right? I mean, fuck Florida they even voted Trump despite the tons of latinos living here. Bay area here I come!

 

[Stasis]

So far Trump has been great for the stock market. Dow just hit an all-time high...

This will definitely last.

And tons of jobs will come back.

And the poor will become middle class, and reap tons of benefits.

All of that will definitely occur.

This is great for the USA's economy. And environment. And security.

Not everyone who voted for him is a 'deplorable' but those sad fucks are in for a massive wake up call in X amount of time when NOTHING they want materializes and their lives are likely worse off than before, other than there's no more 'brown people' where they live.

Personally, I can't wait. They deserve it. For the rest of the US, Canada, Mexico, and every other country inevitably affected by this in some way, it's pretty sad. Hopefully Canada and the EU can work together to offset this bullshit.

Shame climate can't help itself.

 

[EatinOlives]

Raising money to the sum they did did jack shit to sway the votes. It isn't all about money and peddling celebrities/influential people. Not when one of the things you are largely being attacked on is your wealth/establishment ties.

All of these are necessary, but not sufficient, to win the election. They also needed to properly use them, which they couldn't if they were going off of bogus intel. Which they were.

EDIT: At any rate, what I'm arguing is that the polling is what caused the electoral upset, not the lack of racist/sexist coddling.

 

[BFIB]

I guess I will put this out there and see what happens but I voted for Donald Trump.

I will tell you exactly why I did it and why I didn't vote for Hillary Clinton and my reasons have nothing to do with racism or any of that bull crap that people seem to keep trying to make Trump voters turns out to be.

I'm a 26 year old white male. And I make around $20,000 a year. I consider myself to be a hard-working 20 something year old guy with a lot of my future but there were a few things in the end of Obama's administration that absolutely destroyed me, mainly Obamacare.

I fall into this small Gap that Obamacare absolutely did nothing for but destroy my wallet while giving me subpar health care that I not only didn't want but offered almost virtually no benefit to me.

Because I made too much to not be considered to be in poverty in my state I was not offered any subsidies on any kind of health care plan. My options are pretty much to buy a healthcare plan with extremely high deductibles that are almost like car insurance for a couple hundred bucks a month. He offered absolutely no real benefit to me medical wise.

But the thing that really set me off was that he basically bullied me into healthcare. It was pretty much either buy health care or be fine so suddenly I'm in the situation when ObamaCare got passed that my monthly budget was cut by a couple hundred dollars for something I only didn't want but I didn't need.

When you only make $20,000 a year and suddenly twelve to fourteen hundred dollars out of it is just proof gone for something you don't want it's extremely frustrating.

But this small Gap that Obamacare doesn't cover of this group people that make too much to be considered not in poverty but too little to actually afford any kind of Obamacare plans. It represents many people my age just trying to get out into the workforce and trying to figure out something that they want to do with their lives.

When you combine that with more and more companies cutting any kind of health care plans for their employees that are not full time, which I am one of, suddenly in the whole Obamacare health care problem became a huge headache for me and I literally had nothing I can do except either pay the fine or buy health insurance I didn't want.

Obamacare was a huge problem for me because it fundamentally changed my life for no real reason. It didn't benefit me in any single way.

That was one major reason why I voted for Trump because Obamacare needs to be repealed it's just that simple, but that's my opinion.

When you combine that with Obama's foreign policy which I just don't agree with, and also his endless fight against gun control which I think was always in pointless battle that didn't actually solve any problems, you have a president I just didn't agree with.

I don't dislike Obama I think he was doing what he thought was right but at the end of the day I just didn't agree with any of his policies and then his health care plan was something that affected me personally in a negative.

Enter Hillary Clinton,

She literally was an Obama 2. And I just don't see any way that could have benefited and not only me but many people that I associate with and even friends and family that were caught in the same exact predicament with Obamacare.

I voted for Donald Trump because I do want change I want to different foreign policy I want alternative to Obamacare and frankly I just want change I don't want another Obama.

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

Donald Trump comments that he made during that Infamous video definitely shook me up a little bit in terms of his character, but when you look at the other side and all you see is Hillary Clinton who has a lifelong history of making extremely selfish choices to line her pocketbook and give her and her husband power over anything else and I really didn't see that as an issue anymore it basically became a wash.

I'll tell you right now if Bernie Sanders would have been on that ballot there is absolutely no way I could have taken Donald Trump has my vote. Bernie Sanders represented somebody who I actually thought was truthful and not only did he not give off that sense of just sleeping is that both Trump and Clinton had, I actually felt like he was fighting for people even if it meant that I didn't agree with what he was fighting for.

Well, long story short your going from some form of healthcare, to none. So there's that I guess.

 

[Chmpocalypse]

No. It's not that simple. But just keep pretending you're morally superior.

We don't support racists. By default, we are morally superior. Live with it.

 

[yanipheonu]

well, yeah of course. so should we eliminate a third choise now? Hillary and Trump did not convince those people to vote for them so they went third party. I dont see anything wrong with that.

It's not how the election works and they ultimately get nothing for voting third party.
There is no consolation prize for third place.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

There's no silver bullet. Plus shaming Trump supporters only made them hide more.

Yep.

Between polling methods most likely not targeting a broad enough demographic, most Trump supporters as well as anti-Hillary voters were smart enough to stay hidden or lie to the polls.

 

[Nikana]

Hillary understood the issues with Obamacare and wanted to repair it?

She never once said how she would actually repair it. She kept saying she would fix it, but it's kind of like how obama promised it would be affordable, and people wouldn't lose their doctors and choice of doctor. Straight lie.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Well, long story short your going from some form of healthcare, to none. So there's that I guess.

The scary part is 20 million people are about to lose health care, just like that.

 

[Steel]

I guess I will put this out there and see what happens but I voted for Donald Trump.

I will tell you exactly why I did it and why I didn't vote for Hillary Clinton and my reasons have nothing to do with racism or any of that bull crap that people seem to keep trying to make Trump voters turns out to be.

I'm a 26 year old white male. And I make around $20,000 a year. I consider myself to be a hard-working 20 something year old guy with a lot of my future but there were a few things in the end of Obama's administration that absolutely destroyed me, mainly Obamacare.

I fall into this small Gap that Obamacare absolutely did nothing for but destroy my wallet while giving me subpar health care that I not only didn't want but offered almost virtually no benefit to me.

Because I made too much to not be considered to be in poverty in my state I was not offered any subsidies on any kind of health care plan. My options are pretty much to buy a healthcare plan with extremely high deductibles that are almost like car insurance for a couple hundred bucks a month. He offered absolutely no real benefit to me medical wise.

But the thing that really set me off was that he basically bullied me into healthcare. It was pretty much either buy health care or be fine so suddenly I'm in the situation when ObamaCare got passed that my monthly budget was cut by a couple hundred dollars for something I only didn't want but I didn't need.

When you only make $20,000 a year and suddenly twelve to fourteen hundred dollars out of it is just proof gone for something you don't want it's extremely frustrating.

But this small Gap that Obamacare doesn't cover of this group people that make too much to be considered not in poverty but too little to actually afford any kind of Obamacare plans. It represents many people my age just trying to get out into the workforce and trying to figure out something that they want to do with their lives.

When you combine that with more and more companies cutting any kind of health care plans for their employees that are not full time, which I am one of, suddenly in the whole Obamacare health care problem became a huge headache for me and I literally had nothing I can do except either pay the fine or buy health insurance I didn't want.

Obamacare was a huge problem for me because it fundamentally changed my life for no real reason. It didn't benefit me in any single way.

That was one major reason why I voted for Trump because Obamacare needs to be repealed it's just that simple, but that's my opinion.

When you combine that with Obama's foreign policy which I just don't agree with, and also his endless fight against gun control which I think was always in pointless battle that didn't actually solve any problems, you have a president I just didn't agree with.

I don't dislike Obama I think he was doing what he thought was right but at the end of the day I just didn't agree with any of his policies and then his health care plan was something that affected me personally in a negative.

Enter Hillary Clinton,

She literally was an Obama 2. And I just don't see any way that could have benefited and not only me but many people that I associate with and even friends and family that were caught in the same exact predicament with Obamacare.

I voted for Donald Trump because I do want change I want to different foreign policy I want alternative to Obamacare and frankly I just want change I don't want another Obama.

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

Donald Trump comments that he made during that Infamous video definitely shook me up a little bit in terms of his character, but when you look at the other side and all you see is Hillary Clinton who has a lifelong history of making extremely selfish choices to line her pocketbook and give her and her husband power over anything else and I really didn't see that as an issue anymore it basically became a wash.

I'll tell you right now if Bernie Sanders would have been on that ballot there is absolutely no way I could have taken Donald Trump has my vote. Bernie Sanders represented somebody who I actually thought was truthful and not only did he not give off that sense of just sleeping is that both Trump and Clinton had, I actually felt like he was fighting for people even if it meant that I didn't agree with what he was fighting for.

Obama wanted to fix Obamacare from year 2, but the republicans blocked him at every single solitary turn because they wanted to completely get rid of it. Hell, Republicans and blue dogs are the reason it didn't have a public option in the first place. You just elected the posterboy for the tea party movement that fueled the problems you're having.

She never once said how she would actually repair it. She kept saying she would fix it, but it's kind of like how obama promised it would be affordable, and people wouldn't lose their doctors and choice of doctor. Straight lie.

She said how she'd fix it though. Public option, subsidies, etc. Like it's on her website and she has said as much multiple times.

 

[Audioboxer]

All of these are necessary, but not sufficient, to win the election. They also needed to properly use them, which they couldn't if they were going off of bogus intel. Which they were.

That would mean you believe the whole campaign actually thought Trump had no chance, and weren't just happy to let the media go bananas as if that in itself would somehow influence votes.

I'm not sure if the campaign going on "bogus intel" does much at all to salvage it being a good campaign. At these sorts of levels of government you'd expect good intel and smart analysts.

 

[tearsintherain]

At least California showed that they love you. Come here, we even have legal weed!

Nevada also legalized weed, will be for sale starting Jan 1st - there are literally dozens of stores in Vegas, a few owned by Snoop Dogg himself (he lives in Vegas). Nevada also went Hillary, and elected 3/3 democrats to senate and house.

One big advantage over California is no state income tax, plus a 2000 square foot home will cost you 250-350k.

 

[Puck Beaverton]

“. . . yet there is no avoiding time, the sea of time, the sea of memory and forgetfulness, the years of promise, gone and unrecoverable, of the land almost allowed to claim its better destiny, only to the claim jumped by evildoers known all too well, and taken instead and held hostage to the future we must live in now forever.”

 

[spock]

The big lesson that was pretty obvious if you took your glasses off and stopped drinking the kool aid (of either party) was clear. There was and is a large group of people who more than anything want change hell or high water.(the Bernie or Trump group I brought up way early in campaigns that I got so much flack for)

Plenty of these folks voted Obama when he ran on change and hope, the problem is they felt he didnt deliver. Hillary was the epitome of the status quo, the status quo being lying shadey politicians who get nothing done, that is the main reason she lost this. Yes people had issues (mostly single issues) they rallied around but what really sold Trump was the character he continually tried to reinforce that was communicated beyond his words. He sold them the "I will get shit done, fuck the politicians" energy and emotion.

 

[Krappadizzle]

It is that simple. Tell me how you can be ok with him saying and doing the nasty stuff he's done.

I'm not. Just because I voted for him doesn't mean I believe or support everything about him. But there are things that he talks about that I do think should be addressed, mainly Obamacare and illegal immigration.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

How was this the last grand stand of the evangelical/white vote? This is a low turnout election, not a high turnout one.

I said "or maybe this was the last grand stand" to highlight that it was a hypothetical. With shifting demographics maybe Democrats can overcome an acceptable amount of apathy just to raw numbers? Again, that's purely hypothetical. I don't know.

I'm just saying Trump won with a strategy many even on the right didn't think was winnable. Was it a fluke? These are questions the Democratic party has to be asking.

 

[Balphon]

I don't know where he's getting those millions of votes from. There aren't enough precincts left.

I'm guessing they're largely absentee ballots? The times map shows a big chunk of uncounted votes that's basically all in four places: Denver, Los Angeles, San Francisco, & Seattle.

http://www.nytimes.com/elections/forecast/president/map

CO and WA are vote-by-mail so it may be that the estimates are way off.

 

[benny_a]

No. It's not that simple. But just keep pretending you're morally superior.

I just wanted to remind you that there are approximately 12 posts that quoted your previous post directly and it would be nice of you to respond to those.

 

[BFIB]

She never once said how she would actually repair it. She kept saying she would fix it, but it's kind of like how obama promised it would be affordable, and people wouldn't lose their doctors and choice of doctor. Straight lie.

You do realize that those premiums were only there because the GOP forced some say into the matter in order for this to pass in the first place? And that Hillary did outline a plan, very thorough in fact to force the top earners to actually pay their share and eat that burden.

I'd recommend getting all your physicals done by Jan. while you can.

 

[Nikana]

Obama wanted to fix Obamacare from year 2, but the republicans blocked him at every single solitary turn because they wanted to completely get rid of it. Hell, Republicans and blue dogs are the reason it didn't have a public option in the first place. You just elected the posterboy for the tea party movement that fueled the problems you're having.

They blocked him because they said exactly what would happen is it would cost too much. Obama swore it wouldn't, got it passed with an executive order and it was a complete shit show.

 

[iRAWRasaurus]

Good morning New America

(This is in Philly)

I guess I will put this out there and see what happens but I voted for Donald Trump.

I will tell you exactly why I did it and why I didn't vote for Hillary Clinton and my reasons have nothing to do with racism or any of that bull crap that people seem to keep trying to make Trump voters turns out to be.

I'm a 26 year old white male. And I make around $20,000 a year. I consider myself to be a hard-working 20 something year old guy with a lot of my future but there were a few things in the end of Obama's administration that absolutely destroyed me, mainly Obamacare.

I fall into this small Gap that Obamacare absolutely did nothing for but destroy my wallet while giving me subpar health care that I not only didn't want but offered almost virtually no benefit to me.

Because I made too much to not be considered to be in poverty in my state I was not offered any subsidies on any kind of health care plan. My options are pretty much to buy a healthcare plan with extremely high deductibles that are almost like car insurance for a couple hundred bucks a month. He offered absolutely no real benefit to me medical wise.

But the thing that really set me off was that he basically bullied me into healthcare. It was pretty much either buy health care or be fine so suddenly I'm in the situation when ObamaCare got passed that my monthly budget was cut by a couple hundred dollars for something I only didn't want but I didn't need.

When you only make $20,000 a year and suddenly twelve to fourteen hundred dollars out of it is just proof gone for something you don't want it's extremely frustrating.

But this small Gap that Obamacare doesn't cover of this group people that make too much to be considered not in poverty but too little to actually afford any kind of Obamacare plans. It represents many people my age just trying to get out into the workforce and trying to figure out something that they want to do with their lives.

When you combine that with more and more companies cutting any kind of health care plans for their employees that are not full time, which I am one of, suddenly in the whole Obamacare health care problem became a huge headache for me and I literally had nothing I can do except either pay the fine or buy health insurance I didn't want.

Obamacare was a huge problem for me because it fundamentally changed my life for no real reason. It didn't benefit me in any single way.

That was one major reason why I voted for Trump because Obamacare needs to be repealed it's just that simple, but that's my opinion.

When you combine that with Obama's foreign policy which I just don't agree with, and also his endless fight against gun control which I think was always in pointless battle that didn't actually solve any problems, you have a president I just didn't agree with.

I don't dislike Obama I think he was doing what he thought was right but at the end of the day I just didn't agree with any of his policies and then his health care plan was something that affected me personally in a negative.

Enter Hillary Clinton,

She literally was an Obama 2. And I just don't see any way that could have benefited and not only me but many people that I associate with and even friends and family that were caught in the same exact predicament with Obamacare.

I voted for Donald Trump because I do want change I want to different foreign policy I want alternative to Obamacare and frankly I just want change I don't want another Obama.

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

Donald Trump comments that he made during that Infamous video definitely shook me up a little bit in terms of his character, but when you look at the other side and all you see is Hillary Clinton who has a lifelong history of making extremely selfish choices to line her pocketbook and give her and her husband power over anything else and I really didn't see that as an issue anymore it basically became a wash.

I'll tell you right now if Bernie Sanders would have been on that ballot there is absolutely no way I could have taken Donald Trump has my vote. Bernie Sanders represented somebody who I actually thought was truthful and not only did he not give off that sense of just sleeping is that both Trump and Clinton had, I actually felt like he was fighting for people even if it meant that I didn't agree with what he was fighting for.

Congrats you have empowered them. They believe their ideas are the majority since Trump has won.

 

[kingocfs]

.

Hey, thanks for sharing. I believe you when you say you aren't a bad person, and there's nothing wrong with feeling cheated out of a generally ugly policy. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

People will make all sorts of rationalisations for this event, but the reality is that this is just the natural ebb and flow of a two-party democracy.

When your side elects a leader, everybody is electrified and enthusiastic for four years. If the leader doesn't make any bad mistakes and the economy is improving, the enthusiasm will wane a bit, but you will still elect that leader again, but with decreased margins.

By the time the next four years have passed, the enthusiasm will have all but died down on your side, even if the economy has improved greatly. Complacency will have set in. Now the other side will be electrified by whatever leader they choose at that time. And the process will repeat again. And again.

We have seen this exact same thing with Gore in 2000 and now with Clinton.

Both sides dream about a permanent control of government, yet it never happens. And maybe in the long run, that is a good thing. Because the death of a political era, like that of the Clintons, also brings renewal.

I know that this line of thought isn't much comfort if you are going to suffer the consequences of a Trump presidency. I just think it's better to think about it in this way, if the alternative is blaming your own side and all the infighting that go along with it. That will not help the Democrats in four years time.

“I think the American people, you know, they're going to want—you know, that new car smell." - Obama, 2014

 

[Magwik]

I guess I will put this out there and see what happens but I voted for Donald Trump.

I will tell you exactly why I did it and why I didn't vote for Hillary Clinton and my reasons have nothing to do with racism or any of that bull crap that people seem to keep trying to make Trump voters turns out to be.

I'm a 26 year old white male. And I make around $20,000 a year. I consider myself to be a hard-working 20 something year old guy with a lot of my future but there were a few things in the end of Obama's administration that absolutely destroyed me, mainly Obamacare.

I fall into this small Gap that Obamacare absolutely did nothing for but destroy my wallet while giving me subpar health care that I not only didn't want but offered almost virtually no benefit to me.

Because I made too much to not be considered to be in poverty in my state I was not offered any subsidies on any kind of health care plan. My options are pretty much to buy a healthcare plan with extremely high deductibles that are almost like car insurance for a couple hundred bucks a month. He offered absolutely no real benefit to me medical wise.

But the thing that really set me off was that he basically bullied me into healthcare. It was pretty much either buy health care or be fine so suddenly I'm in the situation when ObamaCare got passed that my monthly budget was cut by a couple hundred dollars for something I only didn't want but I didn't need.

When you only make $20,000 a year and suddenly twelve to fourteen hundred dollars out of it is just proof gone for something you don't want it's extremely frustrating.

But this small Gap that Obamacare doesn't cover of this group people that make too much to be considered not in poverty but too little to actually afford any kind of Obamacare plans. It represents many people my age just trying to get out into the workforce and trying to figure out something that they want to do with their lives.

When you combine that with more and more companies cutting any kind of health care plans for their employees that are not full time, which I am one of, suddenly in the whole Obamacare health care problem became a huge headache for me and I literally had nothing I can do except either pay the fine or buy health insurance I didn't want.

Obamacare was a huge problem for me because it fundamentally changed my life for no real reason. It didn't benefit me in any single way.

That was one major reason why I voted for Trump because Obamacare needs to be repealed it's just that simple, but that's my opinion.

When you combine that with Obama's foreign policy which I just don't agree with, and also his endless fight against gun control which I think was always in pointless battle that didn't actually solve any problems, you have a president I just didn't agree with.

I don't dislike Obama I think he was doing what he thought was right but at the end of the day I just didn't agree with any of his policies and then his health care plan was something that affected me personally in a negative.

Enter Hillary Clinton,

She literally was an Obama 2. And I just don't see any way that could have benefited and not only me but many people that I associate with and even friends and family that were caught in the same exact predicament with Obamacare.

I voted for Donald Trump because I do want change I want to different foreign policy I want alternative to Obamacare and frankly I just want change I don't want another Obama.

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

Donald Trump comments that he made during that Infamous video definitely shook me up a little bit in terms of his character, but when you look at the other side and all you see is Hillary Clinton who has a lifelong history of making extremely selfish choices to line her pocketbook and give her and her husband power over anything else and I really didn't see that as an issue anymore it basically became a wash.

I'll tell you right now if Bernie Sanders would have been on that ballot there is absolutely no way I could have taken Donald Trump has my vote. Bernie Sanders represented somebody who I actually thought was truthful and not only did he not give off that sense of just sleeping is that both Trump and Clinton had, I actually felt like he was fighting for people even if it meant that I didn't agree with what he was fighting for.

How can you possibly rationalize not voting or Clinton because of self interests yet you want to vote for a man who hadn't paid federal taxes in probably decades and wants to give tax cuts to the same group of people who keep us in the middle class making basically nothing?

 

[axisofweevils]

53% of white woman voted trump. what is this

Buzzfeed (Yeah, I know!) has a good article about that https://www.buzzfeed.com/annehelenpetersen/meet-the-ivanka-voter?utm_term=.jj7LmPoDn

That’s because the Ivanka Voter has internalized the fact that voting for Trump is not something you do in public: either because she thinks talking about politics is tacky (still a prominent belief, even today), or because she simply doesn’t want to deal with others lecturing her about her vote. As Jennifer, a fiftysomething woman from Rochester, Michigan, told me, “It’s almost as if it’s a moral judgment.”

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

No. It's not that simple. But just keep pretending you're morally superior.

In complete sincerity, why is that not the case?
I honestly want to know.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

Melania is going to be the most awkward first lady.

Nah. She's got plenty of speeches from Michelle Obama she can copy wholesale.

Fuck. I can't even chuckle about that right now.

 

[Quote]

She never once said how she would actually repair it. She kept saying she would fix it, but it's kind of like how obama promised it would be affordable, and people wouldn't lose their doctors and choice of doctor. Straight lie.

The candidate you voted for didn't say what he would do, except destroy it completely and leave many without healthcare. That's not a fucking plan either. But that's on you now.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

The left pushed them to do it because there were a bunch of aggressive assholes pointing fingers and generally acting like dickheads to people who were undecided/were considering Trump.

This is based on what?

 

[mrhyderager]

It's not how the election works and they ultimately get nothing for voting third party.
There is no consolation prize for third place.

No pity party for second place either. I've said for a long time that no matter who lost this election they'd only have themselves to blame. Sucks that it's Hillary but it looks like her supporters are, by and large, not trying to learn from the loss.

 

[Nikana]

You do realize that those premiums were only there because the GOP forced some say into the matter in order for this to pass in the first place? And that Hillary did outline a plan, very thorough in fact to force the top earners to actually pay their share and eat that burden.

I'd recommend getting all your physicals done by Jan. while you can.

It's cheaper to get my physicals without my Insurance, go figure.

 

[Steel]

They blocked him because they said exactly what would happen is it would cost too much. Obama swore it wouldn't, got it passed with an executive order and it was a complete shit show.

The public option was going to be the price control that the other insurances would compete with. It was the price control measure.

And he didn't get it passed with an executive order, he got it through congress with several provisions missing. Like, where are you getting your info?

 

[Goodstyle]

I have nothing against people of other races and in fact my best friend is Latino. And I have dated black women.

I don't doubt that you have nothing against them, but I absolutely believe you do not care about what happens to them and have zero empathy for people who aren't white. I'm a black man, and I'm disgusted at the fact that the person who will be the leader of the free world is a fiend who refused to rent his buildings to black people due to the colour of their skin and took out ads demanding for the death of innocent black teenagers over a crime they did not commit. When faced with DNA evidence that they didn't do it, your candidate doubled down.

If you are making 20,000 dollars a year, Trump will not make your life better. Taxes will raise for you and only be cut for the wealthy. The party you helped give total power in America will actively work to ensure your life is harder for the sake of the misers who line their pockets.

I don't care how many black women you've dated, you were part of a disgusting movement that hurt a lot of people and will be hugely damaging for this country, you included. This is where your lack of empathy has led you, I hope you reflect on it as you move forward with your life.