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[King Gilga]

Wow what a scummy piece of a shit company, now I know who to never ever fly with.

The few people defending this shit in this thread are scumbags, this is indefensible.

 

[Menchi]

Wow what a scummy piece of a shit company, now I know who to never ever fly with.

The few people defending this shit in this thread are scumbags, this is indefensible.

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I literally said that I don't agree with he airline. I just find it to be a bit shitpost'y when people use "defense force lol" instead of actually engaging the poster in substantive debate on the matter.

Overbooking flights is BS and airlines should not be allowed to force you out of a seat that you purchased.

You're assuming that person is arguing in good faith or their opinion is worth engaging.

There's an opinion on the first post where the poster starts out by claiming the victim was acting like a baby. What's to engage if that's the starting point of their post?

They've already made their mind up that the victim bares some of the responsibility for what happened.

 

[ivajz]

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

Well they were doing this so that an employee could use the seat. To me, why not tell the employee to go on a different flight? It just seems like this is event is going to blow up in their faces.

This is no way to handle customers.

 

[pompidu]

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

In this particular instance? Yes, you are a scumbag.

Put your own employees​ on another plane and not act like fucking assholes.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Sometimes overbooking is due to weight restrictions. There are literally empty seats on the plane but because of the number of bags and the fuel load the plane can't be filled to capacity.

Then it isn't the plane capacity by definition.

 

[ColdPizza]

Well they were doing this so that an employee could use the seat. To me, why not tell the employee to go on a different flight? It just seems like this is event is going to blow up in their faces.

This is no way to handle customers.

There are a lot of variables at play here, including things like was this the last flight of the evening for this particular route? Will other flights prevent this staffer from receiving their minimum 8-10 hours rest before their next flight? Etc.

 

[Aselith]

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

You're defending a scumbag move by the company so yeah, roll around mud and you're gonna get dirty.

 

[autumnleaf]

Should have just threatened to cancel the flight, get everyone off the plane, someone would probably have had enough and gave up their seat at that point.

 

[jabuseika]

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

A greedy corporation wanted to have their cake and eat it.

While using law enforcement to beat up and drag out an innocent passenger.

I mean, that's that side...

 

[shintoki]

People here defending the airline.... shaking my head.

Yes, those employees needed to be in St Louis or else they would lose money for a delayed. Now, UA gonna be losing 6 to 7 figures in court, and more in bad PR. Clearly, they didn't think it through. Some of you all would make terrible heads of companies. Giving better incentives is the way to go. More money, board, etc. Someone will budge eventually. What is better? Giving some dude 2k in cash, a free flight, and board for the night? Or now having hundreds of thousands lost in court while this shit is going to be plastered on the news for the next week. Ya done fucked up.

 

[jstevenson]

Well they were doing this so that an employee could use the seat. To me, why not tell the employee to go on a different flight? It just seems like this is event is going to blow up in their faces.

This is no way to handle customers.

Well certainly it's a PR nightmare at this point.

But the guy refused an order by the airline and security to get off the plane. There's really nothing else to be done but remove him.

Now if procedure was followed, and the computer chose him, there was nothing he could do. He wasn't flying.

People can talk about overbooking and the merits of that. Most of the time it never comes to this because the penalties for the airline are so severe (and many people are willing to volunteer for far less).

And in terms of Crew, if United needs crew so another flight will actually make it, they will bump folks. They don't want to, they will fill every jump seat that attendants and pilots aren't using, some routes just aren't heavily serviced and there's only enough seats.

Bad look for United, for sure, but it's a bunch of pretty established policies that lead to this point

 

[teiresias]

Just another reason to add to the long list of reasons I avoid flying United whenever possible.

 

[Bluenoser]

Chicago to Louisville- 5 hour drive. Rent your staff a damn car, and have them drive there. So many other options than assaulting a passenger.

 

[ColdPizza]

Just another reason to add to the long list of reasons I avoid flying United whenever possible.

You're either in, or out. =P

 

[Alienous]

I hope he sues their socks off.

 

[Neverforget]

I cannot believe people defending this, I just don't get it. Empathy anyone? Human decency?

Imagine you have a medical emergency yourself and need to take that plane? Surgery? Someone you love dying? An important meeting that may ruin your career? Even if you don't have any emergency, you bought your ticket, you are inside the plane and they violently force you out and you should be ok with it?

It's the airline fault for overbooking, they handle their own mistakes, it's not the paying customers who need to be punished for it.

 

[VariantX]

The airline should have raised the offer until there was a taker instead of dragging people off the flight. They're going to lose far more money on this than they ever would have when word gets out and damages their rep and opening them up to potential lawsuits. Dumbasses.

 

[boiled goose]

Sunday night flight, probably an inexperienced manager. Couldn't make the call or didn't want to authorize a $2000 cash rebate.

I know for a weekday morning business flight they do not fuck around.

No problem authorizing use of force that will get them a shitton of bad press.

 

[NeOak]

So I'm a scumbag for maintaining a business has a right to remove people refuse to leave? Whilst pointing out is a shitty move none the less?

Ok.gif

You do not want to die on that hill.

 

[BronsonLee]

Chicago to Louisville- 5 hour drive. Rent your staff a damn car, and have them drive there. So many other options than assaulting a passenger.

I would not want a crew who had just driven 5 hours to fly my damn plane

 

[JohnsonUT]

The good news for the airlines is that with just one or two more round of mergers and consolidation, bad PR won't matter! US customers won't have a choice with whom to fly and they can assault passengers as much as they want.

 

[ColdPizza]

I cannot believe people defending this, I just don't get it. Empathy anyone? Human decency?

Imagine you have a medical emergency yourself and need to take that plane? Surgery? Someone you love dying? An important meeting that may ruin your career? Even if you don't have any emergency, you bought your ticket, you are inside the plane and they violently force you out and you should be ok with it?

It's the airline fault for overbooking, they handle their own mistakes, it's not the paying customers who need to be punished for it.

Airlines overbook flights because it's based off an equation that maximizes their profit.

This is why Y2Kev's suggested solution makes the most sense to me. Up the ante.

They should consider this the cost of doing business.

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

I've seen people borderline fight each other for the $500 incentive offer before. At $800 I'm shocked there were no volunteers

 

[shintoki]

Chicago to Louisville- 5 hour drive. Rent your staff a damn car, and have them drive there. So many other options than assaulting a passenger.

Not even, it's 4 hours. Literally, you're probably looking at one more hour of travel if you add in how long it took to get people through the gate, get bags checked, off, etc.

Guess what now after this incident? They took longer than it was to drive!

I would not want a crew who had just driven 5 hours to fly my damn plane

Get them a Limo. Give Joe 300 dollars to drive them there and back! Less comp then a single passenger

 

[ClosingADoor]

Well they were doing this so that an employee could use the seat. To me, why not tell the employee to go on a different flight? It just seems like this is event is going to blow up in their faces.

This is no way to handle customers.

If those crew members needed to get to another flight so that one could take off, having them delayed might have delayed or cancelled that flight impacting potentially hundreds of people.

They didn't just put people on the flight because they were employees, but because they where the standby crew for another flight.

 

[Menchi]

In this particular instance? Yes, you are a scumbag.

Put your own employees​ on another plane and not act like fucking assholes.

Explain exactly why that makes me a scumbag? They have a right to remove anyone, for any reason. It is their business. A shitty, horrible move, but their right as a private entity. How on earth does correctly asserting that they have that -legal- right make anyone a scumbag?

Are you concerned about the other 3 passengers who were asked to leave? I've not seen anyone point out how they were also ill treated for having to get off the plane, but because this passenger refused to, he had to be removed. I imagine the fact he is a doctor plays into this, as I imagine a hillbilly refusing to leave because "damn, I'm American!" wouldn't engender the same "Scumbag!" responses.

I mean, the fact many of the "defenders" have criticised United for the shitty move doesn't seem to register. I personally haven't been saying "Yeah! Do it, kick them off, you guys are amazing!"

It's disgusting that you're able to make sweeping generalisations about a person for pointing out that a company did a shitty thing, that by all legal means, they had the right to. Should they have done it? Probably not, but that isn't the point.

 

[Zips]

Very poorly handled. Upping the reward until someone bit would have been the way to go, and avoided all this.

 

[slider]

Of the big carriers in the US Delta is the only one I've thought decent. United and American are both shit.

 

[Jawmuncher]

What the hell. The smug ass response makes this even worse. Not even an actually apolog of any kind.

 

[BronsonLee]

Get them a Limo. Give Joe 300 dollars to drive them there and back! Less comp then a single passenger

Not a bad idea but they're not gonna deviate from their established shit

Of the big carriers in the US Delta is the only one I've thought decent. United and American are both shit.

Delta has made me sleep on the floor of an airport three times

They can kiss my ass

 

[ironcreed]

I hope he sues the shit out of them and I am sure he will.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

In no way saying I agree with the airline but the people trying to bully those who disagree with "defense force" bullshit is kind of tacky.

Sucking the dick of every authority, rather than daring to question the validity of their actions is pretty fucking tacky too.

 

[Duxxy3]

I hope he sues the shit out of them and I am sure he will.

I'm sure United will offer him a settlement this week.

 

[NeOak]

Of the big carriers in the US Delta is the only one I've thought decent. United and American are both shit.

Both have been good in my travels, so it is a YMMV thing.

I've had the rare bad luck of being delayed 2 days in a row because the plane had a mechanical failure the first day (moved to next day without a problem at the gate) and then the flight got canceled due to weather the second day (automatically rebooked to an earlier flight for the 3rd day without issue).

I've missed flights with AA due to arriving late at the airport and they have rescheduled me no problem.

 

[Mendrox]

Man there really is a defense force for everything wrong with America it seems.

It's a doctor.

Who was flying to patients.

Fucked up. Period.

Explain exactly why that makes me a scumbag? They have a right to remove anyone, for any reason. It is their business. A shitty, horrible move, but their right as a private entity. How on earth does correctly asserting that they have that -legal- right make anyone a scumbag?

Are you concerned about the other 3 passengers who were asked to leave? I've not seen anyone point out how they were also ill treated for having to get off the plane, but because this passenger refused to, he had to be removed. I imagine the fact he is a doctor plays into this, as I imagine a hillbilly refusing to leave because "damn, I'm American!" wouldn't engender the same "Scumbag!" responses.

I mean, the fact many of the "defenders" have criticised United for the shitty move doesn't seem to register. I personally haven't been saying "Yeah! Do it, kick them off, you guys are amazing!"

It's disgusting that you're able to make sweeping generalisations about a person for pointing out that a company did a shitty thing, that by all legal means, they had the right to. Should they have done it? Probably not, but that isn't the point.

just stop. How can somebody so dense? You are so logical and cool. You are the hero this thread deserved.

Of course everybody knows that this is their right, but they shouldn't have done that. There were other and better options to handle this. I hope you won't be in this situation yourself someday.

 

[jabuseika]

Explain exactly why that makes me a scumbag? They have a right to remove anyone, for any reason. It is their business. A shitty, horrible move, but their right as a private entity. How on earth does correctly asserting that they have that -legal- right make anyone a scumbag?

Are you concerned about the other 3 passengers who were asked to leave? I've not seen anyone point out how they were also ill treated for having to get off the plane, but because this passenger refused to, he had to be removed. I imagine the fact he is a doctor plays into this, as I imagine a hillbilly refusing to leave because "damn, I'm American!" wouldn't engender the same "Scumbag!" responses.

I mean, the fact many of the "defenders" have criticised United for the shitty move doesn't seem to register. I personally haven't been saying "Yeah! Do it, kick them off, you guys are amazing!"

It's disgusting that you're able to make sweeping generalisations about a person for pointing out that a company did a shitty thing, that by all legal means, they had the right to. Should they have done it? Probably not, but that isn't the point.

Legal? That's for a court to decide. The passenger wasn't doing anything wrong.

Right? Yeah they have the right to remove passenger​s, it's their plane.

Do they look insane while doing it. Yup.

 

[Neverforget]

Airlines overbook flights because it's based off an equation that maximizes their profit.

This is why Y2Kev's suggested solution makes the most sense to me. Up the ante.

They should consider this the cost of doing business.

What is your point? Are you explaining to me about overbooking or how it cannot be helped and such? To be honest I don't care about the airline profits. It's not for the customer to find them a solution or care for their profits. I care about what I pay for and therefore I'm entitled to.

This guy paid for his seat, isn't a danger and certainly isn't responsible for the company overbooking or such. Why should he or I care for any of it?

The airline has many options to get their employees to their destination and whatever it is, it's not my problem or responsibility.

 

[Bluenoser]

I would not want a crew who had just driven 5 hours to fly my damn plane

From the OP "give up their seats to stand-by United employees that needed to be in Louisville on Monday for a flight."

The flight these employees were supposed to work hasn't even happened yet, and won't until tonight. They had almost 24 hours to get them there. If a human can't recover from 5 hours of driving in that amount of time, I wouldn't want them doing any flights.

Edit: Shit I somehow misread as "monday night for a flight" but it didn't mention night. Maybe I need more sleep

 

[Skellig Gra]

I've seen people borderline fight each other for the $500 incentive offer before. At $800 I'm shocked there were no volunteers

Yeah for a non international flight it's crazy to me that no one took $800. That's like double the price the people probably paid.

Wow what a scummy piece of a shit company, now I know who to never ever fly with.

The few people defending this shit in this thread are scumbags, this is indefensible.

Not defending their actions but every airline does this so good luck. Flying is like taking a bus. It's dirty and you want it over as fast as possible.

 

[andymcc]

Never understood how the US airlines get away with 'selling' you a seat you might not have. When I was on honeymoon flying from San Francisco to Maui, I was informed that I was put on 'standby' while my wife was not. Fortunately they managed to get us both on the same flight but the whole concept is bizarre especially as someone coming from the EU.

Actually, is this not a policy in the EU as well? I was taking a Lufthansa flight back to the USA from Germany over New Years and this SAME scenario almost happened to me and my SO. I was moved to standby and she was ticketed. Luckily, I got on but there fear was real...

 

[bloodydrake]

God fucking dammit, GAF.

We really have defense forces for everything.

Also, you should probably look up the definition of entitlement. I'd say that paying for a seat and expecting to get that seat fit the definition to a tee.

When it got to the point where security is there to remove you and they give you your last chance to do so voluntarily.. and you don't..then your wrong. He made a shitty situation as worse as it could be for everyone on that flight that got delayed due to his sense of entitlement. It sucks to get bounced but he escalated to the point of force ably being removed.

How dare he expect to keep the seat on the flight he paid for. How dare he!

ya its a shitty business practice that should be outlawed. however when security says you have to leave the plane or they will move you and you refuse..you crossed the line.

This kind of responses blow my mind. So airlines lobby lawmakers. Lawmakers create laws that are amoral and unethical and abuse consumers. But because it's law, you are "entitled" if you fucking say no.

You don't get to refused to follow the commands of the flight crew and security.. period.
Its a plane not a public space.

This isn't a unique practice to United all North American Airlines do this.

level of entitlement?

he bought a ticket so he could go home and help out sick and dying people and the people he bought the ticket from said fuck off we gotta get ours.

come ON

Yes he was suppose to get off the plain accept the credit and take the next available flight like any other non entitled civilized human being would.

Are you serious with this shit?

United fucked by up:
Allowing an overbooked flight to be boarded. I've never seen this before because it's meant to be sorted out before anyone gets on.
Not raising the offered price higher to incentivize people get off.
Kicking a paying customer off for a fucking staff member.
Getting police to drag him off by force without doing anything.
A non-apology statement.

If THEY fucked up then THEY should deal with it without effecting paying customers. Put the staff on another airline if they have to. This will create a PR nightmare and will cost them more than $800 that's for sure. Disgusting treatment of customers, incompetently managed, and pathetically dealt with. The staff who caused this should be fired.

yes i'm serious
united did what all airlines do
the situation was unfortunate that the plane was boarded before they knew a company crew needed to get on the flight. obviously if they could have done this at the gate it would have been better.
they're only authorized to offer so much. I like the idea it should keep going up till someone bites.
they weren't kicked off for someone who just worked for united it was a crew to had to get there to keep another whole flight from being delayed/canceled. Its unfortunate but it was a requirement.
The doctor forced the security to remove him..they gave him at least 3 chances..the ugliness of what ensued was purely of his choosing. He forced them to do it.


Same thing happened on Air Canada but no one refused to leave and forced security to remove them. Doctor simply felt he was more important.. and Again I say if it was life threatening that he was on that flight he could have provided a number to verify it was an emergency.. obviously it wasn't he just didn't want to be delayed.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/air-canada-bumping-overbooking-airline-1.4060820

 

[NeOak]

From the OP "give up their seats to stand-by United employees that needed to be in Louisville on Monday for a flight."

The flight these employees were supposed to work hasn't even happened yet, and won't until tonight. They had almost 24 hours to get them there. If a human can't recover from 5 hours of driving in that amount of time, I wouldn't want them doing any flights.

I believe it is due to FAA regulations. Travel time counts as flight time for them, and they can only have so much travel time in a 24 hours period.

 

[gutterboy44]

I have boycotted United for years after they fucked me over and treated me like a tumor instead of a paying customer. This just solidifies my stance. I have had to deal with Time Warner Cable customer service for two decades, yet United still managed to take the prize as worst ever.

 

[NeOak]

I have boycotted United for years after they fucked me over and treated me like a tumor instead of a paying customer. This just solidifies my stance. I have had to deal with Time Warner Cable customer service for two decades, yet United still managed to take the prize as worst ever.

I miss Continental. United is shit tier compared to what Continental was.

 

[Theslammer]

The good news for the airlines is that with just one or two more round of mergers and consolidation, bad PR won't matter! US customers won't have a choice with whom to fly and they can assault passengers as much as they want.

I really wish I could find a version of this where I could read the small words.

 

[Apathy]

The blame the victim crowd is really out in force to stand up for that poor multi billion dollar company.


The man paid for his ticket at this time. If that were me it'd be the same or worse situation cause fuck them for overbooking, I got shit to do and places to be at a set time that I planned for with that ticket.

I hope this doctor goes and sues united for as much as he can get.

 

[giga]

Of the big US airlines, Southwest > Delta > American > United.

 

[ColdPizza]

What is your point? Are you explaining to me about overbooking or how it cannot be helped and such? To be honest I don't care about the airline profits. It's not for the customer to find them a solution or care for their profits. I care about what I pay for and therefore I'm entitled to.

This guy paid for his seat, isn't a danger and certainly isn't responsible for the company overbooking or such. Why should he or I care for any of it?

The airline has many options to get their employees to their destination and whatever it is, it's not my problem or responsibility.

You said it was their fault for overbooking. I'm explaining that overbooking is a calculated risk they take. If their risk fails, they should implement Y2Kev's solution (or not kick passengers off of the plane if they are already seated).

 

[PumpkinSpice]

How long is a bus ride from Chicago to Louisville? Couldn't they have just sent their employees that way?